Electricity problem is due to imported coal, shehbaz Sharif

[Sayfullah]

View attachment 852576

Afghani being so strong is lowkey a curse for Afghanistan.
It’s was artificially kept stable by aid money and afghan exports are very low so a strong currency just makes afghan goods more expensive and unattractive to buy. Pakistani rupee has more demand and is more useful then Afghani, even afghan businessmen know this so they trade in rupees and except rupees.

Kid, I do not know why you are jumping in so aggressively, but I would suggest you take a step back, read up on things, then come back and indulge in a conversation.

As of today, Pakistan has enough installed capacity to meet the demand.

We aren't creating electricity because:

1- The energy costs are way too high
2- We want to keep the import bill (and consequently trade deficit) low because we do not have enough dollars

We literally do not have enough money to buy fuel for the power plants we have. I don't know if you are one of those N trolls we have been infested with lately, so I will give you the benefit of doubt, but if you are, then your own dear Shahid Khaqan has said as such...to reduce 1 hour of loadshedding we need $125 million a month extra. That's the amount we save with 1 hour. Now you do the math.

I am not going to get into the WHY we have such power plants right now, but PTI does not figure into this equation from anywhere.

Had N been more focussed on doing something itself rather than on PTI with 10 press conferences a day, things might have been better.

Afghanistan gets 70% of its electricity from Uzbekistan. I wonder if we can start exporting electricity to Afghanistan because wouldn’t that help us pay capacity payments and lower curricular debt? We can sell our expensive electricity to Afghanistan and use Afghan coal in our power plants since afghan coal is higher quality the one our power plants use but half the price. With the revenue we earn we can use that to end loadshedding in Pakistan.

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

View attachment 852363

In hindsight Pakistan should have continued to deal with load shedding in some months of summer instead of building these plants on imported coal and gas. Should have waited few more years for local coal, hydro, nuclear, solar options to come online.

Now circular debt is out of control and also price of electricity for consumers. At least coal plants will be converted to thar coal in few years but gas ones will remain expensive.

 

[ziaulislam]

In hindsight Pakistan should have continued to deal with load shedding in some months of summer instead of building these plants on imported coal and gas. Should have waited few more years for local coal, hydro, nuclear, solar options to come online.

Now circular debt is out of control and also price of electricity for consumers. At least coal plants will be converted to thar coal in few years but gas ones will remain expensive.

Not in hind sight issue
I was pointing towards that in 2017 right on this forum when everyone else was calling me a youthia and non sense guy
Anyway your reserves are fallong not due to few billion oil subsidy from budget but because of inability to roll over loans due to political crisis

Just shock of 3b$ of chinese loan was big

 

[farok84]

Now circular debt is out of control and also price of electricity for consumers. At least coal plants will be converted to thar coal in few years but gas ones will remain expensive.

Hi,

Are there any official plans for such. Kindly share if you have come across any official commentary.


It will be interesting to know the cost for conversion from Super to Sub critical process/ systems. Hopefully there's a feasibility/ media report you can direct us to?

 

[Enigma SIG]

Not in hind sight issue
I was pointing towards that in 2017 right on this forum when everyone else was calling me a youthia and non sense guy
Anyway your reserves are fallong not due to few billion oil subsidy from budget but because of inability to roll over loans due to political crisis

Just shock of 3b$ of chinese loan was big

View attachment 852871

N League are power hungry fascists. Urta teer lene ki adat hai kameenon ko. Qismat bi meherban hai haramzaday martay hi nahi hain.

 

[Jango]

Instead of calling me kid, it would have been wise if you have re read the OP and other posters. He is also saying about the cost of imported coal. Pakistan need 28000 MW of electricity whereas it is able to produce odd 21000 MW so where is surplus electricity ?

Go over my post again, slowly this time.

 

[Two banks of the River]

Would it be feasible to close down this plant for atleast a few months until coal prices come down. Pakistan has excess electricity.

Or have PMLN/Bureaucrats signed another suicidal iron clad contract that Pakistan won’t be able to get out of.

Well India has been buying loaded consignments of Russian coal very recently. Coal from Russia can be bought via barter trade. Seems a safe bet. Pakistan should look into it.

 

[Jango]

Not in hind sight issue
I was pointing towards that in 2017 right on this forum when everyone else was calling me a youthia and non sense guy
Anyway your reserves are fallong not due to few billion oil subsidy from budget but because of inability to roll over loans due to political crisis

Just shock of 3b$ of chinese loan was big

View attachment 852871

Finally someone gets it.

Those people saying that if PTI was in govt situation would be the same are either naive or unaware of economic realities.

Ever since the VONC, the USD exchange rate has been rising based on speculation, nothing else. Banks are collecting dollars from the open market in hordes. The state bank finally sat down with them last week and gave them a shut up call.

The Chinese loan which was to be rolled over within a couple of days is now taking weeks, and as far as I have read, still hasn't actually been deposited back. We are having to beg the Saudis now to roll over as well, this was a sure shot thing with PTI.

Secondly, GoP is now borrowing from the international market and lendors at astronomical rates, far higher than what was needed before.

Who the heck wants to work with a government jis ka kuch nhn pata woh 1 maheena rahay ya aik saal?

The fuel subsidy isn't even where our current problems begin...but hey, that's an easy target when you don't know how it came about. The one mistake PTI did with the subsidy, in hindsight, is that they were banking on the conflict ending AND OPEC increasing production, along with the Iran deal introducing Iranian oil into the market. This would have reduced the prices and kept them within the original budget earmarked for the subsidy, by reducing PSDP and using the tax collection overhead.

I read it somewhere that of the Rs 60 increased in fuel prices, approximately Rs 30 is due to the rapid dollar devaluation after the govt change, and not due to the oil prices.

If you keep on thinking that the fuel subsidy is the root cause of all our problems right now, you are in for a great surprise.

They must have done something good in 4 years to come out of it.

Read the figures against electricity generated:

https://defence.pk/pdf/attachments/29a0ca56-7e16-4885-ab08-56b6e4b474f0-jpeg.852866/

 

[denel]

Afghani being so strong is lowkey a curse for Afghanistan.
It’s was artificially kept stable by aid money and afghan exports are very low so a strong currency just makes afghan goods more expensive and unattractive to buy. Pakistani rupee has more demand and is more useful then Afghani, even afghan businessmen know this so they trade in rupees and except rupees.


Afghanistan gets 70% of its electricity from Uzbekistan. I wonder if we can start exporting electricity to Afghanistan because wouldn’t that help us pay capacity payments and lower curricular debt? We can sell our expensive electricity to Afghanistan and use Afghan coal in our power plants since afghan coal is higher quality the one our power plants use but half the price. With the revenue we earn we can use that to end loadshedding in Pakistan.

First- I had posted this long back. It shows the folly of your establishment.

1. You have coal -> Connect and get Sasol TOT which is Coal to Gas/Liquids.
SASOL is the world's leader in this technology.

Your establishment has their head in someone's back side to even understand anything basic.

We knew in 50's that we needed alternative fuel source; hence this route was taken as a strategic way given how much coal reserves we have. This process can be modified to use Gas to Liquids as well. Look at Qatar which has one of the largest 'breeder reactors' that SASOL installed there.

Dont take it as a personal insult; but man, you need to have technical people drive these solutions not any army dodo bird.

Oryx - Hydrocarbons Technology

www.hydrocarbons-technology.com

 

[xyxmt]

So he is taking his own government to the cleaners?

NO he is not
He knows very well all Patwaris are Jahil slaves and they will believe their foreign funded Peer.

 

[denel]

NO he is not
He knows very well all Patwaris are Jahil slaves and they will believe their foreign funded Peer.

pardon my ignorance... what is ment by patwaris?

 

[xyxmt]

pardon my ignorance... what is ment by patwaris?

It has a very long definition but I will explain it in short. When God wants to punish someone, God doesn't come down on earth and punches him on face, God instead screws him up in his head which makes him punch himself. These people are called Patwaris, screwed up so badly in their head that they cannot see a difference between good and bad they keep supporting/voting bad and hoping for good.

 

[ziaulislam]

Finally someone gets it.

Those people saying that if PTI was in govt situation would be the same are either naive or unaware of economic realities.

Ever since the VONC, the USD exchange rate has been rising based on speculation, nothing else. Banks are collecting dollars from the open market in hordes. The state bank finally sat down with them last week and gave them a shut up call.

The Chinese loan which was to be rolled over within a couple of days is now taking weeks, and as far as I have read, still hasn't actually been deposited back. We are having to beg the Saudis now to roll over as well, this was a sure shot thing with PTI.

Secondly, GoP is now borrowing from the international market and lendors at astronomical rates, far higher than what was needed before.

Who the heck wants to work with a government jis ka kuch nhn pata woh 1 maheena rahay ya aik saal?

The fuel subsidy isn't even where our current problems begin...but hey, that's an easy target when you don't know how it came about. The one mistake PTI did with the subsidy, in hindsight, is that they were banking on the conflict ending AND OPEC increasing production, along with the Iran deal introducing Iranian oil into the market. This would have reduced the prices and kept them within the original budget earmarked for the subsidy, by reducing PSDP and using the tax collection overhead.

I read it somewhere that of the Rs 60 increased in fuel prices, approximately Rs 30 is due to the rapid dollar devaluation after the govt change, and not due to the oil prices.

If you keep on thinking that the fuel subsidy is the root cause of all our problems right now, you are in for a great surprise.



Read the figures against electricity generated:

https://defence.pk/pdf/attachments/29a0ca56-7e16-4885-ab08-56b6e4b474f0-jpeg.852866/

Govt was giving just 90b rupee per month fuel subsidy..this is not much its peanuts

Issue is noone wants to roll over loans to govt that is so unstable

You need constant loans roll over since alot of our loans are still short term

Though situation is much much better per PMLN STATE BANK president as comapred to 2018 its still not put of the woods yet

 

[Jango]

You need constant loans roll over since alot of our loans are still short term

I don't have a source to quote right now, but I heard that this is a big problem for us. We aren't getting long term loans, only short term.

 

[ziaulislam]

I don't have a source to quote right now, but I heard that this is a big problem for us. We aren't getting long term loans, only short term.

Correct as economy still has poor rating

Unforunately the expensive power deals is biggest disaster in last 10 years..they need not to be..it could have been planned better