Fighting hopelessness: Panama Case, JIT and the confusions

[Arsalan]

Reform electoral system as much, there will still not be a free and fair election with corruption at peak. Systems can be hacked and vote count changed easily when the regulator of the system is in the pocket.

So its a paradox then, because with out the public being a force that matters, one wont be able to root out the corruption at top.

 

[Vazir]

Nope ! There is nothing wrong with the constitution. It is PEOPLE who come in power use is it incorrectly.

Quite the opposite. The constitution is responsible for the hot mess of a public opinion system we have right now.

 

[Arsalan]

Got it this time.

Well! few things could have been done:

1). NS could have been kicked out with an interim PM put in place by the NA.
2). NAB chairman referred to SJC
3). Cases against the heads of FIA and FBR for not acting, and hence, dereliction of duty - even against their oaths.
4). JIT could still remain an option but the clout over it would have been lifted due to NS not being the PM.

Anyway, let us see what comes out in the next 6 weeks. I have a feeling that SC did consider the above as well but, due to some reason, they did not opt to go that way.

Ok, let me try and address this point by point

1. What good have NS being kicked out done? It would have been HIS parliament electing an acting PM that would have served his agenda. We all know that it would have been Ishaq Dar or Nisar. They would have interfered with the investigations as much as NS to get a favorable verdict. If the verdict was against NS then he would have cried foul and played the victim card, if it was in his favor being influenced by HIS acting PM, he would have asked claimed the process to be fair.
2. NAB chairman SHOULD have be punished. Sooner rather than latter and this would have sent out a strong message to the members of JIT too
3. FIA and FBR should have been summoned as well. However i do expect that to happen once the route cause is addressed (and i do hope that it will be, INSHALLAH)
4. Again, it makes no difference whether it is NS or Ishaq Dar as PM. the agenda of protecting the corrupt is one and same.

I just hope, pray and ask you to do the same (while spreading the awareness and message across) that this time, PAKISTAN wins as it might well be the last of our battles otherwise. We have bare the burden of the corrupt and this system for far too long already.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Ok, let me try and address this point by point

1. What good have NS being kicked out done? It would have been HIS parliament electing an acting PM that would have served his agenda. We all know that it would have been Ishaq Dar or Nisar. They would have interfered with the investigations as much as NS to get a favorable verdict. If the verdict was against NS then he would have cried foul and played the victim card, if it was in his favor being influenced by HIS acting PM, he would have asked claimed the process to be fair.
2. NAB chairman SHOULD have be punished. Sooner rather than latter and this would have sent out a strong message to the members of JIT too
3. FIA and FBR should have been summoned as well. However i do expect that to happen once the route cause is addressed (and i do hope that it will be, INSHALLAH)
4. Again, it makes no difference whether it is NS or Ishaq Dar as PM. the agenda of protecting the corrupt is one and same.

I just hope, pray and ask you to do the same (while spreading the awareness and message across) that this time, PAKISTAN wins as it might well be the last of our battles otherwise. We have bare the burden of the corrupt and this system for far too long already.

I agree.

In situations like these there is always more than one possible solution and more than one argument. Your arguments are another aspect of this situation.

The only issue I have is that we have been living with "InshaALLAH" for the last 70-years. Nation's patience is getting thin and things are reaching boiling point.

May be this is the last "InshaALLAH".

 

[Arsalan]

I agree.

In situations like these there is always more than one possible solution and more than one argument. Your arguments are another aspect of this situation.

The only issue I have is that we have been living with "InshaALLAH" for the last 70-years. Nation's patience is getting thin and things are reaching boiling point.

May be this is the last "InshaALLAH".

Its not just the patience that is getting thin my friend. Our resources are doing the same and I am sorry to say, and I hope I am being totally stupid when I say this, but I am not sure if we can survive the way we have been for 70 years for more than next 12-15 years AT BEST. We are already getting late for the change for good and this perhaps is one of our last chances. We need to get this one right or else we are doomed. 70 years is already stretching for too too long.

 

[Mansoon]

Panama Case: Hearing adjourned for two weeks as JIT submits report
May 22, 2017

By: Samaa Web Desk

Published in Pakistan

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ISLAMABAD: Supreme Court of Pakistan has adjourned the hearing of Panama Case for two weeks as the joint investigation team – probing the offshore assets of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and his family, submitted its initial report, Samaa reported.

According to details, a three-member of the top court headed by Justice Ejaz Afzal is hearing the case.

The sealed report was in two parts. The judges reviewed the JIT report in the court room.

Justice Ejaz remarked that the case has to be conclude the case in 60 days. He also said that the court cannot give additional time.

“We are not showing our lack of confidence in the report,” he said.

In the hearing, Counsel of Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) Fawad Chaudhry pleaded the court to provide the copy of the JIT report on Panama Case. The bench turned down his request.

Justice Ejaz, addressing Chaudhry, said that the law does not allow them to do so. He added that interference will not be allowed in this matter.

“This is a very serious and sensitive matter,” Justice Ejaz-ul-Hassan stated.

Additional Director General of Federal Investigation Agency (FIA) Wajid Zia had chaired 12 meetings in which records were sought from Election Commission of Pakistan (ECP), Federal Board of Revenue (FBR), State Bank of Pakistan (SBP) and National Accountability Bureau (NAB) were sought.

An interview of journalist Umar Cheema was also recorded by the JIT whereas officials investigating the Hudaibiya Paper Mills Case were also questioned by the investigators.

Leaders of PML-N and PTI were present in the court for the case hearing.

PML-N and PTI leaders have both said that the case hearing should be open so that there are no doubts. – SAMAA

 

[PakSword]

Alternative!! Suggest an alternative solution people, those who do not beleive in anything good coming from JIT and Panama Case!!

@Farah Sohail @PakSword @Verve @El Sidd
For for a long absence, was out of country and got back yesterday. So how are the things going? Short summary anyone?

Jis din awam sudher jaeingay, hukumraan bhi achay aajaeingay..

 

[Arsalan]

Jis din awam sudher jaeingay, hukumraan bhi achay aajaeingay..

Lo..

Yeh tu mein shuru sa he kahta aaraha hoon!!
But this is not a solution man, agrr yehi solution ha and we have to implement THIS tu phr yeh rona dhona kis baat ka ha?
It is true that the nation as a whole will need to change.

 

[PakSword]

Lo..

Yeh tu mein shuru sa he kahta aaraha hoon!!
But this is not a solution man, agrr yehi solution ha and we have to implement THIS tu phr yeh rona dhona kis baat ka ha?
It is true that the nation as a whole will need to change.

In my previous neighborhood, most of the people were rich, but corrupt. How did I find out about them? Because most of them used to pay some amount to the meter reader as bribe, so that he didn't report to the authorities that the meter was inside the house, not outside. I am sure that the money would go to higher authorities because when the meter reader changed, he didn't report as well.

Most of them, when discussing Pakistan's situation, used to criticize government on corruption. and give examples of western countries.

It was then I decided to take some action (through anonymous email), and alhamdolillah situation got better. I saw a couple of them (one used to say Azan in a local mosque as well) that meter reader had told him someone has reported about the theft.

---------------------------------

You can compare our nation to the employees of PIA. Most of them were hired on political affiliation, and now when the airline is going down, they are not ready to leave, or even search for new jobs. They are the reason of PIA's failure, and now criticizing government (which is also a party in creating this situation) for not handling the matters in the right manner.

---------------------------------

Another example is of a person, who is cutting a branch of a tree which sitting on it.

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[Arsalan]

In my previous neighborhood, most of the people were rich, but corrupt. How did I find out about them? Because most of them used to pay some amount to the meter reader as bribe, so that he didn't report to the authorities that the meter was inside the house, not outside. I am sure that the money would go to higher authorities because when the meter reader changed, he didn't report as well.

Most of them, when discussing Pakistan's situation, used to criticize government on corruption. and give examples of western countries.

It was then I decided to take some action (through anonymous email), and alhamdolillah situation got better. I saw a couple of them (one used to say Azan in a local mosque as well) that meter reader had told him someone has reported about the theft.

---------------------------------

You can compare our nation to the employees of PIA. Most of them were hired on political affiliation, and now when the airline is going down, they are not ready to leave, or even search for new jobs. They are the reason of PIA's failure, and now criticizing government (which is also a party in creating this situation) for not handling the matters in the right manner.

---------------------------------

Another example is of a person, who is cutting a branch of a tree which sitting on it.

---------------------------------

Our society is full of such examples. Talking about them is just the first step, we need to take the next step now. Change ourself, start pushing for it on a bigger level too.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Its not just the patience that is getting thin my friend. Our resources are doing the same and I am sorry to say, and I hope I am being totally stupid when I say this, but I am not sure if we can survive the way we have been for 70 years for more than next 12-15 years AT BEST. We are already getting late for the change for good and this perhaps is one of our last chances. We need to get this one right or else we are doomed. 70 years is already stretching for too too long.

True - Very true.

....and this (loss of patience in the society) is the biggest worry.

This country has a great great potential. Its just that we need the right leadership.

 

[Verve]

So its a paradox then, because with out the public being a force that matters, one wont be able to root out the corruption at top.

hence

things are reaching boiling point

 

[Guvera]

In my previous neighborhood, most of the people were rich, but corrupt. How did I find out about them? Because most of them used to pay some amount to the meter reader as bribe, so that he didn't report to the authorities that the meter was inside the house, not outside. I am sure that the money would go to higher authorities because when the meter reader changed, he didn't report as well.

Most of them, when discussing Pakistan's situation, used to criticize government on corruption. and give examples of western countries.

It was then I decided to take some action (through anonymous email), and alhamdolillah situation got better. I saw a couple of them (one used to say Azan in a local mosque as well) that meter reader had told him someone has reported about the theft.

---------------------------------

You can compare our nation to the employees of PIA. Most of them were hired on political affiliation, and now when the airline is going down, they are not ready to leave, or even search for new jobs. They are the reason of PIA's failure, and now criticizing government (which is also a party in creating this situation) for not handling the matters in the right manner.

---------------------------------

Another example is of a person, who is cutting a branch of a tree which sitting on it.

---------------------------------

Kahin woh meter reader Khurshid Shah tu nahi tha ? just curious

 

[Arsalan]

hence

That too is not a solution. Revolutions are thing of the past. With the world being a global village and vested interests of other nations, things are exploited way too quickly and it will always turn out the same way as that Arab Spring. Surely that didn't brought anything good for anyone. Any unrest in Pakistan will be exploited within matter of hours by other countries and we will be at a loss.

The best way remains to engage the public but via the medium that they are SUPPOSED to be engaged. Reforms there, struggle at the top level, spreading awareness, all these things and more are required, simultaneously, to get things right.

 

[Realistic Change]

That too is not a solution. Revolutions are thing of the past. With the world being a global village and vested interests of other nations, things are exploited way too quickly and it will always turn out the same way as that Arab Spring. Surely that didn't brought anything good for anyone. Any unrest in Pakistan will be exploited within matter of hours by other countries and we will be at a loss.

The best way remains to engage the public but via the medium that they are SUPPOSED to be engaged. Reforms there, struggle at the top level, spreading awareness, all these things and more are required, simultaneously, to get things right.

Absolutely - multipronged approach is required.

However - leadership is of pivotal importance in any game changing strategy. History (even most recent) is rife with examples where sincere leadership has transformed countries from almost oblivion to star performing levels in mere 20 or so years while some highly resourceful countries are tethering at the underdeveloped status for so long.