Chinese troops enter 25 km deep into Indian territory: Sources

[Alfa-Fighter]

For firing 300 KM Sheel PLA contacte Alien from Pluto and they given then this new Technology.....

 

[harpoon]

That still counts as a first strike.

And we have the world's largest arsenal of sub strategic (non-nuclear) missiles, including thousands of conventional ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, and rocket artillery. Most of them are currently pointed at Taiwan, but they are road mobile and can easily be relocated. These can take out all of India's airfields in the region, with plenty to spare, rendering their NE without any air cover. Against a vastly more powerful Chinese air force.

The range is in our favor too, New Delhi is only 300 km away from our border, close enough for even conventional artillery shells.

And our vastly superior border infrastructure will allow us to concentrate our forces at any point along the LAC with overwhelming numbers and speed compared to the other side. Whereas India (for their own reasons) have greatly neglected their border infrastructure and equipment, including basic artillery.

Surely Modi will understand all this.


It is likely that one of our neighbors will fire on us first, absolving us of the responsibility of starting a war. I think Modi is smart enough to avoid it, Aquino on the other hand...

Just out of curiosity...whats the super artillery that PLA has that can lob a shell 300 km away.

 

[harpoon]

BEIJING (Reuters) - As tensions spike between China and other countries in Asia's disputed waters, serving and retired Chinese military officers as well as state media are questioning whether China's armed forces are too corrupt to fight and win a war.


A slew of articles in official media in recent months have drawn parallels with the rampant graft in the People's Liberation Army and how a corrupt military contributed to China's defeat in the Sino-Japan War 120 years ago.

The concerns are striking given the rapid modernization of the PLA, from the development of stealth fighter jets to the launch in 2012 of China's sole aircraft carrier. Backed by a budget that is second only to the United States, China's military is projecting power deep into the South and East China Seas, unsettling the region as well as Washington.

But two scandals have shone the spotlight on deeply rooted graft in the PLA - a key target of President Xi Jinping's sweeping anti-corruption drive.

China said in June it would court-martial General Xu Caihou, who retired in 2013 as vice chairman of the Central Military Commission, the top military decision-making body, for taking bribes.

Earlier this year authorities charged one of his proteges, Lieutenant-General Gu Junshan, with corruption. Gu was the deputy head of the PLA Logistics Department until he was sacked in 2012. Sources have told Reuters that Gu stands accused of selling hundreds of military positions, raking in millions of dollars from a position that gave him sway over appointments and development contracts for military-owned land.

What worries some generals and other Chinese experts is that the buying and selling of senior jobs - long an open secret in China - has led to those with talent being cast aside.

"However much you spend on the military, it will never be enough if these corrupt officials keep appearing," retired Major-General Luo Yuan, one of China's most widely read military figures, told Shanghai-based online news portal The Paper last week.

"The money sucked up by corrupt officials like Xu Caihou and Gu Junshan is hundreds of millions or billions of yuan. How many fighter jets could you build with that? If corruption is not excised we will be defeated before we even go into battle."

Reuters has not been able to reach either Xu or Gu for comment. It is not clear whether they have lawyers.

The Defense Ministry did not respond to a request for comment on the corruption in the PLA.

BLOODY NOSE FROM VIETNAM
Xi has demanded that the 2.3 million strong armed forces, the world's largest, become more combat ready, although the government stresses it wants peaceful ties with its neighbors.

Chinese forces were last seriously tested in 1979, when the army invaded Vietnam as punishment for Hanoi's ousting of Cambodia's China-backed leader Pol Pot. The PLA, however, was beaten back by Vietnam's battle-hardened troops.

China stepped up a crackdown on corruption in the military in the late 1990s, banning the PLA from engaging in business. But the military has gotten involved in commercial dealings in recent years due to a lack of checks and balances, sources say.

For officers who pay bribes to be promoted, corruption is a way to make a return on their investment, military experts say. Examples of graft include leasing military land to private business, selling military license plates, illegally occupying PLA apartments or taking kickbacks when buying food or equipment.

Underscoring his resolve to tackle such graft, Xi is set to promote General Liu Yuan, a whistleblower whose accusations in 2012 paved the way for the corruption charges against Xu and Gu, to the Central Military Commission, sources told Reuters this month. Liu is currently political commissar of the PLA's Logistics Department.

"Corruption in the military absolutely must be eliminated, this is imperative for the development of our armed forces," a retired senior officer told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the matter.

WARNINGS FROM THE PAST
The growing concern within China over military corruption has coincided with the 120th anniversary of the start of the Sino-Japan War, which ended with the signing over of Taiwan to Japanese control a year later, a national humiliation that resonates in China to this day.

Ties with Tokyo, long strained over Japan's occupation of parts of China before and during World War Two, have worsened because of an increasingly ugly spat over the ownership of uninhabited islets in the East China Sea.

Coastguard ships and fighter aircraft from both sides routinely face off around the islands, fuelling fears an accident could spark a clash.

Chinese newspapers have focused on how military corruption was a key reason for China's defeat to Japan in the waning years of the Qing dynasty, a theme taken up last week in the weekly paper the Study Times, published by the Central Party School, which trains rising officials.

"In the late Qing dynasty .... the military (was) unbearably degenerate with lax discipline, superficial training, gambling, frequenting brothels, smoking opium and other wantonness running rampant," it wrote.

It is an issue being discussed at length by China's military establishment.

"Military corruption is at a dangerously unprecedented level," Major-General Kun Lunyan, an influential military commentator, wrote in May in the Global Times tabloid.

"Do we want this historic tragedy to be repeated by our people's army?" Kun wrote, noting that soldiers today "abhor" the practice of only being able to get promoted if they "rely on cash to buy their way up".

China's Communists don't have to go back 120 years to understand the importance of having a clean military.

The party is aware that one reason the Nationalists lost the Chinese civil war and were forced to flee to Taiwan in 1949 is because of rampant corruption.

Writing about that period last month, the official Xinhua news agency reminded its readers that "corrupt elements" were executed by firing squad as Mao Zedong plotted his revolution in the caves in northeastern China in the 1930s and 1940s.

"History proves time and time again that the biggest threat to the military is not the test of gunfire and smell of gunpowder, but the encroachment of corruption into the ranks," it said.



Read more: Chinese Generals Wonder If Military Is Too Corrupt To Fight And WIn A War - Business Insider

Chinese Generals Wonder If Military Is Too Corrupt To Fight And WIn A War - Business Insider

 

[pher]

Just out of curiosity...whats the super artillery that PLA has that can lob a shell 300 km away.

Aren't you india ignorant for everything except bragging? go check our WS series rockets, the maximum strike distance is above 400 kms of acuracy within 50 meters. we sold our 200 kms version to turkeys including technology transfer.

 

[Nexus]

what the hell are u doing in Delhi Mr. Modi ?

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

Aren't you india ignorant for everything except bragging? go check our WS series rockets, the maximum strike distance is above 400 kms of acuracy within 50 meters. we sold our 200 kms version to turkeys including technology transfer.

don't you know the difference between cycle , car and BUS? Or you call bus also cycle, Car also cycle??

Their is difference between Artillery Shell and Rockets.

Thats why India moved its rocks / tanks and /missile to china border in order destroyed those rockets..... you idiot. .....

Moreover , IF india buys a thing Called IRON DOME , your WS rockets are become super duper flops. show.. ( india will buy if need arises)

what the hell are u doing in Delhi Mr. Modi ?

Wait for 3 years

 

[pher]

don't you know the difference between cycle , car and BUS? Or you call bus also cycle, Car also cycle??

Their is difference between Artillery Shell and Rockets.

Thats why India moved its rocks / tanks and /missile to china border in order destroyed those rockets..... you idiot. .....

Moreover , IF india buys a thing Called IRON DOME , your WS rockets are become super duper flops. show.. ( india will buy if need arises)


Wait for 3 years

you stupid moron, can you afford IRON DOME for China rockets, look at your pathetic economy. your moving toward border only provide easy target for PLA practice. That is why your incompetent army couldn't do nothing about PLA invasion other than crying.

 

[alpha q]

No. Like I said, our policy is "China's peaceful rise".

But we are ready for war anytime, if anyone has the nerve to attack us first. Like Nehru once did with his Forward policy.

We seek peace, but are prepared for war as well.

Same can be said for india, its not interested in pricking other countries, its a growing economy but knows well to defend itself

 

[Echo_419]

When you have disputed area with a large enemy and you know what they are capable of... and yet you have faulty maps... i don't understand it. No offense mate its clearly showing that you are not capable of defending your borders.

OMG the maps are faulty becuz there is a Border Dispute becuz of which borders are not clearly marked,that's why sometimes they come here & sometimes we go there

Yes it makes sense to talk peacefully with an adversary more powerful than you, even when that adversary is comfortably entered your country and do whatever they want and you are just a silent spectator watching from far. I am sure the Indian people will be very glad that the Indian govt is taking this route. But Narender Modi seriously is a big let down. I think he can only get innocent civilians killed and raped but not have the guts to challenge a big power like China.

What did they entered our territory & Droned our civilians or they came here in stealth choppers & killed someone,they camp inside a few KMs eat whatever they want to ear & then leave when the problem is solved in a meeting of higher ranking officers & China bashing was just election rhetoric nothing else & he is not guilty of anything since Indian courts have declared him innocent what ever you or anyone else thinks is totally irrelevant i suggest you start paying more attention to Taliban Khan

 

[Echo_419]

That still counts as a first strike.

And we have the world's largest arsenal of sub strategic (non-nuclear) missiles, including thousands of conventional ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, and rocket artillery. Most of them are currently pointed at Taiwan, but they are road mobile and can easily be relocated. These can take out all of India's airfields in the region, with plenty to spare, rendering their NE without any air cover. Against a vastly more powerful Chinese air force.

The range is in our favor too, New Delhi is only 300 km away from our border, close enough for even conventional artillery shells.

And our vastly superior border infrastructure will allow us to concentrate our forces at any point along the LAC with overwhelming numbers and speed compared to the other side. Whereas India (for their own reasons) have greatly neglected their border infrastructure and equipment, including basic artillery.

Surely Modi will understand all this.

It is likely that one of our neighbors will fire on us first, absolving us of the responsibility of starting a war. I think Modi is smart enough to avoid it, Aquino on the other hand...

& you think we are freaking idiots that we are gonna attack the world's biggest army,anyways the Indian people have voted Mr Modi to power on only one thing getting our pride back,fixing the economy & return us to the economic power status that we once were.

Quite the affront!!! They keep getting more and more audacious. smashing surveillance equipment, removing indian flags and knocking down posts --- symbolic and in the literal sense

where's the bingo jingo language from modi and their brilliant new army chief - who wears the mickey mouse looking hat

a sheep every indian sees as a wolf! :

Your concerns are overrated sir,read the article & Enlighten yourself

No Chinese intrusion since 2010, only ‘transgressions': Government - The Economic Times

 

[BuddhaPalm]

This is a response to the mighty modiji's 200 T-72 tanks deployment in that area. In the tank olympics, Indian missed all the targets in the shooting while Chinese hit them all. I bet PLA will destroy those 200 tanks in less than 10 minutes if there is a battle.

I want to see India deploy all its tanks in Ladakh and then getting massacred by PLA using our new light tank. Then we can drive straight to New Delhi and end a united India once and for all.

Modi will respond with ferocity. China beware...

 

[kurup]

I want to see India deploy all its tanks in Ladakh and then getting massacred by PLA using our new light tank. Then we can drive straight to New Delhi and end a united India once and for all.

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

you stupid moron, can you afford IRON DOME for China rockets, look at your pathetic economy. your moving toward border only provide easy target for PLA practice. That is why your incompetent army couldn't do nothing about PLA invasion other than crying.

You uneducated Idiot, ,,, how much Iron Dome cost? you have idea? India buying 16 billion plane , 2 billion USD AC from Russia and cannot buy $50 million per battery IRON DOME.

India is Not PAK, Go and get some education ? some one save the world from these idiots...BTW india buy more 50Billion USD good from China every year .....

Even your rockets will cost more then IRON DOME..... are all Chinese like you, dreaming

 

[dray]

You know New Delhi is only 300 km from the border? Well within range of even our conventional artillery?

Not to mention the fact that we have the world's largest arsenal of sub strategic (non-nuclear) missiles?

You know even the Indian Army itself admitted that they could not possibly match China, and that the gap was "growing larger every day"? They are not just talking about border infrastructure or weapons platforms, they are talking about everything, as they made clear.

India has a "no first use" policy, same as us. The difference is we can target your capital with even conventional weapons.

It would be a big blunder for any army to overestimate themselves, a bigger blunder would be to underestimate their enemy; you are doing both the blunders, good that you are not an army general.

First, China has a large stock of weapons, but most of those are old generation stuff with a limited number of modern weapons, you are nowhere near the electronic/networked warfare capabilities of USA or NATO. Second, India is not a pushover either, it is among the largest powers in the world and can wreck havoc to any country in its neighborhood. Overall, China might have more of the arms & ammunition, but it is not enough to go on offensive against India and secure a victory without committing a suicide. Btw, which conventional artillery shell goes 300 km.? Such fantasies are damaging the rational thinking capacity of young Chinese.

What we want is described in our official policy, and that is "China's peaceful rise".

But that does not mean we will sit back and let other nations hit us without fighting back, on the contrary, any nation that hits us first will come under overwhelming attack from everything we have.

And since we did not hit first, we will have full justification for an overwhelming retaliation. We have no need to hit first, we can simply wait until someone gets an itchy trigger finger.

Now, any country can avoid all that, simply by exercising some self-control. But self-control is in very short supply in South Asian borders. Even our spats in the South China sea only ever end up using water cannons, no bullets or beheading as is common on South Asian borders.

We are not concerned about rise of any country, peaceful or otherwise, unless that country starts thinking that they can step on us, that's not gonna happen. We are not attacking any country unless attacked first, but your tent-parties have to leave our land in case they are there, because that piece of land isn't going anywhere, that's ours.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

& you think we are freaking idiots that we are gonna attack the world's biggest army,anyways the Indian people have voted Mr Modi to power on only one thing getting our pride back,fixing the economy & return us to the economic power status that we once were.



Your concerns are overrated sir,read the article & Enlighten yourself

No Chinese intrusion since 2010, only ‘transgressions': Government - The Economic Times

some "transgression" !!

warning indian soldiers to move back, destroying observation posts and trenches, dismantling and destroying indian surveillance equipment - list goes on