Chinese Weapon Exports

[Desert Fox]

China type81 7.62mm rifle exported to Albania, Sri Lanka, Burma, Zimbabwe, Tanzania
, Congo Army ... also found in some Africa conflicts.

What's the advantage of this gun over the regular Type-56/AK-47??

Does anyone know?? @ChineseTiger1986 @Chinese-Dragon

 

[aliaselin]

If Egypt never gets any foreign aid. It will collapse in 1 month time. I never heard Qatar trying to work against Saudi. I only heard Iran vs Saudi. Qatar, UAE and Saudi always work hand in hand to promote Sunni Islam. And its not a secret Saudi is trying to be the leader in middle east especially with its massive fund available.

As for L-15, the strategy for China is simple. Trying to make a plane compete against USAF F-16 is a sure lose situtation. Countries whos trying to operate an advance 4th gen fighter are usually rich countries who has enough budget to go for USA F-16. Instead China concentrate making an advance trainer that can be a multi platform which will help budget airforce fulfil multi-task and cut operating cost. A good example is Philippine airforce who inititally go for F-16 but it simply to expensive to procure and they decide to go for Korean Golden Eagle Advance trainer. Don't tell me Philippine go for TA-50 simply just to train their pilots without fighter jet to operate? In fact, Korea promise if neccessary, Israel Elta radar can be retrofit into TA-50 and make it a fighter jet. In these way, Philippine air force can save cost by operating just one platform.

Same as China L-15 who can put 8.5g and high AOA and you are telling me it can't perform the role of fighter jet? Don't you find surprise JF-17 which started operation 4 years ago has yet to master a single foreign procurement especially with China who can provide cheap loan and easily make a deal or two to happen. But no, it yet to happen.

L-15 who yet to even debut for PLAAF service and only comfirm finalise design last year , easily bag 2 foreign deals without much sweat.

Don't know Saudi and Qatar conflict only because you didn't read enough foreign news.
L-15 have a dome size for about <500m2 while JF-17 ~650m2, which means L-15 have no chance in BVR with same level of radar. The climibing rate of L-15 is only 200m/s while JF-17 249m/s, on the other hand, L-15 maximum speed is 1.4M while JF-17 1.8M, which shows L-15 is significantly weaker in dog fight. PLAAF uses L-15 as trainer but never as a fighter, and I don't think they are fools.
Rafale has started operation for more than 20 years but not contract has been signed yet, so Rafale is not a good fighter?

 

[Luftwaffe]

Don't know Saudi and Qatar conflict only because you didn't read enough foreign news.
L-15 have a dome size for about <500m2 while JF-17 ~650m2, which means L-15 have no change in BVR with same level of radar. The climibing rate of L-15 is only 200m/s while JF-17 240m/s, on the other hand, L-15 maximum speed is 1.4M while JF-17 1.8M, which shows L-15 is significantly weaker in dog fight. PLAAF uses L-15 as trainer but never as a fighter, and I don't think they are fools.
Rafale has started operation for more than 20 years but not contract has been signed yet, so Rafale is not a good fighter?

JF-17 is an all in one package L-15 will never get AESA among other things, with dual seat JF-17 Squadrons can have ease from Egypt point of view JF-17 dual seat also can work around like F-16B for various missions. Anyway again i would say EAF have some non qualified people at the top making wrong decisions.

 

[Frogman]

JF-17 is an all in one package L-15 will never get AESA among other things, with dual seat JF-17 Squadrons can have ease from Egypt point of view JF-17 dual seat also can work around like F-16B for various missions. Anyway again i would say EAF have some non qualified people at the top making wrong decisions.

Again, the L-15 would be used to replace the Alpha Jet as an advanced trainer. It would not be used to replace or supplement front line 3rd or 4th generation aircraft. It would be used to train cadets or pilots in the operation of current and future 4th 4+ and 5th generation aircraft such as the f-16, M2K, JF-17, Mig-29, Mig-35, or whatever aircraft the EAF decides to introduce.

 

[aliaselin]

JF-17 is an all in one package L-15 will never get AESA among other things, with dual seat JF-17 Squadrons can have ease from Egypt point of view JF-17 dual seat also can work around like F-16B for various missions. Anyway again i would say EAF have some non qualified people at the top making wrong decisions.

I have read a news in Chinese saying that L-15 may have PESA, and AESA not mentioned in that news. Totally agree with your comment about JF-17 dual seat. L-15 is at most a lighter attacker for COIN and can never match JF-17, while JF-17 can take C802A and CM400akg for more important military target than the light-armed terrorists. Moreover, the ability of CAC is far much ahead of Hongdu for fighters.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

What's the advantage of this gun over the regular Type-56/AK-47??

Does anyone know?? @ChineseTiger1986 @Chinese-Dragon

I am not very familiar with the gun, maybe someone else could question your question.

 

[terranMarine]

What's the advantage of this gun over the regular Type-56/AK-47??

Does anyone know?? @ChineseTiger1986 @Chinese-Dragon

Modern Firearms - Type 81
Maybe this site offer you some useful info

 

[Beast]

Don't know Saudi and Qatar conflict only because you didn't read enough foreign news.
L-15 have a dome size for about <500m2 while JF-17 ~650m2, which means L-15 have no chance in BVR with same level of radar. The climibing rate of L-15 is only 200m/s while JF-17 249m/s, on the other hand, L-15 maximum speed is 1.4M while JF-17 1.8M, which shows L-15 is significantly weaker in dog fight. PLAAF uses L-15 as trainer but never as a fighter, and I don't think they are fools.
Rafale has started operation for more than 20 years but not contract has been signed yet, so Rafale is not a good fighter?

PLAAF used L-15 as advanced trainer and why not you used Cambodia airforce to compare with USAF? China is able to design and produce its own fighter and has a big budget. Why would China uses L-15 as a fighter? Look at some of its target customer and you shall known L-15 is trying to target small budget airforce. Big budget airforce like Qatar and China uses L-15 as trainer becos they have better fighter.

But when you are low on budget, do you still think about buying a F-22 or buying a fighter trying to match your budget? Or you are trying to say any airforce not able to match F-22 fighter shall forget about getting any other fighter jet for its own aerial defence? Clearly, you do not understand what is a budget fighter and budget airforce. L-15 definitely cannot try to match a Typhoon or J-20.
Its about putting the best meaningful defence without blowing your budget. Look at Zambia, its best fighter is J-7G and yet they are buying a L-15. I do not forsee they will just used it only for training of pilot. Same as Philippine airforce of buying TA-50 advance trainer which has similiar spec to L-15 and yet they are not inducting F-16 due to budget. So do you think their TA-50 will just remain a trainer without a frontline fighter to face China air force?

L-15 is dual seat, its able to trainer new pilot and when neccessary carry out attack and air defence mission. Its twin engine ensure higher survival compare to JF-17. It has a far superior thrust to weight ratio. Its twin AL-222 engine can produce 8400kg thrust with afterburner.

JF-17 dual seat so far is under planning and we have not seen any fruitful result and not to mention a workable prototype. Its future looks dim and the fact, it clashes with L-15 will doom its future. JF-17 will most likely remain a single seat fighter.

 

[atlantis_cn]

PLAAF used L-15 as advanced trainer and why not you used Cambodia airforce to compare with USAF? China is able to design and produce its own fighter and has a big budget. Why would China uses L-15 as a fighter? Look at some of its target customer and you shall known L-15 is trying to target small budget airforce. Big budget airforce like Qatar and China uses L-15 as trainer becos they have better fighter.

But when you are low on budget, do you still think about buying a F-22 or buying a fighter trying to match your budget? Or you are trying to say any airforce not able to match F-22 fighter shall forget about getting any other fighter jet for its own aerial defence? Clearly, you do not understand what is a budget fighter and budget airforce. L-15 definitely cannot try to match a Typhoon or J-20.
Its about putting the best meaningful defence without blowing your budget. Look at Zambia, its best fighter is J-7G and yet they are buying a L-15. I do not forsee they will just used it only for training of pilot. Same as Philippine airforce of buying TA-50 advance trainer which has similiar spec to L-15 and yet they are not inducting F-16 due to budget. So do you think their TA-50 will just remain a trainer without a frontline fighter to face China air force?

L-15 is dual seat, its able to trainer new pilot and when neccessary carry out attack and air defence mission. Its twin engine ensure higher survival compare to JF-17. It has a far superior thrust to weight ratio. Its twin AL-222 engine can produce 8400kg thrust with afterburner.

JF-17 dual seat so far is under planning and we have not seen any fruitful result and not to mention a workable prototype. Its future looks dim and the fact, it clashes with L-15 will doom its future. JF-17 will most likely remain a single seat fighter.

I think it's time for you to shut up.

 

[Beast]

I think it's time for you to shut up.

Do you run out of reasoning? This proves my points are so valid that you are not able to rebuke point to point.

 

[sami_1]

some people forget many factor for example Egyptian looking for LIFT with West ran stranded
we before made 33 modification for K-8E before start production in Egypt and more modification later not publish yet
same way will do with L-15 have good prospective for development

We got a technical composite materials in collaboration with India for years simple and can increase the proportion of composite materials from 25% in the plane L-15 to 50% weight loss

As well as the production of light attack version of one seat and increase the rates of fuel and ammunition

The possibility of the integration of the radar Italian easily Vixen-500E instead of Chinese radar, a Italian AESA radar which is available nor international restrictions attic while on the other hand

Point on Munitions Ukrainian Merged Russian Munitions

KH-59 which is the extent of 285 kilometers and weighing 920 kg

And also KH-31 missile, which is the extent of up to 260 kilometers

Russian Guided bombs and Cluster

Next to ammunition Chinese C-802 and other differences while with the JF-17 is not huge, but there are other features ignored by some

The success of the export of the aircraft L-15 means pumping more money into research and development, which is missing completely JF-17

The continued existence of the plane's production line a long time means more models developed ones

There are still opportunities to produce a copy of a single seat fighter and light attack and there is a demand by actually

Ukraine is seeking to produce a license for the air forces also

The Chinese are fully aware that the success of K-8E attributed basically to the customer Egyptian where no haste countries to buy K-8 only after Egypt has purchased and manufactured locally while remained in production lines until 1998 a monopoly on Pakistan and two aces forces consider EAF Plane choices for many world air forces options of the Egyptian air force selections which choose the planes based on scientific standards and advanced technical , encouraging many countries to track the Egyptian option to buy the planes and the demand for the same product

China did not pay attention to the export of JF-17 aircraft from the outset did not insist in their contracts with the Russians on the availability of engines for export as well as the aircraft did not enter in the service of their air force making states accept on that plane, which did not enter China Service

China did not provide a two-seater plane JF-17 even competing in the market for the export of the planes LIFT / COIN aircraft such as the T-50, Which achieved successes in the field of export advanced training as an aircraft and light combat

Egypt will follow the concept of the South Korean part of the introduction of the planes AS LIFT and another part to replace a light fighter plane F-5/MIG-21 in some tasks, which requires no multi-role fighter jets

Korean admitted FA-50 substitute for part of the fleet of F-5, not all the functions of the fighters require fighter generation 4.5 + or fifth generation and everyone forgets that the threats facing the countries of the Middle East, now is the threats of terrorists, a mother requires jets cheap cost, whether to run or buy here fit the planes L-15 largely for export to many countries

Egyptians who activate arms exports to Arab and African countries, especially Nigeria, Uganda and northern and southern Sudan, Ethiopia and Uganda through Congo , which will allow the export of part of the domestic production of the plane L-15 The Chinese want to spread globally for their flight
Which is mentioned in the news about the trends of China previously

I understand the point of view of some, and others in criticizing the plane L-15





no big difference between JF-17 & L-15 actuality

L-15 Total Engine Trust 21550 LB JF-17 18300 official 19000 LB

by VLADIMIR KARNOZOV
China¹s L-15 jet trainer is going into production with an afterburning engine from the Ukraine. (Photo: Chris Pocock)
November 4, 2011, 4:50 AM
China has ordered 250AI-222-25F turbofans from the Ukraine to power production versions of theHongdu L-15 advanced jet trainer. The –25F is an afterburning version of theAI-222 that was first flown on the Lead-In Fighter Trainer (LIFT) version of the L-15 in October 2010.
The originalAI-222 was developed by the Ivchenko Progress design bureau at Zaporozhye for the Russian Yak-130 jet trainer, and was then fitted to three of the four L-15 prototypes. The new order suggests that China will not put the basic version of the L-15 into production.
TheAI-222-25F develops 9,250 pounds (4,200 kg) of thrust at full afterburner, enabling the 21,550-pound (9,800 kg)-mtow L-15LIFTtwinjet to accelerate to Mach 1.6. At a price of $10 million, the Chinese aircraft is expected to sell well in international markets. TheLIFTversion can potentially carry air-to-air and air-to-ground weapons.
The engines will be manufactured at the main Motor Sich factory, also in Zaporozhye. Some components will be provided by Moscow-based Salut, which manufactures theAI-222 for the Yak-130. Deliveries will begin later this year, and are due to be completed by 2015.

So try to show that the plane L-15 much weaker than the aircraft JF-17 as a desperate attempt to market the JF-17 is a bit right aircraft is the Chinese designed from the outset as an aircraft advanced training and Pakistanis, for example, using the plane K-8 in the combat roles of the foundation permission should not have to put them in although the field of comparative performance in a tight foundation

 

[aliaselin]

some people forget many factor for example Egyptian looking for LIFT with West ran stranded
we before made 33 modification for K-8E before start production in Egypt and more modification later not publish yet
same way will do with L-15 have good prospective for development

We got a technical composite materials in collaboration with India for years simple and can increase the proportion of composite materials from 25% in the plane L-15 to 50% weight loss

As well as the production of light attack version of one seat and increase the rates of fuel and ammunition


View attachment 41664

The possibility of the integration of the radar Italian easily Vixen-500E instead of Chinese radar, a Italian AESA radar which is available nor international restrictions attic while on the other hand

Point on Munitions Ukrainian Merged Russian Munitions
View attachment 41660

KH-59 which is the extent of 285 kilometers and weighing 920 kg

View attachment 41661
And also KH-31 missile, which is the extent of up to 260 kilometers
View attachment 41662

Russian Guided bombs and Cluster

Next to ammunition Chinese C-802 and other differences while with the JF-17 is not huge, but there are other features ignored by some

The success of the export of the aircraft L-15 means pumping more money into research and development, which is missing completely JF-17

The continued existence of the plane's production line a long time means more models developed ones

There are still opportunities to produce a copy of a single seat fighter and light attack and there is a demand by actually

Ukraine is seeking to produce a license for the air forces also

The Chinese are fully aware that the success of K-8E attributed basically to the customer Egyptian where no haste countries to buy K-8 only after Egypt has purchased and manufactured locally while remained in production lines until 1998 a monopoly on Pakistan and two aces forces consider EAF Plane choices for many world air forces options of the Egyptian air force selections which choose the planes based on scientific standards and advanced technical , encouraging many countries to track the Egyptian option to buy the planes and the demand for the same product

China did not pay attention to the export of JF-17 aircraft from the outset did not insist in their contracts with the Russians on the availability of engines for export as well as the aircraft did not enter in the service of their air force making states accept on that plane, which did not enter China Service

View attachment 41663

China did not provide a two-seater plane JF-17 even competing in the market for the export of the planes LIFT / COIN aircraft such as the T-50, Which achieved successes in the field of export advanced training as an aircraft and light combat

Egypt will follow the concept of the South Korean part of the introduction of the planes AS LIFT and another part to replace a light fighter plane F-5/MIG-21 in some tasks, which requires no multi-role fighter jets

Korean admitted FA-50 substitute for part of the fleet of F-5, not all the functions of the fighters require fighter generation 4.5 + or fifth generation and everyone forgets that the threats facing the countries of the Middle East, now is the threats of terrorists, a mother requires jets cheap cost, whether to run or buy here fit the planes L-15 largely for export to many countries

Egyptians who activate arms exports to Arab and African countries, especially Nigeria, Uganda and northern and southern Sudan, Ethiopia and Uganda through Congo , which will allow the export of part of the domestic production of the plane L-15 The Chinese want to spread globally for their flight
Which is mentioned in the news about the trends of China previously

I understand the point of view of some, and others in criticizing the plane L-15





no big difference between JF-17 & L-15 actuality

L-15 Total Engine Trust 21550 LB JF-17 18300 official 19000 LB

Firstly most of your argument is still on paper, while in reality, JF-17 have better dogfight and BVR ability than L-15 and the integration for ammunition and electronics are finished.

Secondly, let's compare the hardest part for a plane to upgrade: engine. L-15 uses two AI-222-25F with a thrust 8,400kgf while JF-17 at the moment 8,300kgf; however, for further upgrade, the only available one for L-15 is two Mingshan with a thrust 9,600kgf, while for JF-17, RD-33MK 9,000kfg(available now), WS-13B 9,500kgf, WS-13E ~10,000kgf, WS-17 ~12,000kfg, the future is more bright.

Thirdly, with a maximum speed 1.5M, T-50 can never carry out any interception mission, which is exactly how J-7/Mig-21's role, and a climbing rate <200m/s, which is only comparable to the 2nd generation fighter，while for 3rd/4th generation, ~250m/s climbing is a must. And L-15 have the same problem

 

[Beast]

Firstly most of your argument is still on paper, while in reality, JF-17 have better dogfight and BVR ability than L-15 and the integration for ammunition and electronics are finished.

Secondly, let's compare the hardest part for a plane to upgrade: engine. L-15 uses two AI-222-25F with a thrust 8,400kgf while JF-17 at the moment 8,300kgf; however, for further upgrade, the only available one for L-15 is two Mingshan with a thrust 9,600kgf, while for JF-17, RD-33MK 9,000kfg(available now), WS-13B 9,500kgf, WS-13E ~10,000kgf, WS-17 ~12,000kfg, the future is more bright.

Thirdly, with a maximum speed 1.5M, T-50 can never carry out any interception mission, which is exactly how J-7/Mig-21's role, and a climbing rate <200m/s, which is only comparable to the 2nd generation fighter，while for 3rd/4th generation, ~250m/s climbing is a must. And L-15 have the same problem

You all shall take a good look at this video and heard what is say from this Chinese test pilot.

Those who can understand Chinese, please open your big eyes and hear the description by the pilot from 1:10m onwards.

 

[Zarvan]

some people forget many factor for example Egyptian looking for LIFT with West ran stranded
we before made 33 modification for K-8E before start production in Egypt and more modification later not publish yet
same way will do with L-15 have good prospective for development

We got a technical composite materials in collaboration with India for years simple and can increase the proportion of composite materials from 25% in the plane L-15 to 50% weight loss

As well as the production of light attack version of one seat and increase the rates of fuel and ammunition


View attachment 41664

The possibility of the integration of the radar Italian easily Vixen-500E instead of Chinese radar, a Italian AESA radar which is available nor international restrictions attic while on the other hand

Point on Munitions Ukrainian Merged Russian Munitions
View attachment 41660

KH-59 which is the extent of 285 kilometers and weighing 920 kg

View attachment 41661
And also KH-31 missile, which is the extent of up to 260 kilometers
View attachment 41662

Russian Guided bombs and Cluster

Next to ammunition Chinese C-802 and other differences while with the JF-17 is not huge, but there are other features ignored by some

The success of the export of the aircraft L-15 means pumping more money into research and development, which is missing completely JF-17

The continued existence of the plane's production line a long time means more models developed ones

There are still opportunities to produce a copy of a single seat fighter and light attack and there is a demand by actually

Ukraine is seeking to produce a license for the air forces also

The Chinese are fully aware that the success of K-8E attributed basically to the customer Egyptian where no haste countries to buy K-8 only after Egypt has purchased and manufactured locally while remained in production lines until 1998 a monopoly on Pakistan and two aces forces consider EAF Plane choices for many world air forces options of the Egyptian air force selections which choose the planes based on scientific standards and advanced technical , encouraging many countries to track the Egyptian option to buy the planes and the demand for the same product

China did not pay attention to the export of JF-17 aircraft from the outset did not insist in their contracts with the Russians on the availability of engines for export as well as the aircraft did not enter in the service of their air force making states accept on that plane, which did not enter China Service

View attachment 41663

China did not provide a two-seater plane JF-17 even competing in the market for the export of the planes LIFT / COIN aircraft such as the T-50, Which achieved successes in the field of export advanced training as an aircraft and light combat

Egypt will follow the concept of the South Korean part of the introduction of the planes AS LIFT and another part to replace a light fighter plane F-5/MIG-21 in some tasks, which requires no multi-role fighter jets

Korean admitted FA-50 substitute for part of the fleet of F-5, not all the functions of the fighters require fighter generation 4.5 + or fifth generation and everyone forgets that the threats facing the countries of the Middle East, now is the threats of terrorists, a mother requires jets cheap cost, whether to run or buy here fit the planes L-15 largely for export to many countries

Egyptians who activate arms exports to Arab and African countries, especially Nigeria, Uganda and northern and southern Sudan, Ethiopia and Uganda through Congo , which will allow the export of part of the domestic production of the plane L-15 The Chinese want to spread globally for their flight
Which is mentioned in the news about the trends of China previously

I understand the point of view of some, and others in criticizing the plane L-15





no big difference between JF-17 & L-15 actuality

L-15 Total Engine Trust 21550 LB JF-17 18300 official 19000 LB






So try to show that the plane L-15 much weaker than the aircraft JF-17 as a desperate attempt to market the JF-17 is a bit right aircraft is the Chinese designed from the outset as an aircraft advanced training and Pakistanis, for example, using the plane K-8 in the combat roles of the foundation permission should not have to put them in although the field of comparative performance in a tight foundation
View attachment 41665

You are comparing trainer L 15 with JF 17 @Aeronaut @fatman17

 

[Luftwaffe]

Lets be clear, L-15 will never be re-exported by third party even if they receive "license to manufacture" for themselves listed numbers of Aircraft. License is not something to produce unlimited numbers...

That would purely be Hongdu side business every penny would go towards Hongdu.