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History Forum ? Request

There is no such thing as history but different perspective of different people on issues and events of past basically a formula for massive trolling
agreed in principle

History sometimes rephrased as HIS-Story= meaning as told by the victor.
but it is a starting point and if the troll pests are weeded out we can learn much, its all about Niyat.
 
agreed in principle

History sometimes rephrased as HIS-Story= meaning as told by the victor.
but it is a starting point and if the troll pests are weeded out we can learn much, its all about Niyat.
I agree too
 
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Guy's I am very busy right now. Please let me answer your concerns before you go forward with this. I will be free later in the afternoon.

@ Bamxa aka Shaheen it's me here. Nice to see you. You may have not agreed with me all the time but you must agree I gave those Indian's outnumbered at times 10 to 1 a thrashing. I know I got banned because one or two of the Indian's are close with one of the Mods. There and I knew I was going to go down sooner or later.

Anyway you must admit I changed lot of westerners outlook to Pakistan. I knew I had won many over because they sent me Pms. They were shocked about our legacy and history. Anyway nice seeing you here. Catch you later.

Even the thread on forts changed their perception.

Ps. Again guy's let me please put my final case to you guy's later and then you decide.

Keep my handle to yourself please. Thanks.
 
IMHO,

The history section should have two sections. One that acts like a referance or a resource. It should have a panel of contributors with differant areas of interest. I would like to cover ancient history and all the way to 1947. We also need military, economic historians. This resource section should act like a referance library and as much as possible limit to facts although often in history this standard can be difficult to adhere to.

Then once we have built up a body of resource the History forum should open up like rest of the forums. However the resource threads should be kept locked from general members but they can evalute by opening threads below and having discussions.

I regard this as vital for Pakistan's future. We can have all the guns, armies and planes but our identity is so amorphous and weak. Because of this it is open to abuse. oOr people are lost as to who they are. We gave the world one of the earliest civilzations on earth along with Mesopotamian's and Egyptians. North West Europeans were still running around half naked like savages.

Yet, we the people of Pakistan the heirs of a land that only Egypt, Iraq or Greece can match, today are rootless and lost, running around trying to be something we never are going to be. The world laughs at us. The Indian's take jibes at us. The Arab's call us 'Miskeen'.

Like orphans or a man who does not know who are his parents our people run around finding their roots here and there and everywhere, in doing so getting mocked and laughed at by others. It's time we accepted the legacy of our forefathers. The Persian's do it, the Turks do it, the Arabs do it and we who have a history that puts the rest in shadow run around trying invent ourselves as others.

We alread have wrested our political freedom in 1947 but have we wrested the legacy of our land? I say we have not. We have allowed Indian's to rape the legacy of our land. One thing in all my conflicts with Indian's came up again and again. How could we have our land, our political freedom yet somehow they the indian's own the history of our land?

I was reminded of this lack of roots few weeks back. I went to Sparkhill area of Birmingham and as I drove throw the thickly populated Pakistani community along Stratford Rd there was mile after mile shops on both sides. Almost every type of shop was there. This was like Raja bazaar in Pindi.

Anyway it occured to me in one of the biggest Pakistani communities in UK that there is the 'f***' word. Your wondering what I mean? Well I saw names like "Apna Roti house", "Asian Cloth House", "Dhesi Food", "Indian sweets", "Muslim Money Exchange".

I though if I were a Japanese tourist I could have driven through one of the biggest Pakistani communities in UK and not figured out who they are? You go to an area where there is 100 Iranians, 100 Turks, 100 Indians, 100 Indonesians, 100 Slovakians, 100 Latvians, 100 Estonians and I gurantee you will see shops openly emblazoned "Latvian, Estonian, Turkish, Indian".

Have you ever seen Estonian, Latvians? I swear you would need to call FBI forensics or CSI investigators to figure out the Estonian from the Latvian. Yours truely has had some 'dealings' with both and all I can say is both are blonde, tall and talk with funny accents. If you put a gun on my head I on point of death I would not be able to fugure out who is Estonian and who is Latvian both countries probably have sub 4 mill people size of Lahore.

Yet driving through Stratford Rd a country of 180 million was lost and or subsumed into "Apna" which would mean we got pooled in a group of 1,300 mill, 180 mill, 150 mill. So "apana" was 1,600 million. Or even "Muslim" in which case it begged the question, Morrocan, Alegerian, Tunisian, Libyan, Egytian, Malian, Nigerian, Jordanian, dash, dash, dash, Indonesian?

So that begs the question why 4 million Estonians have greater external branding then 180 million Pakistani. Even Arabs. Take Jordanians or Syrians. What is the differance? Lines drwn in the desert with rulers by English? Kuwait or Saudia? Lines drawn by English rulers? Yet today watch how nationalistic Jordanians are.

Pakistan is the "f***" word because our own people don't want to use it. Go out wherever you are and I am sure what I said is pretty well reflected. "Apna, Dhesi, Asian, Muslim, and then maybe "Indian". Pakistan is now a mature country is in age. If you look at the UN we are now older than 70% of the countries there. 70% of the countries became independant in 1950s, 1960s and even 1970s. Malaysia became independat in 1957. Algeria 1963.Kuwait 1963.

It might not be too bad if our name "Pakistan" remained inconspicious and absent. No, Sir. No, No, Sir. A bomb goes off. Who done it? "Apna? Dhesi? Asian? Indian? Muslim? No, sir. It will be Pakistani. Terrorist? Pakistani, Women raped? Pakistani Sex grooming gangs? Pakistani Get the picture? Pakistan has become the "f" word. It is our fault.

BBC NEWS | INDEPTH | LONDON ATTACKS

I will conclude this in the next post.
 
No country is perfect. All have had problems at some time in history. We are peculiar case though because say "Pakistan" and the world conjures up bombers, terrorists and other negatives. however we have no positive or redeaming feature. In other words we are all minus and no plus.

Well we do have plus. Our history, Our land that is bejeweled with a legacy rich that should have crowds gathered grom around the world admiring our past. Taxila should have Japanese, Chinese and Koreans tripping over themselves. The name Pakistan should conjure up "civilization, legacy, history and art". It does not because we ourselves have ignored our history.

In twist of irony the Inndian's do not have any history to speak off. The reality is the Indus Basin has shone through history. When Greek or Persian writers talk about 'India' they in fact are talking about Pakistan. The India of today has nothing worthwhile from antiquity. Proof? They have walked into our land while we slept and effectively stolen our heritage to build up 'Shining India' brand that they then sell to the world.

So let us educate our people to have a identity that is more than one dimentional. Look at it this way if Pakistan is just about Islam then you have to look at this state from a theological prism. In Islamn there is no nation state concept. So if you follow that line of reasoning it follows we are just one dimentional - "Muslim". This means we are part of wider "Ummah" which means ANY Muslim from Africa, Asia, Middle East ought to be able to come here.

Rename this website. put PAF, Pak army at the service of the Ummmah. We should be fighting anywhere where Muslims are in trouble. The Taliban reprsent that viewpoint. If that is what people want well the state shoyld be put at the disposal of the ummah and launch jihad against all non muslims who opress any muslim anywhere.

If not let us build our nation state that includes accepting it's history. The argument it is controversial is wrong. Something that is controversial needs even more attention unless this website is coffee shop for bit of gossip. You cannot let trolls decide yoour policy. The primciple is paramount. If I can't win you guy's over I guess I have lost the case before i even begin with the general membership.

Take the Italians. People used to laugh at them for 'cowards', poverty, slimy' effeminate'. They than managed to turn that around by 'Ferrari, style,movies,food,culture,Rome'. Take the Greeks "lazy, beggers" but they have another side"Greek Empre, Alexander, greek art" etc

We need to start building brand Pakistan also.
 
Guy's I am very busy right now. Please let me answer your concerns before you go forward with this. I will be free later in the afternoon.

@ Bamxa aka Shaheen it's me here. Nice to see you. You may have not agreed with me all the time but you must agree I gave those Indian's outnumbered at times 10 to 1 a thrashing. I know I got banned because one or two of the Indian's are close with one of the Mods. There and I knew I was going to go down sooner or later.

Anyway you must admit I changed lot of westerners outlook to Pakistan. I knew I had won many over because they sent me Pms. They were shocked about our legacy and history. Anyway nice seeing you here. Catch you later.

Even the thread on forts changed their perception.

Ps. Again guy's let me please put my final case to you guy's later and then you decide.

Keep my handle to yourself please. Thanks.
Sir,
First of all ignore all crap made by their management with you so far,second welcome to PDF.
Sir,PDF database section is all yours.You are free to write Pakistani history articles with neutral sources and of course our rest title holders are with you.
Regards
 
^
Thank you, it's always nice to get a positive comment. I was pretty cheesed off at the Indian's. They mobbed me in another forum - like 10 to 1 and when I landed at PDF I was not in any mood to take prisoners so I let it rip.

Any way I hope the Admin. agree to giving PDF a dedictared History forum. I would love to build a complete work of our history because I think we have badly neglected it.

The reason why all the Indian's went crazy like Bees was because in that World History they had built up this edifice of lies. They had convinced all these British, Americans, Canadians, French, Italians, Germans, Poles, Turks, Japanese, South Koreans about 'Shining India'.

So I went in there and plastered them. By the time I finished all the westerners actually said that all they thought of Pakistan was bombs, bombs, bombs. Now they knew about Soanian Culture, Gandhara, Alexander the Great. Everything that the is ours the Indian's had been 'milching'.

So I thought it is time more Pakistani's became aware of this and then spread the word around. That is why I want to build a internet resource base here. Soft power is very important in today's world because it makes people partial to you. They are thus less inclined into accepting Indian propaganda against Pakistan.

At any rate I leave this with the Admin.

That's cool - Tag me in your threads and specially in the ones where you expose the Chindi choors. I hope to read some good unbiased stuff not something like mutalya-e-pakistan.

Rename this website. put PAF, Pak army at the service of the Ummmah. We should be fighting anywhere where Muslims are in trouble. The Taliban reprsent that viewpoint. If that is what people want well the state shoyld be put at the disposal of the ummah and launch jihad against all non muslims who opress any muslim anywhere.

Ok - Ignore my previous post
 
That's cool - Tag me in your threads and specially in the ones where you expose the Chindi choors. I hope to read some good unbiased stuff not something like mutalya-e-pakistan.



Ok - Ignore my previous post


That referance to was 'sarcasm'. I did not actually mean change the name. Do you understand?

Sir,
First of all ignore all crap made by their management with you so far,second welcome to PDF.
Sir,PDF database section is all yours.You are free to write Pakistani history articles with neutral sources and of course our rest title holders are with you.
Regards

Thank you.
 
That referance to was 'sarcasm'. I did not actually mean change the name. Do you understand?



Thank you.
I guess that you and @syedali73 will be making a perfect team:)
If you require anything then please let us know and feel comfortable in here.The Pakistan defence management consists of pro Pakistani mindsets that aim to bring accurate info related to Pakistani defence,military and history.We have been working with that and you can browse our database sanctums.
Regards
 
I guess that you and @syedali73 will be making a perfect team:)
If you require anything then please let us know and feel comfortable in here.The Pakistan defence management consists of pro Pakistani mindsets that aim to bring accurate info related to Pakistani defence,military and history.We have been working with that and you can browse our database sanctums.
Regards

Much appreciated. I will try my do my best to produce quality and logical historical chapters on the history of our land begining with Soanian Culture over 50,000 years ago. Soanian is named afte Soan River near Islamabad. Again if you go to Wiki the Indian's have done their best to leach off Soan.
 
I agree, a 'History of Pakistan' section is needed, i'm willing to regularly contribute as well.



Section bans will fix that issue.

Horus, is there not a way to have open viewership, but posts restricted to members with good standing?
More like seniors club of thing?
 
@Atanz This is simply a great idea. I loved the thread you started on ancient Pakistan. You are right, Pakistanis as a nation need this education.

I also had a suggestion. I was reading the Ancient Pakistan thread (I can't reply there because I'm a new recruit or something) and I thought I would love to see this turned into a blog. Can you do that? That way it becomes accessible to more people and is easily shared of Facebook waghaira. Like a nice looking, well formatted blog. I'm sure we can all help too. This is a great initiative on your part. Thank you so much :)
 
@ Bamxa aka Shaheen it's me here. Nice to see you. You may have not agreed with me all the time but you must agree I gave those Indian's outnumbered at times 10 to 1 a thrashing. I know I got banned because one or two of the Indian's are close with one of the Mods. There and I knew I was going to go down sooner or later.

Anyway you must admit I changed lot of westerners outlook to Pakistan. I knew I had won many over because they sent me Pms. They were shocked about our legacy and history. Anyway nice seeing you here. Catch you later.

Even the thread on forts changed their perception.

Ps. Again guy's let me please put my final case to you guy's later and then you decide.

Keep my handle to yourself please. Thanks.

Oh yes and the reason I never spoke out on anything I disagreed with was that having been on that forum for 4-5 years as the sole Pakistani I know how annoying it can be to have the Hindutva brigade gang up on you. A memorable thread was on Kashmir in 2011 where I think at one time I was indeed debating with at least 7-8 Indians on Kashmir. However as I explained my work-family commitments dont allow me the time to participate effectively at the moment as I like to support anything I say with scholarly backup which requires extensive reading. For this history section however I am willing to give more time and write some pieces to keep the section running and supporting you. I need to become a senior member faster though as I cant even participate on your ancient Pakistan thread lol.

With regards to Historum you should I think maintain your presence there after your ban ends. I know the Indian members can be difficult at times but just put them on your ignore list and continue your threads on Pakistani history. If you never answer their posts everyone will know you have ignored them anyways. Nevertheless keep up the good work :tup:
 
@Atanz This is simply a great idea. I loved the thread you started on ancient Pakistan. You are right, Pakistanis as a nation need this education.

I also had a suggestion. I was reading the Ancient Pakistan thread (I can't reply there because I'm a new recruit or something) and I thought I would love to see this turned into a blog. Can you do that? That way it becomes accessible to more people and is easily shared of Facebook waghaira. Like a nice looking, well formatted blog. I'm sure we can all help too. This is a great initiative on your part. Thank you so much :)

Fantastic. I need motivated, intelligent people. I am counting on you to contribute. My idea is we set a central repository where we gather information, articles relating to our history. That becomes our resource base. It should be secure and only some members ought to be allowed to change matariel therein.

There should be discussion section below which of course people can discuss using the information in the repository. Then we need people to read up and spread the information.I know Bamxa is already in.

I agree with Bamxa we need to know our stuff. We must be able to back up any argument we make with facts or sound, logical reasoning. What ever we say must be able to stand up to scrutiny.
 
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