Atheist War Hero, serving Soldier

[Pakistani E]

Major Afzaal Ahmad Shaheed - OP Zarb e Azab;

Comments


Because there is no ban on any community from joining the army... There is no such a ban ! Nobody is drummed out of the military over his religious associations that is BS!

@Pakistani Exile @Jaanbaz

You are correct. There are, and have always been, a large number of Ahmadis in all Branches of the Armed Forces. I myself come from such a family, I don't want to digress my identity or theirs, but my relatives include both Jawans and Officers. There is no ban on them. On the contrary, in my personal opinion, the percentage of Ahmadis in the Armed Forces is over represented compared to the population of Ahmadis in Pakistan.

EDIT: I believe @Jaanbaz also comes from a military family background. You are likely to find that nearly every single Ahmadi either has family or friends in one of the armed forces of Pakistan, in my experience at least.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Yet atheists are completely oblivious to these perfectly sensible arguments.

As per Kur'an-i Kerim all souls, created together, testified that Allah-u Azimushan is indeed their only LORD. However, when it comes to Takwa (God consciousness) they differ by their own choice and free will - some have it, the others don't have it.

 

[Curious_Guy]

this thread interesting read but this atheism is beyond me ,

 

[Zibago]

If discussion about religion is banned than by that standard discussion about irreligion is also not allowed
@Hypatia
So its best if we leave belief or lack of it to the individual

 

[Hypatia]

That is the thing about this @Hypatia she is denying the existence of God yet has not offered any alternative arguments for the existence of the universe

Have you ever heard of Occam's razor ?
a simple explanation with few assumptions is more likely to be true, I'd take a scientific explanation over fairytales anyday.
The first cause argument is probably the lamest ,
tell me who created God?

If discussion about religion is banned than by that standard discussion about irreligion is also not allowed
@Hypatia
So its best if we leave belief or lack of it to the individual

I agree, I have read the rules , best to avoid discussion on theology, not the right place.
but we can certainly discuss social implications of an extremist belief in appropriate sections i recon.

 

[Moonlight]

I guess she has Not they don't teach that in Pakistani textbooks where they can rote learn it


Dear Burden of proof rest upon you to prove the existence of your deity not the rejectors
Teapot analogy is the best answer to theist's fallacious ‘absence of evidence is not evidence of absence’ argument

I ought to call myself an agnostic; but, for all practical purposes, I am an atheist.
I do not think the existence of the Christian God any more probable than the
existence of the Gods of Olympus or Valhalla. To take another illustration:
nobody can prove that there is not between the Earth and Mars a china teapot revolving in an elliptical orbit, but nobody thinks this sufficiently likely to be taken into account in practice. I think the Christian God just as unlikely

- Bertrand russell
​

An obscure text is not a proof of anything, you'll have to do better than that.

Ma'am go read all your philosophers and then read Quran and see the difference of both. Do understand how the surahs and verses are put up together and why so. Then do come up with your conclusion.

 

[Icarus]

Yaar even before ISSB test there is a form given to every candidate who pass the initial test in recruitment center and on this form there is clause where you have to mention you religion and to accept clearly disassociation with one minority sect. I hope you know about that form. then how can he recruited did he cheat the form and oath.
@Icarus

Its not a matter of cheating, its a legal technicality. Imagine getting an MCQ with four answers and all of them are wrong. Does selecting any one make it any more wrong then the rest? As I said, the Pakistani laws do not recognize atheism as a valid selection in matters of faith so it is not the applicant's dishonesty, rather the authority's ineptitude that should be held to question.

 

[django]

Have you ever heard of Occam's razor ?
a simple explanation with few assumptions is more likely to be true, I'd take a scientific explanation over fairytales anyday.
The first casu argument is probably the lamest ,
tell me who created God?

I agree, I have read the rules , best to avoid discussion on theology, not the right place.
but we can certainly discuss social implications of an extremist belief in appropriate sections i recon.

How is the first case argument the lamest? explain your rationale and as for who created God, if we follow this line of thinking we end up going into an infinite regress of events which preclude us from reaching this current point, to quote Noble prize winning physicist and noted atheist Steven Weinberg " I guess it's one turtle beneath another turtle and so on" lol, the atheist have no answer for this, as for your fairy tales/hocus pocus , well have you ever been to a magicians show, I have seen a magician pulling a rabbit out of a empty hat, however if I was to believe that the magician created the rabbit out of thin air I should rightfully be placed in an asylum, however when we look into the instant beginning of the universe are you content with the argument that absolute nothing created something out of nothing, at least in the case of the rabbit you had a magician in the case of the universe we have nothing, no time ,space,matter,energy quantum foam, laws of physics, higgs field etc talk about fairytales you are the victim of the biggest one (nothing creating something out of nothing) lol

 

[Maarkhoor]

Its not a matter of cheating, its a legal technicality. Imagine getting an MCQ with four answers and all of them are wrong. Does selecting any one make it any more wrong then the rest? As I said, the Pakistani laws do not recognize atheism as a valid selection in matters of faith so it is not the applicant's dishonesty, rather the authority's ineptitude that should be held to question.

Struggle against it legally make it choice till then it is illegal no justification can make it lawful..i will write to ISPR about this issue and will post reply...

 

[Icarus]

Struggle against it legally make it choice till then it is illegal no justification can make it lawful..i will write to ISPR about this issue and will post reply...

The ISPR or the Army can do nothing about it, a change of this magnitude has to come down from our very constitution which lacks the provision for any such change.

 

[Maarkhoor]

The ISPR or the Army can do nothing about it, a change of this magnitude has to come down from our very constitution which lacks the provision for any such change.

I don't want any change but need clarification I my self signed and fill that form which state what I mentioned befoe then how can that sect serve in army...they lie while filling...I want to check that...I enrolled PMA LC 108....I know ...let me check..

 

[Icarus]

I don't want any change but need clarification I my self signed and fill that form which state what I mentioned befoe then how can that sect serve in army...they lie while filling...I want to check that...I enrolled PMA LC 108....I know ...let me check..

Be clear about what you're trying to say. Do you mean Ahmedis? Its not a curse word you know, you can say it.

Do you means Shias? Be clear.

 

[Jaanbaz]

Major Afzaal Ahmad Shaheed - OP Zarb e Azab;

Comments


Because there is no ban on any community from joining the army... There is no such a ban ! Nobody is drummed out of the military over his religious associations that is BS!

@Pakistani Exile @Jaanbaz

You're right, there is no ban whatsoever on any community from joining the armed forces. Only some Indian wannabes like Tarek Pathu comes up with these facts out of their back sides.

 

[Omega007]

How is the first case argument the lamest? explain your rationale and as for who created God, if we follow this line of thinking we end up going into an infinite regress of events which preclude us from reaching this current point, to quote Noble prize winning physicist and noted atheist Steven Weinberg " I guess it's one turtle beneath another turtle and so on" lol, the atheist have no answer for this, as for your fairy tales/hocus pocus , well have you ever been to a magicians show, I have seen a magician pulling a rabbit out of a empty hat, however if I was to believe that the magician created the rabbit out of thin air I should rightfully be placed in an asylum, however when we look into the instant beginning of the universe are you content with the argument that absolute nothing created something out of nothing, at least in the case of the rabbit you had a magician in the case of the universe we have nothing, no time ,space,matter,energy quantum foam, laws of physics, higgs field etc talk about fairytales you are the victim of the biggest one (nothing creating something out of nothing) lol

Clearly you ain't a physics grad,that's for sure.

 

[shah1398]

There is no bar or compulsion for any Religion/Sect/view people joining Pakistani Armed Forces. Anyone performing well is given the due credit and respect by both men and his superiors.

I dont think one can legally be an atheist in Pakistan, Pakistani Law does not even recognize that.
Most atheists/agnostics including myself are Muslims in Papers

Can U plz quote any clause from constitution saying so? Plz keep social and constitutional aspects separate. If one is atheist etc then its not necessary that U are suppose to announce it in loudspeakers to whole world. There are many people who are Muslim by name but in no way any single action of them indicates so and there are many who dont even know if they are Muslims or belong to any Religion. Its totally personal matter and a matter of belief.PD.

 

[Kambojaric]

If they honourably serve the nation, are ready to give their lives for it, then who cares what belief or lack of, they have.