Battle of Yarmouk

[shuntmaster]

Besides, all humans originate from Adam & Eve. Read about the story of Prophet Noah & his sons after the flood. The stories of Shem, Ham, & Japheth; that may shed some light on the different races & ethnicities around today. Shem is considered the father of the Semitic people, Ham; the father of Africans & east Asians such as the Chinese, & Japheth is considered the father of all the Indo-European people. Both the words "Arab" & "Hebrew" for example are derived from the name "Eber"; he is the great-grandson of Shem & an ancestor of Prophet Abraham. Getting back to Adam & Eve; as far as I know, they lived in Arabia, does that mean we can throw the out of Africa theory in the garbage?

This is all very interesting. More interesting is the fact that all this information is from the Jewish holy scriptures or Christian old testament of Bible. It is surprising that Muslims quoting from the Jewish scriptures.
Hebrew language comes from Eber, and is considered the original common language of mankind before God destroyed the tower of babel and dispersed mankind all over the world to speak different languages. Arabic is considered to be derived from Aramaic, the language spoken in Israel during the time of Jesus.

 

[KS]

Besides, all humans originate from Adam & Eve according to Abrahamaic religions

Just nitpicking. Carry on with your debates.

 

[The SC]

Some Americans wannabe victors on this thread, speculate that the US has won some war. It just shows us Muslims how jealous they are, if we talk about any kind of our achievements, they have to attribute something better and higher to themselves, it is a behaviour of looser so we won't bother with them much.

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

This is all very interesting. More interesting is the fact that all this information is from the Jewish holy scriptures or Christian old testament of Bible. It is surprising that Muslims quoting from the Jewish scriptures.
Hebrew language comes from Eber, and is considered the original common language of mankind before God destroyed the tower of babel and dispersed mankind all over the world to speak different languages. Arabic is considered to be derived from Aramaic, the language spoken in Israel during the time of Jesus.

The stories of Shem, Ham, & Japheth have been discussed by Islamic sources many times. I did not quote any Jewish scripture, instead I only discussed people mentioned in the Jewish scriptures. Many of the people referred to in the Torah & Injeel are found in the Quran as well. Prophet Noah for example is mentioned in both the Quran & the Torah.

I don't think that Shem or Japheth are explicitly referred to in the Quran, but Islamic traditions recount them as well. You can take a look at Prophet Muhammad's family tree, you will find that Shem is one of his ancestors. Shem the Son of Noah was also one of the people Prophet Jesus brought back to life as a miracle performed in front of the Jews as proof of his (Jesus) prophethood. This is of course from Islamic traditions themselves.

Muslims do not consider the Hebrew language as the common language of mankind, consider the fact that Hebrew is a Semitic language & both the Proto-Semitic & Proto-Indo-European languages come from the same source. The Arabic script evolved from Aramaic through Nabatean however both the Arabic & Hebrew languages themselves evolve from common origins, they are sister languages.

Just nitpicking. Carry on with your debates.

There was no need to modify my original quote "Besides, all humans originate from Adam & Eve" by inserting the phrase "according to Abrahamaic religions". You could have mentioned it separately in your response instead.

I know that this forum has many non-Muslim members, however I just assumed that my target audience for that post were Muslims.

 

[The SC]

We have fought and won, and carried of prisoners as hostages (why do you think you are in Canada?)

You have lost your wars against the weakest Muslim nations (Read the news).
I am in Canada because I was invited by the best of you way back in time, and it was a choice from many.

Your answers show how low life and ignorance got the better of you .

 

[The SC]

SO essentially you are saying that the Byzantinians were in their own territory minding their own business hundreds of kilometres away from Arabia. Then the Arab Muslims tell the Byzantinians to submit to the Arabic imperialism through their new religion called Islam. When Byzantinians tell the Arabs to take a hike, the Arabs make that as the excuse to attack and occupy the Byzantinian territories.
Are you suggesting that this is what muslims should being today too?

You have got it wrong .
The Muslims sent emissaries to the Byzantine emperor to ask him to join Islam which means peace in submission to the will of GOD and preaches goodness, those emissaries were killed instead of being sent back home with whatever message they came with, as a minimum civilised nation would do. It showed the Muslims how savage and barbarians those byzatines and their supporters were.
The Byzantines saw Islam as a threat and they have started the war, and they lost everything by doing that agaisnt the Muslims.

Didn't US win against Iraq, not once, but twice, with occupying the country completely for over 7 years?
Isn't US still occupying Afghanistan? By Islamic code, Isn't US entitled to kill Afghans and use the Afghan men, women and children as war bounty and keep them as slaves?

If they could , they would, but since they have lost the war, they couldn't.

 

[The SC]

This is all very interesting. More interesting is the fact that all this information is from the Jewish holy scriptures or Christian old testament of Bible. It is surprising that Muslims quoting from the Jewish scriptures.
Hebrew language comes from Eber, and is considered the original common language of mankind before God destroyed the tower of babel and dispersed mankind all over the world to speak different languages. Arabic is considered to be derived from Aramaic, the language spoken in Israel during the time of Jesus.

Aramaic is older than Eber or 'Ibria which is a bifurcation from Aramaic the oldest language of the area that resembles Arabic 'Arabia the most.

If you read the Koran you will know that Islam precedes Judaism and Christianity, since it is the religion of Abraham without the modifications made to it by ignorant false priests and rabies. So it came back at them to correct them again in the name of ISLAM.

 

[SurvivoR]

Stupid people think as if the Torah and the Gospel came from another God... It was the same ALLAH who revealed the Torah to Moses (pbuh) the Gospel to Jesus (pbuh) and the Qur'aan to the Final Messenger Muhammad (pbuh). So, quoting anything which is not in contradiction with Qur'aan is nothing surprising. This criterion of cross checking of the previous Divine Scriptures with the Final Revelation (Qur'aan) is due to the fact that the Qur'aan has been kept safe from alteration throughout the ages as per the Promise of the True LORD.

Honestly, the pagans shouldn't even consider commenting on such topics as they are in gross error as always. May the LORD of the Worlds guide us all to the straight path. Ameen.

 

[Juice]

Pretty sure that the world was created 3,400 years ago by a great turtle on the back of a goat.

You have lost your wars against the weakest Muslim nations (Read the news).
I am in Canada because I was invited by the best of you way back in time, and it was a choice from many.

Your answers show how low life and ignorance got the better of you .

Your responses show how you were repeatedly struck in the head as a youth.

 

[shuntmaster]

You have got it wrong .
The Muslims sent emissaries to the Byzantine emperor to ask him to join Islam which means peace in submission to the will of GOD and preaches goodness, those emissaries were killed instead of being sent back home with whatever message they came with, as a minimum civilised nation would do. It showed the Muslims how savage and barbarians those byzatines and their supporters were.
The Byzantines saw Islam as a threat and they have started the war, and they lost everything by doing that agaisnt the Muslims.



If they could , they would, but since they have lost the war, they couldn't.

That's what the Islamists try to mislead the world. Islam means 'submission' and only the modern Islamists are giving a new twist to the word claiming it means peace. We all know its complete BS. For the Byzantinians accepting Islam meant submission to Arab imperialism and become the slaves of Arabs. This is the gist of the story. Arabs demand the Byzantinians to submit to them and when they refuse, they invade the Byzantinian people who were living in peace. Muslims falsely claim that theirs is a religion of peace and all the wars they fought were in self-defence. Even if the Byzantinians killed the Arab emmiseries who demanded their hosts to surrender, Isn't it a very flimsy excuse to wage war which resulted in 1000's of deaths and occupation of the land for centuries? It basically means that the Arab muslims had already decided to invade and occupy the Byzantanian territories even before they sent the emmisaries with the message to submit.

I suppose the US can claim conclusive victory when they entered Baghdad and slept in the bedroom of Saddam palace. Only difference between the Arab forces of the 6th century and US forces of 2003 was that US forces were sent to liberate the people and not to subjugate and occupy the vanquished territories.

 

[shuntmaster]

The stories of Shem, Ham, & Japheth have been discussed by Islamic sources many times. I did not quote any Jewish scripture, instead I only discussed people mentioned in the Jewish scriptures. Many of the people referred to in the Torah & Injeel are found in the Quran as well. Prophet Noah for example is mentioned in both the Quran & the Torah.

I don't think that Shem or Japheth are explicitly referred to in the Quran, but Islamic traditions recount them as well. You can take a look at Prophet Muhammad's family tree, you will find that Shem is one of his ancestors. Shem the Son of Noah was also one of the people Prophet Jesus brought back to life as a miracle performed in front of the Jews as proof of his (Jesus) prophethood. This is of course from Islamic traditions themselves.

Muslims do not consider the Hebrew language as the common language of mankind, consider the fact that Hebrew is a Semitic language & both the Proto-Semitic & Proto-Indo-European languages come from the same source. The Arabic script evolved from Aramaic through Nabatean however both the Arabic & Hebrew languages themselves evolve from common origins, they are sister languages.



There was no need to modify my original quote "Besides, all humans originate from Adam & Eve" by inserting the phrase "according to Abrahamaic religions". You could have mentioned it separately in your response instead.

I know that this forum has many non-Muslim members, however I just assumed that my target audience for that post were Muslims.

The Jewish and Christian Biblical characters are also found in Muslim scriptures. That is because the Muslims and founders of Islam plagiarised from the the Jewish and Christian scriptures, even the corrupted versions, and presented it in their scriptures to give some legitimacy to their new religion. The Jews and later the Christians had meticulously recorded the major events in their history and put it as part of their scriptures. The pre-Islamic Arabs didn't have any such thing and when they formed a new religion they conveniently plucked stuff from Jewish and Christian scriptures and gave their own twist to it and made it part of their scriptures. The plagarisation and corruption becomes bloopers when silly mistakes are made like claiming Mary, the mother of Jesus as sister of Moses, even though there is over 2000yrs gap between them. Also, as per Islam, Alexander the great, a known pig eater and gay, is supposed to a prophet.

 

[shuntmaster]

The founders of Islam plagiarised heavily from Jewish and Christian scriptures to give some sense of legitimacy to their new religion, in comparison with the religions followed by people in their neigbhourhood i.e. Christians in north-western middle-east and Zoroastrians in Persia.
There is even evidence in the hadiths that the founder of Islam paid the Jews of Yathrib (now called Medina) for the stories from the Torah so that he could modify them to his convenience and present it the ignorant Arabs as divine revelation. Some scholars claim that the founder of Islam wiped out the Jews of Israel and in his last sermon commanded his followers to eliminate all Jews from all of Arabia, to cover his tracks.
We also know that the founder of Islam had some Christian women slaves, most likely coptic, from whom he got the Christian Biblical stories, both new and old testaments. That is why the Islamic scriptures stories of Christian Biblical characters are so similar to the coptic versions.

 

[p(-)0ENiX]

The Jewish and Christian Biblical characters are also found in Muslim scriptures. That is because the Muslims and founders of Islam plagiarised from the the Jewish and Christian scriptures, even the corrupted versions, and presented it in their scriptures to give some legitimacy to their new religion. The Jews and later the Christians had meticulously recorded the major events in their history and put it as part of their scriptures. The pre-Islamic Arabs didn't have any such thing and when they formed a new religion they conveniently plucked stuff from Jewish and Christian scriptures and gave their own twist to it and made it part of their scriptures. The plagarisation and corruption becomes bloopers when silly mistakes are made like claiming Mary, the mother of Jesus as sister of Moses, even though there is over 2000yrs gap between them. Also, as per Islam, Alexander the great, a known pig eater and gay, is supposed to a prophet.

You are merely presenting your own biased view of Islam. The Islamic scripture borrows nothing from the Torah or the Injeel. The Quran is revealed by the same God that revealed the Torah & the Injeel. The God of Israel is the God of the Quran. The last Prophet was unable to read & write, how could he have managed to copy parts of the Judeo-Christian scriptures? If the Prophet or the Muslims had ever attempted to borrow from the previous scriptures then the pagans would have immediately created an uproar in their attempts to defame Islam. However no one was ever able to accuse the Prophet or his followers of plagiarism. When the first few verses of the Quran were initially revealed even the Pagans of Makkah wondered where the Prophet got his poetic verses from. I could bring up lots of arguments with proof for the validity of the Quran, but it's going to turn out to be an extremely lengthy debate.

The Quran never called Mary the sister of Moses, I think the verse you are referring to is this one:

O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste! (The Noble Quran; 19:28)

The source below gives a good reply to your allegations, & I am going to quote from it.

Why Quran calls Mary, a Sister of Aaron ?

So in the very same manner when Qur’an describes Mary, the mother of Christ as 'Sister of Aaron', It means that she is being referred to as a (female) person from the people, the lineage of Prophet Aaron.

This is infact an Arabic idiom, a way to address. In Arabia a person from the tribe Banu Mudhar may be addressed as Ya Akha Mudhar, meaning 'O the brother of Mudhar'.

Mughira b. Shu'ba reported: When I came to Najran, they (the Christians of Najran) asked me: You read" O sister of Aaron", whereas Moses was born much before Jesus. When I came back to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) I asked him about that, whereupon he said: “The (people of the old age) used to call names (of their persons) after the names of the Prophets and pious persons who had gone before them.” (Sahih Muslim, Book on General Behaviour, Hadith 3962)

The Holy Prophet (PBUH) meant to say that Mary’s relationship with Prophet Aaron was mentioned because she was of his lineage for among Semites it was common to associate a person with his lineage.

This fits the context as well. The people thought that Mary had done something unworthy of a chaste woman and thus as they rebuked her, they first made a reference to her noble ancestry and then testified that even her own father was no wicked person (verse 28).

I am uncertain about Alexander the Great being "gay" or being a "pig eater", but what I do know for a fact is that he was a pagan. He is definitely not a prophet of Islam. Homosexuality & eating pork is forbidden in Islam.

Some Muslims consider the person referred to as "Dhul-Qarnayn" in the Quran as "Alexander the Great", some people claim it is "Cyrus the Great of Persia". Some people claim that "Dhul-Qarnayn" is the Byzantine Emperor Heraclius.

However, we can't confirm with a 100% surety that any from among these 3 individuals is the "Dhul-Qarnayn" of the Quran. In my opinion as of now, "Dhul-Qarnayn" is most likely "Cyrus the Great of Persia".

By the way the Quran never refers to "Dhul-Qarnayn" as a prophet of Islam.

 

[shuntmaster]

You are merely presenting your own biased view of Islam. The Islamic scripture borrows nothing from the Torah or the Injeel. The Quran is revealed by the same God that revealed the Torah & the Injeel. The God of Israel is the God of the Quran. The last Prophet was unable to read & write, how could he have managed to copy parts of the Judeo-Christian scriptures? If the Prophet or the Muslims had ever attempted to borrow from the previous scriptures then the pagans would have immediately created an uproar in their attempts to defame Islam. However no one was ever able to accuse the Prophet or his followers for plagiarism. When the first few verses of the Quran were initially revealed even the Pagans of Makkah wondered where the Prophet got his poetic verses from. I could bring up lots of arguments with proof for the validity of the Quran, but it's going to turn out to be an extremely lengthy debate.

The Quran never called Mary the sister of Moses, I think the verse you are referring to is this one:



The source below gives a good reply to your allegations, & I am going to quote from it.

Why Quran calls Mary, a Sister of Aaron ?





I am uncertain about Alexander the Great being "gay" or being a "pig eater", but what I do know for a fact is that he was a pagan. He is definitely not a prophet of Islam. Homosexuality & eating pork is forbidden in Islam.

Some Muslims consider the person referred to as "Dhul-Qarnayn" in the Quran as "Alexander the Great", some people claim it is "Cyrus the Great of Persia". Some people claim that "Dhul-Qarnayn" is the Byzantine Emperor Heraclius.

However, we can't confirm with a 100% surety that any from among these 3 individuals is the "Dhul-Qarnayn" of the Quran. In my opinion as of now, "Dhul-Qarnayn" is most likely "Cyrus the Great of Persia".

By the way the Quran never refers to "Dhul-Qarnayn" as a prophet of Islam.

Whatever you say, it doesnt cover up the goof-up the founder of Islam made by confusing Mary the sister of Moses and Mary the mother of Jesus. If Mary the mother of Jesus is metaphorically referred to as sister of Moses because she comes from lineage of Aaron, the brother of Moses, then she will be a daughter of Moses/Aaron. Only contemporaries are referred as brother/sister and the descendants are always referred as sons/daughters.
Most scholars, both Islamic and non-Islamic, are of the opinion that the character of "Dhul-Qarnayn" mentioned in the Islamic scriptures are Alexander who is supposed to have reached the ends of the world and seen the sun go into a marshy pool. Even if "Dhul-Qarnayn" is Cyrus, still he is pagan.

Regarding how the illiterate founder of Islam came across the Jewish and Christian scripture stories, refer to the post#87 of this thread.

 

[Banu Umayyah]

Whatever you say, it doesnt cover up the goof-up the founder of Islam made by confusing Mary the sister of Moses and Mary the mother of Jesus. If Mary the mother of Jesus is metaphorically referred to as sister of Moses because she comes from lineage of Aaron, the brother of Moses, then she will be a daughter of Moses/Aaron. Only contemporaries are referred as brother/sister and the descendants are always referred as sons/daughters.
.

Where was that mentioned in the Qur'an pagan liar?

Most scholars, both Islamic and non-Islamic, are of the opinion that the character of "Dhul-Qarnayn" mentioned in the Islamic scriptures are Alexander who is supposed to have reached the ends of the world and seen the sun go into a marshy pool. Even if "Dhul-Qarnayn" is Cyrus, still he is pagan.

Again, where is your source cow worshipper?