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Google vs China thread

Google denies leaving China, seeks negotiations
By Melanie Lee

SHANGHAI (Reuters) - Google Inc enters a second week of high stakes brinkmanship with China's government, amid speculation the firm has decided to pull out of the world's biggest Internet market over cyber-spying concerns.

Google, the world's most popular search engine, said last week it was thinking about quitting China after suffering a sophisticated cyber-attack on its network that resulted in theft of its intellectual property.

The company has said it is no longer willing to filter content on its Chinese language google.cn engine, and will try to negotiate a legal unfiltered search engine, or exit the market.

Most of the filters on google.cn were still in place on Sunday, though controls over some searches, including the June 4, 1989 Tiananmen crackdown, appear to have been loosened.

The Google announcement captured the attention of China's 384 million netizens, the world's largest Internet market by users, with blogs and local media quoting unnamed insiders as saying Google has already decided to close its offices in China.

Google has denied that, saying the company is still in the process of scanning its internal networks since the cyber-attack in mid-December. Google also said it would hold talks with the Chinese government over the next few weeks.

China has tried to play down Google's threat to leave, saying there were many ways to resolve the issue, but insisting all foreign companies, Google included, must abide by Chinese laws.

Washington said it is issuing a diplomatic note to China formally requesting an explanation for the attacks.

The Google issue risks becoming another irritant in China's relationship with the United States, already strained by arguments over the Chinese currency's exchange rate, trade protectionism and U.S. arms sales to Taiwan.

Washington has long been worried about Beijing's cyber-spying program. A congressional advisory panel said in November the Chinese government appeared increasingly to be penetrating U.S. computers to gather useful data for its military.

When Google introduced its google.cn website in 2006 with the decision to self-censor searches, it said the move would benefit the Chinese people by expanding access to information.

"We think we have made a reasonable decision, though we cannot be sure it will ultimately be proven to be the best one," a top level Google spokesman told the U.S. Committee on International Relations in 2006.

Google's move to publicly denounce censorship and accuse Chinese hackers of launching an attack that resulted in the theft of its intellectual property was seen as a bold move.

"We have never seen a company take on the Chinese government in such a public and confrontational manner," said James McGregor, senior counsellor to public affairs consultancy Apco Worldwide.

But it may backfire as signs emerge the firm has already damaged its prospects in China regardless of whether it carries out its threat to quit the country.

JPMorgan analyst Dick Wei said he thinks Google's relationship with the Chinese government is already strained and if the firm decides to stay, it could be subject to tighter regulations.

UBS analyst Wang Jinjin also believes Google's relationship with advertisers has been damaged as a result of the threat and that they will choose Baidu Inc over the firm.

On Saturday, Yahoo was dragged into the growing row after its Chinese partner Alibaba Group slammed its statements supporting Google.

Playing down the concerns raised by Google, rival Microsoft Corp said it had no plan to pull out of China.

Microsoft has high hopes for its Bing Internet search engine in China, which has only a small share of the market but could benefit if Google, the No. 2 player behind dominating local rival Baidu Inc, pulls out.

(Editing by Bill Tarrant)
 
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Wow, Mr. elder's last stand come up with a "Blog"

Blogger,Don Clark; is he the same guy with his new book ;

"Loving Someone Gay" ? Interesting HaHaHa

Don Clark's Web Site
:smitten::pakistan::china:
You are so pathetic. The 'Don Clark' you brought on is a PhD in PSYCHOLOGY.

Meet Don Clark

Your clumsiness is an embarrassment.

Here is WSJ's Don Clark...

Don Clark, tech journalist at Wall Street Journal on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
media | Marisa Taylor | Voices | AllThingsD
CES: Qualcomm CEO Comes, Bearing Wireless Gifts - Digits - WSJ

Do they lookalike? Your gay PhD 'Don Clark' has a dimple on his chin. WSJ's 'Don Clark' does not. Instead of addressing the SUBSTANCE of the charge you go after the messenger and ended up with the wrong guy.

:rofl:
 
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Censorship happens in EVERY COUNTRY, including the United States itself. Also on privacy, Google has been handing sensitive, private user information to the FBI, the CIA, and the NSA for years with no problem. Google shakes in its boots when the IRS wants information, too. So why would Google have problem with China in this regard?
The issue is WHAT is being censored. Do I want child pornography censored? Of course. Do I want Watergate or Watergate-like issues censored? No. See if you can tell the difference.
 
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You are so pathetic. The 'Don Clark' you brought on is a PhD in PSYCHOLOGY.

Meet Don Clark

Your clumsiness is an embarrassment.

Here is WSJ's Don Clark...

Don Clark, tech journalist at Wall Street Journal on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
media | Marisa Taylor | Voices | AllThingsD
CES: Qualcomm CEO Comes, Bearing Wireless Gifts - Digits - WSJ

Do they lookalike? Your gay PhD 'Don Clark' has a dimple on his chin. WSJ's 'Don Clark' does not. Instead of addressing the SUBSTANCE of the charge you go after the messenger and ended up with the wrong guy.

:rofl:

Calm down, my dear Mr. elder, being too emotional will be hazardous

to your health at your age, Hint (High blood pressure).

Your anger had failed you badly that you can't even reconized a

"sarcasm", read my post again=I ask="Is he the same guy" ?

Sorry, your built in "Hatred" of China blinded your mind one more

time.

Next time if you expected a serious debate, you need to answer my

question with some creditable sources, not some pick and choose

articles from some blogs, especially not from a Chinese Blogger's

page. Good luck to your health.:smitten::smitten::china:
 
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Calm down, my dear Mr. elder, being too emotional will be hazardous

to your health at your age, Hint (High blood pressure).

Your anger had failed you badly that you can't even reconized a

"sarcasm", read my post again=I ask="Is he the same guy" ?

Sorry, your built in "Hatred" of China blinded your mind one more

time.

Next time if you expected a serious debate, you need to answer my

question with some creditable sources, not some pick and choose

articles from some blogs, especially not from a Chinese Blogger's

page. Good luck to your health.:smitten::smitten::china:
What a lame attempt to weasel out of your own screw-up. Be adult enough to admit it. You were clumsy with online search. You grab onto the first 'Don Clark' returned and when you found your man is a homosexual you tried to use his sexual orientation to discredit the WSJ's article. Too bad it was the wrong man. Serious debate? It is clear by now that the readership should take nothing 'serious' about you.
 
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What a lame attempt to weasel out of your own screw-up. Be adult enough to admit it. You were clumsy with online search. You grab onto the first 'Don Clark' returned and when you found your man is a homosexual you tried to use his sexual orientation to discredit the WSJ's article. Too bad it was the wrong man. Serious debate? It is clear by now that the readership should take nothing 'serious' about you.

You are the one being "Screw Up" not me,

Clumsy online search ? Sorry, you failed again, the first one on the

google page was WJS Don Clark, so all your BS accuse="lame"

Mr. elder, i respected your knowledge on military , but other than that

No offence, you are full of sh@t.


Example; (1) When you failed to degrade Baidu, out of desperation,

you dare to bring up a Chinese blogger web page trying to support

your claim without the ability to read Chinese, after i debunked your

dirty tactic, you avoid providing any explaination.

(2) After you realized Google back off from its tall claim of retreating

from China, it hurt your so-called American ego, you turn your

attention to dig out blogs from WSJ and addressed in your post as

being reported by Wall street Journal along with your own baseless

attacks PRC.

(3) When your post about your so-called claim of doubts of

foreign investment in China, I debunked your BS with "Facts" You

once agian avoiding any response to me.

Now, tell me , who is avoiding a serious debate ?

:smitten::pakistan::china:
 
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And now,in China ,the Internet users are divided into several parts on the google-thing,about 400million net users in China ,more than the whole population of the US,different people has different view.
Even the Google close the www.google.cn site,and the www.google.com is still open.
"We have decided we are no longer willing to continue censoring our results on Google.cn ... We recognize that this may well mean having to shut down Google.cn, and potentially our offices in China," David Drummond, Google's chief legal officer, said in a statement posted on the company's official blog.

The statement, entitled "A new approach to China", claims that the company had detected a highly sophisticated and targeted attack from China that resulted in the theft of the company's intellectual property.

The news echoed around the world and the western media immediately seized the opportunity to attack China's censorship and heaped praise on Google, which is not surprising, as indicated by their previous records. But the question remains: Does Google’s threat to pull out really result from what the company and the Western media have claimed, namely, China's censorship?

To begin with, Google has always placed great importance on China. Google would be condemned if it ignored the Chinese market, which has almost 400 million Internet users and is still rimmed with huge potential. The fact that Google risked lawsuits in 2005 to prize Kai-fu Lee from Microsoft is the best evidence. It is no coincidence that Google.cn was launched shortly after Kai-fu Lee's arrival.
The problem is Google.cn simply cannot compete with its main domestic rival, Baidu.com. A report from China Internet Network Information Center (CNNIC) shows that as of September 2009 Baidu.com's market share in China stood at 77.2 percent, far stripping Google's 12.7 percent. In fact, the majority of Google's users in China choose Google.com as their first choice but Google.cn.

After nearly five years' pushing for the brand of Google.cn and after investing heavily in Google.cn, their efforts in the Chinese market are simply not successful, to say the least. Kai-fu Lee's abrupt departure from Google in September 2009 wasn't helpful, either. To answer for its investors and for shareholders to understand a not so favorable environment of global economy, Google's decision to pull out of China comes as no surprise.

Indeed, Google is not the first or only one Western Internet firm that fared miserably in China's Internet market. The online auction and shopping website E-bay's defeat against the domestic Taobao.com, Alibaba's acquisition of Yahoo China, and QQ.com's dominance in China's instant messaging market, to name just a few, seem to have already foretold Google.cn's fate.

China's censorship, as a matter of fact, is just Google's management's ingenious excuse to flee the Chinese market in which they failed their investors and shareholders. For one thing, Google entered the China market after censorship was instituted, not vice versa. If anything, China has been loosing its censorship since Google's entry. The best proof is perhaps the free debate over the installation of the filtering software Green Dam, in which the Chinese government finally budged.
A number of notable "mass incidents" are freely discussed on the Internet - the mass protest over the death of a girl in Weng'an county in Guizhou province, the mass protest over the death of a chef in Hubei province, and the waitress who resisted sexual advance by killing a local official, not to mention quite a few corruption cases that have been brought to the spotlight through the Internet.

Many claim, most likely with ulterior motives, that the shutdown of Google.cn will leave Chinese netizens isolated from the outside world. That is, simply, untrue. The closure of Google.cn has little, if any, effect on the Chinese users, as Google.com, its global website, is the primary channel they access to search for information. Unfortunately, Google didn't even bother to explain that.

Google's motivation was clear and simple: to earn its share of this huge market. When the company cannot attain the goal and pocket enough money and hopes to find a way out, the Chinese government and its censorship, which the West frequently picks up, just become two convenient scapegoats.
And now,after attract every one's light on Google,Google denied that, saying the company is still under thought of whether leave.
At Last I would say:the Google threat to close the Google.cn and attract everyone's attention to earn its share of this huge market.
 
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You are the one being "Screw Up" not me,

Clumsy online search ? Sorry, you failed again, the first one on the

google page was WJS Don Clark, so all your BS accuse="lame"

Mr. elder, i respected your knowledge on military , but other than that

No offence, you are full of sh@t.
Don Clark works for WSJ, a respected news organization. If they felt his commentary worthy, they will pay for his services. His commentary is that China's PhD graduates, according to Intel's own leadership, is not as competent as American PhD graduates. You tried to discredit Clark by digging up some dirt on him. Unfortunately, you found the wrong 'Clark', who is a homosexual with a PhD in PSYCHOLOGY, not in IT. Now who is looking foolish here?

Example; (1) When you failed to degrade Baidu, out of desperation,

you dare to bring up a Chinese blogger web page trying to support

your claim without the ability to read Chinese, after i debunked your

dirty tactic, you avoid providing any explaination.
Degrade Baidu? Since when? The question is why is Baidu's relationship with the PRC government consider 'good' while Google's imaginary ties to the CIA is 'bad'. Is that too difficult to understand?

(2) After you realized Google back off from its tall claim of retreating

from China, it hurt your so-called American ego, you turn your

attention to dig out blogs from WSJ and addressed in your post as

being reported by Wall street Journal along with your own baseless

attacks PRC.

(3) When your post about your so-called claim of doubts of

foreign investment in China, I debunked your BS with "Facts" You

once agian avoiding any response to me.

Now, tell me , who is avoiding a serious debate ?

:smitten::pakistan::china:
Utter BS. This is about the charge of the PRC government refusing to honor its responsibilities under WTO rules and stealing from foreigners. That is from the NY Times. Its reportage is that foreigners are having doubts about investing in China. That is not saying EVERYONE is withdrawing from China.

Face it...You got busted and now you are trying to cover up your gaff.
 
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The news echoed around the world and the western media immediately seized the opportunity to attack China's censorship and heaped praise on Google, which is not surprising, as indicated by their previous records. But the question remains: Does Google’s threat to pull out really result from what the company and the Western media have claimed, namely, China's censorship?
No...Google questioned its presence in China after it believed the PRC government directed break-ins, aka 'hacking', to its database. Google then decided it will no longer self-censored as it has been in the past. If this refusal to self-censorship result in an eviction from China, Google will take its chances.
 
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Why a gay can't be a PHD? I heard that US is very lenient to gays and lesbians.
Did I say a homosexual cannot be an educated person? Can you show me where or even implied so? Or is there a reading comprehension problem on YOUR part?
 
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No...Google questioned its presence in China after it believed the PRC government directed break-ins, aka 'hacking', to its database. Google then decided it will no longer self-censored as it has been in the past. If this refusal to self-censorship result in an eviction from China, Google will take its chances.

"Google then decided it will no longer self-censored as it has been in the past. "
In the past why Google accepte self-censored?If Google really has a top ethics as it said,Google should deny to self-censore at the first time but after the market share down to 12.7%
 
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"Google then decided it will no longer self-censored as it has been in the past. "
In the past why Google accepte self-censored?If Google really has a top ethics as it said,Google should deny to self-censore at the first time but after the market share down to 12.7%
Google self-censored for the same reason why Baidu does. The difference here is Baidu is run by Chinese, which everyone expected to be compliant with whatever the PRC government said, and Baidu is so compliant. Google is a foreigner and being from a country where freedom of expression is respected and expected, self-censorship earned Google much criticisms.
 
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Google self-censored for the same reason why Baidu does. The difference here is Baidu is run by Chinese, which everyone expected to be compliant with whatever the PRC government said, and Baidu is so compliant. Google is a foreigner and being from a country where freedom of expression is respected and expected, self-censorship earned Google much criticisms.

pls don't find reasons for the google's failure,400million users are not stupid,baidu and Google can survive from tens of search engines because Baidu did well in Chinese and Google did well in Einglish,that's why they can share the 85% of the market.The Google's Chinese search engine is stupid compare with its Einglish engine,Baidu did well on its Chinese engine but Einglish.In china every one use Chinese but only a small part use both Chinese and Einglish.
 
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I prefer google than Bai du
Baidu is good at searching the Mp3 , :smokin:
 
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