Emergency Imposed!

[Always Neutral]

Hon Bhangra,

I am willing to accept a corrupt PM such as Benazir and a President in uniform such as Musharraf, if it means peace and prosperity for Pakistan. To hell with idealism if it means more law and order problems, strikes and down turn in economy. I would go along pragmatism and take the path which would eventually lead to democracy to avoid needless disturbances. This is why I am worrried about what comes next than what has already happened. I have nothing more say on this subject.

Dear Niaz,

Very aptly put. Also any unstability in Pakistan also affects India so they would be foolish to feel any glee. The best would be that Gen M is given a 6 months and then let the Pakistani People decide what they want.

Regards

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

I am terribly amused that the international media is claiming that Musharraf has imposed Martial Law.

Poor sods don't understand the difference between Martial Law and Emergency!

And it is an interesting way to modify international opinion to make Musharraf look like a demon!

Musharraf has been more democratic than many a civilian democrat!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

There is Emergency in Pakistan.

However, there is a lot of spin in the media, both electronic and print, the world over, including India, that there is martial law in Pakistan. Even commentators and those who sit on panels for discussion on the TV, are calling it martial law.

Thus, a large majority are being fed the idea that there is martial law with the euphemism of "Emergency".

Those who are uninitiated and gullible, and there are a vast majority of them the world over, will sincerely believe that there is martial law and that martial law and emergency are the same thing! And they will also "authoritatively" debate it out too!

Yet, Martial Law and Emergency are not the same thing!

And poor Musharraf hangs because the popular opinion has been engineered by the media and the vested anti Musharraf elements on panels for discussion to make him appears as a demon!

People say the democracy has been murdered. Musharraf, though a military man who had taken over in a coup, is more democratic than the so called political leaders of Pakistan. He has allowed a free rein to the media and allowed private TV channels, which no one else allowed, and the channels went hammer and tongs after him and yet he did nothing to gag them. And yet, the so called champions of democracy now tar and feathering him!

That is the power of the media! And Psy Ops!

Check the headings of these:

Musharraf declares martial law in Pakistan
Musharraf declares martial law in Pakistan - Telegraph



Martial law in Pakistan
Daimnation!: Martial law in Pakistan

Pakistan under martial law
Pakistan under martial law - CNN.com

Pakistan denies martial law rumours
Al Jazeera English - News - Pakistan Denies Martial Law Rumours

West urges Pakistan to lift martial law, return to democracy
West urges Pakistan to lift martial law, return to democracy - CNN.com

Note how the words - Martial Law - is being bandied.

I wish you had heard the panellists the world over including India's 'expert' one Parthasarthy, who has become the Indian media's in house Pakistan expert because he had done a stint as the High Commissioner in Pakistan!

I could append many more.

Here is the media for you.

Spin the facts and flame the world and feed the agenda!


And no matter how much the media is howling that even the internet has been blacked out, it hasn't been!

My being here now is proof enough!

 

[bhangra12345]

The conspiracy I talk about relates to derailing the democratic process. Only forces who gain by this choas are "Undemocratic forces" such as religious extremists and suicide bombers.

Yes, I never had any doubt about these particular forces, but the only force among them having even a small voice in Islamabad is the MMA. So are you referring to them.

I had just read an article in jung in which the MMA said very very important/stupid (depends on how you see it) comment. That statement when seen with your comment seems to make sense.

To a query regarding the general elections, he said that the elections should be held on time, and demanded that election schedule must be announced without further delay. He said that at the stage, the question is not of the fair elections, but he is only talking of the elections, but not for the just elections. “We are not democratically strong enough to talk of the just elections.”

Divided opposition caused emergency: Fazl

No just elections means completely rigged elections, so the MMA has been in hand to hand with intelligence agencies( only they are capable to do it) and have been already preparing for this moment. When you see this also in connection with the recent promotion of ISI chief as VCOAS, you know some gaps are being filled.

I have zero doubt that there will be a complete opposite reaction from PML-N, who is the only real complete opposition party.

He said that the elections were necessary for the survival of the political parties. To another question regarding the causes behind the imposition of emergency, Maulana Fazlur Rehman said that it was imposed against the judiciary. However, he said that this impression must be removed, as still he believed that the government should not have adopted such an attitude with the judiciary.

Elections necessary for parties => the positions in govt is already set.

Emergency against only judiciary => (though it actually proves my point, I am implying that) and the next statement shows that there will be a major psyops in the future. Now link this with the recent curbing of freedom of press and you get the picture.

From what I understand, this emergency will be removed in 2-3 months, a sham elections will be conducted, in which just enough majority for PPP + present ruling party will be given and Benazir will be made PM, with Mushy pulling the real strings with the help of ISI. The opposition for the sake of western world will be the MMA and they will be shown as the bogie who will "own" Pakistan if this arrangement fails.

 

[bhangra12345]

Salim saab,
what is the difference between
i) emergency under a "dictator" who has suspended freedom of press and individual rights and
ii) a martial law?
The only major difference is Having military courts and dispensing "justice" through them.

Musharraf achieved complete control of judiciary by appointing only his men on the panel of justices. Basically apart from uniforms, what is the difference between these justices and the justices of martial law?

A rose by any name is a rose.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Elections will be held in Pakistan, even if it is a trifle delayed.

Given the huge reception that Benazir has had, it would not be really a total sham election!

The "democratic face" of Pakistan will come even if Musharraf remains the President and the power behind the throne!

Take it for what it is worth!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Bhangra,

What is the difference between Emergency and Martial Law?

Has the Army been called out?

Is the civilian govt overthrown?

Has the Parliamentarians been arrested?

Is there Military Courts?

The Chief Justice who has been put under house arrest has hardly acted without prejudice and in the highest integrity as is expected of him and his Judges. He is partisan and has pretensions to political grandeur!

 

[Always Neutral]

There is Emergency in Pakistan.

However, there is a lot of spin in the media, both electronic and print, the world over, including India, that there is martial law in Pakistan. Even commentators and those who sit on panels for discussion on the TV, are calling it martial law.

Thus, a large majority are being fed the idea that there is martial law with the euphemism of "Emergency".

And no matter how much the media is howling that even the internet has been blacked out, it hasn't been!

My being here now is proof enough!

Dear Salim,

Emergency is declared by a duly elected President.
Martial Law by the Chief of Army Staff.

So what do you call something which declared by a President who is also the CAS ? Well the answer could have come from the Supreme Court as it does in all democracies including your own country ? So why deprive the Pakistani's of their own Supreme Court. The Highest Courts interpret law no matter how unpopular they are.

As regards your being on this forum shows internet is working in Pakistan is mis-informed. The forum is US based and hence unless India is banning internet off course you will be able to communicate with the forum.

Best Regards

 

[bhangra12345]

What is the difference between Emergency and Martial Law?

Has the Army been called out?
who just occupied the SC and took it under control. who promulgated the ordinance, note not Mushy, the President but Mushy, the army chief

Now, therefore, in pursuance of the deliberations and decisions of the said meetings, I, General Pervez Musharraf, Chief of the Army Staff, proclaim emergency throughout Pakistan.

Pakistan News Service - PakTribune

Could this have been an error? This was intentional and deliberate and one needs to understand its consequences.

Is the civilian govt overthrown? Has the Parliamentarians been arrested?
Was there really a civilian govt before?
what power did these people have even before apart from being figureheads.
What was all that arresting ImranKhan his escape about?

Is there Military Courts?
I have already given you the explanation for this before.


Sir,
I am asking you to look at the situation on hand and see whether all the conditions of martial law are met? They meet and instead of saying "an emergency where the army chief took over judiciary, freedom of press and right, made civilian govt a sham ", a consice form is "martial law".

 

[Always Neutral]

Bhangra,

What is the difference between Emergency and Martial Law?

That is what the Supreme Court would have decided if it was allowed to function ?

Has the Army been called out?

YES. Unless you mean to say all the people who are guarding the roads are civilians in fancy dress.

Is the civilian govt overthrown?

Where is it functioning ? Only the Pakistan Cricket Board is functioning.

Has the Parliamentarians been arrested?

Yes all those who are protesting.

Is there Military Courts?

Since most civil court lawyers are boycotting the courts where does the average Pakistani turn to to get justice ?

The Chief Justice who has been put under house arrest has hardly acted without prejudice and in the highest integrity as is expected of him and his Judges. He is partisan and has pretensions to political grandeur!

So if he gives a judgement favoring Gen M he will be bi-partisan and just.

Regards

 

[bhangra12345]

Salim sir,

I think you might have missed the recent news from Pakistan.

ABC News: 'Hand Over Your Broadcast Equipment': Pakistan Stifles Media, Cuts Phone Lines
excerpts from the link

akistan's Electronic Media Regulating Authority (PEMRA) issued an order that bans the media from making any reports "that defame or bring into ridicule" President Pervez Musharraf, his administration or the military.

Any editor who violates the order can face up to a year in jail or a 5 million rupee fine ($83,000).

Editors at local television channels and newspapers said their phone lines had been cut, their broadcasts interfered, and one station got raided overnight by about two dozen armed cops, who tried to make away with their broadcasting equipment.

"A magistrate arrived at our bureau with about 24 police, all of them armed, and he told me, 'You need to hand over your broadcast equipment to us'," said Talat Hussein, the head of news at Aaj Television. "I said, 'Under what laws?'"

The magistrate then replied, "We can do this the right way or we will do it our way," Hussein said.

This definitely is not the example of freedom of press, if I may say.

Today's editorial from dawn
Unjust denial of information

GENERAL Musharraf would know as well as anybody else that access to information is every citizen’s right. So there is no question about him, or his government, ‘giving’ the country a free media as he believes. It is not for him to take this freedom away either. The government’s arbitrary blocking of all television news channels — including the foreign ones — and putting curbs on the press can thus not be justified. It is clearly an attempt to coerce media organisations to toe the official line. But are TV viewers foolish enough to buy into it? One cannot turn the clock back to the time when PTV was the only source of information — or disinformation. In today’s high-tech world when information can be found on the Internet or obtained through cell phones the move against television channels will be counter-productive. Besides how long can the government keep the plug pulled on TV channels? Gen Musharraf must realise how denial of information can contribute to further unrest, fear and rumour-mongering of the worst kind. Since the channels were blocked, all kinds of rumours have been flying that are discomfiting to the public as well as the stock markets, as we saw on Monday.

The government appears willing to go all out in its efforts to silence dissent. The amendments to the Press, Newspapers, News Agencies and Books Registration Ordinance and the Pemra law prescribe draconian punishment for papers and TV channels not complying with instructions that are ambiguous and already covered by existing laws. Thus why should the government want to arrogate to itself the power to decide what ‘defames or brings into ridicule’ the head of state or members of the armed forces/government? Obviously to assume arbitrary control over the media. In the case of television it proceeded to act even before the amendments were promulgated — something quite unprecedented.

To avoid an ugly confrontation, all TV channels must be put back on air forthwith. A free and independent media is a must, no matter what the nation’s on-going crisis at the time is. The media is well aware of its responsibility of providing people with information. It must be allowed to do its job without fear of reprisal or attack. If it violates the law it is for the court to sit in judgment. History has shown that the press in Pakistan has withstood all kinds of intimidation and come out with flying colours. Independent television — a new phenomenon in the country — can be expected to do the same.

 

[Always Neutral]

Dear Salim,

CNN is broadcasting and the embassies are using satellite phones to connect to internet that does not mean internet is fully working or not working in Pakistan. There are restrictions in Pakistan and the press is not making it up. I know Gen M is the best compared to NS and BB but he is on his last leg with only the Army backing him. Lets see what the future hold for him.

Regards

 

[Bull]

Im no fan of the media, if anything that deserves a baton, its the reproters and its sponsors. Bloody hypocrytes.

 

[Bull]

Hi Ejaz,

So, bad democracy is better than good dictatorship----would you kindly ask Britain or the U S A or the Scandinivian countries to adopt bad democracies for awhile and see how devastating they are.

There is nothing as bad or good democracy. Elected leaders and parliamentarians are a reflection of the society. So dont blame democracy.

 

[Always Neutral]

If democracy works in most of the world why not in Pakistan ?