Dalit Caste Apartheid in India is Alive and Well

[sparklingway]

Even though I would like to comment profoundly on the abject poverty in which many people live across India, I cannot control but say that as soon as I read the title of the thread, I knew it had to be RiazHaq. I had no iota of doubt in this regard and I'm happy that I'm able to recognize people easily now.

As for the point that they face discrimination, both economic and social, even Pakistan has classified Dalit's as "scheduled castes", only a softer name and they are similarly denied all economic and social rights in Pakistan. You might want to read bout that too.

News Reports:-
Discrimination against 'scheduled caste' Hindus continues | Pakistan | News | Newspaper | Daily | English | Online

Discrimination against ‘scheduled caste’ Hindus continues in Pakistan, Low Caste Hindu Women and Kids Being Sexploited in Pakistan Struggle for Hindu Existence

NGO Sustainability Network Plight of Scheduled Caste Hindus in Pakistan

Status Of Dalits/ Scheduled Castes In Pakistan

Research Reports:-

CASTE-BASED DISCRIMINATION IN PAKISTAN

http://idsn.org/uploads/media/PakistanUPRpdf.pdf

Letter to CJ by a dalit social worker:-

Rights of Scheduled Castes/ Dalits of Pakistan

I also happen to have read a detailed study by IIDS in this regard. This is a damning 87 page report, might come as a shocker to you. Read this if you are more than just a basher. This is an extensive report covering social, political, economic and other factors involving the plight of dalits in Pakistan. A necessary read for anybody studying development economics and development geography or anybody wanting to do some social work to improve the lives of everyday Pakistanis. These very dalits are my fellow Pakistanis, they have been denied political, economic, social and human rights. It is my duty to fight for their rights and work for theie improvement. I'd rather do that than write half baked accounts of Indian oppression, Indian hegemony, Indian economic weakness, Indian strategic weakness and anything that sheds a negative light on India (also includes twisting lamp to portray a negative light).

Long Behind Schedule : A Study on the plight of scheduled caste Hindus in Pakistan


To Indian Members :- This is not suppose to be an approval of how dalits are treated in India. You know better than I do that historical wrongs take a lot of time to be corrected but the progress on your side has been slow, terribly slow. Upward mobility of dalits is remarkably low compared with the rest of India. There is much evidence to support this. Dalits face discrimination and are not provided necessary resources and capital to overcome their economic woes. While urban middle class across India has ever increasing access to capital, resources and opportunities today, lower caste peasants and slum dwellers are being denied opportunity in this wonderful new world that is the result of your economic take off. Much needs to be done.

I only wanted to highlight that as usual, RiazHaq, has nothing better than to bash India for reasons apparent to us all. It is not wrong to point out glaring accounts of disparity and denial of rights in India but you might as well have posted something about their condition in Pakistan as well. Improving the lives of impoverished classes and sectors of society is a duty of us all as we represent the upper middle and elite class (mostly).

 

[RobbieS]

To Indian Members :- This is not suppose to be an approval of how dalits are treated in India. You know better than I do that historical wrongs take a lot of time to be corrected but the progress on your side has been slow, terribly slow. Upward mobility of dalits is remarkably low compared with the rest of India. There is much evidence to support this. Dalits face discrimination and are not provided necessary resources and capital to overcome their economic woes. While urban middle class across India has ever increasing access to capital, resources and opportunities today, lower caste peasants and slum dwellers are being denied opportunity in this wonderful new world that is the result of your economic take off. Much needs to be done.

SW - I wouldn't comment on what RiazHaq has to say as that would be akin to feeding a (rather verbose) troll. Neither do I concern myself with the situation of Dalits in Pakistan, even for the sake of comparison.

But you are correct in your assertions that Dalit upliftment in India has been painfully slow. Affirmative action hasn't led to mass upliftment though I'd love to see data on that. For me the very fact that a party like BSP became a power riding on caste politics is sign of failure of India's social development policies. The fact that people voted for their caste-based agenda was an indication that things are not fine at the bottom of the econo-social pyramid. There are a lot of Dalit students in top institutions who enter through Quota but find the curriculum to tough and end up taking 5-6 years for a 4 year course. i wont blame them for that, its just that their initial schools weren't that good enough to develop their minds. Where as upper caste kids had the best of schools and other opportunities. It again boils down to economic opportunity.

But I must add, there have been significant improvement in some regions. My home state Punjab for example. Two of my Dalit schoolmates made it to IIT Delhi and AIIMS-Delhi, the top engg. and medical schools in the country, respectively. And they are as smart as anybody.

 

[sparklingway]

SW - I wouldn't comment on what RiazHaq has to say as that would be akin to feeding a (rather verbose) troll. Neither do I concern myself with the situation of Dalits in Pakistan, even for the sake of comparison.

But you are correct in your assertions that Dalit upliftment in India has been painfully slow. Affirmative action hasn't led to mass upliftment though I'd love to see data on that. For me the very fact that a party like BSP became a power riding on caste politics is sign of failure of India's social development policies. The fact that people voted for their caste-based agenda was an indication that things are not fine at the bottom of the econo-social pyramid. There are a lot of Dalit students in top institutions who enter through Quota but find the curriculum to tough and end up taking 5-6 years for a 4 year course. i wont blame them for that, its just that their initial schools weren't that good enough to develop their minds. Where as upper caste kids had the best of schools and other opportunities. It again boils down to economic opportunity.

But I must add, there have been significant improvement in some regions. My home state Punjab for example. Two of my Dalit schoolmates made it to IIT Delhi and AIIMS-Delhi, the top engg. and medical schools in the country, respectively. And they are as smart as anybody.

That is indeed good to hear. While affirmative actions itself speaks of social inequalities, it is a painful reminder but cannot be ignored. Most of the people who complain that affirmative action policies are based on the very issues that we want to move beyond, are usually trying to maintain existing class structures (a couple of true academics can be isolated cases for they are genuine). I'd like to read about India's affirmative action policies for dalits beyond quota systems. There's much to read on IIDS, but my hands are full these days hence I'd like a comprehensive piece if you can find one. Studies on agriculture and peasants shed light in this regard and I have had considerable study in those areas.

The success of a caste based party is a reminder of how deprived the people of lower castes feel. Ethnic politics is based on the same unholy principles which have no place in a modern civilization.

Pakistan has had its first dalit Senator as well.

This is the page for Senator Dr. Khatu Mal Jeewan for Umerkot, Sindh. He's served as an MNA and MPA earlier.

Senate of Pakistan

 

[Bang Galore]

To Indian Members :- This is not suppose to be an approval of how dalits are treated in India. You know better than I do that historical wrongs take a lot of time to be corrected but the progress on your side has been slow, terribly slow. Upward mobility of dalits is remarkably low compared with the rest of India. There is much evidence to support this. Dalits face discrimination and are not provided necessary resources and capital to overcome their economic woes. While urban middle class across India has ever increasing access to capital, resources and opportunities today, lower caste peasants and slum dwellers are being denied opportunity in this wonderful new world that is the result of your economic take off. Much needs to be done.
.

Well said Sir. While there has been some evidence of political upliftment of dalits, you are spot on in saying that economic upliftment has been very slow to come by. In rural areas, discrimination is unfortunately very rampant and will only change very slowly. Dramatic change will happen only when India becomes more & more urbanised.

I have no complaints against RiazHaq. He is entitled to his views. I would have preferred him to be less confrontational but he, in my view provides a good & necessary balance even if that is not actually his intention. Too many, far too many Indians like to imagine that we have left all this behind and that we are already a superpower whatever that is supposed to mean. I, for one can never understand why so many people go crazy over that word as if attaching it automatically changes something in our lives.

In any case guys like you neutralise a guy like Riaz Haq. You have in your above reply said pretty much the same as in a 100 Riaz Haq posts but i guarantee that almost no Indian member will take offense to anything you said, simply because it was not confrontational and you didn't try to extract unnecessary mileage out of it.

Maybe it's time Mr. Riaz Haq took a page from your book.

 

[RiazHaq]

Even though I would like to comment profoundly on the abject poverty in which many people live across India, I cannot control but say that as soon as I read the title of the thread, I knew it had to be RiazHaq. I had no iota of doubt in this regard and I'm happy that I'm able to recognize people easily now.

As for the point that they face discrimination, both economic and social, even Pakistan has classified Dalit's as "scheduled castes", only a softer name and they are similarly denied all economic and social rights in Pakistan. You might want to read bout that too.

News Reports:-
Discrimination against 'scheduled caste' Hindus continues | Pakistan | News | Newspaper | Daily | English | Online

Discrimination against ‘scheduled caste’ Hindus continues in Pakistan, Low Caste Hindu Women and Kids Being Sexploited in Pakistan Struggle for Hindu Existence

NGO Sustainability Network Plight of Scheduled Caste Hindus in Pakistan

Status Of Dalits/ Scheduled Castes In Pakistan

Research Reports:-

CASTE-BASED DISCRIMINATION IN PAKISTAN

http://idsn.org/uploads/media/PakistanUPRpdf.pdf

Letter to CJ by a dalit social worker:-

Rights of Scheduled Castes/ Dalits of Pakistan

I also happen to have read a detailed study by IIDS in this regard. This is a damning 87 page report, might come as a shocker to you. Read this if you are more than just a basher. This is an extensive report covering social, political, economic and other factors involving the plight of dalits in Pakistan. A necessary read for anybody studying development economics and development geography or anybody wanting to do some social work to improve the lives of everyday Pakistanis. These very dalits are my fellow Pakistanis, they have been denied political, economic, social and human rights. It is my duty to fight for their rights and work for theie improvement. I'd rather do that than write half baked accounts of Indian oppression, Indian hegemony, Indian economic weakness, Indian strategic weakness and anything that sheds a negative light on India (also includes twisting lamp to portray a negative light).

Long Behind Schedule : A Study on the plight of scheduled caste Hindus in Pakistan


To Indian Members :- This is not suppose to be an approval of how dalits are treated in India. You know better than I do that historical wrongs take a lot of time to be corrected but the progress on your side has been slow, terribly slow. Upward mobility of dalits is remarkably low compared with the rest of India. There is much evidence to support this. Dalits face discrimination and are not provided necessary resources and capital to overcome their economic woes. While urban middle class across India has ever increasing access to capital, resources and opportunities today, lower caste peasants and slum dwellers are being denied opportunity in this wonderful new world that is the result of your economic take off. Much needs to be done.

I only wanted to highlight that as usual, RiazHaq, has nothing better than to bash India for reasons apparent to us all. It is not wrong to point out glaring accounts of disparity and denial of rights in India but you might as well have posted something about their condition in Pakistan as well. Improving the lives of impoverished classes and sectors of society is a duty of us all as we represent the upper middle and elite class (mostly).

First, I think you discovered this thread a little late, and then jumped the gun to criticize it in your usual fashion.

Second, it seems that in your extraordinary zeal to be fair and evenhanded, you did not even bother to read the thread starter post in its entirety.

My original post that started the thread acknowledges that the caste discrimination problem exists beyond India's borders in countries. Here's the part that discusses it:

In what has been called Asia's hidden apartheid, entire villages in many Indian states remain completely segregated by caste. Caste-based abuse is also found in Nepal, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Japan, and several African states.

Having said that, the problem in India far worse in terms of scope and scale than any of the other named countries, including Pakistan. Here's part of the original post:

In support of its assertions of Dalit abuse in India, the Human Rights Watch has documented the following abuses:

* Over 100,000 cases of rape, murder, arson, and other atrocities against Dalits are reported in India each year. Given that Dalits are both reluctant and unable (for lack of police cooperation) to report crimes against themselves, the actual number of abuses is presumably much higher.

* India's own agencies have reported that these cases are typically related to attempts by Dalits to defy the social order, or demand minimum wages and their basic human rights. Many of the atrocities are committed by the police. Even perpetrators of large-scale massacres have escaped prosecution.

* An estimated forty million people in India, among them fifteen million children, are bonded laborers, working in slave-like conditions in order to pay off a debt. A majority of them are Dalits.

* According to government statistics, an estimated one million Dalits are manual scavengers who clear feces from public and private latrines and dispose of dead animals; unofficial estimates are much higher.

* The sexual slavery of Dalit girls and women continues to receive religious sanction. Under the devadasi system, thousands of Dalit girls in India's southern states are ceremoniously dedicated or married to a deity or to a temple. Once dedicated, they are unable to marry, forced to become prostitutes for upper-caste community members, and eventually auctioned into an urban brothel.

Sparklingway:

Please stop being so preachy. Learn to read and comprehend before chiming in with your usual negative comments about my posts that deal with serious issues affecting both India and Pakistan. Discrimination and violence are not the exclusive preserve of Pakistanis. These problems, whether discrimination or violence based on gender, caste, or religion, etc. are found in spades in all parts of South Asia, including the "world's largest democracy" next door to a much bigger extent than in Pakistan.

While condemning such injustices, we must put these things in perspective for our region.

 

[PlanetWarrior]

First, I think you discovered this thread a little late, and then jumped the gun to criticize it in your usual fashion.

Second, it seems that in your extraordinary zeal to be fair and evenhanded, you did not even bother to read the thread starter post in its entirety.

My original post that started the thread acknowledges that the caste discrimination problem exists beyond India's borders in countries. Here's the part that discusses it:



Having said that, the problem in India far worse in terms of scope and scale than any of the other named countries, including Pakistan. Here's part of the original post:



Sparklingway:

Please stop being so preachy. Learn to read and comprehend before chiming in with your usual negative comments about my posts that deal with serious issues affecting both India and Pakistan. Discrimination and violence are not the exclusive preserve of Pakistanis. These problems, whether discrimination or violence based on gender, caste, or religion, etc. are found in spades in all parts of South Asia, including the "world's largest democracy" next door to a much bigger extent than in Pakistan.

While condemning such injustices, we must put these things in perspective for our region.

Mr Haq, your research for the information which you set up in your blog is obviously time consuming and well referenced. If indeed it is your noble intention to highlight the problems faced in "our region" then I am certain that Indian members of this forum or readers of your blog can carry no complaint against you. However as a member of this forum I have yet to read an article which emanates from your blog which focuses on social problems in Pakistan , Bangladesh or even China for that matter. Is your blog dedictated to abstract hatred for India or to highlighting the social problems in our region? In conclusion I must commend you for your well referenced research material but may I suggest that you put your talent to better use by adopting a neutral stance in your articles and genuinely highlighting all of the problems faced in all of our regions. You may be rewarded eventually by the fact that your blog could possibly become an authoratative base for social problems which highlight our sub continent. Until then , all that it is regarded as being is a source of India bashing which isn't worth the trouble to look at

 

[RiazHaq]

Police in India are questioning the father and brother of a Delhi-based journalist found dead last week in a suspected "honour killing" case.

Nirupama Pathak was found dead in her parents' home in Jharkhand state. An autopsy revealed that she was pregnant.

She was reportedly in a relationship with a man from a different caste.

On Monday Miss Pathak's mother was arrested in connection with her murder. Her family deny all the allegations and say she committed suicide.

Miss Pathak's family reported her death last Thursday. They said she was found hanging from the ceiling fan in her room and produced two suicide notes.

But an autopsy report showed the death was "a clear case of murder... caused by asphyxia as a result of smothering," the AFP news agency quoted senior Jharkhand police officer MS Bhatia as saying.

The autopsy also showed that Pathak was pregnant, fuelling suspicions that this was a case of honour killing, police said.

Miss Pathak, 22, was a high-caste Hindu Brahmin living in Delhi and reportedly in a relationship with another journalist, Priyabhanshu Ranjan, who was from a lower caste.

Police say that her parents had opposed the idea of their daughter "marrying someone from outside their caste".

Correspondents say that honour killings in the villages of northern India have long been reported.

But if Miss Pathak's case is found to be an instance of honour killing, it would be rare given her education and her urban background.

BBC News - Family questioned in India journalist death

 

[RiazHaq]

Mr Haq, your research for the information which you set up in your blog is obviously time consuming and well referenced. If indeed it is your noble intention to highlight the problems faced in "our region" then I am certain that Indian members of this forum or readers of your blog can carry no complaint against you. However as a member of this forum I have yet to read an article which emanates from your blog which focuses on social problems in Pakistan , Bangladesh or even China for that matter. Is your blog dedictated to abstract hatred for India or to highlighting the social problems in our region? In conclusion I must commend you for your well referenced research material but may I suggest that you put your talent to better use by adopting a neutral stance in your articles and genuinely highlighting all of the problems faced in all of our regions. You may be rewarded eventually by the fact that your blog could possibly become an authoratative base for social problems which highlight our sub continent. Until then , all that it is regarded as being is a source of India bashing which isn't worth the trouble to look at

Your ill-informed and sanctimonious comments put you in the same category as your Pakistani counterpart sparklingway.

Please read my posts and my blog to correct your erroneous allegation of me being a "source of India bashing" .

Here are just a few of my posts that I hope will help enlighten you:

Haq's Musings: A Tale of Tribal Terror

Haq's Musings: Pakistani Children's Plight

Haq's Musings: "Ode" to the Feudal Prince of Pakistan

Haq's Musings: Taliban Target Pakistan's Landed Elite

Haq's Musings: Feudal Punjab Fertile Ground for Pakistani Jihadists?

And there are many more posts like the above.

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Your ill-informed and sanctimonious comments put you in the same category as your Pakistani counterpart sparklingway.

Please read my posts and my blog to correct your erroneous allegation of me being a "source of India bashing" .

Here are just a few of my posts that I hope will help enlighten you:

Haq's Musings: A Tale of Tribal Terror

Haq's Musings: Pakistani Children's Plight

Haq's Musings: "Ode" to the Feudal Prince of Pakistan

Haq's Musings: Taliban Target Pakistan's Landed Elite

Haq's Musings: Feudal Punjab Fertile Ground for Pakistani Jihadists?

And there are many more posts like the above.

Thank you for your informative narrative. However to you as a suspected either amateur or full time journalist or sociologist I suggest that you adopt a thick skin when it comes to criticisms of your blog and that you respond in a more cordial fashion. It may perhaps earn your writings the respect which you yearn for it to do so. Having responded however disdainfully, but nonetheless with a measure of proving your blog as being a wider source of information apart from the India bashing topics which you widely introduce on this forum, might I suggest that you introduce the wider topics to which you refer as topics of discussion on this forum. I would suspect that your blog would benefit from a wider spectrum of readership which it currently enjoys

 

[sirius]

Thank Mr haq..we badly need these types of threads once or two in a week...After all laughter is the best medicine

 

[k_n]

Sir Riaz ,

Whom are you pointing fingers at ?

a . The Indian Govt and Law Enforcing agencies for not enforcing the laws that punish discrimination against Dalits .
b . The Indian society ( spl. Hindu community ) that practises Caste based segregation and nurtures prejudices against a different caste community spl. the Dalits .
c . The religious sanction given to caste heirarchy in Hindu codes of law .

Segegartion based on caste/community is practised throughout South Asia . India , rather Hindu society in India is worst off because of the sanctions given to caste heirarchy in Hindu theology and mythology . Here , the worst sufferers are Dalits as their communities have been reduced to performing only menial jobs in the society . AGREED .

The connotations in your text which solely target a 'few' upper caste Hindu communities in 'ENFORCING' the caste based descrimination and segregation are either trivial or deliberate attempt on your part to show Hindu society in general and upper caste communities in particular in bad light . In the feudal set up still breathing its last in pockets all over rural India we have the preistly/land owning class nexus prevailent ( although in sharp decline ) sanctioning il-treatment of Dalits in particular . This pattern shows up in urban areas as well though not as rigid and nowhere as exploitative , but that doesnt give you a liberty to target either the Hindu religion or Indian Civilization !

1. How many Dalit communities converted en-mass to Islam during Sultanate and Mughal time or to Christianity during Raj in Indian heartland ( The Gangetic plains which is supposed to be seat of 'Brahminism ' ) ?
2. Why does Sikh , Muslim and Christian communities not just in rural North India but also deep down South practise caste based discrimnation . Because I havnt heard of any Jutt marying a Tarkhan let alone a Dalit or any Sayed .. or maybe Pathan in UP marrying someone from weaver or buthcher community ?
3. I dont want to write what I'am writing just now but u need to READ it . Do I need to remind you what led to gang-rape of Mukhtaran Mai ?? Discrimination and Segregation whether caste based or community based and collective community punishment to an individual from the deprived caste/community is afterall HUMAN RIGHTS ABUSE no matter in which society or amongst people following what religion it takes place .
4. Ask a dalit from a particular caste would his family go and seek a marriage proposal in a different dalit caste ? The answer you'll get is NO !

So , dont trivilaise the caste based discrimination as inflicting only Hindu society and an exclusive Hindu Evil .
We Indians are all against medieval discriminatory practises reducing certain communities to the status of mere serfs . Yes the origin lies in Hindu theology but much has taken plae over the last two centuries since the contact of Hinduism with the West .
Regardless of whatever you may write afterwards , the truth is that the process of losening of the grip of the caste system in Indian society has begun long ago . Any Indian here knows what I'am implying to say

 

[Hutchroy]

Even though I would like to comment profoundly on the abject poverty in which many people live across India, I cannot control but say that as soon as I read the title of the thread, I knew it had to be RiazHaq. I had no iota of doubt in this regard and I'm happy that I'm able to recognize people easily now.



I only wanted to highlight that as usual, RiazHaq, has nothing better than to bash India for reasons apparent to us all. It is not wrong to point out glaring accounts of disparity and denial of rights in India but you might as well have posted something about their condition in Pakistan as well. Improving the lives of impoverished classes and sectors of society is a duty of us all as we represent the upper middle and elite class (mostly).

sparklingway Sir,

In respect of the Verbal Diarrhoea spewed out by the “One with a foaming mouth” I give below an Article by Raza Rumi on Casteism / Caste-ism as practiced in Pakistan :

Casteism : alive and well in Pakistan

What do you expect of a country where the aboriginals are known as janglis, asks Raza Rumi

Who says casteism is extinct in Pakistan? My friends have not been allowed to marry outside their caste or sect, Christian servants in Pakistani households are not permitted to touch kitchen utensils, and the word ‘choora’ is the ultimate insult

It is a cliché now to say that Pakistan is a country in transition – on a highway to somewhere. The direction remains unclear but the speed of transformation is visibly defying its traditionally overbearing, and now cracking postcolonial state. Globalisation, the communications revolution and a growing middle class have altered the contours of a society beset by the baggage and layers of confusing history.

What has however emerged despite the affinity with jeans, FM radios and McDonalds is the visible trumpeting of caste-based identities. In Lahore, one finds hundreds of cars with the owner’s caste or tribe displayed as a marker of pride and distinctiveness. As an urbanite, I always found it difficult to comprehend the relevance of zaat-paat (casteism) until I experienced living in the peri-urban and sometimes rural areas of the Punjab as a public servant.

I recall the days when in a central Punjab district, I was mistaken for a Kakayzai (a Punjabi caste that claims to have originated from the Caucasus) so I started getting correspondence from the Anjuman-i-Kakayzai professionals who were supposed to hold each other’s hands in the manner of the Free Masons. I enjoyed the game and pretended that I was one of them for a while, until it became unbearable for its sheer silliness and mercenary objectives.

It was also here that a subordinate told me in chaste Punjabi how the Gujjar caste was not a social group but a ‘religion’ in itself. Or that the Rajputs were superior to everyone else, second only to the Syeds. All else was the junk that had converted from the lowly Hindus (of course this included my family).

My first name is also a matter of sectarian interpretation. Another subordinate in my younger days lectured me on the importance of sticking together as the ‘victims’ of the Sunni majoritarian violence of Pakistani society. Mistaken as a Momin I also got a chance to know intra-group dynamics better, and also how closely knit such groups are and what they think of others. This reminds me of the horrific tales our domestic helper used to tell us about the Shi’ites, and as children we were scared to even go near a Moharram procession, until one day my Sunni parents fired her for poisoning their children’s minds.

My personal inclinations aside, for in the footsteps of the great Urdu poet Ghalib, I view myself as half a Shia, this has been a matter of concern. Can I not exist as a human being without being part of a herd? Obedience to hierarchies, conformity and identification with groups are central tenets of existing in Pakistan.

At a training institution fifteen years ago, where a group of us were being taught how to become ‘officers’, a colleague cooked up a fanciful story about me. In the lecture hall, I had argued for a secular state, quoting Jinnah’s August 11, 1947 speech and had highlighted the shoddy treatment of the minorities in Pakistan as a betrayal of the Quaid’s vision. This imaginative colleague circulated the rumour that the reason for my political views was that I belonged to the Ahmaddiya Jamaat. One could of course talk of the marginalised only if one was a part of that group. Otherwise why should we care, semi-citizens that we are!

In the twenty first century, Punjab’s entire electoral landscape is still defined by caste and biradari loyalties. In the 1980s, General Zia ul Haq’s machinations spearheaded a second social engineering in the Punjab by resuscitating the demons of clan, caste and tribe. Party-less elections helped Zia to undermine the PPP but it also gave enormous leeway to the state agencies to pick and choose loyalties when election was all about the elders of a biradari. His Arain (a non-land tilling caste) background became a topic of discussion as many Arains used this card to great personal and commercial advantage during his tenure. This is similar to what the Kashmiris have perceived under the multiple reigns of the now rechristened (in a democratic sense) Sharifs of the Punjab, who are proud Kashmiris .

Why blame the Punjabis only? In the early years of Pakistan, the migrants from India had set the ground for the politics of patronage along ethnic and group-lines. Karachi became divided into little Lucknows, Delhis and other centres of nostalgia. Employment opportunities and claims of property, as several personal accounts and autobiographies reveal, were doled out on the basis of affiliation to pre-partition networks – Aligarh, Delhi, UP qasbaas and Hyderabadi neighbourhoods. The same goes for the smaller units of Pakistan. Small wonder that the Bengalis ran away from the Pakistan project, despite being its original initiators.

We pride ourselves on being a nuclear armed Islamic state that broke away from the prejudiced Baniyas whose abominable caste system was inhuman. But what do we practice? Who said casteism was extinct in Pakistan? My friends have not been allowed to marry outside their caste or sect, Christian servants in Pakistani households are not permitted to touch kitchen utensils, and the word ‘choora’ is the ultimate insult after the ritualistic out-of wedlock sex and incestuous abuses involving mothers and sisters or their unmentionable anatomical parts. A Sindhi acquaintance told me how easy it was to exploit the Hindu girls at his workplace or at home. And what about the many blasphemy cases in the Punjabi villages, the roots of which are located in social hierarchies and chains of obedience.

The untouchables of the cities and the villages are called something else but they remain the underbelly of our existence. Admittedly these incidences are on a lesser scale than in India. That simply is a function of demographics. Even Mohammad Iqbal, the great reformist poet, lamented in one of his couplets: Youn tau Syed bhi ho, Mirza bhi ho, Afghan bhi ho/Tum sabhi kuch ho, batao tau Mussalman bhi ho (You are Syeds, Mirzas and Afghans/You are everything but Muslims).

Enter into a seemingly educated Punjabi setting and the conversation will not shy away from references to caste characteristics. For instance, I once heard a lawyer make a remark about a high-ranking public official, calling him a nai (barber) and therefore branding him as the lowest of the low. One of the reasons for Zardari-bashing in Sindh, has to do with the Zardari tribe’s historical moorings. They were camel herders as opposed to the ruling classes with fiefs.

When the young motorists playing FM radio, mast music, arranging dates on mastee chats, display the primordial caste characteristic on their windscreens, one worries if the ongoing change process can deliver a better society. Superficial signs of change cannot make up for the need for a secular educational system, equality of opportunity and accountability of political elites and their patron-state that use casteism as an instrument of gaining and sustaining power.

More bewildered, I wonder where I belong. Bulleh Shah has taught me that shedding categorisations is the first step towards self-knowledge. But I live in a society where branding and group labels are essential, if not unavoidable.

For this reason I am peeved that I still don’t know who I am.

Raza Rumi blogs at Jahane Rumi - In search of the unsearchable: O, my soul! where would you find your house? and edits Pak Tea House and Lahore Nama e-zines

 

[RiazHaq]

Thank you for your informative narrative. However to you as a suspected either amateur or full time journalist or sociologist I suggest that you adopt a thick skin when it comes to criticisms of your blog and that you respond in a more cordial fashion. It may perhaps earn your writings the respect which you yearn for it to do so. Having responded however disdainfully, but nonetheless with a measure of proving your blog as being a wider source of information apart from the India bashing topics which you widely introduce on this forum, might I suggest that you introduce the wider topics to which you refer as topics of discussion on this forum. I would suspect that your blog would benefit from a wider spectrum of readership which it currently enjoys

Unlike most posters here, I do not personally abuse any one, nor do I personalize the arguments.

As to the readers and contributors of my blog, I have a good sampling of highly informative and often critical posts from multiple Indian writers and activists who care far more about India than some of the many juvenile and hateful Indian commentators on this forum.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

India Toilet Cleaners Stage Protest over Conditions​

By Rajesh Joshi

BBC News, Delhi

Hundreds of Indian workers employed to manually clean non-flush toilets have protested in Delhi against their working conditions.

They say that the authorities have failed to act despite declaring such work illegal, and should issue an apology for decades of discrimination.

Government figures suggest that about 300,000 low-caste Dalits are still employed in such work.

They are estimated on average to earn less than $4 (£2.50) a month.

The demonstrators began their protests a month ago by criss-crossing the country to highlight their demands.

Manual "scavenging" - removing human excreta from dry or non-flush toilets - is a centuries-old practice in India.

It is mainly carried out by the Dalits, formerly known as the untouchables, who are at the lowest rung of the Hindu caste system.

They go from house to house every morning to collect night soil, a euphemism for human faeces.

Although manual scavenging is prohibited by law, some government departments still have such workers. These include the railways ministry, which employs people to clean railway tracks as most trains have open-discharge toilets.

Government figures show there are more than 300,000 manual scavengers in India, but unofficial estimates put the number at more than one million.

The organisers of the protest say they want the government to completely eradicate the practice and rehabilitate those engaged in it.

They say that there will be a countrywide protest from November if the government fails to meet their demands.

BBC News - India toilet cleaners stage protest over conditions

 

[Ras]

I do not understand...the dalits are not forced to do this work. So if they did not like it then they should do something else. How can you protest something you are doing of your own free will?