General Pervaiz Musharraf's Last Message to Imran Khan just before his death!

[Al_Muhannad]

@The Accountant @PanzerKiel @HRK @waz @PanzerKiel
Besides Gen Zubair's scuffle.
Gen Bajwa another gem

Cancers runs deep.

Here is an interesting video:

 

[Ssan]

How do we know that Buzdar's nepotism did not lead to financial irregularities by his kin?

We can’t make that a claim but you are free to assume as much. I would argue that you should also assume the previous people were also corrupt (probably true if most people are corrupt).

With all the bakvas that ails our nation, I have arrived at the conclusion that corruption is a part of life in Pakistan as it is in the rest of 3rd world. It will only get cleaned up iteratively. Pragmatically speaking, if these chorr siphon 20% into their pockets, hopefully the remaining 80% would go into uplift of the masses.

Disclaimer: Before people attack me personally, Alhamdolillah I have personally never benefited from any type of financial corruption in Pakistan or elsewhere and the reason I state this disclaimer is so people don't think I am condoning something that I have personally benefitted from. Patently not the case.

It depends on what type of corruption you mean exactly. The differentiation is very important. You have corruption of the sort that happened when America was industrializing. This was corruption that allowed corporations to profit and to compete with one another and to grow.

To a lesser extent, you saw this sort of corruption with the kaebols in Korea, and the 17 family corporations in Pakistan in the 60s.

The type of corruption we actually have right now is the Zardari and Sharif model. In the model, no type of development or uplift is possible. To think otherwise is to fool yourself.

 

[Ssan]

which IK did not do because he never removed Buzdar. Corruption is corruption - calling nepotism a lower form because it doesn’t involve money(of which we know of in this case) is stating its ok to cheat in an exam but not ok to steal cash.

In my mind, a lot of things are corruption. The highest priority was to go after the biggest cases in the country through NAB. I have no doubt that IK is not lying when he says that QJB did not let those cases reach fruition.

If we agree that nepotism is a type of corruption, then surely you agree that this is the standard hiring protocol on practically every single company/department in the country

 

[FuturePAF]

I wonder if there is a peaceful way to get rid of institutional corruption and bring in meritocracy. Khan was the only one that cared but they removed him.

The establishment seems like it wouldn't go down without a fight

It's sad to see Pakistan like this but I guess the people tolerate it

They need to see IK as their best spokesman for correcting the economy. The IMF estimates Pakistan has $70 billion in debt repayments over the next 5 years, and it need $10 billion a year for at least the next 5 in FDI to to fill that whole in the budget. A 5 year Khan government can be the best salesman for them to attract that FDI. He has the credibility.

Competent Experts and economists will have to set the economic policy, as they do in all major functional economies, but a charismatic politician is needed to encourage investment, despite people seeing better returns in the US stock market.

People will invest for lower returns than they would have if they invested in the US. they already were when IK was last in power, principally on the belief that under IK their investment were secure. This is needed now more than ever, when even strong economies are having trouble competing with the attractiveness of the US market. But, the US market maybe set to drop 25-30% this year, and people will be looking for a stable and growing market to invest in. Pakistan can be that market with the right reforms and a charismatic salesman to sell the dream to global investors.

Even IK admitted that all major policies in his last government was upon advisement by the establishment. While IK will be less naive in a new government, he will have also learned to refrain from statements that might jeopardize foreign relations and potential foreign direct investment. If IK finds a working relationship with India, or asked the nation to bear heavy reforms, the people will feel the pain, but know that there was no other way for long term benefit.

Bringing IK back will also help heal the rift between people and the establishment, in due course. They have much to gain with a second IK government.

It’s also not the establishment but vested corporate interests that don’t want competitors. IK needs the establishment as well if he is re-elected and wants to push through reforms, which will cement PTI’s long term prospects in Pakistani politics, an important desire for all the politicians and rising politicians in the PTI party. It’s a give and take relationship for both sides.

 

[Ssan]

which IK did not do because he never removed Buzdar. Corruption is corruption - calling nepotism a lower form because it doesn’t involve money(of which we know of in this case) is stating its ok to cheat in an exam but not ok to steal cash.

It’s great if you and to be an absolutist bout it btw. All the more power to you. Pragmatically, I think the way you solve them is different.

 

[Strigon]

Do you think financial corruption does not happen in KSA? They would make Pakistan's financial corruption look like a bad joke.

Financial corruption is also a thing in the US, UK, every single country in the world. Difference is that there are things like accountability, law, punishment which are non existent in Pakistan.

And you already know that kings have different laws for themselves than elected officials.

What does dheet mean?

But anyway, that's my point, when the filth is so deep rooted in society, the only way to push it out is through very extreme measures. We can't use western law here.

My proposal is that anyone involved in any capacity of corruption including nepotism in government institutions should receive one of the following:

- Death penalty.

- 90% assets confiscated by state.

- 10 year jail term.

We can do 2 and 3 both perhaps.

Dheet means arrogant beyond reason. No matter how much to try to teach or tell them, they will not learn, proudly…

 

[FuturePAF]

Pragmatically speaking, if these chorr siphon 20% into their pockets, hopefully the remaining 80% would go into uplift of the masses.

I use to think the same way; “if they only skim 20% off the top, at least 80% will get to the masses”. But, that 20% is the margin we need to have reinvested into our industries and our human capital development to make them competitive.

 

[Kompromat]

And this was the man that IK called "Ghattiya". For those wondering, look up a video on YT of IK with his young sons.

Musharraf was a patriot till his last breath. Nobody can take that away from him.

"وہ بہت بڑے انسان تھے ان کے دوست چھوٹے ثابت ہوئے ہمیشہ پاکستان فرسٹ ان کی سوچ اور نظریہ تھا، خدا غریق رحمت کرے"
- Ch Fawad Hussain

"Don't dare quote laws to us who hold swords"

- Pompey

 

[The Accountant]

And this was the man that IK called "Ghattiya". For those wondering, look up a video on YT of IK with his young sons.

Musharraf was a patriot till his last breath. Nobody can take that away from him.

"وہ بہت بڑے انسان تھے ان کے دوست چھوٹے ثابت ہوئے ہمیشہ پاکستان فرسٹ ان کی سوچ اور نظریہ تھا، خدا غریق رحمت کرے"
- Ch Fawad Hussain

Isnt he responsible for start of civil war in Pakistan by betraying the warriors that were created and supported by Pakistan ?

@The Accountant @PanzerKiel @HRK @waz @PanzerKiel
Besides Gen Zubair's scuffle.
Gen Bajwa another gem

He could see the reality only after remaining out of power ... When in power u r surrounded by hundreds of yes man that will keep u away from the ground reality ...

Hafiz and bajwa couldnt see the reality as they were being told only what they wanted to hear ... Our establishment needs major overhauling if Pakistan intends to survive otherwise another Bangladesh type of scenario is not far away

 

[Corruptistan]

I disagree - because he would not have done Kargil nor authorized ops post 2001 that were both unrealistic and poorly planned/led(at the highest levels). His “good boys club” continues to cause damage to the overall merit and character of the military just as Zia’s did.

Spot on. End of topic IMO.

I spent my childhood in Jeddah and so I am in a position to provide first hand knowledge of the Saudi People. Yes there might be some corruption there BUT THE LIFE SYTLE OF THE SAUDI PEOPLE AND THE WELFARE AND BENEFITS PROVIDED TO THEM BY THE SAUDI GOVERNMENT IS THE ENVY OF THE WORLD INCLUDING THE SO CALLED DEVELOPED WESTERN COUNTRIES.

People are law-abiding because the law there is ENFORCED. My father use to leave his car keys inside his car in the middle of Jeddah city.

Saudi Arabia was the only country that I felt like Home, as If I belonged there. If by a miracle the Saudis ever offered me the citizenship there, I will leave everything and go there and live.

Please do not compare a lawless, gutless, corrupt country like Pakistan with a heaven like Saudi Arabia -- it would be a tragedy.

Spot on. No comparison.

Do you think financial corruption does not happen in KSA? They would make Pakistan's financial corruption look like a bad joke.

No offence but this is nonsense. International rankings confirm it as well.

2022 Corruption Perceptions Index: Explore the results

How does your country measure up in the 2022 Corruption Perceptions Index?

www.transparency.org

Even more so after MBS arrived. There is no comparison. Corruption is present in all societies but there are degrees to it. Pakistan is unfortunately terminally ill on this front. Not unlike a similar case study such as Egypt which in many ways is an apt country comparison on this front.

 

[VCheng]

"Don't dare quote laws to us who hold swords"

- Pompey

I believe you are looking for is LAWLESS.


law·less

adjective

not governed by or obedient to laws; characterized by a lack of civic order.

 

[VCheng]

Musharraf was a patriot till his last breath. Nobody can take that away from him.

Did he leave the country better off when he left power than when he assumed power, or not? That is his legacy, and no one can deny that either. The legacy is easy to see. Claims of patriotism are just that, and no more.

 

[TNT]

The modern deal of selling Pakistan was done by Musharraf. In his tenjre, when US was allowed a huge embassy and given powers to roam freely and do watever they wish, was the bases for infiltration. Since that time the US infiltrated the army and every institution. Now every hafiz or haji is a US slave. He is dead so i wont say much but Allah will deal with him now and i hope he gets what he has done.

 

[Erieye]

The modern deal of selling Pakistan was done by Musharraf. In his tenjre, when US was allowed a huge embassy and given powers to roam freely and do watever they wish, was the bases for infiltration. Since that time the US infiltrated the army and every institution. Now every hafiz or haji is a US slave. He is dead so i wont say much but Allah will deal with him now and i hope he gets what he has done.

This is true but i'd say he also didn't have a lot of choices or full independence, amrekans were pissed after 9-11 and were threatening him

 

[TNT]

This is true but i'd say he also didn't have a lot of choices or full independence, amrekans were pissed after 9-11 and were threatening him

Yea and we all know how brave our generals are, slight thread and they take off their pants.