Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[Malik Alashter]

What is the price Egypt pay for the Rafale?

No less than 200 million $ per plane this is really a huge waste of money!!!.

 

[帅的一匹]

No money, no war.

 

[Malik Alashter]

No money, no war.

Better.

 

[Papa Dragon]

$11 billion for 36 jets is still very expensive no matter whatever spares, weapons package they include. Even though the French say they are selling at the same price as French Air Force got them for , $200m/plane is literally looting the IAF.

India should seriously stop acting as a cash cow for foreign defence firms and focus on it's own indigenous defence industry.

 

[$@rJen]

What is the price Egypt pay for the Rafale?

Egypt paid 5.9 billion for 24 jets while Qatar paid 7.2 billions for 24 jets... i think all packages from weapons to maintenance were included . So why are the french asking for 11 billlons !!!! is because there's a 50% offset which has to be invested in india

$200m/plane is literally looting the IAF.

200 mil a plane included with weapons and maintenance.. we're buying mki's less than 100 million but the life cycle and weapons of it would cost more than 200 million and that too with a poor availability rate... you want a diamond but want to pay only the cost of gold???

The Qataris paid 7 billions for 24 jets we're buying 36, 12 jets more than of Qatar which means the price would be somewhere b/t 7-9 billion and french has to invest 50% of the amount in india.. so they're asking 2 billions more... that's perfectly understandable in my view

 

[kaykay]

Well the final deal cost( hopefully 7-9 Billion USD) will include 50% offset( Means French have to invest 50% cost of total deal in India), weapon costs and life cycle cost for atleast 20 years.

$11 billion for 36 jets is still very expensive no matter whatever spares, weapons package they include. Even though the French say they are selling at the same price as French Air Force got them for , $200m/plane is literally looting the IAF.

India should seriously stop acting as a cash cow for foreign defence firms and focus on it's own indigenous defence industry.

First they are asking for 11 Billion USD while we are paying only 7 so lets wait for final figures. Secondly deal will include 50% offset too( they have to invest 50% of money in India itself) and not to forget weapons and life cycle cost included( for what years is remain to be seen). Alao sir, even new MKIs are costing use 100 million USD/unit without weapons and life cycle cost( which is massive).

 

[cerberus]

My source's say its almost locked on 65,000 crore which 9.6 billion $ good

And yes this was right french was quoting 80,000 crore figure which 11 billion $ with 30% Off set

Point to be noted here is about off-set we get
So initially
If the deal is locked on 9.6 billion $ with 30% offset the actual price we pay is around 6.72 billion $ excluding offset amount with weapons package and spares

Here just in TOI is reporting same
http://m.timesofindia.com/india/Ind...-over-cost-of-Rafale/articleshow/50724401.cms

 

[Saitama]

-305.5555556 million dollars for a single aircraft with spares,maintainece and other packages.
-305.555 which approximately equals to 2074 crores rupees. At current exchange rate.

Now thats just wow! In not so very cool way.

 

[kaykay]

My source's say its almost locked on 65,000 crore which 9.6 billion $ good

And yes this was right french was quoting 80,000 crore figure which 11 billion $ with 30% Off set

Point to be noted here is about off-set we get
So initially
If the deal is locked on 9.6 billion $ with 30% offset the actual price we pay is around 6.72 billion $ excluding offset amount with weapons package and spares

Here just in TOI is reporting same
http://m.timesofindia.com/india/Ind...-over-cost-of-Rafale/articleshow/50724401.cms

They have agreed to 50% offset not 30%( which was earlier figure). This is first time India is getting 50% offset for a deal though.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

The deal was not signed bcz of not price issues. The price is being quoted at Rs 800 Crs (Hindu, businessline) and Rs 750 Crs (IBN Khabar). That inclusive of everything with weapons load.. India is negotiating to get it closer to 650-700 Crs.

The haggling is more from the perspective of spare which we are purchasing upfront for 10 years.

In another few months you will come to know about official announcement of MII under which total birds made in India will be close to 225+ equaling FrAF. On top price assumed is closer to in the bracket of Rs 500-600 Crs under MII with orders over time and localisation aspect.

Relax for some time.. you will see lots of such reports in next few weeks as everybody would like to create a pressure scenario for deal to falter but you can be assured that it wont at all..

If you do basic maths,
800 x 54 = Rs 43,200 crs
The spares for 10 years estimated at around 40% of this cost + other items to be brought upfront for 90% availability clause = 320 x 54 = 17280 Crs

So 43200+17280 = 60480 Crs approx

As you can see thats the basic approximation..

If we dont factor in the spares angle then we have a deal at just 43200 Crs or $ 6.45 Bn all inclusive with weapons.

Now if we reduce the price per jet all loaded, the cost of spare package also comes down due to dependency. On top with MII the spares beyond 10 years will be locally purchased. But certain critical items will have to be procured for such high availability clause implementation.

Its not a rocket science really. We will sign it and release the amount mostly in march end or April beginning based on Financial availability.

 

[cerberus]

They have agreed to 50% offset not 30%( which was earlier figure). This is first time India is getting 50% offset for a deal though.

Yeah But still On Negotiation stage here India want More Add On of what i heard in Last 24 hrs



Well The IGA, once in place, will facilitate the drafting of further contracts between the two sides and bring in private players such as Dassault, the manufacturers of Rafale, as well as the Indian offset partners. With 50 per cent offsets — meaning use of Indian component — the deal, when finalised, is set to be the biggest ever offset contract for India once and if finalised.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-news-india/rafale-deal-india-wants-more-add-ons/

 

[Roybot]

Egypt paid 5.9 billion for 24 jets while Qatar paid 7.2 billions for 24 jets... i think all packages from weapons to maintenance were included . So why are the french asking for 11 billlons !!!! is because there's a 50% offset which has to be invested in india



200 mil a plane included with weapons and maintenance.. we're buying mki's less than 100 million but the life cycle and weapons of it would cost more than 200 million and that too with a poor availability rate... you want a diamond but want to pay only the cost of gold???

The Qataris paid 7 billions for 24 jets we're buying 36, 12 jets more than of Qatar which means the price would be somewhere b/t 7-9 billion and french has to invest 50% of the amount in india.. so they're asking 2 billions more... that's perfectly understandable in my view

How is that acceptable? So we just pay a premium to France, so that we get 50% offset as investment, in the projects which France decides to invest? Or we can just not pay them any premium, not just for the offset clause, and instead we invest the left over money ourselves?

 

[$@rJen]

How is that acceptable? So we just pay a premium to France, so that we get 50% offset as investment, in the projects which France decides to invest? Or we can just not pay them any premium, not just for the offset clause, and instead we invest the left over money ourselves?

they're not asking us stright away due to the reason... the reason of investing 50% offset is pushing them to hike the price. no one is going to invest back 50%,, what do the profit they get??? so they\d to hike the price of the jets..

 

[The BrOkEn HeArT]

11 billion too much. Na hamara , Na tmhara , 9 billion par done kro chalo.

 

[egodoc222]

No less than 200 million $ per plane this is really a huge waste of money!!!.

Waste?
How exactly?
Are you doubting rafale capabilities?