China and Iran may barter weapons for oil

[Hindustani78]

China and Iran may barter weapons for oil - The Hindu
Updated: August 7, 2015 00:14 IST

China appears set to reap the “peace dividend” following Iran’s sanctions-lifting nuclear accord by selling Tehran 24 J-10 fighter jets in exchange for a 20-year access to a major Iranian oil field.

China will barter the 24 fighter planes for access to the giant Azadegan oil field under the weapons-for-oil deal, reports wantchinatimes.com, a Taiwanese news website.

Iranian authorities claim that the Azadegan field has oil-in-place reserves of about 33.2 billion barrels and recoverable resources estimated at about 5.2 billion barrels.

China has not confirmed the report, which, analysts say could buttress the case of Israel, Iran’s foremost regional rival, against the nuclear deal that Tehran has signed with the six world powers last month.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has slammed the deal a “historic mistake”.

Quoting foreign sources, the Israeli daily The Jerusalem Post is reporting the ultimate irony that J-10s now going to Iran are an adaptation of the Lavi aircraft, whose manufacture Israel terminated in the 1980s at the prototype stage.

“The Lavi was built and developed by Israel Aircraft Industries, though the government eventually decided to terminate the programme due to the high costs of production and after the U.S. offered to sell Israel F-16s as an alternative. After the cancellation, the Israeli government resolved to sell the plans to China,” observes The Jerusalem Post.

According to the Taiwanese portal, the J-10 fighters have a range of 2940 km, which will cover Iran’s entire air space as well as of the Persian Gulf. However, analysts say that the transfer of only 24 planes, or two squadrons, is unlikely to shift West Asia’s strategic military balance that is heavily tilted in favour of Israel.

China signed an agreement in 2009 to supply 36 J-10B planes to Pakistan, but none of the aircraft, which were part of $ 1.4 billion contract, has been delivered to Islamabad as yet.

Iran is significantly reliant on military aircraft to protect its vital national assets, including its sole civilian nuclear power plant, as well as strategic gas fields. The Fars News Agency of Iran has reported quoting a senior air force commander that the country’s F4 fighter jets are protecting the Bushehr nuclear power plant as well as the giant South Pars oil and gas field.

“At present, Shahid Yasini air base is responsible for fulfilling missions to provide cover and defend the Islamic Iran’s airspace and economic lifeline using F4 aircraft, in addition to conducting tactical and combat missions,” air force commander Esmayeel Lashkari was quoted as saying.

The Bushehr plant began operations in September 2011, but full commercial production is expected to start later in 2015.

Observers point out that if the reports about the China-Iran deal are true, it would confirm that despite the nuclear deal in which the Americans played a significant role, Iran is unlikely to loosen ties with its traditional allies in Eurasia, including China.

 

[Daneshmand]

The news is fake. No body "barters" a multi trillion dollar oil field for 24 single engine jets. Iran does not need 24 small sized 4th generation single engine jets, which does not do anything to improve its defense capabilities.

What Iran needs is ToT for a fifth generation multi-role single platform jet which has the potential to be improved on, over the next decades (a single platform will reduce costs instead of operating five different jets). Something like the Sukhoi Pak Fa or J-20 with complete technology transfer to be built inside Iran. Otherwise the money better be spent to develop some home grown platforms even if its F-5 copies.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

The news is fake. No body "barters" a multi trillion dollar oil field for 24 single engine jets. Iran does not need 24 small sized 4th generation single engine jets, which does not do anything to improve its defense capabilities.

What Iran needs is ToT for a fifth generation multi-role single platform jet which has the potential to be improved on, over the next decades (a single platform will reduce costs instead of operating five different jets). Something like the Sukhoi Pak Fa or J-20 with complete technology transfer to be built inside Iran. Otherwise the money better be spent to develop some home grown platforms even if its F-5 copies.

Is Iran interested about these toys? China's own Arleigh Burke class DDG and LA class SSN.

 

[Daneshmand]

Is Iran interested about these toys? China's own Arleigh Burke class DDG and LA class SSN.

View attachment 244344

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Oh, yes. Iran needs to modernize in many sectors both military as well as civilian. The problem is, Iran had already "modernized" once before. In 1960's and 70's Iran had bought some very modern fighters, helicopters, tanks, airliners etc etc. But without any technology transfer. At the end, they all counted for nothing from today's perspective.

That is why almost all Iranians are now united in the demand that anything bought from abroad must come with ToT. Without this, soon every thing bought whether in a few years or a few decades become junk. Also the people in Iran want jobs and just importing from abroad is increasingly being seen in Iranian society as a loss of jobs. So, that is why anything such deals must come with some form of ToT and local manufacturing capability, otherwise the public will not buy into it. Another reason is the "bad" experience of sanctions. Now Iranians are afraid that anything bought without ToT can be sanctioned in future. All these together means, the government will have a very hard time to justify to public, pumping billions of dollars or equivalent in oil towards such sale.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Oh, yes. Iran needs to modernize in many sectors both military as well as civilian. The problem is, Iran had already "modernized" once before. In 1960's and 70's Iran had bought some very modern fighters, helicopters, tanks, airliners etc etc. But without any technology transfer. At the end, they all counted for nothing from today's perspective.

That is why almost all Iranians are now united in the demand that anything bought from abroad must come with ToT. Without this, soon every thing bought whether in a few years or a few decades become junk. Also the people in Iran want jobs and just importing from abroad is increasingly being seen in Iranian society as a loss of jobs. So, that is why anything such deals must come with some form of ToT and local manufacturing capability, otherwise the public will not buy into it. Another reason is the "bad" experience of sanctions. Now Iranians are afraid that anything bought without ToT can be sanctioned in future. All these together means, the government will have a very hard time to justify to public, pumping billions of dollars or equivalent in oil towards such sale.

Indeed, I think we don't have to be stingy about the technology transfer, since the new technologies can keep developed and explored.

There are also advantages for China to sell Iran the weapons with the TOT.

- It could push China to increase its production by hiring skilled workers as to increase more job opportunities.

- China can expand its influence in the Middle East by increasing its ties with a regional power like Iran.

- We also got many chances to testify our weapons by other nations in the different environment.

 

[The Last of us]

Is Iran interested about these toys? China's own Arleigh Burke class DDG and LA class SSN.

View attachment 244344

View attachment 244345

You will not see Iran purchase anything from now on in my opinion. You will see more interest in joint projects with TOT.
Iranian ingenious military industry now has the basic starting base to create the ships and submarines it needs in the naval departmental. It just needs the funding in order to design and create the projects and yards for the larger shipssubmarines. But in terms of the fundamental technologies, Iran is not lacking. Iran even makes its own naval engines etc and is also building submarines. For example Iran has already built a 600ton fateh submarine and is in the process of manufacturing 1200 ton Besat. Next step is a 2500-3000 tons submarine which will probably be based around the Kilo. China could certainly aid in Iranian naval development with some joint ventures since you guys have made impressive achievements in this sector.

A Chinese technology transfer will be more than welcome and I seriously hope Iran and China start a few joint projects, especially in the fighter jet department.

 

[Daneshmand]

Indeed, I think we don't have to be stingy about the technology transfer, since the new technologies can keep developed and explored.

There are also advantages for China to sell Iran the weapons with the TOT.

- It could push China to increase its production by hiring skilled workers as to increase more job opportunities.

- China can expand its influence in the Middle East by increasing its ties with a regional power like Iran.

- We also got many chances to testify our weapons by other nations in the different environment.

It is exactly what I am saying and Iranians want to see. In fact, telling you the truth, Iran's strategy is no more different that what China charted for itself when it was modernizing. You see, there is no other way to do it. There is no other developmental model except this. I really hope to see China and Iran working this way to the mutual benefit.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

You will not see Iran purchase anything from now on in my opinion. You will see more interest in joint projects with TOT.
Iranian ingenious military industry now has the basic starting base to create the ships and submarines it needs in the naval departmental. It just needs the funding in order to design an create the yards for the larger ships. But in terms of the fundamental technologies, Iran is not lacking. Iran even makes its own naval engines etc and is also building submarines. For example Iran has already built a 600ton fateh submarine and is in the process of manufacturing 1200 ton Besat. Next step is a 2500-3000 tons submarine which will probably be based around the Kilo. China could certainly aid in Iranian naval development with some joint ventures since you guys have made impressive achievements in this sector.

A Chinese technology transfer will be more than welcome and I seriously hope Iran and China start a few joint projects, especially in the fighter jet department.

We need Iran to join our J-31 project, since most of our military fund goes to J-20, and J-31 was funded by SAC, so more investors is better.

Pakistan has the previous experience with the joint development of JF-17 with us, and they are very satisfied.

As for other toys, China can really offer some high end ones if you really want.

From a 3000 tons AIP sub to a 7000 tons nuclear fast-attack sub, from a 1500 tons corvette to a 7500 tons Aegis destroyer.

 

[The Last of us]

We need Iran to join our J-31 project, since most of our military fund goes to J-20, and J-31 was funded by SAC, so more investors is better.

Pakistan has the previous experience with the joint development of JF-17 with us, and they are very satisfied.

As for other toys, China can really offer the high end if you really want.

From a 3000 tons AIP sub to a 7000 tons nuclear fast attack sub, from a 1500 tons corvette to a 7500 tons Aegis destroyer.

My friend, if China offers such joint project, especially the J-31, then be sure there is a high probability Iran will jump on board. If China is willing to undergo such thing with tot then there is zero reason why there can't be cooperation. Iran's airforce was not given the needed funding and thus has fallen behind, if China can help Iran in that regars, especially in engine development, this will seriously boost Iran-China military relations. But comments made by us on this forum do not effect the conducts of our nations, so we must just sit back and see what happens in real life. I remain positive however

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

My friend, if China offers such joint project, especially the J-31, then be sure there is a high probability Iran will jump on board. If China is willing to undergo such thing with tot then there is zero reason why there can't be cooperation. Iran's airforce was not given the needed funding and thus has fallen behind, if China can help Iran in that regars, especially in engine development, this will seriously boost Iran-China military relations. But comments made by us on this forum do not effect the conducts of our nations, so we must just sit back and see what happens in real life. I remain positive however

I think Iran might even open more doors for us in its civilian market if we can be generous about the military TOT.

That's definitely worthy for more long term investment, since more military ties will increase our geopolitical ties as well.

 

[That Guy]

highly doubt this news.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

"Wantchinatimes"? LOL.

Do people actually take that garbage seriously?

It is exactly what I am saying and Iranians want to see. In fact, telling you the truth, Iran's strategy is no more different that what China charted for itself when it was modernizing. You see, there is no other way to do it. There is no other developmental model except this. I really hope to see China and Iran working this way to the mutual benefit.

I can completely understand and respect Iran's desire to be self-sufficient, especially in terms of things like military technology.
After all, that is our own goal as well.

 

[Daneshmand]

I can completely understand and respect Iran's desire to be self-sufficient, especially in terms of things like military technology.
After all, that is our own goal as well.

Yes. We think very similar in many things from self sufficiency to sovereignty (China also paid a heavy price in its relation with US). After all old civilizations are similar in many ways which is often not understandable to new civilizations like the US.