Coming World War3. And The Role Of Iran And Pakistan

[SQ8]

True but should Muslim majority nations intervene in the internal affairs of other nations? If the Muslim populace of UK feels that its demands are not being met for example, should such an Ummah then have the right to intervene in any manner to side with said section of the populace?

If that section of the population demands the help of the rest of the Ummah, then yes. That is the idea of the concept.. a unified voice across geographical boundaries.

 

[forcetrip]

Role of Iran and Pakistan in world war 3? One should be target practice the other will be cannon fodder. Pakistan being the only country in the world which is the client state of not one, but two superpowers. Crap, did I forget the Saudis? Okay so we are the client state of the US and China and also a client state of Saudi's who themselves are a client state of US. On a world scale that's like being an ant and eying somebody's cupcake.

 

[Jackdaws]

Coming World War 3? Relax, Nostradamus. No one wants to go to war.

 

[SQ8]

First who is talking about governments here they are traitors Mr and when you are attacked give call of Jihad Muslims from all over the world would come to fight for you they came in Afghanistan they will come for you problem is traitor governments Mr and understand they ayat ALLAH has also called Muslim brothers and part of Ummah by denying Ummah you are denying Quran and orders of RASOOL SAW Mr @Oscar you said about Muslims fighting each other when you allow unislamic things betray Ummah Sir this was bound to happen to you read Quran and Sunnah you would know this kind of azaab was promised by ALLAH he in Quran said and I would teach you a lesson by you killing each other and this is also told in Sunnah and Hadees Mr so you have already lost 50000 it can increase ten times if we don't mend our ways because USA will come for us too either now or a little later

You are basically ranting behind scripture, nobody denied anything. If you read the Quran and Sunnah then you would also realize that blaming mistakes on Allah are not part of what is asked within them. If you know what is coming, then you should be prepared for it and work against it. Try to save as many from it instead of sitting on online forums and parroting statements.Go out and prevent people from being misled by the "liberals", go out and convince people what the times demand of Muslims in unity and explain the concept of Ummah and what it asks of us; instead of trying to defend it online and justify that all Muslims see the idea for what it is and its all good. Face it, Muslims dont see Ummah, they dont understand it, those that do live in the fools pipe dream that the rest of the Muslim world does. This is the meaning of the concept that there will be many Muslims but they will have no power..they do not recognize their unity nor the concept of it. While others like you are defending Ummah Ummah here and there without realizing what it means by it being dead in the eyes of most Muslims. The Ummat of our prophet does not realize that it is one, nor does it wish for it other than 5-10%.

As for things happening in Pakistan and to the rest of the world,What you are saying sounds like someone missing Fajr and then saying it was fate that I missed it.

 

[HRK]

an Ummah there may be, but there is no Ummah in the eyes of this Ummah.

Eessence of this Ummah Discussion......I think this should be the ending note.

 

[Dillinger]

If that section of the population demands the help of the rest of the Ummah, then yes. That is the idea of the concept.. a unified voice across geographical boundaries.

How will the Ummah gauge whether the demand of that section is valid or not?

What sort of intervention would be valid, military?

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Then bear current government.



I said so because Pakistan was far better in his regime and not because of WAR.

My post was in context of the topic, not your post. You can clone Zia a thousand times - for all I care

 

[SQ8]

How will the Ummah gauge whether the demand of that section is valid or not?

What sort of intervention would be valid, military?

The same way the UN gauges it across the world.

 

[ashley.1965]

But who defined the Khawarij today? Are you blanket defining the Khawarij as one entity based on sect? Or anyone who does not follow legitimate government.

The khawarij were defined at the time of the Prophet himself, so the same definition applies today. The scholarly interpretations I mentioned can be found in much greater detail in the book at this reference, which compiles in one place a whole list of classical interpretations about them as well:

English Books > Fatwa on Terrorism and Suicide Bombings - Islamic Library

I am quite aware of the concept of Ummah, so read again my statement earlier.. an Ummah there may be, but there is no Ummah in the eyes of this Ummah.

I understand what you are saying - the ummah exists in principle (and scripturally speaking as well) but not in practice, and I agree with this.

The situation, however, will not change unless we ourselves strive for greater intra-Muslim unity, something that a lot of non-Muslims and their khawarij allies simply do not wish to see happen. A first step to countering that surely is not to surrender mentally to the present state of disunity as a fait accompli. By rejecting the very idea of the ummah as being inapplicable in today's day and age (I am not accusing you of this, but this is a sentiment repeatedly and often voiced on this forum) we fall into that very trap. The best antidote to "divide and rule" is to refuse the division, both ideologically and physically, in the first place - hence the importance of keeping the concept of the ummah alive.

 

[Zarvan]

You are basically ranting behind scripture, nobody denied anything. If you read the Quran and Sunnah then you would also realize that blaming mistakes on Allah are not part of what is asked within them. If you know what is coming, then you should be prepared for it and work against it. Try to save as many from it instead of sitting on online forums and parroting statements.Go out and prevent people from being misled by the "liberals", go out and convince people what the times demand of Muslims in unity and explain the concept of Ummah and what it asks of us; instead of trying to defend it online and justify that all Muslims see the idea for what it is and its all good. Face it, Muslims dont see Ummah, they dont understand it, those that do live in the fools pipe dream that the rest of the Muslim world does. This is the meaning of the concept that there will be many Muslims but they will have no power..they do not recognize their unity nor the concept of it. While others like you are defending Ummah Ummah here and there without realizing what it means by it being dead in the eyes of most Muslims. The Ummat of our prophet does not realize that it is one, nor does it wish for it other than 5-10%.

As for things happening in Pakistan and to the rest of the world,What you are saying sounds like someone missing Fajr and then saying it was fate that I missed it.

Sir I am doing what I know I have to do Sir the problem is our corrupt specially the Arab leaders who were installed their when Britian and other occupational forces were leaving until they mend their ways slowly Muslims would be taken out by west one by one Sir but where ever Kufr attack Muslims go their and fight and in case of Pakistan if its get attacked by India just call for Jihad you would see How many Muslims would come even military help from GCC and countries could come and also from Indonesia and Malaysia because GCC countries main defense depends on us despite the face that they have good militaries they don't have nukes Sir we have them and as far as I know Pakistan have some very important things placed in Saudi Arabia we should try to enter GCC at lease defense wise

 

[SQ8]

The khawarij were defined at the time of the Prophet himself, so the same definition applies today. The scholarly interpretations I mentioned can be found in much greater detail in the book at this reference, which compiles in one place a whole list of classical interpretations about them as well:

English Books > Fatwa on Terrorism and Suicide Bombings - Islamic Library

You did not understand my point on that. I am aware of the many interpretations. But which of these is relevant in the way Khawarij are designated today by the Ummah among themselves.

It not about surrendering mentally, it is about knowing priorities in terms of fixing this issue. Banging our heads against the non-muslims is not the only solution. The Jihad today lies in understanding the Quran and Sunnah and working against those that promote adulterated interpretations. Any fool can pick up a gun and fight, and it achieves little.

 

[SQ8]

Sir I am doing what I know I have to do Sir the problem is our corrupt specially the Arab leaders who were installed their when Britian and other occupational forces were leaving until they mend their ways slowly Muslims would be taken out by west one by one Sir but where ever Kufr attack Muslims go their and fight and in case of Pakistan if its get attacked by India just call for Jihad you would see How many Muslims would come even military help from GCC and countries could come and also from Indonesia and Malaysia because GCC countries main defense depends on us despite the face that they have good militaries they don't have nukes Sir we have them and as far as I know Pakistan have some very important things placed in Saudi Arabia we should try to enter GCC at lease defense wise

Good, now you recognize the problem. The GCC leaders and the ideologies they promote are what has bogged us down into divisions. But your fight must start from the home.. what is the immediate thing to do? ..the first word of the Quran that was revealed.. Iqra.. Read as much as you can.. read with understanding. Not just one viewpoint, not just what is posted here and there..and NEVER what is on the internet. Look at the various schools of thought, their teachings... at early Muslim history.. accounts of the prophets life.. of later Islamic political history. Therein lie the lessons and examples on how to end our current quandry. From there you start outward.. just as you are advised not to enter battle without your armor shined and horses ready.. you dont start until you have sufficient knowledge to do so...answer what you may.. but it should be your own understanding and not just from one website or source. This forum is impersonal, impractical in most ways.. start with friends.. with people.. and then see how changes come.

Your aspirations are right, but I disagree with the way you are pursuing them. Inshallah, we all will find the right way and be able to propagate it.

 

[Zarvan]

Good, now you recognize the problem. The GCC leaders and the ideologies they promote are what has bogged us down into divisions. But your fight must start from the home.. what is the immediate thing to do? ..the first word of the Quran that was revealed.. Iqra.. Read as much as you can.. read with understanding. Not just one viewpoint, not just what is posted here and there..and NEVER what is on the internet. Look at the various schools of thought, their teachings... at early Muslim history.. accounts of the prophets life.. of later Islamic political history. Therein lie the lessons and examples on how to end our current quandry. From there you start outward.. just as you are advised not to enter battle without your armor shined and horses ready.. you dont start until you have sufficient knowledge to do so...answer what you may.. but it should be your own understanding and not just from one website or source. This forum is impersonal, impractical in most ways.. start with friends.. with people.. and then see how changes come.

Your aspirations are right, but I disagree with the way you are pursuing them. Inshallah, we all will find the right way and be able to propagate it.

Sir our problems we also need help our economy can take time Sir we can offer Gawadar to China and in return huge amount of weapons from them Sir and than secretly offering Arabs nuke protections we can get money for weapons because India is increasing its military power by every passing day and the way China has entered India and India did nothing they will never mess with China all their might would be used against us Sir we need money urgently without wasting time

 

[ashley.1965]

I am aware of the many interpretations. But which of these is relevant in the way Khawarij are designated today by the Ummah among themselves.

It is clear that more than one interpretation of who are the khawarij is relevant in today's context. (They are mentioned in detail in Chapters 13 and 14 of the book whose reference I gave.)

it is about knowing priorities in terms of fixing this issue. Banging our heads against the non-muslims is not the only solution. The Jihad today lies in understanding the Quran and Sunnah and working against those that promote adulterated interpretations. Any fool can pick up a gun and fight, and it achieves little.

Well stated!

 

[Zarvan]

Sir to do what you are saying we need to change education system we need to end ratta system and concept base studies should be given and by 12th class a student should also be taught Tafseer Hadees and Seerat Sir in Schools and after 12 grade before going to University 6 months military training should be given to our children @Oscar