Exclusive: U.S. moves to cut Huawei off from global chip suppliers

[ILC]

The so-called "global chip suppliers" main actor is TSMC, an ethnic Chinese company and located just around 100km off the China coast and at least 10,000km from the US.

I can hardly believe the US can cut off TSMC from China. TSMC may depend somewhat on the US, but it much more depend on China.

Let's wait and see.

But they did it a few days ago. If TSMC were also producing its equipment which is using to produce chip, then they wouldn't give a 5 cent about American demands.

 

[Rusty]

I think xiaomi poco phones are OK, not the lower ends ones.


Come on... All corporations are tied to the government in some ways, CIA and Google are best friends.

In China every large corporation has to have CCP members on it's board as well as an office for those CCP members.

You know this, you were just hoping I didn't.
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-...nist-party-needs-curtail-its-presence-private

We can talk day and night about american companies and their connection to the government, but no company in China has ever or will ever fight back against the government

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/29/apple-vs-fbi-all-you-need-to-know.html

As a potential customer, I see a case where the government has a direct office in a company vs a company that is fighting against the strongest law enforcement agency in the nation to not open up back door.

This is what I mean by perception.

 

[IceCold]

Buy Vietnam phones!

Vsmart Live is superior to Realmi and Xiaomi in price and performance.

Chinese low end and medium range smartphones have no future.


https://www.chinahandys.net/vsmart-live/

We don't have these in Pakistan.

 

[gambit]

In China every large corporation has to have CCP members on it's board as well as an office for those CCP members.

He is going to argue that the entire boards of Alphabet (Google), Facebook, Microsoft, Instagram, Tinder, and so on...Are all CIA staffers.

 

[Paul2]

So what about building Islands in SCS? However here we can agree that's it is some kind of domestic issue, but with international consequences.

Another question what about belt and road initiative, A2B bank, and so on? I think that's the biggest international decision made by Xi, but I think in many cases these projects are a waste of money.

It's the same, you look at foreign matters, scratch, scratch, and you see an internal one.

Xi is of course not against doing some image projection exercises where he has an opportunity to have a photoshoot with world leaders, and be lauded as a great international statesman, but what he really did bigger than cutting the ribbon for all of that?

OBOR was started before Xi's administration, and kind of got quietly "rebranded" as Xi's idea. What is a bigger need for Xi here is to completely push out initiatives of previous establishments out of political life, because he wants to outshine Jiang, and Hu administrations, and render himself "beyond comparison."

It is a silent acknowledgement that he did not want his performance evaluation on diplomacy to be a topic of everyday discussion in the party.

 

[Rusty]

He is going to argue that the entire boards of Alphabet (Google), Facebook, Microsoft, Instagram, Tinder, and so on...Are all CIA staffers.

That's just part of it.
The training manual has the following instructions.

Start with what about ism
if that does not work, go off topic and peddle fake news.
still no?
start personal insults then ask mods to close the thread as everyone is off topic and insulting each other.
Still no?
Time to go Nuclear,
Accuse them of anti Chinese racism.

This plays out almost in every interaction.

 

[gambit]

I can hardly believe the US can cut off TSMC from China. TSMC may depend somewhat on the US, but it much more depend on China.

Ya better believe it. Huawei is not TSMC's only client.

TSMC's plan for a 12 bils US Arizona fab was probably planned before the Orange One became president. So when the Trump administration decide to go after Huawei, what do you think TSMC's board did? They sat down and calculate all the variables, such as other clients besides Huawei and how much estimated revenue loss versus consistent revenue from other clients that will also fall under US sanctions if they do not comply. The result: Screw Huawei.

There ain't no 'somewhat' about it, pal.

 

[Paul2]

Ya better believe it. Huawei is not TSMC's only client.

TSMC's plan for a 12 bils US Arizona fab was probably planned before the Orange One became president. So when the Trump administration decide to go after Huawei, what do you think TSMC's board did? They sat down and calculate all the variables, such as other clients besides Huawei and how much estimated revenue loss versus consistent revenue from other clients that will also fall under US sanctions if they do not comply. The result: Screw Huawei.

There ain't no 'somewhat' about it, pal.

There were no $12B laying around on their CapEx plan.

With all my knowledge of the industry, building a fab can not be an overnight decision in any way. Fab expansions, economic analysis can go for years before first blueprints are drafted.

If TSMC had anything like a second 5nm fab in mind, it would've at least tipped off investors at confidential meetings, and it wouldn't have been such a bombshell as it is now, and the biggest funds invested in TSMC wouldn't be scrambling to write "TSMCs matter being currently investigated" in their own IR press releases.

With how it is now, seeing a very expensive 5nm fab with just 20k starts per month materialise without any place in the strategic vision, makes little sense.

For anything else, just building a bigger 5nm plant, or extending it later would've made way more sense.

 

[Han Patriot]

In China every large corporation has to have CCP members on it's board as well as an office for those CCP members.

You know this, you were just hoping I didn't.
https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-...nist-party-needs-curtail-its-presence-private

We can talk day and night about american companies and their connection to the government, but no company in China has ever or will ever fight back against the government

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/29/apple-vs-fbi-all-you-need-to-know.html

As a potential customer, I see a case where the government has a direct office in a company vs a company that is fighting against the strongest law enforcement agency in the nation to not open up back door.

This is what I mean by perception.

Normally only SOEs have a party rep. For private companies, they encourage the owners to join the party. That's all man, we don't disguise shit like Google and sell shit to NSA. Links are pretty obvious. Lol

Since when am I hoping for anything, I have never denied any links of companies to CCP, I am just saying US does the same shit discreetly, appearing like a holy man. No difference between the 2 empires mate.

 

[Rusty]

Normally only SOEs have a party rep. For private companies, they encourage the owners to join the party. That's all man, we don't disguise shit like Google and sell shit to NSA. Links are pretty obvious. Lol

Since when am I hoping for anything, I have never denied any links of companies to CCP, I am just saying US does the same shit discreetly, appearing like a holy man. No difference between the 2 empires mate.

I like you.
You are really smooth.
"Yeah man, Chinese companies have to have ccp members in them, but it's no big deal"

"BUT you know what is a big deal? this unsubstantiated and unproven claims I am going to make but going to act like it's 100% true"

"So yeah, proven ccp involvement in companies and wild conspiracy theories on Google... both are the same!!!"


I once said you guys need to up you training, looks like you guys listened.

back on topic
At the end of the day it is Huawei, not Google, who has to prove they are not just another arm of the CCP, and CCP law of having members on the board makes that impossible.

 

[vi-va]

He is going to argue that the entire boards of Alphabet (Google), Facebook, Microsoft, Instagram, Tinder, and so on...Are all CIA staffers.

Full of CIA? True or not true, doesn't matter. Usually FBIs are enough.

When Trump throw the bones, and ask Alphabet (Google), Facebook, Microsoft, Instagram, Tinder, and so on to BIT,

They all BIT.

It doesn't matter if it's FBIs or CIAs, they are all US biting dogs.

 

[Han Patriot]

I like you.
You are really smooth.
"Yeah man, Chinese companies have to have ccp members in them, but it's no big deal"

"BUT you know what is a big deal? this unsubstantiated and unproven claims I am going to make but going to act like it's 100% true"

"So yeah, proven ccp involvement in companies and wild conspiracy theories on Google... both are the same!!!"


I once said you guys need to up you training, looks like you guys listened.

back on topic
At the end of the day it is Huawei, not Google, who has to prove they are not just another arm of the CCP, and CCP law of having members on the board makes that impossible.

I ain't gay, you don't have to like me. Lol
Dude SINCE DAY ONE I have never denied any links between Huawei and CCP. Do you know Cisco and gang works with CIA spying on allies like Germany and France. Come on don't be so naive, US is not the good guy, neither is China, we are both power competing.

Why the double standard? Why only Huawei need to explain, why not Google?

 

[Rusty]

Dude SINCE DAY ONE I have never denied any links between Huawei and CCP. Do you know Cisco and gang works with CIA spying on allies like Germany and France. Come on don't be so naive, US is not the good guy, neither is China, we are both power competing.

Like I said. I like you.

For sure, no one has doubts about US spying. Even US citizens have said it themselves.
But the US is smart enough to do it behind curtains.

China should learn from them.
Don't force CCP officials into companies and give people the feeling that they are not directly linked to the government.

 

[Han Patriot]

0

Like I said. I like you.

For sure, no one has doubts about US spying. Even US citizens have said it themselves.
But the US is smart enough to do it behind curtains.

China should learn from them.
Don't force CCP officials into companies and give people the feeling that they are not directly linked to the government.

This I agree, we need to learn from US sophistication. I think it's more about commie bashing rather than US doing it behind the curtains. US controls the propaganda machine in the West, they will believe whatever shit spewed out. There is a deep state within US dictating what to broadcast. Trump is actually the real hero of you ask me. The elites and deep state is quite OK doing business with China despite all the 'anti China' bashing.

 

[Han Patriot]

There were no $12B laying around on their CapEx plan.

With all my knowledge of the industry, building a fab can not be an overnight decision in any way. Fab expansions, economic analysis can go for years before first blueprints are drafted.

If TSMC had anything like a second 5nm fab in mind, it would've at least tipped off investors at confidential meetings, and it wouldn't have been such a bombshell as it is now, and the biggest funds invested in TSMC wouldn't be scrambling to write "TSMCs matter being currently investigated" in their own IR press releases.

With how it is now, seeing a very expensive 5nm fab with just 20k starts per month materialise without any place in the strategic vision, makes little sense.

For anything else, just building a bigger 5nm plant, or extending it later would've made way more sense.

I believe TSMC wants to balance China and US, they want to sell to both spheres.