Defence White Paper: Australia joins Asia's arms race with spending on weaponry and military forces

[Aepsilons]

"Earlier, we had East Timor [Timor Leste] as one of our outer islands facing Australia. Now, our outer islands are Lirang, Wetar and Alor," Gatot said.

"We need to increase our defense forces, so that we will have eyes and ears on our outer islands that can inform us on all developments," he added.

Great find @Tiqiu !

 

[Pandora]

Very true.

But Aussie does need Aus-US alliance to protect herself from the biggest immediate treat she is facing, not from China, but Indonesia. Those past incidents covered by Aussie media may give some insight about this fear:
The independent of Pupua New guinea:
The independent movement in Indonesia Pupua;
The independent of East Timor;
Boat people crisis;
Aussie navy burning Indonesia fishing boat;
Bali bombings;
Telephone tapping of Indonesian president;
Capital punishment of the Aussie drug trafficker duo;
boycott of Aussie cattle........

True i never said Australia should be a pacifist nation but they also shouldnt be aggressors. Minimum defense is need of every nation.

 

[Nike]

Oh yes, indeed. We are frenemies, have up and down relationship. The so called Japanese and Chinese member here is forgot, it was not Indonesia who give them the true nightmare, but the threat from the North it was, first the Japanese Empire and then the rising of China. The Australian never forgot the threat is always came from North, far North than Jakarta who is always had little fight against them over minor things. That's why they put emphasis more in engaging with Asia and put their security concern with their old allies in the West

 

[Dzul]

Looks like Indonesia Is a buffer zone for Australia

Like US using European Nato as war field to face Russia

 

[Nike]

Looks like Indonesia Is a buffer zone for Australia

Like US using European Nato as war field to face Russia

meh, we are not their buffer zone or whatsoever.

If they still looking at our country with pre-cold war Point of View they would loose more

 

[jhungary]

The problem here is that even though US Australia are miles apart but still many politicians here are American touts. On one hand Australia has dumped all its economy inside china and on the other hand they are buying weapons to confront china in future. China has in no way threatened Australia and yet Australians are wetting their pants over concerns dumped on them by Americans. They destroyed local Medicare for poor people just to buy more weapons.

There are two things you probably need to know about

1.) Australia did not "Dumped" all its economy inside China.
2.) Geopolitics and Economic are two different factors, altogether.

For the first one. Australia is not as reliance to China as you may think. in the year of 2014-2015 (2015-2016 data wasn't available yet) Chinese trade represent 31.8% of all Australian Export, and 21% of all Australian Import. While the total merchandise trade are 26.3%, which is slightly higher than a quarter.

However, it's not the number people should be focus on, but the trend, the YoY (Year-on-Year) comparison saw Chinese drop in both Australian Export and Total Merchandise trade at 18.6% and 7.7% respectively. While at the same time. Australia-US trade have increased in all 3 figure. It have indicating the Australian moving away with goods/merchandise trade with China.

While 26.3% in all general trading and 64 billion in FDI (Compare to US's 758 Billions), I don't think it can be said Australia is dumping their economy inside China. In fact, considering Australia is a financial market driven economy, Australian Economy as a whole does not in fact depend on China in any way or form.

DFTA Data on US and China year 2014-2015 as follow

https://dfat.gov.au/trade/resources/Documents/usa.pdf
https://dfat.gov.au/trade/resources/Documents/chin.pdf

For the second part. Economy and Politics should be 2 completely separate entity, as business goes where the money goes, and it will be open to whoever basically waving money in front of it. If Congo have money and opportunities to invest in Australia tomorrow, being a financially driven country, Australia will open both arms to catch that turnip.

The problem is, geopolitics, coming from the word "Geo-" means proximity. Which means basically who is closer. And in the current state, US is too far for any potential trouble, which the FP between US and Australia would not clash. Hence such a cooperation can be established. However, China and Australia are lies within the same sphere of influence. And as such, there are potential conflict of interest between FP of China and FP of Australia. And mostly it was the Chinese action that was basically scaring the Australian in general. And that would upset the dynamic of influence between Australia and the region. Solution? Australia have to find a counterbalance to maintain the status quo in the region. In come United States.

Say what you will with the Foreign Policy of the United States, but aligning to them is of the interest of Australian Government, until the day the US starting anything that Australia saw as a conflict of interest, then and only then, the Australian alignment would shift, to possibly China

thats why we put you there lad, instead of locking up your ancestors we sent you lot to the other side of the world as punishment. the extra 29.9 billion will be used to hunt kangaroos's and koala's. i think its for the best you increase spending even more. heck give some of the kangaroo's that's left over a gun's too to level the playing field.

Meh, we lost to the Emu back in 1930, not surprise at all if we lost a war on kangaroo.

Emu War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The nature is always our enemy.......

Ur comment above talking like u known australia better than us, who had become their close neighbor since beginning?

lol, look at how this Japanese dude try to use a Greenleaf (Extreme Leftist) publication in 1992 (At the height of East Timor conflict) to try to drive a wedge between Australia and Indonesia.......

This dude is getting a tad bit desperate, don't you think?

 

[Nike]

There are two things you probably need to know about

1.) Australia did not "Dumped" all its economy inside China.
2.) Geopolitics and Economic are two different factors, altogether.

For the first one. Australia is not as reliance to China as you may think. in the year of 2014-2015 (2015-2016 data wasn't available yet) Chinese trade represent 31.8% of all Australian Export, and 21% of all Australian Import. While the total merchandise trade are 26.3%, which is slightly higher than a quarter.

However, it's not the number people should be focus on, but the trend, the YoY (Year-on-Year) comparison saw Chinese drop in both Australian Export and Total Merchandise trade at 18.6% and 7.7% respectively. While at the same time. Australia-US trade have increased in all 3 figure. It have indicating the Australian moving away with goods/merchandise trade with China.

While 26.3% in all general trading and 64 billion in FDI (Compare to US's 758 Billions), I don't think it can be said Australia is dumping their economy inside China. In fact, considering Australia is a financial market driven economy, Australian Economy as a whole does not in fact depend on China in any way or form.

DFTA Data on US and China year 2014-2015 as follow

https://dfat.gov.au/trade/resources/Documents/usa.pdf
https://dfat.gov.au/trade/resources/Documents/chin.pdf

For the second part. Economy and Politics should be 2 completely separate entity, as business goes where the money goes, and it will be open to whoever basically waving money in front of it. If Congo have money and opportunities to invest in Australia tomorrow, being a financially driven country, Australia will open both arms to catch that turnip.

The problem is, geopolitics, coming from the word "Geo-" means proximity. Which means basically who is closer. And in the current state, US is too far for any potential trouble, which the FP between US and Australia would not clash. Hence such a cooperation can be established. However, China and Australia are lies within the same sphere of influence. And as such, there are potential conflict of interest between FP of China and FP of Australia. And mostly it was the Chinese action that was basically scaring the Australian in general. And that would upset the dynamic of influence between Australia and the region. Solution? Australia have to find a counterbalance to maintain the status quo in the region. In come United States.

Say what you will with the Foreign Policy of the United States, but aligning to them is of the interest of Australian Government, until the day the US starting anything that Australia saw as a conflict of interest, then and only then, the Australian alignment would shift, to possibly China



Meh, we lost to the Emu back in 1930, not surprise at all if we lost a war on kangaroo.

Emu War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The nature is always our enemy.......



lol, look at how this Japanese dude try to use a Greenleaf (Extreme Leftist) publication in 1992 (At the height of East Timor conflict) to try to drive a wedge between Australia and Indonesia.......

This dude is getting a tad bit desperate, don't you think?

not only the Greenies Australian journo is always put Indonesia at negative tone since Balibo five incident, but the real decision maker at Canberra know better on how to use their brain than spread fantastic story about Indonesian antiquity. We are not perfect neighbor, but we are not that bad to be related like India-Pakistan LoL

 

[Gibbs]

Australian military and security interests always coincide with Indonesia's regional interests, The China factor is just a ruse, Aussie govt would not topple that apple cart unnecessarily.. Unless the country becomes a republic it's military and foreign policy would be seen aligned with the West.. Due to historical reasons but on the ground it's becoming increasingly Asia centric something it wont be able to resist for long

 

[Penguin]

On the path to building defence funding up to 2 per cent of GDP, the Government will also "de-couple" its spending on the military from the general health of the economy, so that even if growth slows, defence will still get its 2 per cent share.

NATO countries should to that too. Too many below treaty obligation of 2% GDP for defense.

Only US and Estonia meeting NATO budget goal - Business Insider

 

[jhungary]

not only the Greenies Australian journo is always put Indonesia at negative tone since Balibo five incident, but the real decision maker at Canberra know better on how to use their brain than spread fantastic story about Indonesian antiquity. We are not perfect neighbor, but we are not that bad to be related like India-Pakistan LoL

Greenleaf is not the Green Party. The Greenleft guys would make the Green Party looks like Green Peace......

Anyway, the good indication is that this budget rise is not targeting Indonesia. If that would be, then the budget hike would either be too little or not enough.

For Dilemma for Australian security with the immediate Northern Neighbour is the one that we are friendly to each other and avoid conflict. Australia knows if (That is a big IF) Indonesia would one day bearing down the Australian border, the current defence force is not enough to repel an attack that close and that massive. The American factor need at lest 72 hours to realise. So if Australia are intending to fend of an imaginary Indonesia Attack, then the budget increase would not be enough for a full spectrum upgrade.

On the other hand, had Australia try to contain Indonesia and deterring the latter to do anything that would ruin the balance of the region. What the Australian need is to modernize their navy. Being a island nation. A good navy would be more than enough to deter the Indonesian, which considering only 18% of this budget hike going to the navy, that's a lot more than it should be allocated.

 

[Penguin]

the scs has nothing to do with them. just look at the map.

In 2013, Australia exported $265B and imported $224B
Top export destinations: China ($94.4B), Japan ($45.4B), South Korea ($19.5B), India ($10.9B), Hong Kong ($10.3B).
Top import origins: China ($44.7B), United States ($24.5B), Japan ($18.1B), Singapore ($12.2B) Germany ($11.3B).
OEC - Australia (AUS) Exports, Imports, and Trade Partners

How do you think most of that trade reaches/leaves Australia?

Australia Is Normalizing Its Defense Ties With Myanmar

And viewed in the big scheme of things of all shipping lanes

Forest Observations

And your air routes

 

[Aepsilons]

Australian military and security interests always coincide with Indonesia's regional interests, The China factor is just a ruse, Aussie govt would not topple that apple cart unnecessarily.. Unless the country becomes a republic it's military and foreign policy would be seen aligned with the West.. Due to historical reasons but on the ground it's becoming increasingly Asia centric something it wont be able to resist for long

Sharp!

 

[qwerrty]

In 2013, Australia exported $265B and imported $224B
Top export destinations: China ($94.4B), Japan ($45.4B), South Korea ($19.5B), India ($10.9B), Hong Kong ($10.3B).
Top import origins: China ($44.7B), United States ($24.5B), Japan ($18.1B), Singapore ($12.2B) Germany ($11.3B).
OEC - Australia (AUS) Exports, Imports, and Trade Partners

How do you think most of that trade reaches/leaves Australia?

their biggest trading partner is china and going through the scs, the rests are smaller and in different routes. it says so in your map. what's there worry about than playing good doggy to uncle sam lol?

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

http://www.defence.gov.au/WhitePaper/Docs/2016-Defence-White-Paper.pdf

 

[Penguin]

their biggest trading partner is china and going through the scs, the rests are smaller and in different routes. it says so in your map. what's there worry about than playing good doggy to uncle sam lol?

So, you fail to see how disruption of the traffic through SCS (the bulk of the traffic) would impact the traffic to and from Australia, that aren't in SCS? Not to mention the Malakka Strait choke point.

If you are going to post like an A-hole, please move on to another forum.
Plenty of jerks here already, only few serious posters.