Battles, Airstrikes in Pakistan Kill 250

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

A sombre Eid celebrated in Waziristan



Tribesmen avoid large mosques; cleric blames Musharraf for killings

How about blaming the militants carrying out suicide bombings and attacks on security forces, and then hiding and firing from populated areas like cowards? What about blaming the militants for bombing shops and businesses, that have damaged property, and injured and killed dozens of people?

A military statement said elders from two villages near Mir Ali had sought army protection “because militants use their compounds, which are ultimately targeted by retaliating security forces drawing in and inflicting collateral damage on civilians”.

Hypocrites and liars, all of these self declared "protectors of Islam".

 

[IceCold]

There should be a law into the constitution which should prohibit from fake molvis speaking against the government in the mosques. Mosque is a place where a person comes to learn a few things about islam not to hear a debate over politics which gives birth to hatred. This should stop and should be stopped by means of law. Then whoever breaks it should be punnished, to me it comes in the category of treason.

 

[dabong1]

How about blaming the militants carrying out suicide bombings and attacks on security forces, and then hiding and firing from populated areas like cowards? What about blaming the militants for bombing shops and businesses, that have damaged property, and injured and killed dozens of people?".

Where they doing any of these attacks before mushy sent in the army?

Hypocrites and liars, all of these self declared "protectors of Islam".

Are you talikg about mushy?

 

[dabong1]

There should be a law into the constitution which should prohibit from fake molvis speaking against the government in the mosques. Mosque is a place where a person comes to learn a few things about islam not to hear a debate over politics which gives birth to hatred. This should stop and should be stopped by means of law. Then whoever breaks it should be punnished, to me it comes in the category of treason.

I have to disagree,the perfect place for political/social/religious debate must be the masjid.
Do you have a problem with educated malvis?

 

[Keysersoze]

I have to disagree,the perfect place for political/social/religious debate must be the masjid.
Do you have a problem with educated malvis?

Religion and politics should be kept separate......

A lot of people who complain about Musharaff use the excuse that he was not elected.......
When was the last time that a maulvi was elected? Why should they be allowed to influence politics?

If there was a Christian priest or Hindu holyman getting involved in Pak politics, I am sure you would be up in arms............

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Where they doing any of these attacks before mushy sent in the army?

And what did the army do, in the beginning, other than stop the illegal attacks on another sovereign State, and set up check posts?

Are criminals justified in killing police because they are being prevented from conducting illegal activity?

Are you talikg about mushy?

"Enlightened moderation" my friend - no "islam kay naam pay" naaray here.

 

[IceCold]

Do you have a problem with educated malvis?

The problem is that they are not an all educated. What more would pakistan want if we have educated molvis. The point is masjid is not a palce for spreading hatredism. You might disaggree with that but nowhere is civilized muslim societies, a mosque is being used for political purposes. And by the way let me remind you one thing more if mosques are starting to be used for this purposes then incident like lal masjid will happen very often. I doubt if you want that to happen.

 

[IceCold]

Are you talikg about mushy?

Well dabong1 we can disagree with Musharraf's policy all we want but calling him mushy is not the way to go. Afterall he's the president of pakistan and he deserves a proper respect. You are a senior member here and one doesnt expect this from you. I'm myself not the greatest fan of musharraf's policy specially his joining the WOT but he has made some tough decisions and afterall he's the president of the country, so calling him mushy is not the way to go.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Dabong,

Have a look at this:

United Afghanistan Islamic Emirates

This is utterly a misperception & ignorance of many that Taliban are simply reacting or they are just defending themselves and that they do not having any agenda to be pursued in Pakistan or somewhere else.

Whereas in fact, as workers having been despaired by their political leaders (viz dealers) in Pakistan - similarly Taliban were despaired by their ‘religio-political dealers/teachers’ (viz the so called Afghan Mujahideen) given the long infighting for the power by so called Afghan Mujahideen after soviet army were driven out from Afghanistan. None among the warlords of the Taliban’s teachers/dealers had yet prevailed over Afghanistan entirely that they were yearning for separation of Baluchestan & NWFP in the first instance and annexing them with the greater ‘United Afghanistan Islamic Emirates’ (viz UAIE) - and thereafter they shall establish a strong base for the liberation of the loaded Arab Sheikhdoms from the US according to their vision!!! And this was the raison d'être of convergence between Merchant Osama & Mullah Omar and this was the basis for establishing the hard cover guerilla outfit; ‘the Base’ (viz Al-Qaeda). This is not simply my personal thinking rather this is my personal observation while I was participating in the camp for 22 days training program in training cum launching camp of warlord, Gulbadin Hikmat Yar known as Al-fatah Ghund situated in a suitable & safe mountain terrain of Tal - and as such I can say that I have been eyewitness to this deliberation that was conceived by warlords mostly on Pakistan soil during the ‘Over & Omni-asylum’ in Pakistan long before Afghanistan of Taliban.

US, Pakistan and other were thinking that they were using Afghans Mujahideen for their ends but in fact Afghans Mujahideen were using US, Pakistan & others for their ends!!!
I mean to say that present spearhead of Afghan Taliban, Local Taliban and Al-Qaeda are not reacting against Pakistan Armed Forces rather they acting and working on single & common agenda since long for establishing ‘United Afghanistan Islamic Emirates’ and finally to liberate and talibaniz Arab Sheikhdoms and finally set up the ‘World Islamic Khilafat’. In fact US intervention in Afghanistan is blessing in disguise for Pakistan, for had US not attacked Afghanistan ‘they’ would have launched their onslaught long before against Pakistan in the first instance!!! There is no doubt that US government is more brutal & cruel than can be imagined but the misfortune is that our Taliban are second to none in barbarism by the wrath of Allah Almighty!!!

People with no competent leadership never having any role to play they are simply ruled or rolled over.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/presid...-afghanistan-islamic-emirates.html#post106991

Interesting, what?

And it has been posted on this forum and you have not seen it as yet!

 

[IceCold]

The current puppet government is more dangerous for pakistan then the tailban ever were why because they are such an *** tool in the hands of the indian government. Tailban were never a problem for us neither did we ever face anything like what we are facing today the indian sponspered bombing. After establishing control over afghanistan if they would have thrived for pakistani areas which i highly doubt and there is a big IF, we could have easily taken care of them, what about this new threat that we are facing from the indian consulates in afghanistan. Karzai's constant anti pakistan statements, the firing of the afghan soliders over the durand line. These are the problems pakistan is facing now and our resources are being divided from india to afghanistan, so in more simpler terms we have opened another front for ourselves.

 

[Bull]

The current puppet government is more dangerous for pakistan then the tailban ever were why because they are such an *** tool in the hands of the indian government. Tailban were never a problem for us neither did we ever face anything like what we are facing today the indian sponspered bombing. After establishing control over afghanistan if they would have thrived for pakistani areas which i highly doubt and there is a big IF, we could have easily taken care of them, what about this new threat that we are facing from the indian consulates in afghanistan. Karzai's constant anti pakistan statements, the firing of the afghan soliders over the durand line. These are the problems pakistan is facing now and our resources are being divided from india to afghanistan, so in more simpler terms we have opened another front for ourselves.

Well when Pakistan has ecided to be a proxy to India dividing its forces on 2 fronts, why do you complian when we return the favour.

 

[PakForce Unlimited]

Ceasefire after Pakistan border bloodshed: tribal elder​

The Pakistan military and militants have agreed a temporary ceasefire following some of the bloodiest clashes along the Afghan border for six years, a tribal elder said Tuesday.

Elders have been leading talks to try to broker the truce in Miranshah, the main town in the lawless tribal zone of North Waziristan, after fierce fighting last week that officials say left around 250 people dead.

"A temporary ceasefire has been agreed and four army checkposts in the area have been abolished," said Faizullah Khan, who heads the local tribal council, adding it was reached Monday night.

The military denied however a ceasefire had been agreed, saying talks with the jirga, or tribal peace committee, were ongoing and a decision was expected later Tuesday.

"As far as security forces are concerned, negotiations for a ceasefire are continuing and a final decision is expected today," chief military spokesman Major General Waheed Arshad said.

"We have eased restrictions to facilitate movement of civilians in the area," Arshad said.

Fighting halted last Wednesday to allow tribesmen to bury some 50 people killed in a military airstrike that hit the village of Ippi.

There has been almost no clashes since amid ongoing talks and as Pakistan celebrates Eid al-Fitr, the Muslim festival at the end of the fasting month of Ramadan.

The military says 50 foreign militants including Arabs were among 200 rebels killed in the fighting which erupted ten days ago, indicating the involvement of Osama bin Laden's Al-Qaeda network.

Another 46 Pakistani soldiers have also died, the military says, while residents say many of the dead were civilians. There has been no way to independently verify any of the claims.

Hundreds of foreign militants loyal to Bin Laden fled across the border from Afghanistan after US-led forces ousted that country's hardline Taliban regime in the wake of the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States.

Fighting has centred near the town of Mir Ali, which has been identified by US ally President Pervez Musharraf as an Al-Qaeda haunt.

The clashes were the culmination of three months of violence sparked by a government raid on an Al-Qaeda-linked mosque in Islamabad in July and the collapse of a controversial peace deal in North Waziristan.

Link: Print Story: Ceasefire after Pakistan border bloodshed: tribal elder on Yahoo! News

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

The current puppet government is more dangerous for pakistan then the tailban ever were why because they are such an *** tool in the hands of the indian government. Tailban were never a problem for us neither did we ever face anything like what we are facing today the indian sponspered bombing. After establishing control over afghanistan if they would have thrived for pakistani areas which i highly doubt and there is a big IF, we could have easily taken care of them, what about this new threat that we are facing from the indian consulates in afghanistan. Karzai's constant anti pakistan statements, the firing of the afghan soliders over the durand line. These are the problems pakistan is facing now and our resources are being divided from india to afghanistan, so in more simpler terms we have opened another front for ourselves.

If the Taliban, trained in the Pakistan madrassas, are Indian agents, then it indeed indicates that the Indians are real super.

Islamic religious fanatics, tools of non Islamic country and people!

A real rich story!

So, are you suggesting that their (Taliban's) faith in Islam, that they profess so loudly, is so weak? I thought Moslems put their faith first and then nationality, as I read in one of the posts on the forum.

Rather pathetic and frustrated an excuse!

Like Indians, be bold to face the terrorists and fight them back. Excuses, no matter how ingenuous they maybe, will not help Pakistan.

Stand fast and kick the terrorist hard instead!

The Army must be trained how to combat these terrorists rather than think of running the country! Professionalism is the call of the hour or else we will have more of them surrendering to the terrorists without a shot.

Harsh words, but as a person who dislikes terrorists, this is how I look at this sordid drama that is happening in NWFP and neighbouring environs.

Terrorists of all hues against any country, must be sorted out.

 

[dabong1]

Religion and politics should be kept separate....

If pakistan was a secular country i would agree...but are we not supposed to be a islamic country that has islamic princples at its core?
Let us have a referendum to see if the pakistani people want a secular liberal country or a islamic country.

A lot of people who complain about Musharaff use the excuse that he was not elected.......
When was the last time that a maulvi was elected? Why should they be allowed to influence politics?.....

I think you forget that the mullahs in government where voted in.

If there was a Christian priest or Hindu holyman getting involved in Pak politics, I am sure you would be up in arms............

If a Christian priest or Hindu holyman was voted into power by his/her constituent members i have no problem with that,but if they tried to grab power the way mushy did then i have got a problem.

 

[IceCold]

Well when Pakistan has ecided to be a proxy to India dividing its forces on 2 fronts, why do you complian when we return the favour.

First of all you missed the d in decided Secondly because of our sheer stupidity this happened, tailbans were in the best interest of pakistan if they ruled afghanistan not the other way round. The only stupidity that was committed on behalf of the tailbans were supporting the AQ and so the whole situation got messed up. India is taking full advantage of it we know and i think india will continue to do it, destabalize pakistan as long as they can do it. The purpose is to engage pakistan within it self while india gets her grip stronger on kashmir. And if we look at the current chain of events going on, india has been quite successful in it. They have started tourist expeditions, hence starting towards considering the LOC as the final boder. Pakistan just protesting a few words havent done much either because we are so busy in our political matters and killing militants in the boder area. You dont expect us to even complain?