Chengdu J-10 Multirole Fighter Air Craft News & Discussions

[wangrong]

Great question All Green. Anyone know if this is a possibility?

It's a Secret.

We should not stimulate some people

 

[IceCold]

J10S is the twin seater; J10B is an improved version of J10A with extremely high thrust vector and maneuverability. We really dont have enough official info on J10b because the Chinese are very secretive but i have managed to find some info:

THE J-10B IS A HUGE UPGRADE OF THE J-10A WITH FEATURES SUCH AS:
- Thrust-vector control
- Extremely-high maneuverability
- Stealth DSI intakes
- More hardpoints
- AESA radar
- MUCH MUCH MORE

It entered service in 2007.

The J-10B lies on a WHOLE NEW GENERATION than the J-10A. It is much superior to the F-15 Eagle and the Eurofighter Typhoon. Pakistan will use the J-10B (which they call it the FC-20) and they said it was as good as a 5TH-GENERATION FIGHTER.

SPECIFICATIONS (J-10A):
- Speed: Mach 2.2
- g-limits: +9/-3 g (+88/-29 m/s², +290/-97 ft/sÂ&#178
- Combat radius: 2,540 km (1,370 mi)
- Range (without refuelling): 3,400 km
- Service ceiling 20,000 m (65,600 ft)
- Wing loading: 335 kg/m² (64 lb/ftÂ&#178
- Minimum thrust/weight:
- With afterburner: 0.98
- In-flight refuelling: Yes
- Thrust-vector-control: Yes
- Maneuverability: Extremely high

WEAPONS:
- Guns: 2× 23 mm internal cannon
- Hardpoints: 11, 3 under each wing and 5 under the fuselage
- Missiles:
- Air-to-air: PL-8, PL-9, PL-11, PL-12
- Air-to-surface: PJ-9, YJ-9K, 90 mm rockets
- Rocket launcher pods
- Bombs: laser-guided bombs (LT-2), glide bombs (LS-6) and unguided bombs

COMPARABLE TO:
- F-15E "Strike Eagle"
- Eurofighter "Typhoon"
- Sukhoi Su-30MKK "Flanker"
- Dassault "Rafale"
- F-16 "Falcon" (latest versions)

Air-Attack.com Videos :: J-10 FIGHTER: DEFINITION OF INVINCIBILITY

Ok this look all fancy, but how much reality is in it that remains debatable. Somehow i have my doubts. Frist DSI style intakes, i think this was debated earlier somewhere in this thread and most senior members were of an opinion that it was more of a fan boy concept then in reality, however i may be wrong on this one.
AESA radar is another thing i have my doubts, reason being that till today the only country with an effective working AESA radar was the US. Not even the french or the europeans could induct an AESA radar into their first batch of rafale and the EF. China has a long way to go. Pakistan was never really impressed by the Chinese made pulse doppler radars and our priority was always to find a western one, examples are the grifo-7 for F-7s and we still are searching for a western radar for JF-17 although we have the KLJ. So to expect an AESA radar in J-10 imo is farfetched.
Thrust vector control, now i know that a russian engine AL-31FN with thrust vectoring nozzle was demostrated in 2001 in paris airshow for the J-10 but it came with a cost, a cost what the Indian MKI faces, a very lower MTBO and a chinese copy of the same is still far from being finalized to be given the clearance for use in a single engine jet. Would PAF an already budget constraint airforce will go for something not cost effective at all and more over will require Russian permission. I kinda doubt. PAF doesnt seem to be too happy with the performance of the RD-93 either.

 

[waraich66]

deleted double post

 

[waraich66]

Ok this look all fancy, but how much reality is in it that remains debatable. Somehow i have my doubts. Frist DSI style intakes, i think this was debated earlier somewhere in this thread and most senior members were of an opinion that it was more of a fan boy concept then in reality, however i may be wrong on this one.
AESA radar is another thing i have my doubts, reason being that till today the only country with an effective working AESA radar was the US. Not even the french or the europeans could induct an AESA radar into their first batch of rafale and the EF. China has a long way to go. Pakistan was never really impressed by the Chinese made pulse doppler radars and our priority was always to find a western one, examples are the grifo-7 for F-7s and we still are searching for a western radar for JF-17 although we have the KLJ. So to expect an AESA radar in J-10 imo is farfetched.
Thrust vector control, now i know that a russian engine AL-31FN with thrust vectoring nozzle was demostrated in 2001 in paris airshow for the J-10 but it came with a cost, a cost what the Indian MKI faces, a very lower MTBO and a chinese copy of the same is still far from being finalized to be given the clearance for use in a single engine jet. Would PAF an already budget constraint airforce will go for something not cost effective at all and more over will require Russian permission. I kinda doubt. PAF doesnt seem to be too happy with the performance of the RD-93 either.

I dont think J-10 will be selected by PAF.They have selected JF-17 to replace old J6&J7 planes.China is working on J-14/15

PAF H-4 missile can be launched from JF-17 and mirages ,chines also now not ranking J-10 the best chinees air craft.

PAF should go for latest mirages 4 or 4.5 gen as main fighter planes.

 

[Quwa]

PAF will acquire J-10 under the FC-20 designation; could possibly be the J-10B under development right now. Initial batch will consist of 36 aircraft, and depending on circumstance, the PAF J-10 fleet may go up to 150. In any case, the FC-20 is regarded by PAF as a 4+/4.5 generation fighter; I'm pretty sure we'll see TVC, AESA, next-gen weapon-systems, etc, on FC-20.

 

[Luftwaffe]

Sir jee its not easy to make an airplane from scratch its so easy to say rejected lol. U have no idea sir.

Ok take it this way then why did Pakistan wasted investment on jf-17 making a small jet then instead of making such a small jet they should have invested more on this plane and with Chinese cooperation designed and develop something like alleged FC-20 or something that might have seemed exact equal in size and if not exact replica of F-16. Atleast we would have delayed J-10 till that time to be matured. I am not saying JF-17 project is a blunder its a very wise project good Pakistan started this but i am really puzzled why did Pakistan not invested more to make this plane instead a light jet should have been developed in class of F-16 if Pakistan could invest 550 million though the real figure is around 675 million dollars had Pakistan invested 150 million dollars more and really enhanced its design it would have really be one hell of a fighter in Pakistan. Do you Agree with me on this or not?? though its my opinion if i was given this project i would have invested a lil more on this JF-17 and waited to get J-10s after 2012-2013. I strongly feel Pakistan should have made this JF-17 in the same class as F-16, if JF-17 with best avionics costs 25 million it would have cost us 29 million?? but look at this we would have a F-16 class fighter. JF-17 is not at all in the league of F-16 perhaps in future i am sure avionics will be in the league of F-16 or even better may be.

 

[All-Green]

Sir jee its not easy to make an airplane from scratch its so easy to say rejected lol. U have no idea sir.

Ok take it this way then why did Pakistan wasted investment on jf-17 making a small jet then instead of making such a small jet they should have invested more on this plane and with Chinese cooperation designed and develop something like alleged FC-20 or something that might have seemed exact equal in size and if not exact replica of F-16. Atleast we would have delayed J-10 till that time to be matured. I am not saying JF-17 project is a blunder its a very wise project good Pakistan started this but i am really puzzled why did Pakistan not invested more to make this plane instead a light jet should have been developed in class of F-16 if Pakistan could invest 550 million though the real figure is around 675 million dollars had Pakistan invested 150 million dollars more and really enhanced its design it would have really be one hell of a fighter in Pakistan. Do you Agree with me on this or not?? though its my opinion if i was given this project i would have invested a lil more on this JF-17 and waited to get J-10s after 2012-2013. I strongly feel Pakistan should have made this JF-17 in the same class as F-16, if JF-17 with best avionics costs 25 million it would have cost us 29 million?? but look at this we would have a F-16 class fighter. JF-17 is not at all in the league of F-16 perhaps in future i am sure avionics will be in the league of F-16 or even better may be.

Luftwaffe, please note that F-16 today is nowhere near in capability as F-16 of Day1. These birds take a lot of time and effort to mature.
Whereas i do understand that JF-17 is being inducted at a time when lots of modern aircraft platform are in service, the thing to be noted is that JF-17 is designed as a light maneuverable aircraft (a concept similar to F-16) with multirole capabilities in mind and lots and lots of room for improvement in terms of avionics package.
In future thrust to weight may take a jump with better engines and lighter composite materials, RCS is already low and if composite materials are used it shall be that harder to detect.
Already a lot of things like Modern glass Cockpit, LERX were seen in the built version which was not on paper a few years back.
I think we shall see in the next few years what really is in store for JF-17.


As far as FC-20 is concerned it is supposed to be an advanced version of J-10 as rightly pointed out by Mark Sien and Kharian_Beast.

 

[notorious_eagle]

Sir jee its not easy to make an airplane from scratch its so easy to say rejected lol. U have no idea sir.

Ok take it this way then why did Pakistan wasted investment on jf-17 making a small jet then instead of making such a small jet they should have invested more on this plane and with Chinese cooperation designed and develop something like alleged FC-20 or something that might have seemed exact equal in size and if not exact replica of F-16. Atleast we would have delayed J-10 till that time to be matured. I am not saying JF-17 project is a blunder its a very wise project good Pakistan started this but i am really puzzled why did Pakistan not invested more to make this plane instead a light jet should have been developed in class of F-16 if Pakistan could invest 550 million though the real figure is around 675 million dollars had Pakistan invested 150 million dollars more and really enhanced its design it would have really be one hell of a fighter in Pakistan. Do you Agree with me on this or not?? though its my opinion if i was given this project i would have invested a lil more on this JF-17 and waited to get J-10s after 2012-2013. I strongly feel Pakistan should have made this JF-17 in the same class as F-16, if JF-17 with best avionics costs 25 million it would have cost us 29 million?? but look at this we would have a F-16 class fighter. JF-17 is not at all in the league of F-16 perhaps in future i am sure avionics will be in the league of F-16 or even better may be.

JF17 will be improved with time, the first batch will only carry Chinese avoinics and radars. But PAF is already in negotiation with many European firms, so you can expect the next batch of JF17 will be more lethal with better equipment. It took years to improve early versions of F16's and F15's, with time and better equipment they developed this fierce reputation.

 

[All-Green]

I think JF-17 is stealing the thunder of J-10 here
Bottom line is JF-17 will be a force to be reckoned with, mark my words.
So with that diversion lets get back to J-10 "the vigorous dragon" (feeling ignored).


waraich66 claims that J-10 is not being regarded by Chinese as their best Chinese plane.
In current scenario where J-10 is the premier locally designed (not just manufactured) fighter and hundreds of which have been inducted; Please tell me what lead you to this conclusion?

Also i believe PAF has ordered 36 already and they do realize that it shall become a very very potent fighter.
Anything you heard contrary to this?

 

[wangrong]

I think JF-17 is stealing the thunder of J-10 here
Bottom line is JF-17 will be a force to be reckoned with, mark my words.
So with that diversion lets get back to J-10 "the vigorous dragon" (feeling ignored).


waraich66 claims that J-10 is not being regarded by Chinese as their best Chinese plane.In current scenario where J-10 is the premier locally designed (not just manufactured) fighter and hundreds of which have been inducted; Please tell me what lead you to this conclusion?

Also i believe PAF has ordered 36 already and they do realize that it shall become a very very potent fighter.
Anything you heard contrary to this?

J11XX（after J11B)
This is an open secret, secret solution also needs some time

 

[raheelocelot]

Wangrong, u a partially rite. PAF has ordered some J-10s but that deal has not been finalized yet. It is going through some package changes n stuff. And talking about the comparison of jf-17 and j-10; there is no comparsion my friend. J-10 is a far superior aircraft, consideredhi-tech against a med-tech Jf-17. And the combination of them would be very lethal. So, lets wait till 2015 and pray for the best

 

[All-Green]

J11XX（after J11B)
This is an open secret, secret solution also needs some time

wangrong my friend.
I believe J-11 was upgraded version of SU-27
Whereas i think it would have been greatly enhanced by China, still it cannot be called a true breakthrough like J-10 which was the first high tech Chinese designed and manufactured aircraft.
That is why i said that i have heard nothing contrary to J-10 being the best Chinese fighter (from Chinese fighter i meant Chinese made).

Also what is J-11XX?
A newer version of J11?

Thanks.

 

[Imran Khan]

may be new vision of su-30mki.made in chaina very good.

 

[wangrong]

wangrong my friend.
I believe J-11 was upgraded version of SU-27
Whereas i think it would have been greatly enhanced by China, still it cannot be called a true breakthrough like J-10 which was the first high tech Chinese designed and manufactured aircraft.
That is why i said that i have heard nothing contrary to J-10 being the best Chinese fighter (from Chinese fighter i meant Chinese made).

Also what is J-11XX?
A newer version of J11?

Thanks.

Yes.

 

[wangrong]

may be new vision of su-30mki.made in chaina very good.

No,they are very different,the different roles