China is rushing to put railguns on warships, but the superguns are likely worthless in a war

[jhungary]

Lol... Becos US dont have the tech to get these railgun works to its full potential not becos of the dismay performance.

Days of US always being number one on all fronts are over. There is a peer called China

Cant eat the pie and claim its sour. It is so sad american american has reached that stage. Indeed, US is on the stage of decline.


Lol... If u know nothing, better keep it to yourself.

Railgun has far more powerful projected compare to traditional chemical powder rounds. Minus the chemical, the rounds fire is much smaller and safer with just the explosive warhead. That means a warship originally can carry 500 rds , can easily increase to 700 rds due to smaller rds but with same storage space. No expended chemical means firing a rd using railgun is far safer compare to explosive method to project a rd.

Most importantly, the barrel shelf life will be much longer and range achieved is far more longer.

lol, actually, it seems like you are the one that know nothing...…...

First of all, US is the only country in this world have the ships to carry the railgun and have a functioning and tested railgun in their arsenal, and that is since 2008. PLAN have to convert a Landing ship to carry a railgun, which mean even if PLAN are able to make the railgun to work (Which is another issue) Chinese Navy do not have a ship class that can load it on that is build around the usage of railgun. 055 is the best platform to do it, but current electricity of 055 is no more than 40 MW (compare to Zumwalt's 78) which mean PLAN would have to rework 055 from its drawing board to have meet the requirement for railgun.

Secondly, railgun are "Unguided" weapon, which mean railgun is like your 5 inch gun, which rely on a LOS trajectory, which mean yes, it is fast, it can shoot further, but still it is a better version/upgrade of 5 inch gun. And there are no use other than ground support for the Navy to use the 5 inch anyway, which mean even if China can solve the problem US have been dealing with since 2008, the gun itself have limited usage to begin with.

The Pentagon is right. The future is going to be shooting extremely sour grapes at hypersonic speeds to corrode enemy ships with the sourness of the grapes. Advanced biotech in the US has created grapes with sourness unlike any seen on Earth. The Zumwalt super-destroyer will be the first to deploy the revolutionary "grapeshot". China beware!

Do show me one of these photo when China has successfully fire their railgun, then, MAYBE THEN, we can talk

If not, seems like it's PLAN who have the sourgrape to shoot, not the USN

 

[Beast]

Lol. What US tested is only ground experiment and the there plenty of problem that they never solve. Not to mention minimise it to good enough to fit onboard ship. If u do more research. The LST is chosen due to ample space available to put the powerplant needed for experiment railgun. You are not doing your home work well. 055 will be the operational target for railgun installation.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-01...ctromagnetic-railguns-spotted-at-sea/10680108

In the years since 2011, Chinese researchers have been testing the weapon at greater distances.

A US intelligence report found that China's weapon would be able to strike 200 kilometres away with a projectile velocity of 2.5 kilometres per second (9,000kph — greater than Mach 7).

You shall known China is secret about its project and never open abt experiment to public but China is not shy to show off to US intelligence about its military experiment progress. I am sure you can go ask US intel and they can sure tell u that China never exaggerate abt their military capabilities claim since US intel has so many spy satellite on China

Even US article never dare to claim China railgun is fake and we got a smart Alec trying to claim he knows more than US intel?

What is even more convincing is China is sending this experiment ship to open sea for testing. Any spy agency can easily monitor the progress of the railgun. There is no way to fake or hide the test. China railgun is real and is leading US.

 

[MastanKhan]

lol, actually, it seems like you are the one that know nothing...…...

First of all, US is the only country in this world have the ships to carry the railgun and have a functioning and tested railgun in their arsenal, and that is since 2008. PLAN have to convert a Landing ship to carry a railgun, which mean even if PLAN are able to make the railgun to work (Which is another issue) Chinese Navy do not have a ship class that can load it on that is build around the usage of railgun. 055 is the best platform to do it, but current electricity of 055 is no more than 40 MW (compare to Zumwalt's 78) which mean PLAN would have to rework 055 from its drawing board to have meet the requirement for railgun.

Secondly, railgun are "Unguided" weapon, which mean railgun is like your 5 inch gun, which rely on a LOS trajectory, which mean yes, it is fast, it can shoot further, but still it is a better version/upgrade of 5 inch gun. And there are no use other than ground support for the Navy to use the 5 inch anyway, which mean even if China can solve the problem US have been dealing with since 2008, the gun itself have limited usage to begin with.



Do show me one of these photo when China has successfully fire their railgun, then, MAYBE THEN, we can talk

View attachment 532448

If not, seems like it's PLAN who have the sourgrape to shoot, not the USN

Hi,

That is what my thinking was---where is china going to use its rail gun mounted on ships and against whom and under what circumstances---.

Are you taking this thread like a joke? Why ask irrelevant and absurd question?

Young man,

My questions and concerns are always as serious as a heart attack---.

I would like you to show me a scenario where china would use this ship mounted rail gun---against who and what kind of target under what circumstances---.

I would like to get a clearer picture---. I think that the rail gun is a great project---it is good to have---but it does not beat the conventional weapons---.

The cost---the maintenance---the servicing---the exposure to the operators---I very much doubt it is feasible.

China is not like the US---who has to go out and show its naval power in middle east or other countries---. Americans can go out and start shelling any 3rd world country that they have differences with---.

tell me what country would china want to shell thru its navy ships---?

 

[Beast]

Hi,

That is what my thinking was---where is china going to use its rail gun mounted on ships and against whom and under what circumstances---.



Young man,

My questions and concerns are always as serious as a heart attack---.

I would like you to show me a scenario where china would use this ship mounted rail gun---against who and what kind of target under what circumstances---.

I would like to get a clearer picture---. I think that the rail gun is a great project---it is good to have---but it does not beat the conventional weapons---.

The cost---the maintenance---the servicing---the exposure to the operators---I very much doubt it is feasible.

China is not like the US---who has to go out and show its naval power in middle east or other countries---. Americans can go out and start shelling any 3rd world country that they have differences with---.

tell me what country would china want to shell thru its navy ships---?

You didnt know 055 new destroyer is the one to first mount an operational railgun? Against what target is irrelevant as long as it can hit further, faster over conventional guns will do.

 

[Darwin]

Hi,

Actually this "Railgun" thingy has put nations following the tail lights of a truck.

Its utility is not as substantial as compared to missiles---. I would rather have the capacity to launch 30 missiles thru a VLS than a railgun---.

The author is correct in his assessment---.

Also speed is nothing if the target is not tracked properly.
Eg in the kargil war, till India started use of laser guided missiles, the constant bombing was not so effective from the air. Might be more expensive but gets the job done.

 

[MastanKhan]

You didnt know 055 new destroyer is the one to first mount an operational railgun? Against what target is irrelevant as long as it can hit further, faster over conventional guns will do.

Hi,

Every weapons system has to have a function---utility---purpose---target etc etc etc---.

I do not doubt the ability and capability of China to build a successful & operational railgun unit---.

But where does it fit in china's image---. The US is known to attack any which country that displeases it---it sends its naval flotilla and starts launching missiles---which country would the chinese use the railgun against---.

Tactically---I don't see china using the railgun---its anti ship missiles would be launched from farther away---so if you could share a scenario---that would be interesting to read---.

 

[jhungary]

Lol. What US tested is only ground experiment and the there plenty of problem that they never solve. Not to mention minimise it to good enough to fit onboard ship. If u do more research. The LST is chosen due to ample space available to put the powerplant needed for experiment railgun. You are not doing your home work well. 055 will be the operational target for railgun installation.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-01...ctromagnetic-railguns-spotted-at-sea/10680108

In the years since 2011, Chinese researchers have been testing the weapon at greater distances.

A US intelligence report found that China's weapon would be able to strike 200 kilometres away with a projectile velocity of 2.5 kilometres per second (9,000kph — greater than Mach 7).

You shall known China is secret about its project and never open abt experiment to public but China is not shy to show off to US intelligence about its military experiment progress. I am sure you can go ask US intel and they can sure tell u that China never exaggerate abt their military capabilities claim since US intel has so many spy satellite on China

Even US article never dare to claim China railgun is fake and we got a smart Alec trying to claim he knows more than US intel?

What is even more convincing is China is sending this experiment ship to open sea for testing. Any spy agency can easily monitor the progress of the railgun. There is no way to fake or hide the test. China railgun is real and is leading US.

You didnt know 055 new destroyer is the one to first mount an operational railgun? Against what target is irrelevant as long as it can hit further, faster over conventional guns will do.

Explain to me how 055 destroyer, itself is not even operational, is the world first to mount an operational railgun, when we cannot ever see "said" railgun operational.

Just because you said so and its Chinese, that does not make the problem I mentioned goes away....

I do understand sometime people go over their capability for the sake of nationalism, but still, when you yourself know nothing about any of the development, i's not wise to say to people who do know what they said, "Knowing Nothing"

 

[Beast]

Hi,

Every weapons system has to have a function---utility---purpose---target etc etc etc---.

I do not doubt the ability and capability of China to build a successful & operational railgun unit---.

But where does it fit in china's image---. The US is known to attack any which country that displeases it---it sends its naval flotilla and starts launching missiles---which country would the chinese use the railgun against---.

Tactically---I don't see china using the railgun---its anti ship missiles would be launched from farther away---so if you could share a scenario---that would be interesting to read---.

The Navy is looking into other uses for railguns, besides land bombardment, such as air defense; with the right targeting systems, projectiles could intercept aircraft, cruisemissiles, and even ballistic missiles.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railgun

 

[zectech]

The Navy is looking into other uses for railguns, besides land bombardment, such as air defense; with the right targeting systems, projectiles could intercept aircraft, cruisemissiles, and even ballistic missiles.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railgun

Coastal Defense too. 200 km can hit Taiwan.

 

[Beast]

Explain to me how 055 destroyer, itself is not even operational, is the world first to mount an operational railgun, when we cannot ever see "said" railgun operational.

Just because you said so and its Chinese, that does not make the problem I mentioned goes away....

Hi, can you have some patience? You expect an experiement ship going for sea trial just few weeks ago to have an operational working gun on destroyer workin tomorrow? You are just trying to find fault with unreasonable demand to prove your point. I am sure u know there are already large number of 055 under construction and first 055 destroyer has even gone for 4th sea trial with high speed cruising test. It can be commission in just few weeks time if not in a months or two. If u think US is going to mount an operational railgun ahead of China 055, feel free to point it out or prove it.

Coastal Defense too. 200 km can hit Taiwan.

Then we have an old slayer who cant even bother to google and keep asking about its usage with irrelevant question to derail this thread. @MastanKhan

 

[jhungary]

Hi, can you have some patience? You expect an experiement ship going for sea trial just few weeks ago to have an operational working gun on destroyer workin tomorrow? You are just trying to find fault with unreasonable demand to prove your point. I am sure u know there are already large number of 055 under construction and first 055 destroyer has even gone for 4th sea trial with high speed cruising test. It can be commission in just few weeks time if not in a months or two.

The problem is, the "Sea Trial" is not on a 055, it is on a modified type 072 landing ship, which mean if you have to put it on a 055, you need to remodify your ship. And a 055 in the current form cannot load any railgun because of the low electricity output, which mean to do that, they need to rework the design of any 055 to double (or even triple) their electricity output.

And you said "055 IS The first ship that have an operational railgun" so I just wonder why and how you can say that when both were not operational.

On the other hand, both EMLRG and Zumwalt are both operational. So.…...

 

[Beast]

The problem is, the "Sea Trial" is not on a 055, it is on a modified type 072 landing ship, which mean if you have to put it on a 055, you need to remodify your ship. And a 055 in the current form cannot load any railgun because of the low electricity output, which mean to do that, they need to rework the design of any 055 to double (or even triple) their electricity output.

And you said "055 IS The first ship that have an operational railgun" so I just wonder why and how you can say that when both were not operational.

On the other hand, both EMLRG and Zumwalt are both operational. So.…...

Checkout the lastest news of 055. Batch 2 will have full electric power system install to be ready for railgun. Zumalt has the power ready but not the railgun. Feell free to prove US will mount a working one ahead of China if u can. I am open to discussion as long as u can prove it.

 

[jhungary]

Checkout the lastest news of 055. Batch 2 will have full electric power system install to be ready for railgun. Zumalt has the power ready but not the railgun. Feell free to prove US will mount a working one ahead of China if u can. I am open to discussion as long as u can prove it.

How lol?

You cannot just double the generator in your ship so you can put the railgun in, doing so will shift the balance of the ship, and in the sea, oh, what you get from an unbalanced ship? OH yeah, it sinks.

You need to redesign the ship so that it will be balance in weight and not top heavy or side heavy, which mean you are going to have to redraw the ship architecture of a ship if you want to load it out with railgun.

and again, come back to me when you can find me a photo of Chinese railgun actually being fired. Because at this point, all I and other people can see is, US have both the ship they need to mount a working railgun, and have a working and operational railgun since 2008 and China have NEITHER. Now talking about proof. Show me proof that China have either a ship that build for railgun or the railgun itself before you talk?

And even if Chinese navy does have both the ship and the railgun, PLAN still at the USN level back in 2008, the problem I mentioned still existed for PLAN, and unless you are claiming China have passed US in terms of technology, it will be decades before China can mount any railgun to any meaningful warship, if we use US Navy as a yard stick.

LOL, quite funny, because you keep accusing the Indian member here for celebrating and bragging about something not yet operational, and weren't you actually doing the same?

 

[Beast]

How lol?

You cannot just double the generator in your ship so you can put the railgun in, doing so will shift the balance of the ship, and in the sea, oh, what you get from an unbalanced ship? OH yeah, it sinks.

You need to redesign the ship so that it will be balance in weight and not top heavy or side heavy, which mean you are going to have to redraw the ship architecture of a ship if you want to load it out with railgun.

and again, come back to me when you can find me a photo of Chinese railgun actually being fired. Because at this point, all I and other people can see is, US have both the ship they need to mount a working railgun, and have a working and operational railgun since 2008 and China have NEITHER. Now talking about proof. Show me proof that China have either a ship that build for railgun or the railgun itself before you talk?

And even if Chinese navy does have both the ship and the railgun, PLAN still at the USN level back in 2008, the problem I mentioned still existed for PLAN, and unless you are claiming China have passed US in terms of technology, it will be decades before China can mount any railgun to any meaningful warship, if we use US Navy as a yard stick.

LOL, quite funny, because you keep accusing the Indian member here for celebrating and bragging about something not yet operational, and weren't you actually doing the same?

Sorry, we are no Indians. I guess you are in denial mode.

https://www.atimes.com/article/top-...ian-sheds-light-on-plas-electric-warships/amp

Technologies developed by Xiao’s team will be used on the Type 052E destroyer, an improved version of the Type 052D, and might possibly be employed in the nation’s future
nuclear-powered carriers.

The colossal Type 055, China’s 10,000-ton class destroyer, is very likely to see an improved powertrain with electric propulsion in the near future.

You think Chinese is some idiot? When they design the system , they don't take into consideration of the dimension of the ship? Everything is already taken into consideration for future and what is there for redesign of whole warship. Please don't make absured accusation when u know nothing about China future warship development.

Just like doubting Chinese railgun as some fake project when US Intel don't even dare to question Chinese feasibility becos the info they collected about Chinese project is real.

There are some even idiots claiming Chinese Chang e 4 moon landing is fake. Yes, like fake when ESA orbiter tracks the full landing seqence of our chang e 4 mission and immediately send congrat letter to CSA for the successful landing..

In this high tech info era, it's impossible for Chinese to fake project or make absured claim when spy satellites are prominent. There is no info you can hide. The western are always eager to expose Chinese weakness but everytime our successful projects always disappoint them.

 

[jhungary]

Sorry, we are no Indians. I guess you are in denial mode.

https://www.atimes.com/article/top-...ian-sheds-light-on-plas-electric-warships/amp

Technologies developed by Xiao’s team will be used on the Type 052E destroyer, an improved version of the Type 052D, and might possibly be employed in the nation’s future
nuclear-powered carriers.

The colossal Type 055, China’s 10,000-ton class destroyer, is very likely to see an improved powertrain with electric propulsion in the near future.

You think Chinese is some idiot? When they design the system , they don't take into consideration of the dimension of the ship? Everything is already taken into consideration for future and what is there for redesign of whole warship. Please don't make absured accusation when u know nothing about China future warship development.

Just like doubting Chinese railgun as some fake project when US Intel don't even dare to question Chinese feasibility becos the info they collected about Chinese project is real.

There are some even idiots claiming Chinese Chang e 4 moon landing is fake. Yes, like fake when ESA orbiter tracks the full landing seqence of our chang e 4 mission and immediately send congrat letter to CSA for the successful landing..

In this high tech info era, it's impossible for Chinese to fake project or make absured claim when spy satellites are prominent. There is no info you can hide. The western are always eager to expose Chinese weakness but everytime our successful projects always disappoint them.

It didn't say anything about how it was build to use railgun.

Using railgun is not something you can just put some power pack and you can use it. Your "Article" only say how powertrain and electric propulsion is going to improve in the future, BOTH WERE NOT used to power railgun. Fact is, coming from the Chinese scientist, 055 at this stage at most have 40 MW power, which is simply not enough to power any railgun. You don't design the railgun base on your ship, you design your ship to house your railgun. Because the ship is bigger than the railgun.

Plus, China have NOT YET SHOWN ANY DETAIL on any 055 and railgun being operational, and you accuse me of jealous of Chinese technology? What technology? I only see a report, and should I be Jealous on a report?

And yes, you are doing what Indian do, because you are taking credit for something still have no exist, or proven existed, the only thing we have here, is not a photo, is not a brief from some top brass, but your word. So excuse me, if I don't believe you. And you ARE bragging on something you do not have at the moment, I don't really care how "Advance" you think PLAN are, what USN encountered during their railgun development in the 2000s still applies to PLAN, I never doubt China is developing a railgun but the FACTS ARE THESE.

1.) THERE ARE NO 055 BEING OPERATIONAL
2.) THERE ARE NO CHINESE RAILGUN BEING OPERATIONAL
3.) THERE ARE NO INDICATION CHINA HAVE SOLVED THE PROBLEM US ENCOUNTERED 10 YEARS AGO

So yes, unless you can definitely prove Chinese Railgun exist and is not just a design, you are bragging something you don't have, that's the same you accuse of what the Indian is doing.

Strange you want me to argue with you with facts, yet you cannot provide any and you just use your words.