Autonomy Under Indian Constitution: An Old Pragmatic Approach To Kashmir or a Recipe for Disaster?

[Stephen Cohen]

Have you not seen how the Sanghis in Delhi have baulked at the prospects pointed out to them by their legal experts of the consequences of any action removing Art. 370? Do you think it mere coincidence that their voice on this 'burning issue' has become honeyed and seductive? Why do you think the likes of Modi have beaten a diplomatic retreat?

Article 370 has Geo political and Geo strategic VALUE

It has NO LEGAL value

It is a STICK with which we can BEAT Pakistanis and Kashmiris

We say " Outsiders are NOT allowed to settle in Kashmir

hence we have protected the Muslim character of Kashmir "

Article 370 has given us the STRENGTH to STARE DOWN all countries of the world
including OIC countries
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@Joe Shearer @Soumitra @hellfire @Nilgiri

You can go through MANY articles on the Supreme Court case which said

" India is an Indestructible UNION of destructible states "

There are REFERENCES to Kashmir also in some of these articles

https://www.google.co.in/webhp?sour...preme+court+India+is+an+indestructible+union+
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This statement that If Article 370 is abolished ; Kashmir will AUTOMATICALLY secede
on a Legal basis is absurd and blatantly false and misleading

 

[Joe Shearer]

they have not beaten a retreat. You pick and choose your battles.

1 there is GST which is neccesary for the development of the country. much work has been done and hopefully it will be passed this session

2 there is UCC - it is for the integrity of the nation. the process has started with the law commission asked to prepare a draft for the same

3 Article 370 regarding unity and integrity of the nation will come after that . Waiting for a year or two to get the necessary numbers in the Rajya Sabha is good strategy

4 Ram Mandir - It is a religious and emotive issue. that will be tackled last (hopefully by that time SC judgement will come)

As far as I can see, each of these is being approached with such ill-judged lack of knowledge and of even a rudimentary idea of the issues involved - your post was perhaps the most effort that any of your ilk undertook - that I can only pray that the country will withstand your witch-doctor stunts and jadu-tona approach. Look for yourself at the preceding posts by Sanghis and despair for yourself at their crass inability to grasp even simple concepts and ideas. What can you people do with such elemental simplicity guiding your thoughts?

I somehow didn't notice this ...


Incorrect. The insurrection in Poonch was the direct result of the demobilisation in aftermath of World War 2 wherein many locals had served as soldiers in the British Indian Army at the Burma Front.

These men wanted to be absorbed into the state forces (which the Maharaja refused) and had issues of unpaid arrears. This was conveniently linked to other factors wherein the general feeling of antagonism to the Maharaja's rule was clubbed with these factors to create an incident which was purely 'political'.

To claim otherwise is to do exactly what we have been doing in pre-independence era (and indeed in post-independence era) - claim that 1857 was 'First War of Independence'. A fallacy at best and totally delusive in impolite terms.

@Joe Shearer

Legally, Hyderabad has not acceded to India either, if one does look at the pertinent points raised by AG Noorani with respect to the Government of India policy on Instrument of Accession and the letter of Nizam itself . Hence, my contention that India could have absorbed Kashmir on similar lines and diluted Article 370 over the period and abolish it altogether at opportune time. Logical reasoning - why dither here too!!

You have a point there.

 

[Soumitra]

As far as I can see, each of these is being approached with such ill-judged lack of knowledge and of even a rudimentary idea of the issues involved - your post was perhaps the most effort that any of your ilk undertook - that I can only pray that the country will withstand your witch-doctor stunts and jadu-tona approach. Look for yourself at the preceding posts by Sanghis and despair for yourself at their crass inability to grasp even simple concepts and ideas. What can you people do with such elemental simplicity guiding your thoughts?



You have a point there.

Sorry we are not "intellectuals" like you. We like to KISS "Keep It Simple Stupid"

We dont want to spend millions of dollars to make a pen that can work in zero gravity. We will use a pencil

When faced with a gordian knot we will not spend hours to see how to see how to untie it. We will just use our sword to cut it

We feel the ends justify the means. If our witch doctor stunts and jadu tona approach get us the results so be it

We will not spend time shedding fake crocodile tears for terrorists or calling them freedom fighters or rebels just to satisfy a different constituency other than our nation.

If someone approaches us to draft an appeal for peace we will not use words which are against our conscience just because they appeal to the other side. We will rather not draft such an appeal just to show off our "intellectual" side. What say @Levina @SpArK @nair @third eye

(BTW did they approach you or did you offer your services? If it was the later then .....)

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sorry we are not "intellectuals" like you. We like to KISS "Keep It Simple Stupid"

We dont want to spend millions of dollars to make a pen that can work in zero gravity. We will use a pencil

When faced with a gordian knot we will not spend hours to see how to see how to untie it. We will just use our sword to cut it

We feel the ends justify the means. If our witch doctor stunts and jadu tona approach get us the results so be it

We will not spend time shedding fake crocodile tears for terrorists or calling them freedom fighters or rebels just to satisfy a different constituency other than our nation.

If someone approaches us to draft an appeal for peace we will not use words which are against our conscience just because they appeal to the other side. We will rather not draft such an appeal just to show off our "intellectual" side. What say @Levina @SpArK @nair @third eye

(BTW did they approach you or did you offer your services? If it was the later then .....)

Hurt a lot, did it?

 

[Soumitra]

Hurt a lot, did it?

Nope Not at all. I love to see intellectual gymnastics and frothing in the mouth. Sorry you will have to suffer atleast till 2019

 

[Joe Shearer]

Nope Not at all. I love to see intellectual gymnastics and frothing in the mouth. Sorry you will have to suffer atleast till 2019

As I already said, I'm no intellectual. Only those who suffer from penis envy use that. I guess you should consult Babaji; he probably has some exercises you could try.

 

[Soumitra]

As I already said, I'm no intellectual. Only those who suffer from penis envy use that. I guess you should consult Babaji; he probably has some exercises you could try.

OK let us say you are not an intellectual. I have a few questions regarding your signature
"Enlightened times will only enlighten a small number of honest men and women. The common people will always be fanatical."

1. Do you consider that we live in enlightened times or are we still in the dark ages? Or did we enter the dark ages from May 26, 2014?
2. If we are in enlightened times are you in "small number of honest men and women" or are you in the "common People"

 

[Joe Shearer]

OK let us say you are not an intellectual. I have a few questions regarding your signature
"Enlightened times will only enlighten a small number of honest men and women. The common people will always be fanatical."

1. Do you consider that we live in enlightened times or are we still in the dark ages? Or did we enter the dark ages from May 26, 2014?
2. If we are in enlightened times are you in "small number of honest men and women" or are you in the "common People"

I have no idea how to answer the mentally constipated. Get rid of the shit in your mind, and we might - just might - have a conversation.

May 26, 2014 is only a way-station. And since I disclaim fanaticism, you should, with your vast networked resources, be able to join the dots.

 

[OrionHunter]

J&K is like another state of india and there shouldn't be much difference in it with other states

Unfortunately Article 370 doesn't say so! Kashmir has a special status. This article of the Indian constitution grants special autonomous status to the state of Jammu and Kashmir. The article is drafted in Part XXI of the Constitution, which relates to Temporary, Transitional and Special Provisions.

We need to scrap it first before we can treat it like other states of the Indian Union, which I think is next to impossible.

 

[Soumitra]

I have no idea how to answer the mentally constipated. Get rid of the shit in your mind, and we might - just might - have a conversation.

May 26, 2014 is only a way-station. And since I disclaim fanaticism, you should, with your vast networked resources, be able to join the dots.

I accept that I am a Sanghi. I am simply trying to point out your hypocricy that on one hand you get to call us Chaddis. Sanghis, Bhakts etc. why cant we call you for what you are - "Leftists" , "Liberals" "Seculars" and "Intellectuals". Why dont you accept what you are?

 

[Joe Shearer]

I accept that I am a Sanghi. I am simply trying to point out your hypocricy that on one hand you get to call us Chaddis. Sanghis, Bhakts etc. why cant we call you for what you are - "Leftists" , "Liberals" "Seculars" and "Intellectuals". Why dont you accept what you are?

A simple question - do you understand the word 'despise'? Can you leave me alone? I hate talking to people with whom I have nothing in common.

 

[Soumitra]

A simple question - do you understand the word 'despise'? Can you leave me alone? I hate talking to people with whom I have nothing in common.

Sure I will be on my way. Just dont put my posts out of context in other threads

 

[Joe Shearer]

Sure I will be on my way. Just dont put my posts out of context in other threads

You know what? You don't tell me what to do. I decide. Ponder over that. But don't do it standing still; be on your way.

 

[Soumitra]

You know what? You don't tell me what to do. I decide. Ponder over that. But don't do it standing still; be on your way.

You couldnt stop could you? You also dont get to tell me what to do or not do. Feel free to ignore me if you want. but I will not stop exposing your hypocrisy

 

[Joe Shearer]

You couldnt stop could you? You also dont get to tell me what to do or not do. Feel free to ignore me if you want. but I will not stop exposing your hypocrisy

My hypocrisy? I am genuinely surprised. My style is the most open and transparent. To the extent where it has exposed me to vicious backbiting, among others, from you. Which is one reason for my despising you, with the rest of your crowd. Ill-read and ill-educated, and unable to distinguish between another person's beliefs and his preparing a brief.

I suppose you want me to truckle to your nonsense and resent it because I don't. Too bad.

From this point on, you can say all the things you wanted to say - look up l'esprit d'escalier - without fear of my refuting it. Not unless you call yourself Ranjeet.