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Comparison with last PML-N govt: PTI govt incurs 48pc less external liabilities: Finance

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Comparison with last PML-N govt: PTI govt incurs 48pc less external liabilities: Finance

Zaheer Abbasi 16 Nov 2020


ISLAMABAD: Finance Ministry has claimed that present government led by Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) incurred 48 percent ($15 billion) less external liabilities in first 9 quarters of (June 2018-September 2020) than Pakistan Muslim League (N) government last nine quarters (March 2016-June 2018) despite 78 percent more debt servicing.

Adviser on Finance Dr Abdul Hafeez Shaikh made a comparison between last nine quarters of PML-N government and first nine quarters of PTI led government. The graph shared by Hafeez Shaikh to media showed that PML-N government had added $24.8 billion net external debt from March 2016 to June 2018 while PTI added $18.5 billion to net external debt from June 2018 to September 2020.

State Bank of Pakistan (SBP) Reserves had contracted by $ 6.3 billion during the period under review of Pakistan Muslim League (N) tenure while foreign exchange reserves improved by $2.4 billion during the first nine quarters of the present government. Overall liabilities impact, the adviser said, had been $31.1 billion during PML-N government last two years and one quarter as compared to $16.1 billion of present government tenure.

The adviser added that despite the challenges posed by Covid-19, Pakistan's industrial sector registered growth and in LSM, textile production & auto-sales are on the rise. Year-on-year industry wise LSM growth in September 2020 showed 21 percent growth in non metallic mineral product, followed by autos 28 percent, pharmaceuticals 20 percent, paper and board 12 percent, food 10 percent, fertilisers 8 percent, chemicals 8 percent and rubber 15 percent.

The adviser said that vehicles sales was also on the rise with 29 percent growth in car sales during October 2020 over the same month a year before after car sales was increased from 10,853 units to 14,054 units.

Sale of motorbikes and 3-wheelers also witnessed sizeable increase of 12 percent as their sales increased from 156,872 units to 175,294 units. Sale of tractors increased from 2861 units to 4482 units, showing a growth of 67 percent and trucks and buses from 349 to 388 with 11 percent increase.

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Can they please also post how much the economy shrunk in those years and rate of actual inflation?

I mean at the end of the day, do any of these fudged figures explain why naya Pakistan is so darned expensive when prevention of ML and corruption alone should have offset any side effects of devaluation/returns etc.?
 
Can they please also post how much the economy shrunk in those years and rate of actual inflation?

I mean at the end of the day, do any of these fudged figures explain why naya Pakistan is so darned expensive when prevention of ML and corruption alone should have offset any side effects of devaluation/returns etc.?
Bahi do you think it would have offset it ?

Except dollar blunder by Dar.. non viable subsidies were also problem which PTI stopped.. and then covid hit...
 
Can they please also post how much the economy shrunk in those years and rate of actual inflation?

I mean at the end of the day, do any of these fudged figures explain why naya Pakistan is so darned expensive when prevention of ML and corruption alone should have offset any side effects of devaluation/returns etc.?
2 points.

First: the Pakistani economy was artificially higher than it should have been. PMLN used artificial means to boost the economy and help it grow, which ended up hurting Pakistan in the medium term, and will be even worse in the long term.

PTI cleaning up the mess was bound to shrink the economy.

Cancer treatment is painful, but necessary to destroy the cancer infesting Pakistan.

Second: Covid-19.
 
Can they please also post how much the economy shrunk in those years and rate of actual inflation?

I mean at the end of the day, do any of these fudged figures explain why naya Pakistan is so darned expensive when prevention of ML and corruption alone should have offset any side effects of devaluation/returns etc.?
Artificial rupee valuation resulted in artificial import based growth in economy.

Have you ever had a credit card? Chances are you overspend, eat out everyday , buy electronics, and when the statement date hits and you see the financial charges rack up month on month you figure out you can't pay the minimum due. Then you go into damage control mode, stopping all expenses and figuring out ways to reduce your debt. Yeah you won't eat out more, or probably have to stop munching on your favorite Lindt bar for a couple of months but it will get you financially on track.

Damage control mode + COVID was a disaster for Pakistan but thankfully we're back on track and if the pace is kept up we'll be in the black sooner than later.
 
Bahi do you think it would have offset it ?

Except dollar blunder by Dar.. non viable subsidies were also problem which PTI stopped.. and then covid hit...

But that was the selling point based on which PTI came into power. That by plugging outflow of black money, prevention of ML & tax evasion and elimination of corruption, Pakistan's economy would grow exponentially stronger. That money recalled from Swiss Banks would simply be fringe benefits.

I disagree with the whole premise that Dar made any blunders, despite my hatred for nepotism and family inherited political kingdoms on which PML and PPP stand, I cannot help but appreciate Dar's performance through his tenure. He is the reason because of which lives of average Pakistanis was decent. Even subsidies, where needed, must be appreciated as they often lead to growth...…today, most of the subsidy and tax holiday should be focused on export industry and FDI; and so on.
2 points.

First: the Pakistani economy was artificially higher than it should have been. PMLN used artificial means to boost the economy and help it grow, which ended up hurting Pakistan in the medium term, and will be even worse in the long term.

PTI cleaning up the mess was bound to shrink the economy.

Cancer treatment is painful, but necessary to destroy the cancer infesting Pakistan.

Second: Covid-19.

So, this is the 2nd time somebody mentioned COVID but failed to appreciate the Dharna's aided by establishment terminating on WoT which Pakistan actively fought after the attack on APS which drained considerable resources, to further add the hyper-active judicial suo motos on top of a severely critical and anti-government establishment.......don't you think these odds were even more severe than COVID which also largely negated financial hit by by postponed/rescheduled debt repayments?

Now, coming back to the ever-important point, Pakistani economy was not artificially higher. Infact, what constitutes economic parity or balance in respect to USD? It used to be Gold, and for good reason too; however, what determines the strength of economy of a country like Pakistan or countries like India, Sri Lanka, China and even Japan? One can most certainly disagree with the different economic plans but it is quite evident which plan was working and which failed miserable.
Artificial rupee valuation resulted in artificial import based growth in economy.

Have you ever had a credit card? Chances are you overspend, eat out everyday , buy electronics, and when the statement date hits and you see the financial charges rack up month on month you figure out you can't pay the minimum due. Then you go into damage control mode, stopping all expenses and figuring out ways to reduce your debt. Yeah you won't eat out more, or probably have to stop munching on your favorite Lindt bar for a couple of months but it will get you financially on track.

Damage control mode + COVID was a disaster for Pakistan but thankfully we're back on track and if the pace is kept up we'll be in the black sooner than later.

Very good example but not relevant to this case, a more aptly example in this case would be a house loan, you build on your infrastructure and wait for the base to settle in before you start reaping the rewards. We were most certainly importing a lot but how much of it was for CPEC and Military? How much was it for Power Generation which is the base to all commercial activity including the much needed export industry? Today, we are able to generate surplus energy is all because of the imports of yesteryears which were implemented in projects now bearing rewards.

Now that the previous regime set the base, for export industry to start building which would eventually lead to exports growing every year, it is for this Government to reap the rewards...…if it was only so capable.
 
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Can they please also post how much the economy shrunk in those years and rate of actual inflation?

I mean at the end of the day, do any of these fudged figures explain why naya Pakistan is so darned expensive when prevention of ML and corruption alone should have offset any side effects of devaluation/returns etc.?
Where is the decrease of Gdp in PKR? Decrease in USD is due to devaluation of PKR thanks to your absconder Ishaq Dollar economic hitman policies
PTI cleaning up the mess was bound to shrink the economy.
Economy did not shrink under PTI. That's the biggest lie by Pmln mafia
I disagree with the whole premise that Dar made any blunders, despite my hatred for nepotism and family inherited political kingdoms on which PML and PPP stand, I cannot help but appreciate Dar's performance through his tenure. He is the reason because of which lives of average Pakistanis was decent.
Yeah and at what price? Lives were decent because your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar overvalued PKR artificially, draining Pakistan's foreign exchange reserves for billions of US dollars!
349721A2-470E-4246-A76E-6174D9F8319B.png
03AD6048-E84A-434B-A9E9-58D7322ECE3D.png

Today, we are able to generate surplus energy is all because of the imports of yesteryears which were implemented in projects now bearing rewards.
Hahaha. What good is this surplus electricity when its price is highest in the region causing Pakistani export industry to become non competitive. Furthermore power sector has growing circular debt of more than 2 trillion Rs. Who will pay for that when electricity price is already highest in the region? Your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar or people of Pakistan?
Now that the previous regime set the base, for export industry to start building which would eventually lead to exports growing every year, it is for this Government to reap the rewards...…if it was only so capable.
Please tell us how you get exports to grow with the highest electricity price in the region. And with a growing circular debt of 2 trillion Rs in power sector?

 
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Where is the decrease of Gdp in PKR? Decrease in USD is due to devaluation of PKR thanks to your absconder Ishaq Dollar economic hitman policies

Let me start off by saying very explicitly that I am neither your enemy nor your ill-wisher; And I am unable to respond in kind to your comments, I will merely respond to the technical (or not so technical points) in your post. I would also seriously recommend that you get out of Twitter/Youtube mindset and use your own reasoning.

You ask me where GDP has decreased in PKR when GDP world over is established in USD, this again is naivety because of your political affiliation rather than logical thinking. Furthermore, when Dar was Finance Minister, we needed to import more than we could export at that time. We were importing Oil, Machinery (heavy CPEC related imports including) & Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Weapons (JF-17's, Chinese Subs etc.), Vehicles etc. We were importing more because we needed imported machinery, electronics, chemicals and raw material to establish CPEC related projects amongst other projects. One of the most important requirement for any export oriented country is power which we were facing acute shortage of ever since Musharraf's exit. We needed a lot of power projects and today we have surplus energy generation capacity. Now is the time to import more machinery, electronics, raw material etc., and establish industry which is capable of producing export goods in short to medium term.



Economy did not shrink under PTI. That's the biggest lie by Pmln mafia

Again, please stop trusting Twitter and Facebook posts which are usually posted by fanboys, paid resources or supporters of one political party or the other. Instead research reliable open sources such as ADB, WB, IMF etc. Pakistan's economy has actually shrunk in relative sense.

Let me give you an example: The budget for Military was Rs. 1,227 billion in 2019 which has been jacked up to Rs. 1,289 billion in 2020. In reality the allocation has increased but in relative terms (considering all our major military procurements are in USD; local currency is used only for salary, benefits etc.) it has shrunk as USD in 2019 was around 140 whereas it is around 156 in 2020 which leaves us with a budget of USD 8.76 Billion in 2019 vs USD 8.26 Billion in 2020.



Yeah and at what price? Lives were decent because your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar overvalued PKR artificially, draining Pakistan's foreign exchange reserves for billions of US dollars!

Do you understand how currency is manipulated in Pakistan? How big is the open market? How could Dar or anyone else manipulate PKR? Also, do you know how much we were importing under Dar? If you put 2 and 2 together, Dar wasn't merely supporting PKR against USD by flooding the market with USD, he was also actively supporting an import based economy while importing Oil, Machinery, Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Military Equipment, Vehicles etc. and magically he was also ensuring a higher reserve than anyone else ever did (Rs. 20 Billion when Dar was disqualified in 2017).......so, seriously, does it make sense when PTI waalas claim that Dar was artificially managing USD to the disadvantage of Pakistan?



Hahaha. What good is this surplus electricity when its price is highest in the region causing Pakistani export industry to become non competitive. Furthermore power sector has growing circular debt of more than 2 trillion Rs. Who will pay for that when electricity price is already highest in the region? Your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar or people of Pakistan?

The real question is, how expensive was electricity under Dar and PML. When you consider the fact that sovereign guarantees, international stock (bond) maturity, repayments etc., are all tied to the USD; does it not automatically become apparent that a lower USD would mean less payments externally?

Basically, when people buy into the PTI lies (and there are dozens of major lies by Imran Khan, the master of U-Turn/Munafiqat) they automatically assume all PTI claims to be factual, however ridiculous they may be.

Electricity, gas, petrol, medicine etc., are all very very expensive under the incumbent because of their lies, stupidity, inability, incompetence, nepotism and corruption. What saddens me the most is that Imran Khan the munfiq-e-aala can still blame the previous governments for all the ills today and his followers believe him. I mean I too was an avid supporter of MQM back in the day but I started calling Altaf Hussain a drunk a*****e as far back as 2005.



Please tell us how you get exports to grow with the highest electricity price in the region. And with a growing circular debt of 2 trillion Rs in power sector?

You speak of CD, do you even realize that it was Rs. 1,126 billion under PML and considerably lower under Dar but has spiked up to Rs. 2,400 Billion by now? It was Rs. 2,150 billion till June 30th, 2020! But you still blame PML.

Anyway, even now all is not lost. We need to offer tax subsidies to export oriented industries to offset the higher cost of business, strengthen the PKR to a sweet spot where our exports are competitive yet critical imports not too cumbersome etc.[/QUOTE]
 
Let me start off by saying very explicitly that I am neither your enemy nor your ill-wisher; And I am unable to respond in kind to your comments, I will merely respond to the technical (or not so technical points) in your post. I would also seriously recommend that you get out of Twitter/Youtube mindset and use your own reasoning.

You ask me where GDP has decreased in PKR when GDP world over is established in USD, this again is naivety because of your political affiliation rather than logical thinking. Furthermore, when Dar was Finance Minister, we needed to import more than we could export at that time. We were importing Oil, Machinery (heavy CPEC related imports including) & Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Weapons (JF-17's, Chinese Subs etc.), Vehicles etc. We were importing more because we needed imported machinery, electronics, chemicals and raw material to establish CPEC related projects amongst other projects. One of the most important requirement for any export oriented country is power which we were facing acute shortage of ever since Musharraf's exit. We needed a lot of power projects and today we have surplus energy generation capacity. Now is the time to import more machinery, electronics, raw material etc., and establish industry which is capable of producing export goods in short to medium term.





Again, please stop trusting Twitter and Facebook posts which are usually posted by fanboys, paid resources or supporters of one political party or the other. Instead research reliable open sources such as ADB, WB, IMF etc. Pakistan's economy has actually shrunk in relative sense.

Let me give you an example: The budget for Military was Rs. 1,227 billion in 2019 which has been jacked up to Rs. 1,289 billion in 2020. In reality the allocation has increased but in relative terms (considering all our major military procurements are in USD; local currency is used only for salary, benefits etc.) it has shrunk as USD in 2019 was around 140 whereas it is around 156 in 2020 which leaves us with a budget of USD 8.76 Billion in 2019 vs USD 8.26 Billion in 2020.





Do you understand how currency is manipulated in Pakistan? How big is the open market? How could Dar or anyone else manipulate PKR? Also, do you know how much we were importing under Dar? If you put 2 and 2 together, Dar wasn't merely supporting PKR against USD by flooding the market with USD, he was also actively supporting an import based economy while importing Oil, Machinery, Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Military Equipment, Vehicles etc. and magically he was also ensuring a higher reserve than anyone else ever did (Rs. 20 Billion when Dar was disqualified in 2017).......so, seriously, does it make sense when PTI waalas claim that Dar was artificially managing USD to the disadvantage of Pakistan?





The real question is, how expensive was electricity under Dar and PML. When you consider the fact that sovereign guarantees, international stock (bond) maturity, repayments etc., are all tied to the USD; does it not automatically become apparent that a lower USD would mean less payments externally?

Basically, when people buy into the PTI lies (and there are dozens of major lies by Imran Khan, the master of U-Turn/Munafiqat) they automatically assume all PTI claims to be factual, however ridiculous they may be.

Electricity, gas, petrol, medicine etc., are all very very expensive under the incumbent because of their lies, stupidity, inability, incompetence, nepotism and corruption. What saddens me the most is that Imran Khan the munfiq-e-aala can still blame the previous governments for all the ills today and his followers believe him. I mean I too was an avid supporter of MQM back in the day but I started calling Altaf Hussain a drunk a*****e as far back as 2005.





You speak of CD, do you even realize that it was Rs. 1,126 billion under PML and considerably lower under Dar but has spiked up to Rs. 2,400 Billion by now? It was Rs. 2,150 billion till June 30th, 2020! But you still blame PML.

Anyway, even now all is not lost. We need to offer tax subsidies to export oriented industries to offset the higher cost of business, strengthen the PKR to a sweet spot where our exports are competitive yet critical imports not too cumbersome etc.
[/QUOTE]

Your knowledge about basic economics is very poor bro. You are only copying propaganda without any substantial reasoning.
Here is an article for you to read upon and understand some basics.

Currency games!
BR Research 17 Nov 2020
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The PKR/USD breached 158 level yesterday. Most treasuries were of the view that PKR/USD could cross 170, when it was north of 165. Forces of demand and supply are driving currency movements since July 2019. The currency has hovered in the band of 154-168 since then.
The sentiment is positive today and it can take rupee back to 150. Some say this should happen to bring the dollars from the lockers into the market. But this would put pressure on the current account. Exporters are already uneasy on the currency appreciation. If the PKR goes on appreciating, at some point they may lose orders. The SBP should look at the market holistically and intervene accordingly.
The objective of SBP should be to build reserves – and that would happen when the current account is in good shape, capital/financial inflows keep on coming, and exchange companies are the net seller. If the PKR appreciates too much, these three factors can shift poles. Rupee below 155 could not necessarily be beneficial.
The current account is in surplus in the last four of the five months. Till the time oil prices hover around $40-45/barrel and remittances remain at a run rate of $2.2-2.3 billion per month, the current account is in control. The economic activities are picking up and these grow faster with currency appreciation. If the currency appreciates too much, this can bounce back in the form of higher imports and lower exports.
The word on the street is that exporters are fully booked till June 2020. Many exporters are operating at full capacity and they are in the process of expansion. There are some advantages of currency appreciation for exporters, as they are importing cotton and other raw material at better prices, the expansion cost is going to be lower in PKR. But the core business margins are squeezing for some. The reason exports are at full potential or they are in expansion is that they don’t have any loss due to overvalued currency (as was the case in 2014-18).
In fact, the currency is now under-valued. And it should be kept undervalued for some time. It is the inertia of the past few years of overvaluation. The undervalued currency may help in building much needed reserves through achieving surpluses in current and capital/financial accounts. The cash holder of foreign currency in local markets may sell and that should help SBP in reducing its forward/swap liabilities.
One of the reasons, the exporters are in expansion phase and are getting big orders, is the undervalued currency. One of the reasons cash holders are net sellers (as per exchange companies’ representatives) for the past 16 months is undervalued currency as well.
The party should not be over. The reserves are built in the process; but are not enough. Prior to COVID, SBP reserves were at $12 billion and then the toll fell substantially and now it is back to similar levels. The comfortable level is nothing below $20 billion. There is some journey to cover for the SBP before they can sit and relax.
Many say that Pakistan should focus on services exports. Many say that foreign exchange regime should be fully flexible, on the premise that if the money flow is seamless, investment, services exports and goods exports will grow through promotion of goods and services abroad. By doing this, the incentive to keep flows outside through under and over invoicing would die. But for opening up of the regime, it would require a certain level of reserves, for making SBP to lose control as the depth would be enough to absorb any external crisis.
Thus, for moving towards fully flexible exchange rate and foreign exchange movement markets, reserves need to be built. For that, open market should keep on selling and interbank market should be in surplus. And too much appreciation can undo it.
The SBP’s stated policy is of adaptation of flexible exchange rate as a buffer against external shocks, with SBP intervention in the foreign exchange market limited to prevent disorderly market conditions and a possible exchange rate overshooting but not suppressing a trend. This would mean that the SBP may not intervene for the PKR to appreciate further. This means the PKR in the short term may go below 155.
It all depends on flows. The exchange companies are selling $10-12 million a day. This along with current account surplus is helping SBP to lower its forward/swap liabilities - down by $919 million in October and a similar run rate is continued in this month. Some say that $6-7 million foreign currency is being surrendered by cash holders every day.
According to money market people, this conversion can increase further. But for that, government has to give some cushion to informal foreign currency holders in the form of amnesty scheme or something. “They want to sell, but they don’t have an option”, added Malik Bostan, a key money market figure. Government should come up with a way to bring this money back into the system as this would help in gaining reserves.

Again I ask are you an importer? Or are you a beneficiary of past system who wants to move capital abroad?
 
You ask me where GDP has decreased in PKR when GDP world over is established in USD
Lol no. Gdp is always measured in local currency and then converted to USD
We needed a lot of power projects and today we have surplus energy generation capacity. Now is the time to import more machinery, electronics, raw material etc., and establish industry which is capable of producing export goods in short to medium term.
Now is the time to import machinery? With what money? Pakistan's dollar reserves were left at minus 8 billion USD by your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar
681572F3-21D9-4594-8B25-5A4DDABDAE0E.png


Under the CPEC, Pakistan requested China to help overcome the energy shortages by investing in installation of power plants and removing infrastructure bottlenecks through early harvest programme.

This request had some repercussions, which the policy makers should have known beforehand. Investment in these two sectors – power and infrastructure – was bound to cause surge in imports, especially in shape of machinery and raw materials. It was a blunder on part of the Pakistani negotiators who made no efforts to convince the Chinese to relocate their industries in the existing economic zones. They should have urged the Chinese side to simultaneously shift some of the industries to the existing zones in Hattar and Karachi, as well as some parts of Punjab. This could have helped boost exports without wasting too much time.

Moreover, the government should have taken the declining exports as a red flag and should have declared an emergency to achieve a major jump in exports. It is an unforgivable blunder on part of the PML-N government that exports, instead of increasing in the last four years have declined
Pakistan's economy has actually shrunk in relative sense.
Shrunk means negative Gdp growth. Where is that?
In reality the allocation has increased but in relative terms (considering all our major military procurements are in USD; local currency is used only for salary, benefits etc.) it has shrunk as USD in 2019 was around 140 whereas it is around 156 in 2020 which leaves us with a budget of USD 8.76 Billion in 2019 vs USD 8.26 Billion in 2020.
So who is responsible for artificial over valuation of PKR between 2013 and 2018 so that now we are stuck with rapid currency decline? Again your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar
F726770A-5029-4134-9C1C-AD5B975795A3.png

and magically he was also ensuring a higher reserve than anyone else ever did
Yes that magic was short term high interest rate loans that caused record debt repayments post 2018
BA3E4BF0-EE26-4E7B-84BE-BB8644708BF1.jpeg

he was also actively supporting an import based economy while importing Oil, Machinery, Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Military Equipment, Vehicles etc.
So you admit Ishaq Dollar is responsible for turning 8 billion USD net international reserves to minus 8 billion USD dollars in just two years. And yet you defend him like some slave
C8EC69E2-C5AD-4086-84C9-F7FE7A0A2BA8.png

44D69299-387E-4A7A-B1AE-C359E05B7401.jpeg

The real question is, how expensive was electricity under Dar and PML. When you consider the fact that sovereign guarantees, international stock (bond) maturity, repayments etc., are all tied to the USD; does it not automatically become apparent that a lower USD would mean less payments externally?
How can you lower USD artificially for ever without bankrupting the economy?
A065ECF3-6257-4974-BE5E-55B85241BB33.png

Electricity, gas, petrol, medicine etc., are all very very expensive under the incumbent
Because your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar had artificially overvalued PKR for 4 years depleting Pakistan's dollar reserves, nearly bankrupting Pakistan. If incumbent govt had not done what it did, there would have been bankruptcy and hyper inflation.
16E3D0B5-F6D4-449F-A645-944EAFD432E4.png

You speak of CD, do you even realize that it was Rs. 1,126 billion under PML and considerably lower under Dar but has spiked up to Rs. 2,400 Billion by now? It was Rs. 2,150 billion till June 30th, 2020! But you still blame PML.
Yes I blame Pmln because it is the one responsible for doing these extremely expensive energy contracts in US dollars instead of PKR
Anyway, even now all is not lost. We need to offer tax subsidies to export oriented industries to offset the higher cost of business, strengthen the PKR to a sweet spot where our exports are competitive yet critical imports not too cumbersome etc.
All is lost thanks to your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar. All the Cpec related projects were signed in USD. Then PKR was overvalued, destroying Pakistani export industry. Now PKR is devalued to its real market value but the country is still stuck because of pmln energy contracts in USD giving Pakistan the most expensive electricity price in the region.
Again I ask are you an importer? Or are you a beneficiary of past system who wants to move capital abroad?
Yes he is Khota Biryani supporter of Ishaq Dollar
 
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Your knowledge about basic economics is very poor bro. You are only copying propaganda without any substantial reasoning.

Honestly my friend, where did you get the impression that I was copying and pasting anything at all? Each and every word of my post is my own and none of it is propaganda, you are most welcome to respond to my points intellectually.



Here is an article for you to read upon and understand some basics.

Your assumption is that since somebody posted an article in the BR, it must be factual. My friend, all these articles are authored by human beings and most of them are authored by those who have very basic understanding of economics and commerce. Many of the articles are pure propaganda too. Anyway, let me respond to the article in paragraphs:



The PKR/USD breached 158 level yesterday. Most treasuries were of the view that PKR/USD could cross 170, when it was north of 165. Forces of demand and supply are driving currency movements since July 2019. The currency has hovered in the band of 154-168 since then.

The USD->PKR conversion would have crossed 170 and that is well calculated figure. The only reason that USD did not breach 170 or even 180 and actually fell back is the reprieve that we received from G20 Debt relief where our debt servicing was initially relieved for 1 year and is further expected to get a relief for 6 months. The reason that PKR is hovering around 158 and our foreign reserves increasing is the massive COVID assistance that we have received while saving 6-7 Billion USD in loan repayments.

The sentiment is positive today and it can take rupee back to 150. Some say this should happen to bring the dollars from the lockers into the market. But this would put pressure on the current account. Exporters are already uneasy on the currency appreciation. If the PKR goes on appreciating, at some point they may lose orders. The SBP should look at the market holistically and intervene accordingly.

The objective of SBP should be to build reserves – and that would happen when the current account is in good shape, capital/financial inflows keep on coming, and exchange companies are the net seller. If the PKR appreciates too much, these three factors can shift poles. Rupee below 155 could not necessarily be beneficial.

The current account is in surplus in the last four of the five months. Till the time oil prices hover around $40-45/barrel and remittances remain at a run rate of $2.2-2.3 billion per month, the current account is in control. The economic activities are picking up and these grow faster with currency appreciation. If the currency appreciates too much, this can bounce back in the form of higher imports and lower exports.

The word on the street is that exporters are fully booked till June 2020. Many exporters are operating at full capacity and they are in the process of expansion. There are some advantages of currency appreciation for exporters, as they are importing cotton and other raw material at better prices, the expansion cost is going to be lower in PKR. But the core business margins are squeezing for some. The reason exports are at full potential or they are in expansion is that they don’t have any loss due to overvalued currency (as was the case in 2014-18).

So rupee appreciates on sentiments? What kind of a nonsense article is this?

A steadily depreciating rupee will most likely end up in the market, however, players/hoarders are well aware of the volatile nature of PKR appreciation and are most satisfied that USD will inevitably appreciate the moment we start debt repayments. So, they will wait patiently.

And what about those big players who can throw or collect 5 or 50 million USD from the market to manipulate it? A rising CAD in the short to medium term is of no concern as long as we continue building our ability to pay it back later; consider any example of acquiring an asset on loan, as long as the asset does not depreciate.

Now let's talk about an appreciating rupee and export orders. It is no rocket science that an appreciating rupee would eventually make our exports non-competitive; however at what conversion rate? Our immediate competitors would be Bangladesh and India right? Indian conversion rate is 75:1 and Bengali conversion rate is 85:1 whereas we are still at 158:1...................isn't it maddening to insinuate that PKR under 150 would make us non-competitive?

Funny enough, the article itself suggests that there are benefits to an appreciating PKR when we absolutely have to import, and we will always need raw material to make imports which is why it is Pakistan which must determine the absolute parity between imports and exports thus leading to the desired PKR:USD conversion rate.



In fact, the currency is now under-valued. And it should be kept undervalued for some time. It is the inertia of the past few years of overvaluation. The undervalued currency may help in building much needed reserves through achieving surpluses in current and capital/financial accounts. The cash holder of foreign currency in local markets may sell and that should help SBP in reducing its forward/swap liabilities.
One of the reasons, the exporters are in expansion phase and are getting big orders, is the undervalued currency. One of the reasons cash holders are net sellers (as per exchange companies’ representatives) for the past 16 months is undervalued currency as well.
The party should not be over. The reserves are built in the process; but are not enough. Prior to COVID, SBP reserves were at $12 billion and then the toll fell substantially and now it is back to similar levels. The comfortable level is nothing below $20 billion. There is some journey to cover for the SBP before they can sit and relax.
Many say that Pakistan should focus on services exports. Many say that foreign exchange regime should be fully flexible, on the premise that if the money flow is seamless, investment, services exports and goods exports will grow through promotion of goods and services abroad. By doing this, the incentive to keep flows outside through under and over invoicing would die. But for opening up of the regime, it would require a certain level of reserves, for making SBP to lose control as the depth would be enough to absorb any external crisis.
Thus, for moving towards fully flexible exchange rate and foreign exchange movement markets, reserves need to be built. For that, open market should keep on selling and interbank market should be in surplus. And too much appreciation can undo it.
The SBP’s stated policy is of adaptation of flexible exchange rate as a buffer against external shocks, with SBP intervention in the foreign exchange market limited to prevent disorderly market conditions and a possible exchange rate overshooting but not suppressing a trend. This would mean that the SBP may not intervene for the PKR to appreciate further. This means the PKR in the short term may go below 155.
It all depends on flows. The exchange companies are selling $10-12 million a day. This along with current account surplus is helping SBP to lower its forward/swap liabilities - down by $919 million in October and a similar run rate is continued in this month. Some say that $6-7 million foreign currency is being surrendered by cash holders every day.
According to money market people, this conversion can increase further. But for that, government has to give some cushion to informal foreign currency holders in the form of amnesty scheme or something. “They want to sell, but they don’t have an option”, added Malik Bostan, a key money market figure. Government should come up with a way to bring this money back into the system as this would help in gaining reserves.

More on this later, will edit the post when have spare time.



Again I ask are you an importer? Or are you a beneficiary of past system who wants to move capital abroad?

I am neither an importer nor any beneficiary of the rubbish past systems. I am a common Pakistani who wants to manage his budget as I was able to do 2-3 years ago; my expenses have increased many times over because of super inflation whereas my salary has hardly benefited to cover me from inflation.
 
Where is the decrease of Gdp in PKR? Decrease in USD is due to devaluation of PKR thanks to your absconder Ishaq Dollar economic hitman policies

Economy did not shrink under PTI. That's the biggest lie by Pmln mafia

Yeah and at what price? Lives were decent because your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar overvalued PKR artificially, draining Pakistan's foreign exchange reserves for billions of US dollars!
View attachment 688675View attachment 688676

Hahaha. What good is this surplus electricity when its price is highest in the region causing Pakistani export industry to become non competitive. Furthermore power sector has growing circular debt of more than 2 trillion Rs. Who will pay for that when electricity price is already highest in the region? Your favorite absconder Ishaq Dollar or people of Pakistan?

Please tell us how you get exports to grow with the highest electricity price in the region. And with a growing circular debt of 2 trillion Rs in power sector?

:hitwall::hitwall::hitwall:

GDP never contracted... Why is this so difficult to understand
You ask me where GDP has decreased in PKR when GDP world over is established in USD, this again is naivety because of your political affiliation rather than logical thinking. Furthermore, when Dar was Finance Minister, we needed to import more than we could export at that time. We were importing Oil, Machinery (heavy CPEC related imports including) & Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Weapons (JF-17's, Chinese Subs etc.), Vehicles etc. We were importing more because we needed imported machinery, electronics, chemicals and raw material to establish CPEC related projects amongst other projects. One of the most important requirement for any export oriented country is power which we were facing acute shortage of ever since Musharraf's exit. We needed a lot of power projects and today we have surplus energy generation capacity. Now is the time to import more machinery, electronics, raw material etc., and establish industry which is capable of producing export goods in short to medium term.
you are talking from your ???..
open up sbp.gov.pk..
there was no increase in machinery but increase in food and other luxury imports ...
i have poste it here several times.......

Do you understand how currency is manipulated in Pakistan? How big is the open market? How could Dar or anyone else manipulate PKR?

yes open market is limted to non existent
its very simple. because open market is limited you can manipulate the interbank rates and supply dollars to open market
its pretty simple concept, you say hey this pen 2 rupee pen(real value) is going to be 100rs now. all people are surprised how?, you say hey i will buy it at 100rs..so you end up buying the acess rupee from market and supply dollars instead..
one may ask how did the rupee fell to begin with...the answer is state bank lending. Which literally means PRITNINT FAKE NOTES. Check how much each govt has lend from state bank

Also, do you know how much we were importing under Dar? If you put 2 and 2 together, Dar wasn't merely supporting PKR against USD by flooding the market with USD, he was also actively supporting an import based economy while importing Oil, Machinery, Electronics, Chemicals, Metals, Military Equipment, Vehicles etc. and magically he was also ensuring a higher reserve than anyone else ever did (Rs. 20 Billion when Dar was disqualified in 2017).......so, seriously, does it make sense when PTI waalas claim that Dar was artificially managing USD to the disadvantage of Pakistan?
reserves were being maintained because of high borrowing..do you even know how to do maths..

its pretty simple..
just plot the CAD..
it was almost positive in 2015 but then due to high imports, low remittences and fast SHRINKING EXPORTS, it was ballooning out of control to 24 b $ in 2018..how is this difficult to understand

The real question is, how expensive was electricity under Dar and PML. When you consider the fact that sovereign guarantees, international stock (bond) maturity, repayments etc., are all tied to the USD; does it not automatically become apparent that a lower USD would mean less payments externally?

correct, so there are two ways to achieve low dollar

either self declare it like Zimbabwe and Afghanistan that dollar will 100rs..like dar did
or
imporve your rupee by correcting the fundamentals, that is exports and growth

Basically, when people buy into the PTI lies (and there are dozens of major lies by Imran Khan, the master of U-Turn/Munafiqat) they automatically assume all PTI claims to be factual, however ridiculous they may be.

of course PTI lies, like all other parties, i agree with you..

if it start telling truth no one will vote for you..
will someone had voted for PTI if they said they will go to IMF with rupee tumbling to 200rupees. (this didnt happen due to imran khan successful begging and boot polishing of arabs getting a 20b $ relieve package)


Electricity, gas, petrol, medicine etc., are all very very expensive under the incumbent because of their lies, stupidity, inability, incompetence, nepotism and corruption.

electricity is expensive because of imran khan..pretty sure even you dont believe this ..
look at solar, coal and wind power deals here and in india

You speak of CD, do you even realize that it was Rs. 1,126 billion under PML and considerably lower under Dar but has spiked up to Rs. 2,400 Billion by now? It was Rs. 2,150 billion till June 30th, 2020! But you still blame PML.
ofcourse, what do you think, he will waive a wand and all of sudden there will be no increase in circular defcit..do you even know maths??????????

if circular debt was increasing by 400b /yr, an improvement will be if it increases by 300b/yr and 200b/yr and so on..

freezing the circular debt will be mean that THE PROBLEM HAS ALREADY SOLVED..ARE YOU SAYING DAR SOLVED THE PROBLEM IN 2018 AND THUS IT WILL NOT INCREASE IN PTI GOVT


Anyway, even now all is not lost. We need to offer tax subsidies to export oriented industries to offset the higher cost of business, strengthen the PKR to a sweet spot where our exports are competitive yet critical imports not too cumbersome etc.
[/QUOTE]

TELL THAT TO PML N GOVT WHO DIDNT OFFER ANY EXPORT INCENTIVES..infact held billions in refunds that now have to be dealt with by the new govt
WAIT..i am confused. Are you critising the govt policies or praising the
=====================

i have always said that for last 30 years we simply printed notes (state bank lending) and controlled the rupee & interest rates (that would have gone up due to increase fake notes) is what cause the boom and burst cycle in Pakistan and so far ALL PARTIES DID IT repeatedly..

i am afraid PTI will do it too ....we will have to wait and see, if they do so ...i will be the first to critic it, as i did PMLN in 2016 when they started to do so right on this forum when everyone was saying i am in lala land...
 
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GDP never contracted... Why is this so difficult to understand
Tell that to Khota Biryanis :D
Now let's talk about an appreciating rupee and export orders. It is no rocket science that an appreciating rupee would eventually make our exports non-competitive; however at what conversion rate? Our immediate competitors would be Bangladesh and India right? Indian conversion rate is 75:1 and Bengali conversion rate is 85:1 whereas we are still at 158:1...................isn't it maddening to insinuate that PKR under 150 would make us non-competitive?

Funny enough, the article itself suggests that there are benefits to an appreciating PKR when we absolutely have to import, and we will always need raw material to make imports which is why it is Pakistan which must determine the absolute parity between imports and exports thus leading to the desired PKR:USD conversion rate.
Govt can't find the right price of PKR. Only open market can.
 
I am a common Pakistani who wants to manage his budget as I was able to do 2-3 years ago; my expenses have increased many times over because of super inflation whereas my salary has hardly benefited to cover me from inflation.
How many times you need to be told that the only reason you were having better off between 2013 - 2018 was due to overvalued PKR and record trade deficit, along with record govt money printing.
it was almost positive in 2015 but then due to high imports, low remittences and fast SHRINKING EXPORTS, it was ballooning out of control to 24 b $ in 2018..how is this difficult to understand
@Mav3rick in case you still don't understand the impact of overvalued PKR.
3-1532027175 (1).jpg

electricity is expensive because of imran khan..pretty sure even you dont believe this ..
You will be surprised to know that Ishaq Dollar fan boys actually believe this. Pakistan was the land of milk and honey before Imran Khan.
will someone had voted for PTI if they said they will go to IMF with rupee tumbling to 200rupees. (this didnt happen due to imran khan successful begging and boot polishing of arabs getting a 20b $ relieve package)
Ishaq Dollar fanboys even make fun of that calling Imran Khan "begger" when they are themselves responsible for it.
freezing the circular debt will be mean that THE PROBLEM HAS ALREADY SOLVED..ARE YOU SAYING DAR SOLVED THE PROBLEM IN 2018 AND THUS IT WILL NOT INCREASE IN PTI GOVT
Ishaq Dollar right after taking power paid 400 billion RS to get rid of circular debt. Later it was found, this was all paid with a very expensive loan. Darnomics 101 :D
WAIT..i am confused. Are you critising the govt policies or praising the
He is praising Ishaq Dollar policies. He is a genius.
i am afraid PTI will do it too
No it won't. Reason being PTI supporters are mostly educated who believe in sustainable GDP growth.
 
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