What's new

Can India destroy Pakistan’s nuclear arsenal?

Disagree, the facts are in front of you... We were unable to do anything when America invaded Pakistani airspace in 2011, our ACM has issued a threat that Pakistan would shoot down any drone including American if they entered Pakistani airspace however there was a drone strike yesterday.

America has probably the best defence equipment of this planet, B2, B52, stealth aircrafts and choppers. US Navy; USS Bainbridge would probably be the first vessel to reach Pakistan if anything happened.

America’s 5th fleet is stationed in Bahrain and it would be no problem for them to ship to India. And there are no geographical points that would make it hard for US to fight. It’s not patriotism but putting a curtain in front of your eyes.
If this was so easy to happen then the time Afghanistan were invaded by USA it would happen then. USA does know our weaknesses and strength as well. If drones are not getting shot down it's due to other variables not the capacity to retaliate. Let me ask you an honest question. Why drones are not crossing the border like before? Why they have limited the attacks? And just keep patience drones will start to down when enough is enough. When all civilian or military plus opposition will be on same page to bear all necessary pressure which we will face as a nation after offensive strike from us. It's not that simple as we think it's. Just wait for positive things to happen you will start believing yourself. Now please don't say this that "What is enough?", "Or When will it happen?", "Will we have to wait for total destruction for show some action?". Don't think that ACM is foolish enough to give such statement just to make fun of himself afterwards. Just Be Positive Sir!

If this was so easy to happen then the time Afghanistan were invaded by USA it would happen then. USA does know our weaknesses and strength as well. If drones are not getting shot down it's due to other variables not the capacity to retaliate. Let me ask you an honest question. Why drones are not crossing the border like before? Why they have limited the attacks? And just keep patience drones will start to down when enough is enough. When all civilian or military plus opposition will be on same page to bear all necessary pressure which we will face as a nation after offensive strike from us. It's not that simple as we think it's. Just wait for positive things to happen you will start believing yourself. Now please don't say this that "What is enough?", "Or When will it happen?", "Will we have to wait for total destruction for show some action?". Don't think that ACM is foolish enough to give such statement just to make fun of himself afterwards. Just Be Positive Sir!
Please mind that americas finest instruments on earth also have some limitations. And when you are attacking on another country thousands of miles away from home, you will have to take in mind certain things.
 
.
If this was so easy to happen then the time Afghanistan were invaded by USA it would happen then. USA does know our weaknesses and strength as well. If drones are not getting shot down it's due to other variables not the capacity to retaliate. Let me ask you an honest question. Why drones are not crossing the border like before? Why they have limited the attacks? And just keep patience drones will start to down when enough is enough. When all civilian or military plus opposition will be on same page to bear all necessary pressure which we will face as a nation after offensive strike from us. It's not that simple as we think it's. Just wait for positive things to happen you will start believing yourself. Now please don't say this that "What is enough?", "Or When will it happen?", "Will we have to wait for total destruction for show some action?". Don't think that ACM is foolish enough to give such statement just to make fun of himself afterwards. Just Be Positive Sir!
My dear friend, are you referring to the Soviet war or American invasion of Afghanistan 2001? If it's 2001 the objective was never to invade Pakistan, all the planning of the twin tower attacks happened from Afghanistan, not Pakistan. The plan was to clear out Afghanistan which backfired and never happened. If anything, America can not afford an unstable Pakistan because it's a nuclear power and those weapons can be deadly in the wrong hands. You are mistaken if you think Pakistan can fight off the Americans, a country that has a defence budget of $600Bn vs a country that has a defence budget of $10Bn. I'll let you do the math.

As for your drone statement, it's not a big deal if they didn't cross the border this time... If it' a strike near the Afghan-Pak border, they never cross the border... Only time US drones cross the border is if they want to strike deep within Pakistan.

Lets just put it this way; Pakistan does not have full radar coverage of it's Western border and that a fact the whole world knows, the United States also has the most advanced stealth technology on this planet, nor is Pakistan able to shoot those aircraft down if we detect them but that makes no difference because we won't be able to detect them.

The United States had no reason to invade Pakistan in 2001 and therefor didn't.
 
.
Ok i am really intrigued, can you please explain in few words why you think gulf war is not an apt example?
The frame of reference for this explanation is beyond the scope of this forum, nor is it an appropriate place....
 
.
Americans don't need to go to war against Pakistan to cripple it. Reality is that if they start a full fledge sanctions regime like was in affect against Iran for eg., that made it roll back it nuclear program, Pakistan will succumb in a matter of years too. At least in Irans case they were energy independent to some extent. No such luck with Pakistan. The only way for that not to happen is for Pakistan to diversify its economy and get connected to the global markets in Europe and Asia in a much bigger way. If all we have to export is fruits and food, then we will always have trade deficits and be easily replaceable. Need to invest in human capital and education, hi tech industries, even on small scale and niche markets ... and prioritize Pakistan over everyone else. Way too many Chinese coming in for CPEC related work, even labor and construction? Why? Last I checked we had no shortage of manpower. Its the poor short-sighted policies that will eventually hamper or do-in Pakistan then any other foreign power.
 
.
But USA will never be able to attack on Pakistan with full force cuz Geography of Pakistan is very much on Pakistan side against USA. USA will have to rely upon aircrafts carriers and long channels to transport equipments. And in such conditions Pakistan can retaliate well against. Once Pakistan get a major breakthrough or give a big blow to USA they will have to abort the war.
Pakistan is blessed with geography and capabilities that contribute to its "geopolitical significance" one way or the other in modern times. Allah Almighty has rewarded Pakistan in numerous ways but we are taking his gifts for granted and drifting away from his teachings which should be a cause for great concern. I recommend reading Surah al-Isra.

Anyways! American military capability has increased to an extent that it is capable of projecting power in any part of the world and geography will not hinder it.

First, an analogy:-

Tora Bora region in Afghanistan featured a vast number of caves, tunnels and fortifications that [collectively] provided a secure environment to a militia to manage its affairs from there. These hideouts withstood Soviet onslaught in the 1980s and were believed to be virtually impregnable since. However, US-led forces combed and cleared this stronghold in a span of just three weeks in 2002 (i.e. Operation Anaconda).

In-fact, when Operation Anaconda was underway, then US Secretary of State Donald Rumsfled denied a request from an American commander to commit 700 US Army (rangers) to war-effort in Tora Bora - a move that was necessary to entrap and prevent Osama Bin Laden (and his close aides) from slipping into Pakistan but this request was denied (confirmed in a report submitted to US Senate in 2009 by an American politician John Kerry). Those who managed to slip into Pakistan were hunted down and nabbed from Pakistan over the course of years and Osama was taken out in a compound in the Pakistani city of Abbottabad in 2011. You can connect the dots now.

Anyways, you should know how US collects relevant information. Watch this video first:


Space-Based Infrared System Satellites (SIBRS) network is operational since 2006 with the capability to scan entire surface of the Earth [24/7] to detect and track movement of various objects of interest (ballistic and cruise missiles in particular) in real-time and relay this information to relevant authorities and systems. This network facilitate American missile defense systems in tracking and countering such threats within the sphere of their operations.

FYI: https://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/these-are-the-doomsday-satellites-that-detected-the-exp-1737434876

SIBRS network can pierce through all-weather conditions and detect much smaller objects (in motion) in seamless manner such as mortar rounds and tank shells but the full extent of its capabilities are largely classified.

Emphasis mine.
Any ballistic or cruise missile that Pakistan will launch, will be spotted and tracked in real-time. The probability of their intercept increases manifold accordingly, and scores of USN vessels are equipped with Aegis missile defense systems at present.


FYI: https://missilethreat.csis.org/system/aegis/

Americans also have the capability to detect natural and man-made hideouts through their surveillance capabilities. Some techniques highlighted in the image below.

underground-hideouts1.png


Known layers of surveillance from space:-

1. Visible imagery (from space)

Some snapshots from two commercial satellites (DigitalGlobe WorldView series) in this link : http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_t..._best_satellite_images_from_digitalglobe.html

"They’re snapshots sent down from DigitalGlobe’s WorldView-2 and WorldView-3 satellites, among the most powerful commercial satellites orbiting the planet. They’re capable of achieving resolutions so sharp that the U.S. government prohibits them from being released for public view. The examples here have been reduced to levels permissible under federal regulations."

Those photos are just the tip of the iceberg. Majority of people have no idea about the power and capabilities of American spy satellites in orbit at present; these satellites can distinguish objects less than 10 cm across. A recent entry in the orbit known as Zuma is even more powerful (its failure is Fake News).

2. Infrared imagery (from space)

"Infrared imagery provides an alternative to visible imagery by looking for heat sources emitted by deeply buried facilities. Infrared sensors look for heat such as exhaust vents and entrances. Infrared imagery could provide information about facility operations. For example, the level of heat coming from a facility is a key indicator of the activity going on inside." - (Streland, 2003)

3. Hyperspectral imagery (from space)

"Hyperspectral sensors provide another alternative to visible and infrared imagery intelligence. Hyperspectral sensors work in multiple frequency bands beyond the visible and infrared spectrum so they provide the potential for detecting deeply buried facility signatures that cannot be detected by visible or infrared imagery intelligence assets. For example, hyperspectral sensors could be used to detect information about a facility’s operation by examining exhaust gases or water discharge from a deeply buried facility, especially facilities manufacturing chemical or biological weapons. As infrared sensors look for sources of heat, hyperspectral sensors could look for signatures in air or water associated with particular chemicals."
- (Streland, 2003)

3. Radar imagery (Sea; Land; Airborne; Space)

"One additional imagery intelligence source capable of producing both images and sets of digital data describing terrain features is radar. Radar imagery systems use electromagnetic beams reflected off the earth’s surface to produce images and digital models of the earth’s surface. The information contained in these digital models is known as Digital Terrain Elevation Data (DTED). DTED models contain a series of latitude and longitude points on the surface of the earth, with each point having a terrain height value associated with it. Integrating large numbers of DTED points together can create detailed computer models of the earth’s surface. This data comes from space radar missions including the Shuttle Radar Topography Mission (SRTM) in 1998 and the Canadian RADARSAT spacecraft. Since DTED provides very precise elevation measurements at certain locations on the ground, it could be used to detect activities associated with the construction or operation of deeply buried facilities. A minor change in elevation at a specific location on the ground could be the result of deeply buried facility construction. Large debris piles from cut and cover facility or tunnel construction could register as changes in terrain when examining DTED data from the same location over a period of time." - (Streland, 2003)

r


Photo of Boeing X-37B - an unmanned spy shuttle that is capable of functioning in space, beyond the reach of majority of AA/AD systems in service across the world. Its capabilities are largely classified, and its endurance is such that it spent 718 days in space - collecting relevant information - in one of its missions not long ago.

4. Ground Penetrating Radar (Airborne)


US-SL-SAR is an example.

5. SIGINT (NSA)


According to experts, NSA is the most powerful and resourceful intelligence agency in the world. NSA is believed to have a hand in sabotaging an Iranian nuclear facility in Natanz with its cyber warfare capabilities in 2005.

6. MASINT (DIA)


FYI: https://us.sagepub.com/sites/default/files/upm-binaries/71503_Lowenthal5Disciplines_Chapter_6.pdf

7. Gravity technology (Airborne)

Gravity technology is very impressive and accurate. Keep in mind that deeply buried facilities yield a different gravity then their surroundings. Additionally, these tools can distinguish man-made voids from naturally occurring features. :azn:

"Gravity field measurement offers the potential to detect deeply buried facilities in a manner that is very difficult to spoof or confuse." - (Streland, 2003)

Emphasis mine. Few understand the fact that "surveillance" is the greatest leg of American war-machine in modern times because situational awareness is the key to success in a high-intensity near-peer battlefield and also a tool of deterrence. Multi-layered surveillance approach provides a rich picture of developments on the ground across the world and makes it virtually impossible for an adversary to defeat it. Conversely, numerous experts are working behind-the-scenes to study data obtained through various surveillance tools in order to identify and mark positions of what they consider as "strategic assets" from across the world. Pakistani nuclear assets are dispersed across its mainland for increased safety but American surveillance capabilities are top-notch and active [24/7]. No matter what we do, we cannot prevent them from mapping our territory and getting a fix on our strategic assets with their multi-layered surveillance approach. We can continue to enhance safeguards of our strategic assets but we need to come to terms with the reality of vast American surveillance capabilities as well.

---

Should hostilities ensue (God forbid), they will try to neutralize our "command and communications infrastructure" with the initial salvo and strike at both well-known and suspected sites with subsequent salvo in order to minimize our chances of retaliation. With our "command and communications infrastructure" in disarray, our defenses are likely to falter and defeat would be certain.

Please bear in mind that American war-machine packs tremendous offensive capabilities and is likely to act in the cover of darkness initially. They can strike at hundreds of potential targets across the country in one-go and deliver salvo after salvo for a prolonged period, taking out thousands of potential targets in the process. Pakistani defenses are not going to hold for long under intense bombardment and chances of retaliation will lessen with each passing minute. Even if we are able to retaliate under intense bombardment, it would be of limited scope and USN vessels are absolutely capable of taking care of anything heading their way. And we need to worry about USAF on top.

Also bear in mind that under the shadow of appropriate situational awareness and long-range precision strike capabilities, it is not difficult to defeat even deeply buried facilities across an hostile environment. Deeply buried facilities tend to have a connection with the outside environment and other forms of openings that can be exploited with the right kind of tools. It may not be possible to outright destroy a deeply buried facility with conventional options [short of NEPW option]; it is certainly possible to render it useless by targeting its entrance points and by sabotaging its vents and such.

Watch this video to get an idea how they disable deeply buried facilities:-


You also need to keep in mind following capabilities:-



There is so much stuff to discuss but I believe that aforementioned information will be sufficient.

---

Aforementioned realities notwithstanding, I do not think that US is contemplating destruction of Pakistan. We have shed our blood in support of US-led operations in Afghanistan and in tackling the menace of terrorism in the region, and much of the world have a high opinion of Pakistani efforts in this regard. Pakistan's primary concerns are Kashmir and a stable Afghanistan and these concerns do not affect US in any way or form. So we need not worry.

Agreed! but strategies can be changed based upon events happened. This is a fact that USA, France, Germany and others are so much ahead of us in defence tactics & equipments but this is also a fact that they did blunders in past and afterwards learned from them. Op. Neptune Spear has also educated a lot to Pakistan Security forces. This is that we shouldn't trust on USA as they have no trust on us. So should deploy Chinese equipments on eastern side, so such operations couldn't happen in future.
Mishaps and miscalculations can occur during the course of a conflict but US can literally overwhelm any adversary with the sheer firepower at its disposal.

Operation Neptune Spear might have raised some eyebrows but Pakistan is a country of limited-resources in the end. Chinese equipment does not guarantee anything in the face of overwhelming odds because it is not magic.

We can continue to strengthen our defenses in whatever ways we can but we cannot afford an arms-race with the most powerful country in existence. We do not need to.

"There's always a bigger fish." (Qui-Gon Jinn)

Pakistan needs to fine-tune its diplomacy and transform itself into a hub of international investment much like India and China, IMO. When sword is not the solution, talks and sound policies can do wonders. There are scores of countries in this world which are not nuclear powers but doing very well. Have faith in Allah Almighty, not nukes. :)

@The Deterrent
@The Diplomat
 
Last edited:
.
If nuclear arsenals were that easy to destroy they would be useless. They are not shrinking violets.

Pakistan’s nuclear warheads are so spread out that they will need to be able to safely conquer Pakistan and then have to skim every 100km grid with a thermal and rad counter to find it all.

In other words, when their various fantasies come to light like their Stalin incarnate Podi likes to reference, they might have a sloths chance against a bullet to find even 40% of them.

In event of a nuclear war, more Indians will feel the warmth of their skin roasting away than any remaining Pakistani would. Id love to see any more bathing in the Ganga after the whole thing is done, that would be hilarious.

Haven't you ever thought that the Pakistani arsenal exists purely as a bluff?

Do you guys really think Pakistan will use nukes on India when the Indian Army is running amok within Pakistan?

Where will the Pakistani armed forces and civilians hide if you so blatantly kill Indian civilians?

Here's what I think will happen in case India declares total war on Pakistan. Pakistani authorities will reveal locations of their nukes to the Americans for extraction. The location of the ones that are forward deployed, if any, will be given to the Indians so that we can take them out in missile strikes. This will be done in order to guarantee the existence of the Pakistani state, in other words, the Pakistani Army, in a post war period.

Or the alternate, Pakistan destroys one or two major Indian cities. India blows up a few Pakistani cities in retaliation, and then the IA takes over Pakistan and starts executing anything and everything to do with the Pakistani security establishment in revenge after pinning the Pakistani state with "crimes against humanity" and the whole world will support the purge and applaud it after it's done.

So good luck with your nukes.
 
.
Haven't you ever thought that the Pakistani arsenal exists purely as a bluff?

Do you guys really think Pakistan will use nukes on India when the Indian Army is running amok within Pakistan?
So we also have cerebally challanged people across the border. A comforting thought.
 
.
So we also have cerebally challanged people across the border. A comforting thought.

The only argument people can make when faced with the truth.

Pakistan is bluffing, and it's going to be called when the time comes.
 
.
Haven't you ever thought that the Pakistani arsenal exists purely as a bluff?

Do you guys really think Pakistan will use nukes on India when the Indian Army is running amok within Pakistan?

Where will the Pakistani armed forces and civilians hide if you so blatantly kill Indian civilians?

Here's what I think will happen in case India declares total war on Pakistan. Pakistani authorities will reveal locations of their nukes to the Americans for extraction. The location of the ones that are forward deployed, if any, will be given to the Indians so that we can take them out in missile strikes. This will be done in order to guarantee the existence of the Pakistani state, in other words, the Pakistani Army, in a post war period.

Or the alternate, Pakistan destroys one or two major Indian cities. India blows up a few Pakistani cities in retaliation, and then the IA takes over Pakistan and starts executing anything and everything to do with the Pakistani security establishment in revenge after pinning the Pakistani state with "crimes against humanity" and the whole world will support the purge and applaud it after it's done.

So good luck with your nukes.
sp what is stopping you from calling the bluff sonny? why your military backed off in 2002 and 2008 despite making so much noise?
 
.
sp what is stopping you from calling the bluff sonny? why your military backed off in 2002 and 2008 despite making so much noise?

Lack of action in the past does not mean security is guaranteed for the future.

There are plenty of reasons why military action cannot always be taken and most of them are political in nature, not military. For example, why hasn't the US attacked North Korea yet? Why hasn't the US attacked Iran? There is nothing stopping the Americans from a military standpoint, but there are plenty of reasons from political and economic standpoints.

There will come a time when the nuclear bluff is called, and it's not going to be pretty.

We could have crossed into Gilgit during Kargil War and proceeded to at least take over the region you call Azad Kashmir. But we didn't, and it wasn't from a military standpoint that we didn't choose to undertake such an option. Pakistan did not and still does not have the ability to stop India if the IA starts marching across the LoC. Your lot is still struggling to fight the TTP, if you haven't noticed. The military was in fact all for an offensive military operation during all three times, Kargil, Op Parakram and after Mumbai attacks.

India still has plenty of other options to deal with Pakistan without having to resort to an expensive war. War is an option only after other options have been exhausted, and they have not yet been exhausted. Until then we only need to prepare, as we have always done.

For one, we need a stronger economy. We are building the foundations for 3 to 4 economic corridors like the DMIC. The first one will be ready in 2019 and will eventually support 100 million jobs. Second, we need the kind of diplomatic leverage that we can get away with genocide. We need so much diplomatic leverage that we can wipe out entire sections of population and the world would not even bat an eye, like how Germany was treated during WW2. Getting to this point takes time, we are not there yet.

India shouldn't be seen as a big country bullying a small country, India should be seen as a responsible power that is a champion of global peace destroying a major global threat to humanity. And that only requires a change in public opinion, nothing else. We are already seeing this change in public opinion in the West with regards to Pakistan.

In the meantime, would you say Pakistan has been enjoying its security environment? So why would we upset the apple cart?
 
.
Lack of action in the past does not mean security is guaranteed for the future.

There are plenty of reasons why military action cannot always be taken and most of them are political in nature, not military. For example, why hasn't the US attacked North Korea yet? Why hasn't the US attacked Iran? There is nothing stopping the Americans from a military standpoint, but there are plenty of reasons from political and economic standpoints.

There will come a time when the nuclear bluff is called, and it's not going to be pretty.

We could have crossed into Gilgit during Kargil War and proceeded to at least take over the region you call Azad Kashmir. But we didn't, and it wasn't from a military standpoint that we didn't choose to undertake such an option. Pakistan did not and still does not have the ability to stop India if the IA starts marching across the LoC. Your lot is still struggling to fight the TTP, if you haven't noticed. The military was in fact all for an offensive military operation during all three times, Kargil, Op Parakram and after Mumbai attacks.

India still has plenty of other options to deal with Pakistan without having to resort to an expensive war. War is an option only after other options have been exhausted, and they have not yet been exhausted. Until then we only need to prepare, as we have always done.

For one, we need a stronger economy. We are building the foundations for 3 to 4 economic corridors like the DMIC. The first one will be ready in 2019 and will eventually support 100 million jobs. Second, we need the kind of diplomatic leverage that we can get away with genocide. We need so much diplomatic leverage that we can wipe out entire sections of population and the world would not even bat an eye, like how Germany was treated during WW2. Getting to this point takes time, we are not there yet.

India shouldn't be seen as a big country bullying a small country, India should be seen as a responsible power that is a champion of global peace destroying a major global threat to humanity. And that only requires a change in public opinion, nothing else. We are already seeing this change in public opinion in the West with regards to Pakistan.

In the meantime, would you say Pakistan has been enjoying its security environment? So why would we upset the apple cart?
good luck with your wet dreams of destroying Pakistan and occupying its territory without getting molested,will see how that works
oh and Btw we are not struggling against TTP we have successfully crushed them which US along with all its Allies and military might fail to do so, while on other hands your country has not been able to defeat even Kashmiri school kids who regularly screw you and i am not even mentioning moist and others who are third most dangerous after ISIS and Afghan Taliban
 
.
Anyways! American military capability has increased to an extent that it is capable of projecting power in any part of the world and geography will not hinder it.
I am absoutely aware of US supremacy. In the part of the world where I live we regularly get bombarded about the American military might. But I want you to do me a favour. I am not a military or technical expert just like I am not a medical expert but non of that means I cannot make lay observations. If I go to doctor who claims to world blah, blah in xyz ailment but after having recieved his full treatment my condition has not been cured I can pretty will assume he might be a hot shot doctor but he has failed me.

So let's look at the Tora Bora. Frankly who is bothered about Tora Bora. It's few caves in nondescript mountain range. How about we look at Afghanistan. After 17 years US has failed to defeat few tousand rag tag sandal wearing Taliban. So much so that it is giving Americans enough grief that they are lashing out at Pakistan. Pakistan nearly 7 times bigger population then Afghanistan with huge madaris educated loonies running around and nuclear weapons thrown in the mix.

And you expect me to freakin believe that in order to fix the molehill of problem in Afghanistan America is about use all those fancy hi-tec against Pakistan and create a mountain of a problem in Pakistan? seriously?

3vArFGO.png



To my mind it is simple. You have a X problem in Afghanistan. You cannot with a straight face say that if US unleashed everything it has on Pakistan after another 17 years you have 7X of a problem. At least seven times bigger headache then what Afghanistan is at the moment.

A Pakistan after US attack would make Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan problems combined look like minor kindergarten fights. There is no way USA or the world can afford a destroyed state like Iraq or Syria. The international geo-politics would not allow this. I know Saudia Arabia, GCC would pobably even offer their airfields to US for attack on Pakistan thus raping the ummah chummah brigade in Pakistan but countries like China and Russia would vetoe such a event.

On a funny note many years ago we developed a leak below our sink in the kitchen. My dad called the plumber. He came and identified the problem which was a joint under the sink copper cold pipe. All it required was a new copper T-joint worth few pounds. However to do so he had to switch off the water supply to the house. After almost an hour of trying he could not find the water supply disconnect tap in the house.

Frustrated he went outside the house to search for the main supply valve on the street. This had clear sign "Yorkshire Water" and warning that nobody but YW could touch it. He opened the top cover and not having the proper YW tool to switch of the main he used a hammer and spanner to try to shut it off. That ended up fracturing the valve and next thing we had 10ft fountain on the street.

This attracted the attention of all the neighbours. The said plumber looking all fazed came running into the house and grabbed his toolkit and jumped into his van never to be seen again. In order to fix our leak under the kitchen he had just created a fountain outside. Soon after Yorkshire Water crew arrived to fiz the "fountain" and started to ask question as to who had messed with their property. It was illegal for anybody to mess with YW line system which is why the plumber legged it.

In the same way you think USA is going to fix the leaky problem of the "Haqqani" network and create "fountain" in Pakistan? You think that makes a sense? Would you okay that?


Pakistan is bluffing, and it's going to be called when the time comes.
It is not bluffing. I have within my family some retired army officers in Pakistan. And I know from their demeanour [I assume rest of the serving officer cadre is similiar] they would not hesitate to use the nukes.
 
Last edited:
.
oh and Btw we are not struggling against TTP we have successfully crushed them

We saw how long that took, and is still going on.

You have used up so much time, resources and manpower combating them and they are still as strong as ever.

which US along with all its Allies and military might fail to do so,

The US didn't fail. They have withdrawn in order to continue receiving support from Pakistan. Haven't you read the recent article where Joe Biden said the US needs Pakistan 50 times more than they need Afghanistan? Their decision to withdraw was political, and that can change anytime depending on how Pakistan plays its cards.

Their objective is to not let Russia or China come into Afghanistan. They have no interest in fighting the Taliban itself. I think you need to bring yourself up to date about the actual politics in the region and not the propaganda that you've been fed with.

while on other hands your country has not been able to defeat even Kashmiri school kids who regularly screw you and i am not even mentioning moist and others who are third most dangerous after ISIS and Afghan Taliban

I find it funny that you are comparing civilian protests with civilian police action to actual military operations.
 
.
Pakistan like the erstwhile Soviet Union is pretty well secure and insured against any military attack from any country by reason of the cost such a venture would attract on any such foolish venture. This is premised on it's nuclear forces. Be it from India or USA.

However Pakistan might be secure on the military front but is is extremely fragile on other fronts. If India or USA or combined developed more nuanced policy to gnaw away at it's weak points Pakistan would collapse with two decades much like Soviet Union did. Pakistan's fragility is it's internal order and polity. If India applied stress there Pakistan would suffer Balkanization.

I am actually surprised Indian planners have not gone for Pakistan's Achille's Heel. Such a effort would reward India with absolute victory with two decades and without even firing a shot.
 
.
We saw how long that took, and is still going on.

You have used up so much time, resources and manpower combating them and they are still as strong as ever.
really where? how much ground do they hold and where? Indian forces in kahmir are operating since 90s still resistance is going on


The US didn't fail. They have withdrawn in order to continue receiving support from Pakistan. Haven't you read the recent article where Joe Biden said the US needs Pakistan 50 times more than they need Afghanistan? Their decision to withdraw was political, and that can change anytime depending on how Pakistan plays its cards.

Their objective is to not let Russia or China come into Afghanistan. They have no interest in fighting the Taliban itself. I think you need to bring yourself up to date about the actual politics in the region and not the propaganda that you've been fed with.
so you are accepting US lost considering 40% afghanistan is still under taliban control

I find it funny that you are comparing civilian protests with civilian police action to actual military operations.
I also find it funny who civilian protestors make it to the 4rd most dangerous terrorist organization
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/nati...4th-most-affected-in-world.html?fromNewsdog=1
 
.

Latest posts

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom