Ditching Rafale

[vsdave2302]

There are already several prototypes flying and being tested! While Tejas MKII is a paper plane!

PAKFA being much more complex in nature shall take longer time to test, Build and Induct.

MK2 is just an upgraded version of Mk1.

 

[Koovie]

PAKFA being much more complex in nature shall take longer time to test, Build and Induct.

MK2 is just an upgraded version of Mk1.

Yet, the MKII has not been built... it only exists on paper and thus, saying that its specs will match specs of already operational fighters ins nonsense...

 

[vsdave2302]

Yet, the MKII has not been built... it only exists on paper and thus, saying that its specs will match specs of already operational fighters ins nonsense...

I have never said so. From where did you get this?

 

[Koovie]

Here:

No I won't recomend Grippen because with LCA MK2 we shall come close to grippen E. If we go for Tejas MK3 with stealth, we can surpass Grippen NG. So there is no need to go for Grippen. Recruite a huge new talent on national mission basis and keep designing new planes and higher versions.

 

[+4vsgorillas-Apebane]

Just be done with the Rafale and give the domestic aviation industry a 20 billion dollar kick in the arse jump start. That way the money stays in India rather than being extorted by the French and their exorbitant prices.

 

[Gandhi follower]

We are a poor nation. we can't afford such expensive toys. better invest to enhance the domestic capacity. Time to scrap MMCRA, pull in SAAB to make Tejas a success.

 

[conworldus]

if you'll going to ditch Rafale/MMRCA
should go for a few squadrons of SU-34 "Fullback"
100 Tejas Mark 2
100 Mig-29M2

The Su 34 is a ground attacker. I dont think Urban Meyers will take that " fullback", either.

 

[Indian_Patriot]

We already operate more fighter types than the mighty US airforce, with all the complexity that brings in terms of logistics. We don't need another expensive toy, one that is going to cost the ex-chequer $20B. Order more Sukoi's, introduce LCAs, FGFAs, and get working on the Indigenous AMCA.

 

[C130]

The Su 34 is a ground attacker. I dont think Urban Meyers will take that " fullback", either.

isn't that what India needs a good ground attack aircraft??

I thought the SU-30 and T-50 is for Air Supremacy

and also Urban Meyer, what lol

 

[sancho]

IF the Rafale is to fill the gap between heavy and light fighters. Then we should go for AMCA and LCA Mk2.

MMRCAs are not meant to fill any gap anymore, but to add operational alternatives (weapons, systems, capabilities) and industrial advantages, that our aviation industry desperately needs in this decade. None of this can be achieved by an LCA MK2 that still is only a concept today and a paper plane like AMCA, that most likely will even increase the operational costs.
You can get other fighters to fill the numbers (LCAs + MKIs, or Pak Fa from Russia) but you can't gain the same advantages the MMRCA aimed on, other than choosing one of the shortlisted MMRCAs.

 

[gau8av]

MMRCAs are not meant to fill any gap anymore, but to add operational alternatives (weapons, systems, capabilities) and industrial advantages, that our aviation industry desperately needs in this decade. None of this can be achieved by an LCA MK2 that still is only a concept today and a paper plane like AMCA, that most likely will even increase the operational costs.
You can get other fighters to fill the numbers (LCAs + MKIs, or Pak Fa from Russia) but you can't gain the same advantages the MMRCA aimed on, other than choosing one of the shortlisted MMRCAs.

what specific gaps in our current capability, advantages and weapon systems would the rafale provide that more mkis/pakfa won't be able to fill ?

 

[Zabaniyah]

*sigh*

Rafale - A plane that no one would buy.

isn't that what India needs a good ground attack aircraft??

I thought the SU-30 and T-50 is for Air Supremacy

Don't know about the T-50. But from what I gather, the Indian variant of the Su-30 is good for strike missions.

 

[sancho]

what specific gaps in our current capability, advantages and weapon systems would the rafale provide that more mkis/pakfa won't be able to fill ?

As I said, it's not about filling gaps but adding capabilities next to what MKI offers and having an alternative to it. Therefor getting another fighter with advanced radar and flight performance capabilities, additional advanced weaponary to the Russians / Indians the MKI will offer, improving the strike capabilities..., with lower operational is what we needs to for the bulk operations. It's about using MKIs long range radar capabilities, alongside with Rafales low RCS and passive sensors. It's about MKIs heavy weapons, along side Rafales AASM or EF's Brimstone and SPEAR 3, it's about having R73 / Astra, but also MICA or IRIS-T / METEOR, Scalp or Storm Shadow / Brahmos.
More MKIs only provide us with more numbers, but the same capabilities and the same operational costs or difficulties, not different or lower once. Just as more MKIs only offer us the same industrial advantages that we already get, while MMRCA is meant to add new industrial capabilities, more offsets and export potential (at least of parts and systems).

 

[airmarshal]

The original poster article complains like Indian in-laws. None of it makes sense.

India has money. France has technology. Technology comes at a premium. French wont give their technology that easily. Its as simple as that.

Do you think they will transfer technology to nobody in India just because India fancies so? RATPL, the article admits has ZERO experience building a glider let alone a super high tech plane like Rafale. And India expects Dassault to take full ownership of the plane built by RATPL?!!! Amazing foolhardiness.

 

[Didact]

The original poster article complains like Indian in-laws. None of it makes sense.

India has money. France has technology. Technology comes at a premium. French wont give their technology that easily. Its as simple as that.

Do you think they will transfer technology to nobody in India just because India fancies so? RATPL, the article admits has ZERO experience building a glider let alone a super high tech plane like Rafale. And India expects Dassault to take full ownership of the plane built by RATPL?!!! Amazing foolhardiness.

The propensity of certain members to comment without knowing the head, tail or *** of a topic is incredible, almost mesmerizing.

Just in case you care to know, RATPL is something Dassault brought up. Yep, that's right, Not India, not the MoD, not the Air force, and most definitely not the HAL.

And as far as sharing of technology is concerned, if they do not want to, fair enough. Write a short letter informing your wish to withdraw from the tender, we will oblige.