Erdogan in China

[airmarshal]

@ Aryan_B

You keep mention about Turkey's NATO membership, right i agree to but that's a different story.. what's the difference with PAK-China basically the only difference is that you are a puppet of China and Turkey that of NATO.. and maybe even more? Why are you not opposing this? It is not honest from you.

No one should call one country another country's puppet. Its not that black and white. Turkey might have its own interests in giving its NATO membership precedence over any other foreign policy matter.

Pakistan's relation with China is a different dimension. China has been our most reliable ally. Its alliance with us is not transactional like US.

We are not experts here.

Lets get back to the topic.

Turkish PMs visit is recognition by Turkey to diversify its relationship. China as the worlds fastest growing economy is a logical choice. Also, worlds capital is shifting towards east. So its an intelligent move by Turks. I will be extremely happy if Pakistan can play a role in bringing China and Turkey much closer.

Wandering off topic, I would like to see RCD (Regional cooperation and Development)of 70s revived. This was economic cooperation between Iran, Pakistan and Turkey. Regional alliances wil make Pakistan stronger.

 

[lem34]

Inshallah, Pakistan will prosper. I think the Pakistani Military and ISI is not a puppet of US. They are working for national interests. Inshallah they will bring due change in the civilian government soon.

You are correct that is why we are getting so much criticism from American and western newspapers

 

[King Solomon]

Yep.AryanB and his kinds are spouting some nonsense they are taught.




Destruction of Chechnya:Accomplished



I explained it before.




I call it what it is.



Israel(you explained why) and Iran. Thanks to Iraq War which was a disaster for the Sunni power in there,Iran has got Iraq. Yankees know politics. They are using Shia to control Sunnis.




No need to parrot the same thing.

Chechnya is a local separatist movement, just like your PKK, which Russia has every right to use force in quenching it down. Unike Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Pakistan, which are not local rebellions in NATO. I doubt if you studied any "international relations" that you claimed to have studied before.

Israel(you explained why) and Iran. Thanks to Iraq War which was a disaster for the Sunni power in there,Iran has got Iraq. Yankees know politics. They are using Shia to control Sunnis.

So, you still deny Israel is the one who controls NATO? And that Turkey, by being a member of NATO, indirectly serves Israeli interests? And that Turkey, being member of NATO, is powerless to stop NATO from destroying Muslim countries?

And spare the shia sunni debate. Don't want to engage in any religious debate.

 

[lem34]

C

So, you still deny Israel is the one who controls NATO? And that Turkey, by being a member of NATO, indirectly serves Israeli interests? And that Turkey, being member of NATO, is powerless to stop NATO from destroying Muslim countries?

.

Very sad as I said very early we love our Turkish brothers but we are not blind and we do not apportion any blame on them

 

[mehmeTcc]

This puppet Turkey has biggest economy and has technologies that other Muslims can dream of.

This thread showed us how Muslim brotherhood fails. Türkün turkten başka dostu yoktur.

 

[damm1t]

Yes guys keep it up!
Let's keep humiliating each other, when israeli forummers involved this thread will be more enjoyable

 

[Kompromat]

That is not fair yaar. He is one of the most logical and rational posters her.

Then maybe i am retarded because what he wrote made absolute no sense to me.

Can I ask you something??

1. America because of it size dominates and has most influence on NATO-Yes

True

2. AIPAC dictates American foreign policy-Yes

No - Just US policy for Israel.

3. Tel Aviv-dictates to AIPAC -Yes

Israel centric

4. Turkey values its position in NATO over and above all considerations-Yes

They needed it at the time they joined , every country has sucked up to Americans at the time of need , Gulf , Iran , Pakistan to name a few. Just because you are collaborating with them doesn't mean you have joined a cult. US was a superpower & Turkey had interest in joining hands with them , its pure business.

The policy of Turkey is shifting ever since Erdogan came into power , NATO is something they needed then , but today they are looking at a Neo-Ottomon f.policy which is Independent to a great extent , look at what Erdogan did in Davos ? He blasted off Israelis right in front of the global media. He was the first one to jump into Libya , first PM of any nation to visit Somalia in 30 years. He HAS to work with the US , he has no choice otherwise if he starts acting like a lunatic which is probably the easiest thing to do , he will end up as Isolated as Iran and N Korea.

I have been a keen follower of Erdogan policies , i have bought every magazine with his cover pic. I can tell you for a fact that he is a highly intelligent , policy maker who has Turkish interests at heart regardless of his collaboration with the US which as i said before is a compulsion for his policies and it would be for some time.

Domestically he has increased per capita GDP income by 288% in JUST 8 years which is a living miracle. Internationally his f.policy is working & trust my words if you can that his f.policy as per my read and understanding is as Turkish centric as it could get.

It follows that Turkey is used as a post man from time to time. Yes Sir

Which country doesn't ?

This does not change the fact that we Pakistanis are brought up to love our Turkish Muslim brothers but these are facts.

This is a well established fact that we Pakistanis love Turks with a passion & its the same in Turkey , i have come across many turks who called me "Kardesh" {Brother}.

Look i can't speak on behalf of the Pakistani govt , because they are a bunch of retarded lunatics who don't know what they are doing. But i can tell you right now , that in my opinion , We don't or shouldn't respect or follow Turkey just because we love them but they have proven themselves to be a role model both economically and through their f.policy.

Erdogan says: Be good muslims , love your family , pay your taxes & pray in the Mosque but wear a business suit.
Regardless of what a bunch of people at PDF says about - we in a need to cut ourselves from the west , i say Turkish F.policy should be imitated to Pakistan. I want to have relations with the West , China and even India , i don't want to see my country Isolated globally. I say lets learn from this man , he is friendly to US to China , Russia , Africa and is loved in the middle east at the SAME time.

Doesn't it speak ANYTHING to you about the charisma of this man ? - he has achieved something , that not even Obama with his robust calls of a f.policy has been able to achieve.

 

[Cem_]

We value China and we accept we take into account China's concerns but you should do the same my friend you are part of Nato which recently in the last 10 years has been used as a killing machine of innocent Muslims aka collateral damage.

So you value relationship with China but expecting from Turkey to abandon NATO with empty hands to be surrounded by enemies+ after it a hostile NATO in our borders aswell. Are you okay?

By the way, you are ignoring THE massacres of Uygurs, they are muslim brothers too.. Either come up with real solutions and alternatives for all of us or stay silenced.

 

[ovarel]

Chechnya is a local separatist movement, just like your PKK, which Russia has every right to use force in quenching it down. Unike Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Pakistan, which are not local rebellions in NATO. I doubt if you studied any "international relations" that you claimed to have studied before.

Chechnya is not a movement,do you smoke something?Its a federal subject. Russians killed innocent civilians while using seperatists as an excuse,just like Israel.

And that Turkey, being member of NATO, is powerless to stop NATO from destroying Muslim countries?

Yes.Just as its powerless to stop Russians and Chinese(killing Uyghurs).

And spare the shia sunni debate. Don't want to engage in any religious debate.

So you want to ignore one of the most important factors in the region. That explains your simplistic ignorance.

And here i found something: An anti-imperialist coming with Air France.

 

[lem34]

This puppet Turkey has biggest economy and has technologies that other Muslims can dream of.

This thread showed us how Muslim brotherhood fails. Türkün turkten başka dostu yoktur.

No problems bro good luck to you. If Pakistan was in a position to join Nato and benefit I would push for it. Even if it meant that we would have to side with west. But I would accept and acknowledge the price.

Yes guys keep it up!
Let's keep humiliating each other, when israeli forummers involved this thread will be more enjoyable

sadly you are correct

No - Just US policy for Israel.

Israel centric


.

AIPAC controls the political leaders in America that is a fact and it is a fact that they have been assisting Hindu/Indian lobby in Washington so it is not just Israel centric

So you value relationship with China but expecting from Turkey to abandon NATO with empty hands to be surrounded by enemies+ after it a hostile NATO in our borders aswell. Are you okay?

By the way, you are ignoring THE massacres of Uygurs, they are muslim brothers too.. Either come up with real solutions and alternatives for all of us or stay silenced.

i am not asking you to give up Nato. but I am just stating that Turkey's policies are limited cos Nato is conflict with a lot of Muslim countries. we are constrained by our ally China but China is not killing Muslims like America is everywhere. I like the fact Turks and Chinese are cooperating

Now guys lets talk Turkey can you imagine if Turkey Iran and Pakistan could cooperate lol

 

[Alienoz_TR]

We value China and we accept we take into account China's concerns but you should do the same my friend you are part of Nato which recently in the last 10 years has been used as a killing machine of innocent Muslims aka collateral damage. Admit Nato has influence in Turk policy. Big difference China has not interfered and killed hundreds of thousand Muslims btw America has

I guess that persecution of Uighurs are censored in Pakistani media.

 

[lem34]

I guess that persecution of Uighurs are censored in Pakistani media.

Compared to the disproportionate response by America and it's war of terror it is minor relatively I would say.

Don't get me wrong America has every right to punish Al Qaeda etc for attacks on America. But their response to it was I would say disproportionate.

But don't forget Saddam was not involved with Osama, Taliban did offer to give Osama up before Afghanistan was attacked

 

[ovarel]

AIPAC controls the political leaders in America that is a fact and it is a fact that they have been assisting Hindu/Indian lobby in Washington so it is not just Israel centric



i am not asking you to give up Nato. but I am just stating that Turkey's policies are limited cos Nato is conflict with a lot of Muslim countries. we are constrained by our ally China but China is not killing Muslims like America is everywhere. I like the fact Turks and Chinese are cooperating

1.Then why do Obama and Rick Perry differ that much? On one hand,Obama calls Erdogan as a partner,on the other Perry calls Erdogan as an Islamic terrorist.

2.Turkey is powerless to help Pakistan in its conflict with NATO and the USA. Thats a fact noone would oppose. Thats why you should stick to China to have balance.I wouldnt want you to have a 3rd world ideology though.Its up to you. But if you say that China is not killing muslims(eerr how about Uyghurs then?) because it is "good",you are mistaken. If Chinese interests would require invading others then they are going to do that with pleasure.Right now they have no interest and the power to bully the Muslim world.If they had been the super-power,they wouldnt be more merciful,trust me.

Btw,i have nothing against China but these are the facts of this world.

 

[Cem_]

i am not asking you to give up Nato. but I am just stating that Turkey's policies are limited cos Nato is conflict with a lot of Muslim countries. we are constrained by our ally China but China is not killing Muslims like America is evrywhere

Okay, it's clear, u are hiding THE truth of muslim Uygurs just for some worthless interest, after this you dont have THE right to lecture Turkey about NATO membership it is our interest too so deal with it you hypocrite.

 

[Alienoz_TR]

Compared to the disproportionate response by America and it's war of terror it is minor relatively I would say.

Persecution of Crimean Tatars who have been forced out of their homeland, now reduced to 400.000. Denied to access their property.

Persecution of Uighurs which are at least 10 millions. They have been murdered, raped, forced to marry Han Chinese "occasionally"

Somebody should care for them, because No other Muslim country cares.