Future MRL possibility's for PA

[Kaiser]

Ive made this thread to discuss what pakistan can buy to make is MRL fleet better which is looking real bad when compared to india.

I say we order A-100 from china with liscence production, and make more of our own MRl's at home. We should also order the Astro's II from brazil (said to be one of the best and cheapest)

Here is some info on the A-100 from china

A-100 300MM MULTIPLE LAUNCH ROCKET
The A-100 is the 300mm, 10-tube multiple launch rocket system developed by Beijing-based China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT, also known as 1st Space Academy) for the PLA ground forces. In many aspects, the system is very similar to the Russian Smerch 9K58 300mm rocket system. Its rocket is fitted with a primitive guidance system for greater accuracy. In 2002 the rocket system was spotted in service with the PLA 1st Artillery Division in Guangzhou Military Region, possibly for trial and evaluations.
PROGRAMME
China reportedly received a small number of the Russian Smerch 9K58 300mm, 12-tube multiple launch rocket system and its ammunitions in 1997. The Smerch 9K58 system is capable of firing a ‘smart’ submunition that has a dual-colour infrared sensors for terminal guidance, which enables the rocket to achieve accuracies previously difficult to achieve with unguided rockets of that range. The submunition is fitted with kinetic energy fragment warheads which are said to be able to penetrate 70mm of armour at an angle of 30° to the normal.
China National Precision Machinery Import and Export Corporation (CPMIEC), a trading company that market Chinese missile and defence technologies to foreign customers, revealed the A-100 300mm, 10-tube multiple launch rocket system in 2000. The system was developed by CALT, which is famous for its ChangZheng (Long March) family of space launch vehicles and DongFeng family of ballistic missiles. The A-100 system is CALT’s first attempt to break into the tactical weapon market. The A-100 development possibly began in the late 1990s and the weapon was spotted in service with the PLA 1st Artillery Division in Guanbgzhou MR in 2002.
CPMIEC claimed to have developed a range of rockets with ranges between 40km and 100km, but the actual effective range of the weapon may be around 85km. The A-100 rocket is fitted with a primitive guidance for greater accuracy. The PLA’s acquisition of the A-100 system demonstrated its interest in upgrading its artillery with “deep strike” tactics and capabilities. Combined with advanced intelligence, surveillance, target acquisition, and reconnaissance (ISTAR) capabilities and “smart munitions”, the A-100 would enable the ground forces to defeat large armoured formations at “beyond-visual-range”.
LAUNCH VEHICLE
The launch vehicle is based on a TAS5380 8X8 wheeled truck chassis developed by Tai'an Special Vehicle Manufactory. The vehicle weights 21t and has a maximum load of 22t. The vehicle has a maximum road speed of 60km/h and a maximum range of 650km. The vehicles has a gradient of 57% and a fording depth of 1.1m. The vehicle is equipped with four hydraulically operated stabilisers which are lowered in preparation for the rocket launch. 10 launcher tubes mounted on the chassis are arranged as two blocks of four (top) and six (bottom) tubes.
The vehicle is fitted with a GPS to provide real-time positioning data. A computerised aiming system collects meteorological and other parameters from various sensors and automatically calculate the trajectory for the rockets. The system could complete the process of target setting and pre-launch examination for all 10 rockets within 90 seconds and launch all 10 rockets within 60 seconds. The system is capable of both single and salvo firing.
AMMUNITIONS
The A-100 fires 300mm rocket powered by a solid propellant rocket motor, with a firing range of 40~100km. The A-100 rocket is 7.3m in length and weights 840kg. The rocket carries a 235kg warhead, and is stabilised by spin, thrust, and stabilising fins. It is fitted with a warhead containing 500 HE-FRAG (High Explosive Fragmentation) anti-armour/personnel submunitions. The submunition can penetrate 50mm of armour, and has a blast radius of 7m. The submunitions have a spreading radius of 100 +/- 40 metres.
The rocket consists of the warhead and fuse, a thrust stabilising system, a rocket motor and the tail section. The rocket motor is a single chamber, solid rocket motor with an advanced hydroxy-terminated polybutadine (HTPB) composition rocket propellant. The stabilising fins are folded inside the launch tube and open once the rocket leaves the tube.
The rocket is equipped with an onboard computer to help correct the horizontal and vertical deviations. During the first three seconds of the rocket’s flight, the onboard computer detects the horizontal difference between the programmed trajectory and actual status of the rocket, and controls the rocket’s stabilising thrust system to correct the rocket’s flying direction. The onboard computer corrects the vertical deviation by adjusting the warhead detonation time so that the submunitions are spread with a high accuracy.
GROUND EQUIPMENT
The ground equipment comprises a rocket launch vehicle, a transport and loading vehicle, and a firing command vehicle. A rocket system battery is equipped with one firing command vehicle, 6~9 rocket launch vehicles, and 6~9 transport and loading vehicles.
The command vehicle is mounted on a 6X6 truck chassis. It is equipped with a radio communications and data transmission system; a firing and control computer and simulation trajectory system; and a global positioning system. It collects the meteorological information, calculate the trajectory and transmits the data to the firing units.
SPECIFICATIONS
Rocket calibre: 300mm
Rocket length: 7,300mm
Rocket weight: 840kg
Warhead: 235kg, ~500 submunitions
Firing range: 40~100km
Reloading time: 20 minutes
Launch vehicle road speed: 60km/h
Launch vehicle travelling range: 650km

According to my knowledge the PA current uses a small force of Ws-1b MRL's well I say we replace these with the A-100 which can be cheaper and more lethal

Know here is some info on the deadly Bravilian Astros II

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]The ASTROS II is today the world's most complete Artillery Saturation Rocket System, and with the hightest degree of operational employment flexibility. The ASTROS II system has been proved in combat in the last two Gulf wars, and it has been increasingly adopted by armies of several countries.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]ASTROS II features also enable the system to be employed in Littoral Warface operations with extraordinary success.[/SIZE]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]The ASTROS II was developed to present a long life span through the constant introduction of new technology modules, specially on its ammunitios and even on its launcher platforms. One of such new technology modules for the ASTROS II System is the TM (Tactical Missile), with a range of up to 300 kilometers.[/SIZE][/FONT][/FONT]

The official Avibras site http://www.avibras.com/I/sys/M020101.asp

Pakistan is in dire need for new Mrl's and I say the no 1 contender should be the brazilian Astro's II and the chinese A-100

 

[Kaiser]

Some more info on the Astro's II

Astros II (Artillery Saturation Rocket System) is developed and manufactured by Avibras Aerospacial S.A. based in Sao Paulo, Brazil. Deliveries of Astros II started during 1983 and the system is operational in the Brazilian Army and Saudi Arabia. The system is battle proven, having been used in action by the Iraqi Army in the Gulf Wars and also Saudi Arabian systems were used during the Gulf conflict in 1991.
Malaysia has ordered a number of Astros II systems. The first was delivered in 2002.
The Astros II rocket system includes a fleet of vehicles:
Universal Multiple Launcher (AV-LMU) capable of firing 5 kinds of rockets with different calibers.
Ammunition Supply Vehicle (AV-RMD) for resupply of the AV-LMU, carrying 2 complete loads for each launcher.
Command and Control Vehicle / Fire Control Unit (AV-VCC) to provide the battalion level command with coordination and direction of firing missions for up to 3 Astros batteries.
Mobile Workshops for electronic and mechanic field maintenance of the system.
Optional Electronic Fire Control Unit (AV-UCF) which main task is to facilitate the procedures of fire direction using radar and computer.
Astros II can also be configured as a coastal defence system when deployed with an AV-CBO Searching and Operation Centre.
A typical battery configuration consists of six AV-LMU Universal Multiple Launchers, six AV-RMD Ammunition Supply Vehicles together with an optional AV-UCF Fire Control Unit. An AV-VCC Command and Control Vehicle / Fire Control Unit together with two mobile workshop vehicles which would be stationed at the battalion headquarters.

The system capability includes: High mobility and armour protection.
High volume of fire.
Short ripple time.
Minimum crew.
All-weather day and night capability.
Wide operational range and longest ranges in its class.
High accuracy for efficient use of the ammunition.
High saturation firing capability.
Deployment against different types of targets.
ROCKETS
The launcher is capable of firing rockets of different calibers armed with a range of warheads.
The SS-30 rocket, caliber 127mm, can be loaded with 32 rounds per launcher and has a range between 9km and 30km.
The SS-40 rocket, caliber 180mm, can be loaded with 16 rounds per launcher and has a range between 15km and 35km.
The SS-60/SS-80 rocket, caliber 300mm, can be loaded with 4 rounds per launcher and has a range between 20km and 80km.
Avibras has developed a Tactical Missile for launch from ASTROS II. The autonomously-guided Astros TM will have a range of 300km and can be fitted with a variety of warheads.
Cluster munitions warheads and dual purpose anti-armour and anti-personnel bomblets for increased area saturation are available for the SS-40, SS-60 and SS-80 rockets. A high explosive white phosphorous incendiary warhead provides anti-personnel, smoke deployment and materiel incendiary capability. A mine deployment warhead carries anti-personnel and anti-materiel mines. An anti-runway warhead which is equipped with a delayed action fuse has the capability of penetrating reinforced concrete runways to a depth of nearly 0.5m.
VEHICLE
All the Astros II vehicles are based on the Astros Standard Chassis AV-VBA 6 x 6, 10t off-road vehicle which is supplied by Tectran Engenharia, a subsidiary of Avibras based in Sao Jose dos Campos, Brazil. The vehicle has a maximum speed of 90km/h and is fitted with a Mercedes-Benz 280hp diesel engine.

 

[Kaiser]

The Chinese Type 90 might also be closely looked into

The Type 90 is the second-generation truck-mounted 122mm 40-tube multiple launch rocket system developed by China North Industries Group Corporation (NORINCO) in the mid-1990s as a successor to the Type 81 122mm rocket system. The Type 90 has been promoted by NORINCO to the export market, but has yet received any order. The improved Type 90B was first revealed in 2004.
PROGRAMME
The PLA developed the Type 81 122mm 40-tube multiple launch rocket system based on the Soviet BM-21 ‘Grad’ in the early 1980s. In the mid-1990s NORINCO revealed a new 122mm rocket system design known as Type 90. The biggest difference on the Type 90 is the reload pack carrying 40 spare rockets, which can reload the rocket launcher within 3 minutes after the first launch, providing additional firepower with quick turnarounds. The launcher is mounted on the improved North-Benz 2629 6X6 truck, which possesses better performance compared to the Yan’an SX2150 truck used by the Type 81.
The Type 90 is also supported by a large formation of ground equipment including a battery command truck, rocket reloading trucks, reconnaissance APC, meteorological radar, and maintenance vehicles. Greater firing accuracy is ensured by the use of a computerised fire-control system integrated with GPS on the improved Type 90B. The weapon system could deliver intensive fire-power over a distance of 40km within a very short period. The weapon was designed to engage large area targets such as armour formation, airport, weapon storages, etc. NORINCO has developed a range of warheads for different purposes.
ARMAMENT
The Type 90 fires 122mm fin-stabilised free rockets to a minimum range of 10~12km and a maximum range of 20~40km depending on the rocket type. The combination of spin- and fin-stabilisation ensures closely grouped fire. The rocket can deliver High-Explosive (HE), High-Explosive Fragmentation (HE-FRAG), High-Explosive Incendiary (HEI), anti-tank/anti-personnel submunitions, and mind-laying warheads of 18.3~22kg at standard range, or 26~28kg at reduced range. These rockets could also be launched from the older Type 81 rocket system.
GROUND EQUIPMENT
A typical Type 90 multiple launch rocket system battalion comprises the battalion headquarters and three firing units (companies). The battalion headquarter is equipped with:

• A battalion command truck;
• 3 reconnaissance APC;
• A meteorological radar truck;
• A mechanical maintenance truck;
• A electronic maintenance truck

Each firing unit is equipped with:

• A company command truck;
• 6 rocket launch trucks
• 6 reloading trucks

COMMAND TRUCK
The battalion/company command trucks are in the form of workshop shelter mounted on 6X6 North-Benz 2629 trucks. They are the command and control centre for artillery firepower resources and used for planning out the effective application of firepower. The battalion command truck is responsible for control and coordination of the three firing units (companies), and the company command trucks perform individual trajectory calculations and corrections, data processing and management for a company of up to six rocket launch trucks. The command trucks are equipped with radio and intercoms for communications, and GPS for accurate positioning.
ARMAMENT
The free rocket used by the WS-1 and WS-1B consists of the warhead and fuse, an FG-42/43 rocket motor and the tail section. The FG-42/43 rocket motor is a single chamber, solid rocket motor with an advanced hydroxy-terminated polybutadine (HTPB) composition rocket propellant. The rocket of the WS-2 system features four control surfaces in the middle section of the rocket for terminal guidance.
The rocket can be fitted with various types of warheads including anti-armour/personnel submunition, blasting, fuel air explosive (FAE), and high-explosive (HE). The ZDB-2 blasting warhead is loaded with steel balls and prefabricated fragments. The SZB-1 submunition warhead is designed to destroy large area targets such as armour formation and infantry troops. When the SZB-1 submunition warhead detonates, around 500 bullets are expelled under high pressure.
LAUNCH TRUCK
The rocket launch truck uses a North-Benz 2629 6X6 truck. The electrically powered launcher has four rows of 10 tubes mounted above each other on a rotating cradle assembly. The launch tubes have an elevation range of 0° to 55° and azimuth range of -102° to +102°. The truck is equipped with two hydraulically operated stabilisers at rear which are lowered in preparation for the rocket launch.
The rocket launcher can be operated in manual, semi-automatic, or automatic modes. The electrical firing system fires the rockets in either single or in salvo with 0.5 seconds interval. The launcher can be operated inside the driver’s cab or remotely outside the vehicle. The reloading rack located in front of the launcher can load the launcher in under 3 minutes. The truck is equipped with a hydraulically operated foldable canvas cover, which covers the launcher and the reloading rack when the truck is in travelling mode.
The vehicle is fitted with slope and gradient sensors, launcher elevation and and azimuth sensors, as well as GPS and computerised fire control system to ensure higher firing accuracy.
RECONNAISSANCE APC
The artillery reconnaissance vehicle for the Type 90B is based on the 6X6 WZ551 wheeled armoured personnel carrier. The vehicle is located at front position for target acquisition and surveillance. The reconnaissance APC is equipped with portable laser rangefinder with a maximum range of 10,000m and an accuracy of +/-5m; thermal imager for nigh operations; radio communications; message processor; and panoramic periscopes.
SPECIFICATIONS
Rocket calibre: 122mm
Number of tubes: 40
Rocket length: 2,870mm (20km range HE); 2,757mm (30km range HE); 2,900mm (40km range HE)
Rocket weight: 67kg (20km range HE); 61kg (30km range HE)
Warhead: 18.3kg
Min firing range: 9~12km
Max firing range: 20~40km
Rate of fire: 40 rounds in 18~20 seconds
Reloading time: 3 minutes
Launch vehicle road speed: 85km/h
Launch vehicle travelling range: 800km

 

[master_fx]

i dont think is necessary at the momment.... would be better to buy more PLZ45 155mm and fc-1.....

 

[Kaiser]

Actually MRL's wreaked alot of heavok on the iraqi army in both gulf wars especially the Astro's II

MRL are area weapons and can do alot of damage. I would personally like to see pakistan go for 200 Astro's II and liscence produce more in Pakistan. That would give pakistan armor forces unformidable support which the Indians will be far from matching

 

[A.Rahman]

Actually MRL's wreaked alot of heavok on the iraqi army in both gulf wars especially the Astro's II

MRL are area weapons and can do alot of damage. I would personally like to see pakistan go for 200 Astro's II and liscence produce more in Pakistan. That would give pakistan armor forces unformidable support which the Indians will be far from matching

Ofcourse, before that happened air superiority was established, but thats totally another topic. but you get the point.

btw what kind of MRL's pakistan has? or they can get in future?

 

[Kaiser]

We currently make our own MRL's which arnt really good when compared to modern ones. The chinese have made vast improvements in rocket technology ecpecially on there A-100 which I would rate atleast on par with the Russian Smerch which India recently aquired.

Pakistan might also go for the brazilian Astro's II which will be cheap, proven, reliable, universal missile platform (pakistan can modifie its own rockets to be used and even modfy babur to be used) and best of all TOT is a huge possibility

 

[A.Rahman]

taken from pakdef:

Unfortunately, Pakistan does not produce artillery pieces not even the field type what to talk of medium pieces. Its entire range of guns is either of US or Chinese origin. Of the more prominent equipment with Chinese origin are the 130 MM guns and the entire assets of the MRL ( Multiple Rocket Launchers.) Pakistan holds a sizable chunk of lower calibre weapons of Chinese origin such as the 85mm, 122 mm, PRC Type 54, etc. The MRLs which played a pivotal role in the 1991 Gulf War are known for saturating the battlefield with steel rain and splinters I are a deadly weapon and even the tanks are not safe against them. Pakistan holds MRL 122.mm quantity 45 ( PRC- Type 83).

 

[Kaiser]

We also sold a small amount of Chinese WS-1B but I think were better off getting Chinese A-100's in large numbers and Astros II with TOT and liscense production at HIT (HIT can use alittle MRL tech skills)

 

[A.Rahman]

We also sold a small amount of Chinese WS-1B but I think were better off getting Chinese A-100's in large numbers and Astros II with TOT and liscense production at HIT (HIT can use alittle MRL tech skills)

yes, I would love to see Pak army armed with that, lets see how it works out in future

 

[sigatoka]

Whats wrong with Artillery? Artillery is more accurate, does not expend as much ammunition to achieve goals and provides more employment.

 

[Kaiser]

MRL's are area weapons mainly used to cover large area's with enemy's. 1 NATO regiment of MRL's equiped with metal fragment rockets can cover an area of 365,000 Square feet.

MRL's can be used to decimate enemy armor and positions at long rages while Artillery can be used tacticly to destroy roads, bases, enemy lines, infantry etc

 

[master_fx]

WS-2 would be much better.... with range of 200km

http://www.sinodefence.com/army/mrl/weishi7a.jpg

 

[Kaiser]

Range isnt everything how much area can 2 rockets cover?

Were better off using our own mrl's and BM's than the WS-2

A-100 is by far the best chinese MRL

 

[sigatoka]

MRL's are area weapons mainly used to cover large area's with enemy's. 1 NATO regiment of MRL's equiped with metal fragment rockets can cover an area of 365,000 Square feet.

MRL's can be used to decimate enemy armor and positions at long rages while Artillery can be used tacticly to destroy roads, bases, enemy lines, infantry etc

Ah yes But is the quantity of explosives delivered greater over 24hour period when reloading of rockets is taken into account compared to shell Artillery??

The truth is that conventional Artillery shells can deliver higher quantity of explosives when reloading is taken into account and conflicts rarely last less than 2 hours, modern conflicts go for around at least one week.