China-Taiwan reunification

[Chinese-Dragon]

how many people from even hong kong honestly see people from the mainland as equals?

I see HK people and mainlanders as equals.

Hong Kong is 95% Han Chinese. That means our ancestors came from mainland China.

How can I look down on my own ancestors?

Seigecrossbow is right, I have never once looked down on other Chinese people, regardless of where they come from. China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Singapore, etc.

We are all Chinese brothers.

 

[siegecrossbow]

The fact is no one in Taiwan, discounting the insane "Deep Green" DPP, believes that Taiwan could stand up to the mainland militarily anymore.

Just 15 years ago they had tremendous advantages over China's air force and navy but that is no longer the case with the considerable strides that China has made in military modernization.

When Li Ao grilled Li Jie, the Minister of National Defence of Taiwan in 2006 over the procurement of American weapons, the National Defence Minister said that Taiwan, by it self, could only withstand a mainland assault for a few weeks. The national defence policy for Taiwan right now is to "withhold a main land attack" until the Americans would come to the rescue.

I believe that the majority of Taiwanese people are sane and understand that there is almost no chance of success in a military confrontation with the main land. In fact the people there are very frightened by the prospect of an invasion. Why then, I must ask, do we have to fan the flames with statements like "reunification is inevitable with out war"? It will only lend more credence to the DPP nutters. This is why I support the current governmental policy of rapprochement with Taiwan despite the fact that it makes us look "weak".

 

[Martian2]

Speaking on behalf of the Taiwanese and Taiwanese-American community, I can assure you that Taiwanese do not have an unfavorable view of Mainlanders. To the contrary, there is a shift in perception that Mainlanders work harder than the new generation of Taiwanese or Taiwanese-Americans, who are accustomed to a comfortable life.

Furthermore, it is the prevailing view among Taiwanese-Americans and my relatives on Taiwan that reunification is inevitable. The only question is "when" and the exact conditions.

The modern era is a new golden age for all Hans as China re-emerges to reclaim her rightful place among the pinnacle of nations.

[Aside: By the way, if you are Taiwanese-American, make sure to bring your Taiwanese passport if you are visiting China. My uncle received a 50% discount at a hotel for using his Taiwanese passport instead of his American passport. He was informed that this is a national regulation.]

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

The modern era is a new golden age for all Hans as China re-emerges to reclaim her rightful place among the pinnacle of nations.

That sounds like a beautiful future.

 

[Martian2]

The majority (i.e. 47%) of the people of Taiwan want a summit between Ma and Hu, presidents of Taiwan and Mainland China respectively. The poll was conducted by China Times, "one of the four biggest newspapers in Taiwan." I believe that the majority of Taiwanese want their leader to discuss and resolve Taiwan-Mainland China issues, including eventual reunification.

http://www.taiwantoday.tw/ct.asp?xitem=566...de=414&mp=9

"Taiwan Today

Poll finds majority want Ma-Hu meeting

* Publication Date：08/04/2009
* Source： China Times

A summit between the leaders of both sides of the strait is favored by the majority of respondents, according to a survey conducted by local daily “China Times.”

The poll found that 47 percent support a meeting between President Ma Ying-jeou and the mainland Chinese leader Hu Jintao. Only 16 percent said there is no need for such an encounter.

Regarding the timing of a possible Ma-Hu meeting, 42 percent said it should be held between 2010 and 2012, with 30 percent indicating that this year would be the most opportune time. A resounding 72 percent believe such an encounter could take place during the president’s first term. Only 14 percent said the meeting should take place after Ma’s mandate expires May 2012.

The survey also showed that 35 percent feel Hong Kong would be the best place to carry out such a summit. Around 30 percent hoped that Hu could come to Taiwan to meet Ma while 5 percent said the encounter should be held on the mainland. A total of 20 percent think the Ma-Hu meeting must be held in a territory separate from Taiwan or the mainland.

Separately, as to the signing of the proposed cross-strait economic cooperation framework agreement, 58 percent of those polled said they are aware of the proposed trade pact.

Out of these, 37 percent said they understood its content, while 47 percent stated they were unclear about the agreement. A total of 17 percent said they have no idea about the nature of the pact.

Overall, 48 percent see the inking of the ECFA in a positive light, believing it will assist in Taiwan’s overall development. However, 24 percent fear that it might have a negative impact. Only 5 percent believe it will exert no influence.

The survey also revealed that 52 percent are in favor of inking an ECFA with the mainland. Only 25 percent said there was no need for such agreement, with 23 percent seeing the agreement as having no effect.

For those who support the ECFA, 45 percent believe the pact should be inked in this year, while 38 percent indicate that between 2010 and 2012 would be best. Only 6 percent said the ECFA should be signed after 2012.

The poll was conducted via telephone July 31. Nearly 800 citizens aged over 18 participated. (CYH-JSM)

Copyright © 2010 Government Information Office, Republic of China (Taiwan) Tel: (886-2) 23970180 Fax: (886-2) 23568233"

China Times - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The China Times (traditional Chinese: 中國時報; simplified Chinese: 中国时报; pinyin: Zhōngguó Shíbào) is a newspaper published in the Republic of China (Taiwan) in Traditional Chinese. It is one of the four biggest newspapers in Taiwan, the other three being the Liberty Times, United Daily News, and Apple Daily (Taiwan).

The free-to-air China Television (CTV) channel and the satellite channel Chung T'ien Television (Cti TV) are under the ownership of the China Times Group."

 

[Martian2]

For those with most of their relatives on Taiwan, they would like to see Taiwan maintain the status quo or reunify with Mainland China. Why reunification? The simple reason is that it is a matter of time before a DPP president defies the U.S. and declares independence.

The reality is that there are 1,200 or more short-range ballistic missiles pointed at Taiwan. Also, have you looked at the thread, "China's Top Ten Videos"? China has the world's second-largest military budget and they have built an impressive military. Most Taiwanese are sensible and do not want to see their home turned into a burning island of death. Losing your relatives is bad feng shui.

Realistically, the U.S. cannot protect Taiwan forever. Let's assume that Taiwan declares independence and the U.S. can repel a Mainland Chinese military response. What about in ten, twenty, or thirty years? Just like the American Civil War, Mainland China will never relent on reunification. Sooner or later, America will get tired of being involved in the unending Chinese Civil War.

A better outcome is to skip all the battles and keep as many Taiwanese alive as possible.

 

[Martian2]

The modern era is a new golden age for all Hans as China re-emerges to reclaim her rightful place among the pinnacle of nations.

That sounds like a beautiful future.

The IMF is like the weatherman. Short-term predictions are fairly accurate. However, predictions for the long-term tend to be unreliable.

Five years is a short time for economic forecasting. I've checked prior 5-year predictions by the IMF and they're usually fairly close to the actual GDP. The IMF GDP numbers for China are understated by 1/2 trillion U.S. dollars because China has revised her GDP numbers. The IMF predicts that China's GDP in 2015 will be $9.44 trillion dollars. We add in an extra 1/2 trillion dollars from the revised statistics.

Some of you will do the math and say: $9.44 trillion + $0.5 trillion = $9.94 trillion; that's not quite $10 trillion dollars. Technically true, but you forgot the interest income from China's forex reserves and remittances from overseas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...al%29_estimates

China's GDP in 2015 will be $10 trillion dollars.

I guarantee it!

 

[below_freezing]

For those with most of their relatives on Taiwan, they would like to see Taiwan maintain the status quo or reunify with Mainland China. Why reunification? The simple reason is that it is a matter of time before a DPP president defies the U.S. and declares independence.

The reality is that there are 1,200 or more short-range ballistic missiles pointed at Taiwan. Also, have you looked at the thread, "China's Top Ten Videos"? China has the world's second-largest military budget and they have built an impressive military. Most Taiwanese are sensible and do not want to see their home turned into a burning island of death. Losing your relatives is bad feng shui.

Realistically, the U.S. cannot protect Taiwan forever. Let's assume that Taiwan declares independence and the U.S. can repel a Mainland Chinese military response. What about in ten, twenty, or thirty years? Just like the American Civil War, Mainland China will never relent on reunification. Sooner or later, America will get tired of being involved in the unending Chinese Civil War.

A better outcome is to skip all the battles and keep as many Taiwanese alive as possible.

sensible. however:

"
The survey also showed that 35 percent feel Hong Kong would be the best place to carry out such a summit. Around 30 percent hoped that Hu could come to Taiwan to meet Ma while 5 percent said the encounter should be held on the mainland. A total of 20 percent think the Ma-Hu meeting must be held in a territory separate from Taiwan or the mainland."

shows their superiority complex. why do more people think that Hu should go to Taiwan than the other way around? Hong Kong is a logical choice, the mainland is the next most logical, and Taiwan is an insane choice, yet 30% support an insane choice.

Obongo does not visit the president of Iraq. The president of Iraq crawls on his knees to Obongo to beg for aid. We don't expect Ma to crawl and kiss Hu's shoes, but we do expect respect for the fact that Hu is the leader of a far larger and more overreaching administration.

 

[Martian2]

sensible. however:

"
The survey also showed that 35 percent feel Hong Kong would be the best place to carry out such a summit. Around 30 percent hoped that Hu could come to Taiwan to meet Ma while 5 percent said the encounter should be held on the mainland. A total of 20 percent think the Ma-Hu meeting must be held in a territory separate from Taiwan or the mainland."

shows their superiority complex. why do more people think that Hu should go to Taiwan than the other way around? Hong Kong is a logical choice, the mainland is the next most logical, and Taiwan is an insane choice, yet 30% support an insane choice.

Obongo does not visit the president of Iraq. The president of Iraq crawls on his knees to Obongo to beg for aid. We don't expect Ma to crawl and kiss Hu's shoes, but we do expect respect for the fact that Hu is the leader of a far larger and more overreaching administration.

You might be placing undue emphasis on protocol. As long as the summit occurs, everything else is trivial. History will not remember the trivial details.

The important point is that the majority/plurality of Taiwanese want a summit and they want to resolve the outstanding "One China" issue. Ma has stated that he is willing to attend a summit as soon as the 1,000+ short-range ballistic missiles pointed at Taiwan are moved elsewhere.

Ma cannot attend a Mainland-Taiwan summit and survive as president with 1,000+ ballistic missiles pointed at Taiwan. The ball is in Beijing's court.

Also, I believe that your analogy of comparing Taiwan to Iraq is not a good metaphor. Taiwan is a fully modern and industrialized nation. Taiwan has been thermonuclear-capable for decades. The only restraint has been the prohibition by the United States for Taiwan to go thermonuclear. Taiwan has the technology and capability to create a viable thermonuclear deterrent. It is American power that has constrained Taiwan.

In light of the American suppression of Taiwan's thermonuclear ambitions, Taiwan is willing to settle the "One China" issue amicably with the Mainland. It is a mistake to compare Taiwan to Iraq. Taiwan can quickly grow very powerful fangs if only the Americans would permit it.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Also, I believe that your analogy of comparing Taiwan to Iraq is not a good metaphor. Taiwan is a fully modern and industrialized nation. Taiwan has been thermonuclear capable for decades. The only restraint has been the prohibition by the United States for Taiwan to go thermonuclear. Taiwan has the technology and capability to create a viable thermonuclear deterrent. It is American power that has constrained Taiwan.

You're right, it's a big mistake to compare Taiwan to Iraq.

Taiwan is a highly-advanced, modern nation, that can easily stand on it's own as an East Asian power. Taiwan is one of the leading nations in the world when it comes to producing highly technological products like computer chips and smart phones, with world-leading companies like Asus and HTC.

The Taiwanese people are also our Han brothers and sisters. Let's not forget that.

Hong Kong would be a good place for a Hu-Ma meeting, it is administered by the PRC, while also being the birthplace of President Ma. Hong Kong would be very happy to host such a high-level meeting.

 

[Martian2]

Taiwan is not a normal small country. One of the reasons often cited by American think-tanks and media is that it is harmful to the security of the United States for China to take control of Taiwan (and Hsinchu Science Park) today.

Currently, Taiwan still possesses more advanced technology than Mainland China in important sectors. The most obvious is semiconductor technology, where TSMC is at the leading-edge of 28nm. The point is that Taiwan is a worthwhile prize and the U.S. intends to informally "hold onto" Taiwan for as long as possible.

If a minor gesture regarding the location of a summit meeting is the price that Hu must pay to hasten the control of Taiwan by the Mainland, I am certain that is a price that the CPC would gladly pay.

As someone who grew up in a KMT household, I am biased towards only "One China." However, it would be a profound mistake for others to believe that Taiwan does not have options.

If the KMT and its followers joined the DPP and advocated Taiwan independence then Mainland China would have a real problem on its hands. If all of Taiwan called out to the United States for self-determination, independence, and democracy, there is a strong possibility that the United States will try to keep Taiwan within the United States-Europe-Japan-South Korea-Australia-New Zealand camp.

The KMT already has a difficult job. The KMT is stealthily pushing ahead with reunification because KMT members have always been taught (from the time of being young children) that there is only One China. Threatening Taiwan and changing the minds of KMT members is a bad idea.

Taiwan is a proud nation. It was Taiwan's technology and money (e.g. $150 to $300 billion U.S. dollars of direct investment) that built the countless manufacturing plants on Mainland China. While conveniently forgetting Taiwan's important contributions to China's rise, the expectation that Taiwan has to crawl to Mainland China will not go down well with the Taiwan compatriots.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Currently, Taiwan still possesses more advanced technology than Mainland China in important sectors. The most obvious is semiconductor technology, where TSMC is at the leading-edge of 28nm. The point is that Taiwan is a worthwhile prize and the U.S. intends to informally "hold onto" Taiwan for as long as possible.

Yes, Taiwanese technology is some of the best in the entire world, truly first-class. I would say that Taiwan has better technology than even Japan or other such nations.

If we could combine the Mainland's size and power, with Hong Kong's financial expertise, and Taiwanese technology... That would be an unstoppable combination.

Let's take a look at today's Hong Kong under the "one country, two systems" structure.

Please make sure to select 720p in the bottom right-hand corner. It is far clearer than 480p.

YouTube - Full HD 1080p HD ?? ????? Victoria Harbour ??? ???(5)????W0018

Thanks for the video, Martian. It looks amazing.

 

[Martian2]

Patents By Country, State, and Year - All Patent Types (December 2009)

Taiwan has the fifth-highest cumulative number of patents granted by the United States government at 94,579 to a foreign country. Though Taiwan is physically small in size, it is a monstrous world power in technology.

Pecking order from USPTO newslink above: U.S., Japan, Germany, United Kingdom, France, TAIWAN, Canada, South Korea, and Italy.

http://www.fpif.org/articles/taiwan_a_key_to_chinas_rise_and_transformation

"The Taiwan story of solid economic growth and peaceful political change is a great success story for all Chinese, on and off the island. In addition to the massive transfer of capital, technology, and socioeconomic norms and values to the mainland over the past two decades...."

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Taiwan is a proud nation. It was Taiwan technology and money (e.g. $150 to $300 billion U.S. dollars of direct investment) that built the countless manufacturing plants on Mainland China. While conveniently forgetting Taiwan's important contributions to China's rise, the expectation that Taiwan has to crawl to Mainland China will not go down well with the Taiwan compatriots.

That's right, Chinese Economic growth was based on Foreign Direct Investment, this is the Beijing model.

Most of the FDI came from Overseas Chinese, Taiwanese, and Hong Kong people. The large and powerful Chinese diaspora outside of China really helped the economic growth of today.

Now Hong Kong is once again a part of China... and I think it is important to acknowledge the vital contributions of our Chinese brothers and sisters who do not live in PRC-controlled territories. Sun Yat-Sen, Deng Xiaoping and Zhu Rongji can be classified as "overseas Chinese" yet they contributed so much to modern China.

We should never underestimate the role of the Taiwanese and the overseas Chinese in providing FDI back to the mainland. They are our Chinese brothers and sisters, and their investment is one of the reasons China is so successful today. We should always remember that.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Hey Martian 2! You said that one of your uncles was Taiwanese. Are you a Taiwanese American as well?