China Civil Aviation Industry, Technology, Infrastructure: News & Discussions

[TaiShang]

Shoukd we trust any statistics coming from an Indian or the US, especially on issues related to China?

Is this statistic number kind of "40% NASA scientists are Indian"news?.

Sorry, i am serious. I started to doubt any claim by the US regarding their capabikity long time ago. The primitive North Vietnamese should surrender immediately iin 1955 if they believed in the mighty of the US techonology.

Manufacturing, value added (% of GDP, WB)

Manufacturing, value added (current US$, WB)

 

[jhungary]

Boeing's first overseas factory to be built in China's Zhoushan
Xinhua, March 13, 2017

Boeing and Chinese aviation manufacturer Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China Ltd.(COMAC) will start to build a Boeing 737 completion center in eastern China's Zhoushan city at the end of March, scheduled to make its first delivery in 2018.

This is Boeing's first overseas facility as part of its 737 production system, and designed to deliver 100 Boeing 737 planes a year.

In the joint-venture completion center, Boeing's 737 aircraft will be installed with flight entertainment systems and seats. The plant in Zhoushan, 287 km southeast of Shanghai, also provides services such as coating, repair and maintenance of Boeing aircraft.

Boeing and COMAC signed an agreement in October 2016 to set up the Zhoushan plant, which will consist of two parts: the 737 completion center, a joint venture of Boeing and COMAC, and the 737 delivery center owned by Boeing.

Construction of the delivery center will also start at the end of March.

To accommodate aircraft manufacturing in Zhoushan, Putuoshan Airport in the city is undergoing a 750 million yuan (108 million U.S. dollars) expansion to become an international airport.

In addition to supporting Boeing, the aviation base in Zhoushan will also develop an entire industrial chain for aircraft manufacturing, with the capacity of assembling, delivering and modifying 600 aircraft a year by 2025.

Zhoushan is an archipelago and island city in Zhejiang Province, which has the largest fishery in China and boasts strong shipbuilding, tourism and service industries.

How sensationalist the title can be? It make it looks like China is producing Boeing 737.

Also, this is NOT THE FIRST BOEING FACTORY outside United States.

https://jobs.boeing.com/location/japan-jobs/185/1861060/2

I don't know which one is the first, but when Japan's ANA bought a few 787 Dreamliner, Boeing have established a workshop in Japan to service these 787in 2010.. There are alot of assemble line and workshop for Boeing outside US. My brother works for Boeing, he physically was trained in England for some Engine Specialist course and have to work in a Boeing Factory near Manchester.

And when it come a time when OP keep saying fake news this and fake news that...

 

[Gothic]

So much for Trump's 'America fist' , why not build boeings in mexico when you can build them in china

 

[TaiShang]

WOW
Pathetic number of 2012 Supa Powa

But they are service economy, entirely skipping manufacturing. Because they have immense qualified labor power to be the most competitive service economy in the world.

So much so that Trump will put 45% tax on China while not raising finger against 2012 super power.

The Boeing move must be just an accident.

 

[Gothic]

Trump is just another puppet dog of the establishment putting on a new face.
He has done nothing good for the low-education people so far.

yes , that's why i'm saying the administration after Trump is probably going to build Boeing's in mexico ..

 

[TaiShang]

So much for Trump's 'America fist' , why not build boeings in mexico when you can build them in china

I think for market optimization. To be closer to one of the largest aviation markets in the world makes sense. Otherwise, China would put certain sanctions, hurting Boeing.

Besides, China's own industry is catching up, now putting in service a narrow body regional jet and getting prepared (probably in cooperation with Russia) for a wide body one.

 

[jhungary]

So much for Trump's 'America fist' , why not build boeings in mexico when you can build them in china

That's because Boeing already have factory in mexico.......

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...ofuel-research-and-development-300225975.html

http://www.americasquarterly.org/content/aerospace-emerging-mexican-industry

Okay, they are not to build airplane, but a biofuel production and research site and a OEM parts site.

 

[Gothic]

That's because Boeing already have factory in mexico.......

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...ofuel-research-and-development-300225975.html

http://www.americasquarterly.org/content/aerospace-emerging-mexican-industry

Okay, they are not to build airplane, but a biofuel production and research site and a OEM parts site.

So you 're moving the production of your cars and your other low tech productions back to the US but you move out your planes' production to china ? that's populism on part of mr. trump if i'm asked ..

 

[Nilgiri]

So you 're moving the production of your cars and your other low tech productions back to the US but you move out your planes' production to china ? that's populism on part of mr. trump if i'm asked ..

Trump cares about jobs period. This will create a net increase in jobs in the US (given its an assembly line that will increase component fabrication in the US) given it will help increase/maintain market share of Boeing in China's aviation market.

Its a fairly common sense trade-off (jobs wise and market access wise) given China slaps more tariffs on fully made aircraft from the US compared to SKD/CKD.

As other aviation markets grow and the same issue pops up, Boeing will repeat the model. Its how the transport industry works in general.

What Trump has an issue with is US companies offshoring jobs (replacing US workers) and then these companies exporting the products back to the US...with no tangible benefit for the US public (past a few shareholders and owners). None of that is going to happen with this assembly line in China.

 

[jhungary]

So you 're moving the production of your cars and your other low tech productions back to the US but you move out your planes' production to china ? that's populism on part of mr. trump if i'm asked ..

I don't consider Installing Seats and Inflight Entertainment System is "Produciton" of an Aircraft.

That factory did not produce aircraft or even fabricate the hull, you need to read carefully on the article to spot the different, if you can't, let me point it out to you.

Boeing's first overseas factory to be built in China's Zhoushan
Xinhua, March 13, 2017

Boeing and Chinese aviation manufacturer Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China Ltd.(COMAC) will start to build a Boeing 737 completion center in eastern China's Zhoushan city at the end of March, scheduled to make its first delivery in 2018.

This is Boeing's first overseas facility as part of its 737 production system, and designed to deliver 100 Boeing 737 planes a year.

In the joint-venture completion center, Boeing's 737 aircraft will be installed with flight entertainment systems and seats. The plant in Zhoushan, 287 km southeast of Shanghai, also provides services such as coating, repair and maintenance of Boeing aircraft.

Boeing and COMAC signed an agreement in October 2016 to set up the Zhoushan plant, which will consist of two parts: the 737 completion center, a joint venture of Boeing and COMAC, and the 737 delivery center owned by Boeing.

Construction of the delivery center will also start at the end of March.

To accommodate aircraft manufacturing in Zhoushan, Putuoshan Airport in the city is undergoing a 750 million yuan (108 million U.S. dollars) expansion to become an international airport.

In addition to supporting Boeing, the aviation base in Zhoushan will also develop an entire industrial chain for aircraft manufacturing, with the capacity of assembling, delivering and modifying 600 aircraft a year by 2025.

Zhoushan is an archipelago and island city in Zhejiang Province, which has the largest fishery in China and boasts strong shipbuilding, tourism and service industries.

Aircraft production is in US, both in Long Beach Plants and Witchta Plant (WHich my brother currently working at) and there are no production of aircraft or parts in China, it's a assembly plant.

Also, it's only practical issue to goes with overseas factory, you don't expect to fly your 737. 747, 757, 767, 777, 787 back to the US everytime you need to fix this or have a A, B, C, D check. Boeing establishing service center around the world is to service just that. You don't need to send the aircraft back to the US to paint them when you transfer your registration, or you don't need to send the aircraft back to the US to install Sound system or IES. It would make sense if you are talking about Airline in America (Like United or AA) and if they want to install something inside their aircraft, they can send it back to Boeing PLant in Long Beach and Kansas.

But if you are an overseas costumer like China and Japan, would you be sending your aircarft back to the US Boeing Plant for small alternation such as seat and paint job? IT make much more sense to have the job done in China or Japan, rather than sending it back to the States.

I simply say Boeing have other overseas plants for either parts manufacturer or joint venture, one example is Boeing-RR joint venture in the UK. and the Service line in Japan, it was there to show the title of this article is simply "FRAUDULENT"

In short, you been hacked by a fake and misleading article.

 

[Nilgiri]

That factory did not produce aircraft or even fabricate the hull, you need to read carefully on the article to spot the different, if you can't, let me point it out to you.

To start out with yeah (interiors, paint and MRO)

They will potentially attach wings, empennage etc...to the fuselage by 2025 it seems (though I am not sure what the extent of this will be given its just called "assembly").

 

[jhungary]

To start out with yeah (interiors, paint and MRO)

They will potentially attach wings, empennage etc...to the fuselage by 2025 it seems (though I am not sure what the extent of this will be given its just called "assembly").

Well, it said in the article that this plants involve 2 things.

1.) A Joint Venture Completion Center. Which basically is where you fit your order in it. What kind of seating you want, what kind of length of the isle you want, the bulkhead gap and so on. Each Boeing Aircraft was order to specific term, you can order with or without winglet, with 3 isle seating or 2, or how many row per bulkhead. This is what you will do in a completion center

2.) A Finishing/Delievery Center (Which is wholely owned by Boeing) a Finishing center focus on more superficial stufff. Painting, Detailing and somewhat more importantly, wiring of the system. This is when you want to put your stuff in that aircarft (say if I want to put a PS4 system in my Boeing 737 order, and I want it to link to every seat and for some reason the central computer.) That iss the place to put that thing in.

It also work to check your aircarft prior to delievery. Hence it must be own by Boeing and no one else.

This is the information I got from my bro who is a Boeing Engineer.

 

[AndrewJin]

Fortune: Is Trade with China Literally Killing Middle-Aged White American Men?

Stephen Bowden hugs Bob Hatch, both of Bucksport, after they worked their final shift at the Bucksport paper mill Wednesday, December 17, 2014. Hundreds of community members gathered and cheered for the workers who filed out at 3 pm.

Researchers say they may have found a link.

A new study has drawn an apparent connection between a rise in mortality among middle-aged white American men and increased trade with China.

A “statistically relevant relative increase in suicide… concentrated among white males” is detectable in U.S. counties where local industries were affected by competition from China, said Federal Reserve economist Justin Pierce and Yale economist Peter Schott in the Wall Street Journal.

Their research was inspired by an earlier study that showed that while mortality rates among all ethnic groups were improving, those among whites were worsening at a startling rate.

Between 1999 and 2014, death rates in the 45 to 54 year-old demographic increased by 134 deaths per 100,000 people. “Only H.I.V./AIDS in contemporary times has done anything like this,” said Nobel-laureate Angus Deaton, who co-authored that study with Princeton economist Anne Case.

They discovered that the rise in mortality was due to unprecedented increases in suicide and drug overdoses.

“The thing about that paper that we noticed was that the trend started in 2000, when you see a big jump in U.S. imports from China and a huge loss in manufacturing jobs,” Schott told the Journal.

Areas where there was heavy manufacturing were most affected. But even those areas with merely average levels of trade competition with China saw suicide increases of 3.5% and a 24% leap in the numbers of overdoses for the demographic.

The issue of foreign trade taking U.S. jobs was a major element of Donald Trump’s campaign, which promised to bring back jobs and roll back economic ties with China.

The Washington Post said of voting majorities that Trump was strongest “in states where middle aged white mortality rates were high”

In his first 100 days outline, released on social media last week, one of Donald Trump’s plans was to “negotiate fair bilateral trade deals that bring jobs and industry onto American shores.” He promised that Obama’s legacy Trans Pacific Partnership deal, which has not yet been ratified, will be the first thing to go when he takes over the White House on January 20, 2017.

“Whether it’s producing steel, building cars, or curing disease, I want the next generation of production and innovation to happen right here,” Trump has said.

However, Schott did not recommend ceasing to liberalize global trade, telling the Journal that such a move “hurts everyone. We want the increases in productivity and reductions in prices that trade brings.”

Instead, his recommendations emphasize more training for disenfranchised workers, with a focus on helping them move into growing areas of the economy.

Schott also pointed out that increased trade with China could improve people’s lives by bringing cheaper (and therefore increased) access to goods and services across the board, from healthcare to tangible everyday items.

 

[Nilgiri]

Well, it said in the article that this plants involve 2 things.

1.) A Joint Venture Completion Center. Which basically is where you fit your order in it. What kind of seating you want, what kind of length of the isle you want, the bulkhead gap and so on. Each Boeing Aircraft was order to specific term, you can order with or without winglet, with 3 isle seating or 2, or how many row per bulkhead. This is what you will do in a completion center

2.) A Finishing/Delievery Center (Which is wholely owned by Boeing) a Finishing center focus on more superficial stufff. Painting, Detailing and somewhat more importantly, wiring of the system. This is when you want to put your stuff in that aircarft (say if I want to put a PS4 system in my Boeing 737 order, and I want it to link to every seat and for some reason the central computer.) That iss the place to put that thing in.

It also work to check your aircarft prior to delievery. Hence it must be own by Boeing and no one else.

This is the information I got from my bro who is a Boeing Engineer.

Yeah I understand that bit.

This is what I am referring to:

In addition to supporting Boeing, the aviation base in Zhoushan will also develop an entire industrial chain for aircraft manufacturing, with the capacity of assembling, delivering and modifying 600 aircraft a year by 2025.

Not sure if this will concern Boeing specifically though.

 

[jhungary]

Yeah I understand that bit.

This is what I am referring to:



Not sure if this will concern Boeing specifically though.

I think that's more related to Chinese Domestic Aerospace business, since it said "IN addition to supporting Boeing in the begining". The Chinese will need these outlying business to support a plants in this scale. Unless Boeing also have a hand on this, I would think it's about Chinese Domestic industry.