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Chinese president to pay state visit to Russia from March 20 to 22

Agree which is what most people here miss. This shows the power gap between US and Russia. Contrary to what many believed in the past that Russia was still a near military peer (well, behind US but not that far to this extent) to the US.
THIS CONFLICT has shown that Russia is nowhere near a military peer to the US. in fact I believe the US is just taking her time to slowly but surely drain Russia to a point that Russia will be inconsequential in any future conflict after they are done with them in Ukraine(the war will probably last another couple years by which time Russia will be another shadow of nits former self).
Had the US really committed itself completely in helping Ukraine(I.e focus even half of their might) Russia wouldn't have been able to sustain this war for even a few months to be honest. The thing is despite US hostility towards Russia, the Russia doesn't see Russia as a credible real threat to herself. Russia is just seen as an irritant to the US to be honest. Reason the US and its political/military establishment isn't really focused 100% on dealing with Russia in Ukraine. The US knows its real long term threat to its hegemony and world supremacy will be(is) China. Russianis just an afterthought and rightly so. Had China be the one fighting to invade another country(like Russia did with Ukraine) then you can be sure that the US reaction will be totally different. All US political, military and industrial establishment will be clamouring for the US to go 100% on a war footing, ramp up its military production and they will have provided all necessary military aid they could to that country and provide unconditional unlimited military and economic aid to that country to country to fight off the Chinese. So the US would have acted completely different and fully committed, since they view China as their principal number 1 threat today and in the coming decade. So in this regard I will say Russia is also lucky, since without the Chinese threat, US support in Ukriane will be different and even more precarious for Russia..

Insightful post.
 
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Iraq had a stronger (or at least as strong) military than China in 1990. They weren't a second rate military. They had everything the USSR had to offer and a ton of it, but the US just destroyed it.

Saudi military isn't a good example. They got some really high tech weapons but this isn't what makes a military lethal. What makes a military lethal is the level of coordination it has. The expertise. Neither China nor Russia can provide that.

US knows how to deal with drones. CRAM, laser systems , EW and drones designed to take out enemy drones are all capable of that.

Also, be sure that the US won't let you send even a single weapon to its enemies.
You must be a joke by saying that Iraqi miliary was stronger than China in 1990s. For one obvious thing, Iraqi didnt have nukes as China did and does, not to mention all the other weaponary. Iraqi airforce were useless because of their air defense weakness. And their possession of some Soviet tanks didnt make them a great power as such.
 
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modern technology is a recent achievement.

cold war ideas about nuclear war maybe it's not applicable to today.

nuclear war simulations by computer, shields interceptors and so on.

I know USA is in the vanguard in all those fields, but they should not underestimate the Chinese, and Russians have the brute force needed (nukes and ICBM/SLBM in very large amount).
You dodged my comment. China dumped USSR to team up with America in 1969
Putin would love to return the favor (if the price is right)

Agree which is what most people here miss. This shows the power gap between US and Russia. Contrary to what many believed in the past that Russia was still a near military peer (well, behind US but not that far to this extent) to the US.
THIS CONFLICT has shown that Russia is nowhere near a military peer to the US. in fact I believe the US is just taking her time to slowly but surely drain Russia to a point that Russia will be inconsequential in any future conflict after they are done with them in Ukraine(the war will probably last another couple years by which time Russia will be another shadow of nits former self).
Had the US really committed itself completely in helping Ukraine(I.e focus even half of their might) Russia wouldn't have been able to sustain this war for even a few months to be honest. The thing is despite US hostility towards Russia, the U.S doesn't see Russia as a credible real threat to herself. Russia is just seen as an irritant to the US to be honest. Reason the US and its political/military establishment isn't really focused 100% on dealing with Russia in Ukraine. The US knows its real long term threat to its hegemony and world supremacy will be(is) China. Russianis just an afterthought and rightly so. Had China be the one fighting to invade another country(like Russia did with Ukraine) then you can be sure that the US reaction will be totally different. All US political, military and industrial establishment will be clamouring for the US to go 100% on a war footing, ramp up its military production and they will have provided all necessary military aid they could to that country and provide unconditional unlimited military and economic aid to that country to country to fight off the Chinese. So the US would have acted completely different and fully committed, since they view China as their principal number 1 threat today and in the coming decade. So in this regard I will say Russia is also lucky, since without the Chinese threat, US support in Ukriane will be different and even more precarious for Russia..

Encircling China with Russia is a long term dream for the neocons

1, Russia hasn't fully extended its muscle either. See how Stalin militarized the country in ww2.

Russia not fully extending its muscle ?? Short of using nukes what can Russia do ? Getting humiliated on a matter of importance in Ukraine
 
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You got hundreds of nukes, not thousands. The destruction is mutual.

In 1990? It did. It was a big power. Whether Russia gave it more arms wouldn't have made any difference.

US is technologically superior to you. You'll see.
You don't think China will increase nuke number on the day when the war breaks out, do you? How technologically superior US is to China? For land wars, tell me which weapon US has and China doesn't? I know China has some unblockable missiles which US doesn't have.

Russia not fully extending its muscle ?? Short of using nukes what can Russia do ? Getting humiliated on a matter of importance in Ukraine
See what Stalin did. Russians are still having normal lives now. The presidential election is coming, Putin has to care people's feeling to win the election
 
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You must be a joke by saying that Iraqi miliary was stronger than China in 1990s. For one obvious thing, Iraqi didnt have nukes as China did and does, not to mention all the other weaponary. Iraqi airforce were useless because of their air defense weakness. And their possession of some Soviet tanks didnt make them a great power as such.
Nukes don't matter in this scenario unless you're planning to give nukes to Iran or other countries which the US won't allow you.

What other weaponry?

Your air defenses weren't superior to Iraq and had no chance against the F117s the Americans deployed.

Their tanks got absolutely destroyed, correct.

US wrecked the Iraqis, nothing the USSR or China could have sent would have turned the tide.
 
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You dodged my comment. China dumped USSR to team up with America in 1969
Putin would love to return the favor (if the price is right)
If the price is right the first country to be bought is US

7fbi9j.jpg
 
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Nukes don't matter in this scenario unless you're planning to give nukes to Iran or other countries which the US won't allow you.

What other weaponry?

Your air defenses weren't superior to Iraq and had no chance against the F117s the Americans deployed.

Their tanks got absolutely destroyed, correct.

US wrecked the Iraqis, nothing the USSR or China could have sent would have turned the tide.
Lol, of course Chinese air defence system is superior to Iraq. Are you joking saying that nukes have no use in Chinese defence, dont divert the topic.
 
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Lol, of course Chinese air defence system is superior to Iraq. Are you joking saying that nukes have no use in Chinese defence, dont divert the topic.
Do you even know the context before you butted into this conversation?

We were discussing China's and Russia's ability to stop the US from invading smaller countries. The dude I talked to here said Iraq had no support, whereas I am saying there was no support that could have helped Iraq win the Gulf War.

In 1990 China didn't have superior air defenses to Iraq, they had the same Soviet air defenses. Iraq had the advantage of having way more of its land covered by air defenses. Not that it would matter since F117s and F111s with EW could fly over both China and Iraq with impunity back in those days.
 
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Do you even know the context before you butted into this conversation?

We were discussing China's and Russia's ability to stop the US from invading smaller countries. The dude I talked to here said Iraq had no support, whereas I am saying there was no support that could have helped Iraq win the Gulf War.

In 1990 China didn't have superior air defenses to Iraq, they had the same Soviet air defenses. Iraq had the advantage of having way more of its land covered by air defenses. Not that it would matter since F117s and F111s with EW could fly over both China and Iraq with impunity back in those days.
You dont know what the fk you are talking about, you were clearly saying that China would not fare any better than Iraq against US in the 1990s. You are just good at lying.

See what you said:

"Iraq had a stronger (or at least as strong) military than China in 1990."

Only a fool would believe your BS. And Chinese military had and have nukes and Iraq didnt.
 
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You dodged my comment. China dumped USSR to team up with America in 1969
Putin would love to return the favor (if the price is right)
I think ideological/historic problems are not relevant when modern technology can allow you to loot washing machines in the most rich country over face of Earth, Russia+China is the only possible future military threat against USA.
 
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Try telling Putin that

Translation - China does not have a prayer taking on USA and its allies head to head alone

A good washing machine to loot can persuade everyone in Kremlin to do any military [war] alliance with nothing ideological or even historical problems friends.

washing-machine-washer.gif
 
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1, Russia hasn't fully extended its muscle either. See how Stalin militarized the country in ww2.
2, Americans may not realize the consequence of the war: US has lost its priviledge, which it used to have, to wage war to small countries like Iraq and Afghanistan. Because Russia( probably China too) will definitely intevene it. Iran and N.Korea are 100% safe now. And other countries like Saudi and South American countries will more frequently say no to US. Small countries will be mor independent from US influence. Which is no good for US. I dare to say US loses more than it gains from Ukraine war
Seriously, you are comparing the soviet union to Russia today? Are you even serious?lool Why not compare Nazi Germany to Germany today? Lol How can you even compare Russia today to the Soviet Union of the 1930s-80s? It's like comparing the sun and a lamp. Lol
Dude, just small Ukraine alone has shown how Russia is a shadow of itself and dilapidated power full of corruption and nepotism even in its military. Had it been soviet Union Ukraine probanly wouldn't have lasted long enough for U.S/Western aid to arrive in the first place.
Russia has been trying all it can to beat Ukraine invane. The only thing they haven't used yet is nuclear weapons since they know the implications this will have on them if they do. I don't know which planet you live in to believe Russia hasn't fully extended its muscles either. Lmao. Seems you are just trolling.
Russia has been struggling in Ukraine so bad, so much that they have abandoned their former terms and ambitions for launching the invasion in the first place. In fact they are even in favor of a peace plan/cease fire today.lol. You think they want that for NOTHING? LOL If they could defeat Ukraine why be in favour of a peace plan? When in the beginning Putin wanted to take over the country , demilitarise the country completely, installed a Russian puppet leader and rewrite the construction constitution that forbids them from EVER joining E.U/NATO etc. None of that has been achieved and he's already open for a cease fire lol . Shows you he knows this war is unwinnable for him as long as the U.S/West backs Ukraine amd Ukrainejas the resolve to fight for their territory.
The thing is the U.S hasn't even use 1/30th of its capabilities in this conflict yet Russia is already struggling. The US sees Russia just as an irritant(minor threat) as I said, they know Russia poses no real credible threat to US global hegemony/supremacy per se(though its still beneficial to cut them down to size as well). China is what the US is focus on, reason the US hasn't fully committed itself to Ukraine. THERE is no consensus in the U.S political establishment and parties to support Ukraine fully. Many US politicians, senator's, house rep, officials are divided even on the little support the US has been providing Ukraine since they dont see Russia as a major threat, they keep saying the US should focus 100% on China. Even the republicans are tilting more in favour of a reduced US aid to Ukraine and im favour of a focus only on China.. as I said If China was the one who launched this war believe me US response would have completely different. Since both sides of political establishment (republicans and democrats) have only one thing alone they agree on i.e China as the US only real threat this coming years/decades. So the US would have committed itself fully 100% to Ukraine and beef up its military supplies and industry to provide unlimited and unconditional military aid to Ukraine. Ukraine wouldn't even need to ask. Lol So as I said, Russia is lucky China is there, else the US response would have been completely different. Even with the war in Ukraine, US is still providing less military capital to Ukraine aid than its providing to its military in the indo Pacific command against China's threat. Check this year military budget procurement. You can see that US doesn't see Russia as much of a threat( and rightly so, they are a shadow of themselves militarily and even more so economically/financially)

The US hasn't loss much in ukraine war. If anything they have benefited. They have been able to deplete Russia's military to a very low level(and it will keep getting worse for Russia with each passing day in ukriane) without lossing 1 american soldier, they have suceeded in uniging NATO even more under US military umbrella(even finalnd and swdeen are joining NATO and allying even more with US , something that was unthinkable just 2 years ago), they have suceeded in pulling Germany away from Russia orbit and blackmail by severing economic links between both and stopping Russias huge gas supply and leverage over Germany and Europe (something the US has been trying to do for years invane) lol, They have isolated Russia internationally now with even Europe (their biggest trade partner) joining the sanctions and isolation. Etc etc Russia now has only China, Iran , North Korea and India to a lesser extent to rely on. Even so Chineee, Indian companies are not openly trading with them, many companies from China and India even stopped involvement in Russia for fear of secondary sanctions from the West. Especially those whose business are more exposed to the West. So Russia has only Iran and North Korea(2 countries with barely any significant foriegn trade/presence. Lol ) to trade with Unconditionally. Lol etc etc
Only a very naive person will say the US has lost more than gained in the Ukeaine war. Lol like seriously? No point even discussing further if you actually think that for real.
 

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Seriously, you are comparing the soviet union to Russia today? Are you even serious?lool Why not compare Nazi Germany to Germany today? Lol How can you even compare Russia today to the Soviet Union of the 1930s-80s? It's like comparing the sun and a lamp. Lol
Dude, just small Ukraine alone has shown how Russia is a shadow of itself and dilapidated power full of corruption and nepotism even in its military. Had it been soviet Union Ukraine probanly wouldn't have lasted long enough for U.S/Western aid to arrive in the first place.
Russia has been trying all it can to beat Ukraine invane. The only thing they haven't used yet is nuclear weapons since they know the implications this will have on them if they do. I don't know which planet you live in to believe Russia hasn't fully extended its muscles either. Lmao. Seems you are just trolling.
Russia has been struggling in Ukraine so bad, so much that they have abandoned their former terms and ambitions for launching the invasion in the first place. In fact they are even in favor of a peace plan/cease fire today.lol. You think they want that for NOTHING? LOL If they could defeat Ukraine why be in favour of a peace plan? When in the beginning Putin wanted to take over the country , demilitarise the country completely, installed a Russian puppet leader and rewrite the construction constitution that forbids them from EVER joining E.U/NATO etc. None of that has been achieved and he's already open for a cease fire lol . Shows you he knows this war is unwinnable for him as long as the U.S/West backs Ukraine amd Ukrainejas the resolve to fight for their territory.
The thing is the U.S hasn't even use 1/30th of its capabilities in this conflict yet Russia is already struggling. The US sees Russia just as an irritant(minor threat) as I said, they know Russia poses no real credible threat to US global hegemony/supremacy per se(though its still beneficial to cut them down to size as well). China is what the US is focus on, reason the US hasn't fully committed itself to Ukraine. THERE is no consensus in the U.S political establishment and parties to support Ukraine fully. Many US politicians, senator's, house rep, officials are divided even on the little support the US has been providing Ukraine since they dont see Russia as a major threat, they keep saying the US should focus 100% on China. Even the republicans are tilting more in favour of a reduced US aid to Ukraine and im favour of a focus only on China.. as I said If China was the one who launched this war believe me US response would have completely different. Since both sides of political establishment (republicans and democrats) have only one thing alone they agree on i.e China as the US only real threat this coming years/decades. So the US would have committed itself fully 100% to Ukraine and beef up its military supplies and industry to provide unlimited and unconditional military aid to Ukraine. Ukraine wouldn't even need to ask. Lol So as I said, Russia is lucky China is there, else the US response would have been completely different. Even with the war in Ukraine, US is still providing less military capital to Ukraine aid than its providing to its military in the indo Pacific command against China's threat. Check this year military budget procurement. You can see that US doesn't see Russia as much of a threat( and rightly so, they are a shadow of themselves militarily and even more so economically/financially)

The US hasn't loss much in ukraine war. If anything they have benefited. They have been able to deplete Russia's military to a very low level(and it will keep getting worse for Russia with each passing day in ukriane) without lossing 1 american soldier, they have suceeded in uniging NATO even more under US military umbrella(even finalnd and swdeen are joining NATO and allying even more with US , something that was unthinkable just 2 years ago), they have suceeded in pulling Germany away from Russia orbit and blackmail by severing economic links between both and stopping Russias huge gas supply and leverage over Germany and Europe (something the US has been trying to do for years invane) lol, They have isolated Russia internationally now with even Europe (their biggest trade partner) joining the sanctions and isolation. Etc etc Russia now has only China, Iran , North Korea and India to a lesser extent to rely on. Even so Chineee, Indian companies are not openly trading with them, many companies from China and India even stopped involvement in Russia for fear of secondary sanctions from the West. Especially those whose business are more exposed to the West. So Russia has only Iran and North Korea(2 countries with barely any significant foriegn trade/presence. Lol ) to trade with Unconditionally. Lol etc etc
Only a very naive person will say the US has lost more than gained in the Ukeaine war. Lol like seriously? No point even discussing further if you actually think that for real.
That's a very long crap.
1, European countries shared most war burden for US. The thing is, Weakening EU is equal to weakening West camp's power. Russia is fighting the whole West camp. Not US alone. Let alone Ukraine. Today Russia's population is not so much different than Soviet Union's. Actually Russia army performed pretty well considering who they are fighting.

2,What US has paid for the war? US has run out all non-war measures. Including the so-called economic nuclear bomb- SWIF ban. But Russia is fine now. US has ruined the reputation of dollar and west financial system. All non-West countries saw that. Which will hurt US and other west countries like Switzerland in the long term. Have you heard money is escaping from western countries banks to Hongkong and Singapore? You think Saudi chose to establish a close relationship with China for no reason? US lost more than Russia lost.

3, US didn't engage too much in the war. So didn't China. It is a help for Russia even China does nothing. US dares not to pay too much resource in Ukraine just because of China's existence.
 
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Agree which is what most people here miss. This shows the power gap between US and Russia. Contrary to what many believed in the past that Russia was still a near military peer (well, behind US but not that far to this extent) to the US.
THIS CONFLICT has shown that Russia is nowhere near a military peer to the US. in fact I believe the US is just taking her time to slowly but surely drain Russia to a point that Russia will be inconsequential in any future conflict after they are done with them in Ukraine(the war will probably last another couple years by which time Russia will be another shadow of nits former self).
Had the US really committed itself completely in helping Ukraine(I.e focus even half of their might) Russia wouldn't have been able to sustain this war for even a few months to be honest. The thing is despite US hostility towards Russia, the U.S doesn't see Russia as a credible real threat to herself. Russia is just seen as an irritant to the US to be honest. Reason the US and its political/military establishment isn't really focused 100% on dealing with Russia in Ukraine. The US knows its real long term threat to its hegemony and world supremacy will be(is) China. Russianis just an afterthought and rightly so. Had China be the one fighting to invade another country(like Russia did with Ukraine) then you can be sure that the US reaction will be totally different. All US political, military and industrial establishment will be clamouring for the US to go 100% on a war footing, ramp up its military production and they will have provided all necessary military aid they could to that country and provide unconditional unlimited military and economic aid to that country to country to fight off the Chinese. So the US would have acted completely different and fully committed, since they view China as their principal number 1 threat today and in the coming decade. So in this regard I will say Russia is also lucky, since without the Chinese threat, US support in Ukriane will be different and even more precarious for Russia..

Russia's conventional military strength has not improved since the collapse of the Soviet Union, and this is a problem that was exposed in the Ukrainian battlefield.

It is unclear what the conventional military strength of the United States is.

The United States hopes to achieve reindustrialization by sacrificing its allies before a decisive battle with China. I am personally not optimistic.
 
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