China City Bans Long Beards, Islamic Clothing on Buses: Report

[Perseus]

First of all you are responsible for your own image, blaming western media is secondary. History is witness that a muslim's loyalties lies elsewhere. When British brought down Turkish Ottoman empire, there were protests and riots by muslims in India which is called Khilafat movement. Muslims make a hue and cry when something happens like french ban on veils and this beard thing in xinjiang but no muslim mjority country gives any rights to the non-muslims. What kind of a character is this? What right then it gives them to raise voice against other countries? Pure hypocrisy. All muslim majority nations declare themselves as theocratic Islamic nation and take away basic rights of non muslims. Its this mindset that put them in poor light. Just see how this thread is full of pakistanis looking down upon china with nasty words whereas they are supposed to be best friends, allies and strategic partners. There is a saying in India that its better to have a wise enemy than have a foolish friend.

I repeat the following:

Indeed almost every media channel in India is like the Fox News of United States. Your government has brainwashed you well.

You are playing the blame game and mentioning a few things which have got no basic proof. I believe that the Muslim countries do give the right and respect for non-muslims to practice their religions. No where in Islam is where it says to be harsh to a non-muslim or to not let them practice their beliefs. It is just that you probably seem to be hurt over a certain event you might have heard over the media and are trying to boast it so much to make the entire majority of Muslims look bad. Also there is nothing wrong with protesting over something like the french ban or the following xinjiang issue at hand. It is our right to protest over something we believe is not okay. You can be hurt and complain about the protests all you want since you seem to get you information through the Fox News of India we all know how valid that Information you are receiving is. Also there is a minority of pakistanis who do not like china and Vice Versa in China in which some Chinese do not like pakistanis. It is like that in every society. No one is supporting another 100% You can not use that as an excuse to demoralize the supporters of Pak-China Friendship. I have seen more Indians on this thread who are taking this chance to worsen this situation between the two countries fellowmen. Indeed the two countries are good friends and of course there are some things they may not support of each other. That does not mean they can not still be great friends. So stop trying to derail the 2 sides from there common grounds. I am Canadian but I have indeed followed the countries issues on hand very deeply and thoroughly and unlike most of you -Hindus- I do not get my information from Fox News. I research before I spill something.

 

[zxmint]

I understood what your main point was but of course we should understand exactly what we as Muslims are doing wrong first and then mention if there is some one else we believe is helping the cause to degrading Muslims across the world. This is of course the basic step any reasonable person would take into understanding this situation. Believe me we know ourselves what most of us are doing wrong. It is just a good amount of Muslim countries have just recently started moving on from the old ages of Empire. The west had just gotten ahead of leaving behind the Empire and focusing more on building democratic states while the Muslim states kept a hold of Dictatorships where as the oppressed kept getting oppressed. This advantage to the west is where the Anti-Muslim are playing a key role into portraying the Oppressed Extremists and Oppressors who have no moral ground on what is correct or wrong they only rule for their personal gain. As the role model Muslims. It is only a matter of time in which this situation could be healed or worsen if the Dictatorships are not broken. To heal the estrangement is in the hands of the oppressed such as the Palestinians @ war these days. What is happening there will only make Karma happen in the future. It is not only the Muslims. You Clap with 2 hands not one.

For a long time, most Chinese people support Palestinians and always blame Israel when conflicts happened between this two. But it is sad to see things got different, if not opposite, for this time. Chinese people really got their heart broken for bloody terror attacks and there are reasonable anger among us. In my point of view, from a neutral stand, it is really hard to judge which side is "invading" the other between Israel and Palestine. The history was just far too twisted. When you blame Israel for killing innocent Palestinians, you could not deny that Hamas was also launching rockets to kill innocent Jewish. So what is most important now is that both sides should try to give up hatred, end this continuous bloody conflicts, and go back to the negotiating table. Violence can not solve anything. Just calm down and think it reasonably, Israel government is just not that foolish to aim at "slaughtering" Palestinians, they have nuclear weapons, they have chemical weapons, they could kill much more if they really just aimed at killing. Then the whole thing is just about war, and accusing only one side cannot solve any problems.

 

[Perseus]

For a long time, most Chinese people support Palestinians and always blame Israel when conflicts happened between this two. But it is sad to see things got different, if not opposite, for this time. Chinese people really got their heart broken for bloody terror attacks and there are reasonable anger among us. In my point of view, from a neutral stand, it is really hard to judge which side is "invading" the other. The history was just far too twisted. When you blame Israel for killing innocent Palestinians, you could not deny that Hamas was also launching rockets to kill innocent Jewish. So what is most important now is that both sides should try to give up hatred, end this continuous bloody conflicts, and go back to the negotiating table. Violence can not solve anything. Just calm down and think it reasonably, Israel government is just not that foolish to aim at "slaughtering" Palestinians, they have nuclear weapons, they have chemical weapons, they could kill much more if they really just aimed at killing. Then the whole thing is just about war, and accusing only one side cannot solve any problems.

I never did say I was accusing 1 side but a fact is a fact there is oppressed Palestinians and that's the example I used in my previous post haha And you are indeed on point I am neutral in this situation aswell. Nice talking to you bud I apologize if anywhere I was being rude in my replies and such I did not mean it! Take Care

 

[zxmint]

I never did say I was accusing 1 side but a fact is a fact there is oppressed Palestinians and that's the example I used in my previous post haha And you are indeed on point I am neutral in this situation aswell. Nice talking to you bud I apologize if anywhere I was being rude in my replies and such I did not mean it! Take Care

Well, never mind, it was a good talk. We both know we mean no harm and just want to exchanging ideas. It is helpful.

I never did say I was accusing 1 side but a fact is a fact there is oppressed Palestinians and that's the example I used in my previous post haha And you are indeed on point I am neutral in this situation aswell. Nice talking to you bud I apologize if anywhere I was being rude in my replies and such I did not mean it! Take Care

I feel sorry for both Palestinian and Israel people. They deserve a more peaceful life, without bombs or rockets over their heads.

 

[That Guy]

You just mentioned secular movements and I am happy to see you mentioned communism. Just look at China, including Vietnam, they both reformed, modified part of their ideology, and they are continuing reforming to fit the changing world better and we all have seen the success. If there is conservative Islam, then there has to be revolutionary Islam or reforming Islam. The world is changing all the time and the conservatives all mean to fall behind.

I don't think you read my comment all the way through.

I'd also like to point out that today's China is hardly communist in nature. China is more capitalist than the US at this point, and they're getting better and better at it.

Just like the reforms in China no longer make China a communist nation, any sort of reform of Islam would no longer make it authentically Islam; it would only be Islam in name only.

 

[HariPrasad]

BEE have 8 eyes but they prefer to sit on SHIT
(one time dip wont purify you, you need to develop muslim habbits of taking bath 5 times a day)
Majority of INDIAN Population lives in Slum / Gutter
AIDS infested country must avoid raising fingers towards us

BEE have 8 eyes but they prefer to sit on SHIT
(one time dip wont purify you, you need to develop muslim habbits of taking bath 5 times a day)
Majority of INDIAN Population lives in Slum / Gutter
AIDS infested country must avoid raising fingers towards us

Your Post shows where you would be leaving.

 

[That Guy]

Well, well, I knew I can never persuade a muslim to rethink about their religion, even if a tiny point. It is a virtue and understandable to be devout and loyal to your own religion.

Don't insult my intelligence. I gave you clear cut logic on why you're wrong, this has nothing to do with me being Muslim.

But when some parts of your religion doctrine,especially the "jihad" part, is being "misunderstood" or "got used of" again and again, by more and more people, causing countless casualties, I was wondering how you feel about that?

If the laws of physics are misunderstood, should we change them? Use common sense.

How you feel when you see hundreds of innocent people get killed by terrorists who have the same religion belief with you?

Except they don't. Those terrorists have shown a blatant disregard of Islamic law, including laws that govern military action. Suicide bombings, and targeting of women and children and considered heretical and barbaric under Islamic law.

Various Islamic leaders from around the world have declared groups like Al-Qaeda and ISIS are heretical groups. I myself consider them heretics.

Have you ever feel regret or shame for that? I think most of you just feel like they have nothing to do with you, and any response caused by those brutal acts are unfair to you. You are always right. Then how could you expect the rest of world understand, sympathize you if yourself hold an attitude like this? Most Common German citizens felt guilty even though they were not Nazis and some of the Germans even feel guilty today, more than half a century after WWII. Have you ever feel guilty for those terror attacks? I bet the answer is NO.

Why should I feel guilty for something that I haven't done? Your logic is flawed. The same way it is not your fault that your neighbor may have commit a crime, and happens to be Chinese, that is the same way I don't feel guilty about something that I have no personal involvement in.

I don't expect the rest of the world to sympathize with me, I expect the world to be smart and use their brains, instead of just doing as they're told. This is why I don't respect nationalists, and ultraconservatives.

The German people have nothing to feel guilty about, especially this generation, as they weren't involved in the atrocities that were committed under the Nazi regime. Do you feel guilty about the crimes your neighbors may have committed? Probably not. If you do, then hand yourself over to the police and tell them that you're just as guilty as the perpetrator.

To admit guilt to something that you have no personal involvement in, makes you a fool, nothing more.

 

[Aepsilons]

The German people have nothing to feel guilty about, especially this generation, as they weren't involved in the atrocities that were committed under the Nazi regime.

Absolutely correct. Well said.

 

[zxmint]

A relationship is always based on principles, shared values, mutual trust and mutual interest. Interests are temporary but values and principles are eternal. Trust is the basis on which the relations are formed and is very tender. by nature. I can see there is growing mistrust between Islamic world and China. However, muslim nations are still confused. You talk of Turkey as your leader against chinese, hindu and west but Turkey is an ally of west, member of NATO. Yet you have no confidence in yourself to lead despite being a nuclear power. Attitude is still servile. And do you think Iran, Saudi, Egypt or Indonesia will accept Turkey's leadership. Also, if you polarize youself, the rest automatically polarize and they would still be double your strength. Also strength does not come from nubers. A herd of sheep and cattle means nothing in front of a pride of lions. You need to be economically viable. Right now minus petro dollars muslim world is nothing. At one place you say that you can not support independence for Uyghurs because you can not fight chinese strength. Then how you propose to challenge them? Raising voice like you do against Israel which means nothing.
Obsession with Islam is obstructing you all from seeing good in others and you are emerging as an unreliable ally who can not be trusted in the long term.

I can not agree with you more. What you said matches my points quite a lot. Practically, if Muslims feel that they were treated unfair especially by some strong powers(it is inevitable to be honest), then first of all you need strengthen your own countries. Develop your economy and science, not hate, and then bombing or stabbing innocent "kafirs" !!! Believe me, Chinese used to suffer no less unfair treatments than any Islam countries.Tens of millions of our countrymen got killed. We lived without any dignity for more than 100 years when we were invaded and slaved by western countries. And see what happened now, in which way did we get stronger? It was generations of efforts on industry and science. Killing innocent citizens are the most coward and shabby thing in this world, no matter how much hatred you have, and it does no help to your countries at all.

By the way, I was not blaming any mild Muslims and I still have confidence on Islam.

 

[xunzi]

It is unfortunate that Islam is associated with terrorism. Whether fairly or unfairly, it has a consequence.

 

[historysheeter]

I repeat the following:


You are playing the blame game and mentioning a few things which have got no basic proof. I believe that the Muslim countries do give the right and respect for non-muslims to practice their religions. No where in Islam is where it says to be harsh to a non-muslim or to not let them practice their beliefs. It is just that you probably seem to be hurt over a certain event you might have heard over the media and are trying to boast it so much to make the entire majority of Muslims look bad. Also there is nothing wrong with protesting over something like the french ban or the following xinjiang issue at hand. It is our right to protest over something we believe is not okay. You can be hurt and complain about the protests all you want since you seem to get you information through the Fox News of India we all know how valid that Information you are receiving is. Also there is a minority of pakistanis who do not like china and Vice Versa in China in which some Chinese do not like pakistanis. It is like that in every society. No one is supporting another 100% You can not use that as an excuse to demoralize the supporters of Pak-China Friendship. I have seen more Indians on this thread who are taking this chance to worsen this situation between the two countries fellowmen. Indeed the two countries are good friends and of course there are some things they may not support of each other. That does not mean they can not still be great friends. So stop trying to derail the 2 sides from there common grounds. I am Canadian but I have indeed followed the countries issues on hand very deeply and thoroughly and unlike most of you -Hindus- I do not get my information from Fox News. I research before I spill something.

If you read the thread you will find that writings of pakstanis here is hurting sino-pak friendship more than what i or other indians are writing. I am sure the sino-pak friendship would be deeper than ocean and higher than mountains to be affected by what a few enemy indians or a few misguided pakistanis are writing on this website. Today media is not just the TV chanels. Internet and google are the main source of information. Every nation has anti social elements and ethnic strife but what matters is the system of govenance, the constitution and govt. policies. A muslim can become the head of govt. of USA, Canada, China and India but the same can not be said for a non muslim in a muslim country. The entire west, India, china and even Israel give their citizens equal rights in all respects regardless of their origin or religious beliefs but a non muslim citizen never gets equal rights in a muslim country. Why? Please prove me wrong by naming the country which does so.

 

[zxmint]

Don't insult my intelligence. I gave you clear cut logic on why you're wrong, this has nothing to do with me being Muslim.



If the laws of physics are misunderstood, should we change them? Use common sense.



Except they don't. Those terrorists have shown a blatant disregard of Islamic law, including laws that govern military action. Suicide bombings, and targeting of women and children and considered heretical and barbaric under Islamic law.

Various Islamic leaders from around the world have declared groups like Al-Qaeda and ISIS are heretical groups. I myself consider them heretics.


Why should I feel guilty for something that I haven't done? Your logic is flawed. The same way it is not your fault that your neighbor may have commit a crime, and happens to be Chinese, that is the same way I don't feel guilty about something that I have no personal involvement in.

I don't expect the rest of the world to sympathize with me, I expect the world to be smart and use their brains, instead of just doing as they're told. This is why I don't respect nationalists, and ultraconservatives.

The German people have nothing to feel guilty about, especially this generation, as they weren't involved in the atrocities that were committed under the Nazi regime. Do you feel guilty about the crimes your neighbors may have committed? Probably not. If you do, then hand yourself over to the police and tell them that you're just as guilty as the perpetrator.

To admit guilt to something that you have no personal involvement in, makes you a fool, nothing more.

Good. Then you must understand Japanese govn't which refuse to apologize to Asian people for WWII, just because it was not themselves who committed the crime. You share the common value. We don't. We Chinese people are just too kind, and kind people always get no fair return.

OK, then let us come back to the logic. People blame the whole Islam for terror attacks mainly because the terrorists share something in common with you, like you all believe in Allah, you all read Koran, you dress in similar ways, and actually you share a lot of common beliefs on Islam. While you feel innocent and misunderstood because you think it is the different part between you and terrorists that drives them to attack, not the common part. Do you agree with me about this analysis?

You may not care about my ideas but I still want to say that, if parts of your doctrine(like Jihad on kafir) are so easy to be "misunderstood" or "taken advantage of" by terrorists, then you need to do something. Not sitting there, feeling like it has nothing to do with you. At least you need try to make your doctrine more understandable, cause this misunderstanding is deadly. It is causing hundreds of deaths around the world from time to time. Have you thought about how much sorrow the families of victims suffered? You can never, ever deny that those terror attacks are relevant with Islam, even though you view the terrorists as fake Muslims. You do have the responsibility to actively handle this mess.

Absolutely correct. Well said.

Well, it seems like that you just find a natural ally for each others. Congrats.

"The German people have nothing to feel guilty about, especially this generation, as they weren't involved in the atrocities that were committed under the Nazi regime. Do you feel guilty about the crimes your neighbors may have committed? Probably not. If you do, then hand yourself over to the police and tell them that you're just as guilty as the perpetrator.

To admit guilt to something that you have no personal involvement in, makes you a fool, nothing more."

Source: China City Bans Long Beards, Islamic Clothing on Buses: Report | Page 14


@That Guy
I just cannot help but repost your "classic" conclusion. Let more people see and discuss about it.

 

[zxmint]

I don't think you read my comment all the way through.

I'd also like to point out that today's China is hardly communist in nature. China is more capitalist than the US at this point, and they're getting better and better at it.

Just like the reforms in China no longer make China a communist nation, any sort of reform of Islam would no longer make it authentically Islam; it would only be Islam in name only.

Then you vividly explain us what does "conservatism" mean, technically. Who tells you that China is not socialism any longer just because of reforming? U.S. also changed their policies for a lot of times, then it is no capitalism any more, too? Human beings are always changing through millions of years of Human history, so we are no humans nowadays? That is totally ridiculous. I really understand your points, cause any reforms will meet impediment from conservative forces. But ultimately, reforms are unstoppable for everything in human society, in this planet, in this universe, and you'd better be wiser facing them.

 

[Erhabi]

If you read the thread you will find that writings of pakstanis here is hurting sino-pak friendship more than what i or other indians are writing. I am sure the sino-pak friendship would be deeper than ocean and higher than mountains to be affected by what a few enemy indians or a few misguided pakistanis are writing on this website. Today media is not just the TV chanels. Internet and google are the main source of information. Every nation has anti social elements and ethnic strife but what matters is the system of govenance, the constitution and govt. policies. A muslim can become the head of govt. of USA, Canada, China and India but the same can not be said for a non muslim in a muslim country. The entire west, India, china and even Israel give their citizens equal rights in all respects regardless of their origin or religious beliefs but a non muslim citizen never gets equal rights in a muslim country. Why? Please prove me wrong by naming the country which does so.

ive went through the whole thread,..reading every comment by every user..there r no more thn 2 pakistanis condemning this act..they are not supporting the terror attacks while i did saw alot of islam and sino pak friendship hating hindus jumping up n down like yourself..and some chinese members who are outright disrespecting Islam n its values n generalizing everything..now i m the third one condemning this move placed by a local administration in one of the hundreds cities of China..i believe bearded people are more peaceful n I never felt worried or threatened by their presence..it is the shaved people you have to beware of..thats my personal experience n you n ur yindoos are just here to troll n create division. you indians are so full of hatred n hypocrisy it amazes me sometimes. even if you cleanse yourself 50 times a day it wont clean the shit inside ur skull..

 

[historysheeter]

ive went through the whole thread,..reading every comment by every user..there r no more thn 2 pakistanis condemning this act..they are not supporting the terror attacks while i did saw alot of islam and sino pak friendship hating hindus jumping up n down like yourself..and some chinese members who are outright disrespecting Islam n its values n generalizing everything..now i m the third one condemning this move placed by a local administration in one of the hundreds cities of China..i believe bearded people are more peaceful n I never felt worried or threatened by their presence..it is the shaved people you have to beware of..thats my personal experience n you n ur yindoos are just here to troll n create division. you indians are so full of hatred n hypocrisy it amazes me sometimes. even if you cleanse yourself 50 times a day it wont clean the shit inside ur skull..

You can clean the shit by answering the question I asked or else people will think that its actually your skull that is full of shit.