Fresh clashes erupt between Azerbaijan, Armenia

[dBSPL]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1570112568122818562

https://twitter.com/x/status/1570158021556441088

 

[Foinikas]

The cocky tone of their PM before the war was astonishing.

Wait a minute,which PM are you talking about? If it's Pashinyan,yes he is an idiot. He is either too incompetent or he wanted to start such a war and leave NKR alone,so he could sign all the deals with Turkey and Azerbaijan.

They actually started this war and got beaten badly.

No they didn't. For many years there were incidents or small skirmishes at the borders of NKR,but nothing crazy. They would snipe or shoot each others soldiers,shell a guardpost or trenches or a small base,but not that often.

In 2020,it was the Azeris who started the attack. And if you remember,Turkey and Azerbaijan had some common exercises during the summer,before the war.Some Turkish soldiers and equipment never left Azerbaijan.

As for now,again it's Azerbaijan's fault. They invaded and captured parts of Armenia proper in 2021 and never left.

If they were any better, they would have settled issue in 30 years but instead they threatened to take more territory.

You think the Azeris wanted to settle this? Aliyev would have fallen if he gave all that land to Armenia or even half of it. Plus,the war was still fresh and they had little chance of negotiating succesfully.

Azerbaijanis are still good ppl to let them keep much of NK.

I'm sorry,what are you talking about?

This is the agreement after the 2020 war:

Azerbaijan was given all the red parts,although they hadn't captured them. Do you know what happened in the areas where Azeris got? Despite promises of protecting the Armenian churches and monasteries,they either left them in ruins,demolished them,they started destroying Armenian crosses and monuments here and there,they started harassing locals,even in villages close to areas they were not given,telling them to leave,sending them messages asking to buy their houses,I remember a case where they even harassed a village with a loudspeakers.

They harassed farmers,drivers passing by from checkpoints,tearing or covering the stickers with the NKR flag or the license plates. Doesn't that remind you a bit of Zionist tactics?

Pashinyan: No document will be signed between Armenia and Azerbaijan

Prime Minister Nikol Pashinyan said that no document would be signed...

news.am

This maps shows Azerbaijan and Armenia territory all over the place. No wonder they're fighting.

View attachment 879170

Bhai,check post #74

 

[Foinikas]

Pakistan should provide support to Azerbaijan in the form of supplying weapons to them or any military advice they need or training.

Azerbaijan is our important ally and alliance with Azerbaijan serves our national interests. Azeris can give us oil or gas in exchange for weapons and ammunitions. Azerbaijan serves as a counter to Iran. Iran is our regional rival and Azerbaijan can be used to keep them in check if they get too close to india.
Also, helping Azeris and Turks in this war would mean they would help us in our war.
We need strong allies in the region.
Our alliance with Azerbaijan and Turkey is a natural alliance. We don’t care who the aggressor in their war is, we care about having a strong ally in the region which can serve as a counter to our other regional rivals should they act up and harm us.
We need strong allies in every region of the world and Azerbaijan is our best ally for their region.

Has Azerbaijan EVER helped Pakistan in a war? Did they ever care for Kashmir? Do you know they're good friends with Israel and Russia? Russia supports India and Israel supports ...well India and a lot of others. What's with this dumb logic some Pakistanis have? "Oh they're friends with Turkey...they are also muslims...we should be friends". What is this? You don't check the diplomacy first,you don't even see who's right or wrong,you just going like "Ertugrul Ertugrul we should help Azerbaijan".

What's this mentality?

 

[dBSPL]

Wait a minute,which PM are you talking about? If it's Pashinyan,yes he is an idiot. He is either too incompetent or he wanted to start such a war and leave NKR alone,so he could sign all the deals with Turkey and Azerbaijan.


No they didn't. For many years there were incidents or small skirmishes at the borders of NKR,but nothing crazy. They would snipe or shoot each others soldiers,shell a guardpost or trenches or a small base,but not that often.

In 2020,it was the Azeris who started the attack. And if you remember,Turkey and Azerbaijan had some common exercises during the summer,before the war.Some Turkish soldiers and equipment never left Azerbaijan.

As for now,again it's Azerbaijan's fault. They invaded and captured parts of Armenia proper in 2021 and never left.


You think the Azeris wanted to settle this? Aliyev would have fallen if he gave all that land to Armenia or even half of it. Plus,the war was still fresh and they had little chance of negotiating succesfully.


I'm sorry,what are you talking about?

This is the agreement after the 2020 war:

View attachment 879177

Azerbaijan was given all the red parts,although they hadn't captured them. Do you know what happened in the areas where Azeris got? Despite promises of protecting the Armenian churches and monasteries,they either left them in ruins,demolished them,they started destroying Armenian crosses and monuments here and there,they started harassing locals,even in villages close to areas they were not given,telling them to leave,sending them messages asking to buy their houses,I remember a case where they even harassed a village with a loudspeakers.

They harassed farmers,drivers passing by from checkpoints,tearing or covering the stickers with the NKR flag or the license plates. Doesn't that remind you a bit of Zionist tactics?


Bhai,check post #74

There are dozens of videos on the Internet. Armenians who settled after 93 setting their houses even forests on fire instead of handing them over.

I can bring here hundreds of documents showing how Azerbaijani towns were completely destroyed in these regions, mosques were destroyed and all cultural traces of the Azerbaijani people were destroyed.

Do you have a single message on this forum about Armenia's terrible cultural destruction? No, then stop making propaganda, over mostly false claims.

 

[Foinikas]

The Soviets created such complex borders and played with demographics in all the territories they were withdrawing from that there are problems in many regions. You can research the Fergana valley for example, three different central Asian countries have come very close to fighting a few times in the past. Finally, in recent years, this danger has been overcome with mutual dialogue. The same should be for Karabakh/zengazur.

Soviets always destroyed borders by mixing populations here and there or giving a part of a republic to another republic. For example Crimea,Transnistria...maybe something in Turkestan,South Ossetia and Abkhazia to Georgia and like you mentioned...Nagorno-Karabakh,full of Armenians,to Azerbaijan. So many problems because of that.

 

[dBSPL]

Soviets always destroyed borders by mixing populations here and there or giving a part of a republic to another republic. For example Crimea,Transnistria...maybe something in Turkestan,South Ossetia and Abkhazia to Georgia and like you mentioned...Nagorno-Karabakh,full of Armenians,to Azerbaijan. So many problems because of that.

The problem is that while the Armenians in Azerbaijan mostly remained on their lands, the Azerbaijanis who remained in Armenia were either killed or their lands were usurped.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Soviets always destroyed borders by mixing populations here and there or giving a part of a republic to another republic. For example Crimea,Transnistria...maybe something in Turkestan,South Ossetia and Abkhazia to Georgia and like you mentioned...Nagorno-Karabakh,full of Armenians,to Azerbaijan. So many problems because of that.

The Soviets transferred a chunk of Estonia to Russia after WW2 which Estonia still claims. Ivangorod.

 

[Foinikas]

There are dozens of videos on the Internet. Armenians who settled after 93 setting their houses on fire instead of handing them over.

Yes,that's what many do. They set them on fire,instead of letting Azeris take them.

I can bring here hundreds of documents showing how Azerbaijani towns were completely destroyed in these regions, mosques were destroyed and all cultural traces of the Azerbaijani people were destroyed.

Because Azeris didn't destroy Armenian towns before and after the '90s war?
And ffs you were complaining about Armos not keeping their part of the deal.

Do you have a single message on this forum about Armenia's terrible cultural destruction? No, then stop making propaganda, over mostly false claims.

What single message do you want? False claims?

Here,here's superior Azeri culture:

Monumental loss: Azerbaijan and 'the worst cultural genocide of the 21st century'

A damning new report details an attempted erasure by Azerbaijan of its Armenian cultural heritage, including the destruction of tens of thousands of Unesco-protected ancient stone carvings

www.theguardian.com

A damning new report details an attempted erasure by Azerbaijan of its Armenian cultural heritage, including the destruction of tens of thousands of Unesco-protected ancient stone carvings




The 21st century’s most extensive campaign of cultural cleansing to date may not have happened in Syria, as you might assume, but a largely ignored part of the Transcaucasian plateau.
According to a lengthy report published in the art journal Hyperallergic in February, the Azerbaijani government has, over the past 30 years, been engaging in a systematic erasure of the country’s historic Armenian heritage. This official, albeit covert, destruction of cultural and religious artefacts exceeds Islamic State’s self-promotional dynamiting of Palmyra, according to the report’s authors, Simon Maghakyan and Sarah Pickman.

Here,here's your brave Azeris:

https://www.reddit.com/r/KarabakhConflict/comments/jqsoi3

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/j931CYby4qc

Aaah cultured people. So different from "barbaric Armenians".

The problem is that while the Armenians in Azerbaijan mostly remained on their lands, the Azerbaijanis who remained in Armenia were either killed or their lands were usurped.

Ah da?

 

[Ahmadbhutta01]

To my turk friends , Greek is an old man of Europe . Don't fall for the trap the powers behind it want to engage turk with Greek to weaken turkey
Just ignore the poor Greek they will die of their old age

 

[MMM-E]

What single message do you want? False claims?

Here,here's superior Azeri culture:

Armenian terrorism against Azerbaijan

Armenia fired dozens of Ballistic Missiles on Azerbaijani cities to kill civilians

Some of the mosques have been turned into pig styes.
144 mosques, 192 tombs/visits and hundreds of monuments were destroyed by Armenians in Karabakh

Armenia has not only massacred civilians but also destroyed cultural and historical heritage in Karabakh, which it has occupied for 30 years

If Armenia treats Azerbaijan , then Armenia gets the same response

 

[Sayfullah]

Has Azerbaijan EVER helped Pakistan in a war? Did they ever care for Kashmir? Do you know they're good friends with Israel and Russia? Russia supports India and Israel supports ...well India and a lot of others. What's with this dumb logic some Pakistanis have? "Oh they're friends with Turkey...they are also muslims...we should be friends". What is this? You don't check the diplomacy first,you don't even see who's right or wrong,you just going like "Ertugrul Ertugrul we should help Azerbaijan".

What's this mentality?

Azerbaijan diplomatically has always sided with Pakistan on Kashmir issue.
The point for our alliance with Azeris is to keep Iran in line.
By that logic even china, Arabs and most the world have relationships with Israel and india.
My logic isn’t because they are Turkeys friend or Muslims. Azerbaijan isn’t even a Muslim country it’s secular.
The mentality behind it is, Iran and Pakistan bought want their influence over some areas and Iran has influence in Pakistan via having links to certain sects. Iran and Pakistan’s interests in many areas are against each other like Afghanistan. Iran’s military might is growing and so is their influence. Baloch militants use Iran as a safe haven. Iran has good and strong ties to india. Pakistan’s with Azerbaijan is because if Iran acts up, we have ways to pressure it. This is thinking in the future because Pakistan wants Gwadar to be the link to Central Asia and influence in Afghanistan. Iran is a rival to these goals. Iran isn’t a open enemy but it’s a rival in the region. All our rivals should be kept in check if they try messing with us.
A strong Iran with strong ties to india is a threat to Pakistan. Pakistan must counter this threat with strong ties with Azerbaijan and it already has strong ties with many Arab countries and its influence in Afghanistan.

Many like you won’t understand. You have to think critically and only a Pakistani knows how much harm Iran has already done in Pakistan and what it can do. Iran’s IRGC actively supports Baloch groups against Pakistan while recruiting our citizens to fight their wars and it supports our enemies in Afghanistan.

And for those who deny Iran is our rival and hidden enemy, your living in a fantasy.

 

[Foinikas]

The point for our alliance with Azeris is to keep Iran in line.

You guys don't have major problems with Iran though,do you? I thought most of the support for the Baloch seperatists comes from India.

To my turk friends , Greek is an old man of Europe . Don't fall for the trap the powers behind it want to engage turk with Greek to weaken turkey
Just ignore the poor Greek they will die of their old age

Stop smoking that thing.

 

[Sayfullah]

You guys don't have major problems with Iran though,do you? I thought most of the support for the Baloch seperatists comes from India.

India supports Baloch terrorists through Iran and previously Afghanistan. blf is based out of Iran. Indian spy khulbushan was arrested and he entered Pakistan through Iran. Iran vetoed OIC resolution on Kashmir in 94 at Indias request. Iran recruits fighters from Pakistan to join terrorist groups like zainibyon. Iran engages in sectarianism in Pakistan. Iranians kill innocent baloch traders on pak Iran border often. Iran supports northern alliance and now nrf in AFG and supports people like amrullah saleh who are very anti pak and against our interests in AFG. Chabahar is a rival to Gwadar. Iranians when india violated our sovereignty in 2019 had also threatened a “surgical strike” before Indians did one. Many Iranian generals have made hostile remarks towards Pakistan. Just this year Pakistan has arrested tons of Iranian agents which infiltrated Pakistani institutions.
Iran is not our ally but our rival and sometimes enemy. We need something to keep them in line when they act as our enemy.

 

[PakAlp]

The status changed in 2021. The Susha declaration has almost transformed the security cooperation between Azerbaijan and Turkiye into a confederation format. Pursuant to the agreement, if a declaration of war on the territorial integrity of one of the Parties is made, the other country considers this attack to have been committed against itself.

Russia's attitude will be an important factor in easing this crisis. While Russia-Turkiye relations are moving towards the best point in history after centuries, it would not be the right approach to expect Armenia to allow it to sabotage it.

Let me share two views from the Russian press:

Igor Korotchenko:
"Armenia will either sign a peace agreement with Azerbaijan on the basis of the five principles proposed by President Ilham Aliyev, or Armenia will fall into chaos, lose its statism and disappear from the world political map."

Maxim Shevchenko:
"It is not profitable for Russia to get involved in this conflict. Turkiye, which supports Azerbaijan, is Russia's partner. If Turkiye becomes our enemy, the Russian economy will not last long."

The Soviets created such complex borders and played with demographics in all the territories they were withdrawing from that there are problems in many regions. You can research the Fergana valley for example, three different central Asian countries have come very close to fighting a few times in the past. Finally, in recent years, this danger has been overcome with mutual dialogue. The same should be for Karabakh/zengazur.

I agree. The borders between Armenia and Azerbaijan look like they were designed to keep them fighting, similar to India Pakistan issue, they left Asia but divided us in a such a way that we'll keep fighting.

You guys don't have major problems with Iran though,do you? I thought most of the support for the Baloch seperatists comes from India.

Pakistan doesn't have any land disputes with Iran etc. The only issue is Iran has rivalry with a certain nation and they will never allow us make an alliance with Iran but they themselves have recently tried to make amends with Iran. Pakistan gets used by master nations. Iran must be stupid if they support Baloch rebels because the rebels want Iranian Balochistan aswell. Both nations need to make joint security force to manage the border region but they always fail to do it, i wonder why?

 

[Foinikas]

To my turk friends , Greek is an old man of Europe . Don't fall for the trap the powers behind it want to engage turk with Greek to weaken turkey
Just ignore the poor Greek they will die of their old age

Stop smoking that thing.

India supports Baloch terrorists through Iran and previously Afghanistan. blf is based out of Iran. Indian spy khulbushan was arrested and he entered Pakistan through Iran. Iran vetoed OIC resolution on Kashmir in 94 at Indias request. Iran recruits fighters from Pakistan to join terrorist groups like zainibyon. Iran engages in sectarianism in Pakistan. Iranians kill innocent baloch traders on pak Iran border often. Iran supports northern alliance and now nrf in AFG and supports people like amrullah saleh who are very anti pak and against our interests in AFG. Chabahar is a rival to Gwadar. Iranians when india violated our sovereignty in 2019 had also threatened a “surgical strike” before Indians did one. Many Iranian generals have made hostile remarks towards Pakistan. Just this year Pakistan has arrested tons of Iranian agents which infiltrated Pakistani institutions.
Iran is not our ally but our rival and sometimes enemy. We need something to keep them in line when they act as our enemy.

That does change things then