France's Mistral Warship Deal With Russia Is Off

[Gazprom]

Russia can manage without the Mistrals but what happens to French reputation

Simple. It is finished. France has two options
1) Deliver
2) Suffer reputation and loss of future potential profits.

 

[atatwolf]

Yes, Good idea. After it is delivered to india,even better we will sell it to Russia in exchange for more nuclear submarine tech . Maybe ,Borei the most silent SSBN this time.

You need some balls to do that

IMHO it would be a bad choice. For India it is the best if it listens to Anglo-Saxons.

As I said. You don't want to go down the road of Russia's anti-western tirade. Last time they did that under the Soviet Union they fractured in a thousand pieces and are licking their wounds ever since.

 

[Gazprom]

You need some balls to do that

IMHO it would be a bad choice. For India it is the best if it listens to Anglo-Saxons.

As I said. You don't want to go down the road of Russia's anti-western tirade. Last time they did that under the Soviet Union they fractured in a thousand pieces and are licking their wounds ever since.

Don't worry .We have the balls to do that. The last time we did a nuclear test with repercussions being sanctions of USA. We can do it again.

As for Russian tirade ,its against the petrodollar as of now. Maybe Russia could make rupee a petrorupee like how it has made yuan a petroyuan. Being a petro exchange currency means fabulous wealth.

 

[mike2000]

What about uk relationship with usa nowadays.

lool if you have been following my posts on here, then you wouldnt have said that. i always try and look past my country/countries wise. When i want to have a mature/constructive discussion with others(especially on a defence/discussion forum like this one) i try as much as possible not to be biased unlike most members here(well you seem to be the exception as well.).

In this regard, i have said before, that yes the U.K (and the west in general) is a junior partner to the U.S, since no country in the world today is an equal to the U.S, so you cant expect us to be equals. The U.S is simply too far ahead in major fields technologically,financially, economically,allainces, and most of all military for any country to claim equality with it(FOR NOW).
So we being allies, is also because our interests in the west are better served by having the U.S as world leader/Superpower than say having Russia or China. So of course we woill obviously follow our own interests and be closer to the U.S than otherwise. Since the U.S can offer us more than other rival/aspiring powers in the east. Its simply a question of interests bros.

So we will keep our close relaionship with the U.S for a long time to come, until maybe external conditions/interests again changes in future, then this will/can be reviewed. But until then it will remain this way. It all but normal, every country should be looking after their interests first and foremosts. It has nothing to do with friendship. So i was just pointing out that those of your Indian brothers who claim 'best friendship' with Russia are being a little bit Naive. I have never claimed we are 'all weather friends' with the U.S. Even if some politicans say that, its usually just politicking(they themselves know its a big lie, as interests comes before evrything else). There is no such thing as friends in politics at all, and never will there be Unfortunately. Its everyone for himself and looking for the best way to protect your interests/seek coutnries with whom they match

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Simple. It is finished. France has two options
1) Deliver
2) Suffer reputation and loss of future potential profits.

If this matter is not resolved soon Putin will put utmost pressure on India
for delaying the Rafale

We have got far too many projects going on with Russia both
declared and undeclared

Rafale is for our future needs

Russia can affect ; BOTH ways ; our military strength almost immediately

 

[atatwolf]

Don't worry .We have the balls to do that. The last time we did a nuclear test with repercussions being sanctions of USA. We can do it again.

As for Russian tirade ,its against the petrodollar as of now. Maybe Russia could make rupee a petrorupee like how it has made yuan a petroyuan. Being a petro exchange currency means fabulous wealth.

India won't listen to UK and US....

 

[Gazprom]

If this matter is not resolved soon Putin will put utmost pressure on India
for delaying the Rafale

We have got far too many projects going on with Russia both
declared and undeclared

Rafale is for our future needs

Russia can affect ; BOTH ways ; our military strength almost immediately

Russia won't. It will ask India to implement currency swap agreements to full to hit the dollar hard. Thats his(putin) primary goal for now. France has told Russia via unofficial channels that it can fulfil the contract once tension reduce. France does not wish to be part of the mess created by US and EU.

But India could use this to advantage to pressure France to reduce cost and give the tech for rafale fully.

 

[mike2000]

US/Turkey relations is equal relation where we don't always agree but we are on the same level.

Huh......my friend Atawolf , i beg to differ. Turkey is not an equal to the U.S. far from it. Turkey is still not even an equal to the U.K/France or Germany to be honest. But Turkey is a regional middle eastern power though. One of the few(with Iran) i respect in the region for their strive for self sufficiency, indutrialization and advancements.

 

[mike2000]

Russia won't. It will ask India to implement currency swap agreements to full to hit the dollar hard. Thats his(putin) primary goal for now. France has told Russia via unofficial channels that it can fulfil the contract once tension reduce. France does not wish to be part of the mess created by US and EU.

But India could use this to advantage to pressure France to reduce cost and give the tech for rafale fully.

lool who told you France doesnt wish to be part of the so called mess we created? lol France is a western/EU country and nobody forced them with a nuclear war to stop the Mistral delievery to Russia. Their government took this stance themselves, if they had wanted, they could have easilly moved on with the deal(Yes we would have made some noise, but after few weeks everything would have died down/calm down/return to normal). So you have to look for other reasons to justify the french government decision other than saying they dont want to be part of the mess the U.S/E.U created, as if they are not part of that group.

Secondly, i agrre/like your last point. Yes i wouldnt mind at all if India used this occasion to its own benefit(though im not sure your 'best friend' Russia will be happy with this though.lol) and pressure France with Rafale deal, to get a better bargain and more TOT from France on the Rafale. Afterall, thats what any country would/should do, your own interests should come before anything/country, even 'all weather friend' Russia.

 

[Gazprom]

lool who told you France doesnt wish to be part of the so called mess we created? lol France is a western/EU country and nobody forced them with a nuclear war to stop the Mistral delievery to Russia. Their government took this stance themselves, if they had wanted, they could have easilly moved on with the deal(Yes we would have made some noise, but after few weeks everything would have died down/calm down/return to normal). So you have to look for other reasons to justify the french government decision other than saying they dont want to be part of the mess the U.S/E.U created, as if they are not part of that group.

Secondly, i agrre/like your last point. Yes i wouldnt mind at all if India used this occasion to its own benefit(though im not sure your 'best friend' Russia will be happy with this though.lol) and pressure France with Rafale deal, to get a better bargain and more TOT from France on the Rafale. Afterall, thats what any country would/should do, your own interests should come before anything/country, even 'all weather friend' Russia.

Don't worry about the best friend. The currency swap agreements is much bigger challenge to the West and the petrodollar with a multiplier effect lol. As of now,thats their focus. Not rafale or topol or borei. But the toppling of the petrodollar supremacy.

Second, The EU top leaders are alignment with the US neo-cons rather than constituent govts . Most of them with exception of Poland did not want to start what Victoria nuland and Catherine Ashton did in Ukraine which started the whole mess

 

[Abingdonboy]

For India

Rafales and Your French Subs contracts could possibly be put on hold or cancelled along with sanctions.

There is no way the two situations can be compared.

 

[atatwolf]

Huh......my friend Atawolf , i beg to differ. Turkey is not an equal to the U.S. far from it. Turkey is still not even an equal to the U.K/France or Germany to be honest. But Turkey is a regional middle eastern power though. One of the few(with Iran) i respect in the region for their strive for self sufficiency, indutrialization and advancements.

IMHO I think you are wrong. US wanted Turkey to join invasion of Iraq in 2003. We disagreed. With the fight against ISIS. We rejected them again since we value our own interests too. We have our own agenda. India doesn't have these capabilities. When UK said we are going to invade the middle-east in WW1. They took a sh1tload of Indian young men and send them to the front lines as cannonfodder. IMHO there is a difference between making your own choices and others making the choices for you.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Ohh man what did I just read... Indians admitting they are back stabbers hence not to be trusted

No, Indians admit that India looks out of its own interests as simple as that.

Putin is arriving in India next month and Obama the month after- show me another country who could pull this off.

 

[Abingdonboy]

@he-man

So now what precautions should India while finalising the Rafale deal

And if things get worse what if PUTIN asks India to CHOOSE between
Russia and France ie take More SU 30 / 35/ FGFA / AKULAs / and dump the
Rafale ; what should be our response

I believe India will be dragged into this mess

No way, India won't allow itself to be dragged into this mess nor do I believe Putin would ask such things of India.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

IMHO I think you are wrong. US wanted Turkey to join invasion of Iraq in 2003. We disagreed. With the fight against Assad. We rejected them again since we value our own interests too. India doesn't have these capabilities. When UK said we are going to invade the middle-east in WW1. They took a sh1tload of Indian young men and send them to the front lines as cannonfodder. IMHO there is a difference between making your own choices and others making the choices for you.

In WW1 and WW2 it was MASTER and SLAVES. My friend what happened to the Automan Empire after WW1 though you were on the wining side. Today wars are different and yes except for the invasion of Afghanistan Turkey did not approve to be part of USA.