Arjun-II MBT development l Updates & discussion.

[GORKHALI]

Yes @sancho when I read about Arjun being better than T-90. I asked someone in IA who knows this in and out and his answer was that Arjun is better than T-72 and a good Tank but is not better than T-90. He also said that the there are fake news circulated and IA cannot respond to those news. He had no hesitation when he said so. I believe him and I cannot disclose but he was in very important position at that time and knew this in and out.

Well I asked someone in IAF and he said that Su 30 mki is junk and very low availability.He swear that many of IAF pilots like MK2 more than the Mki and they also heard Tejas is on similar lines.You believe this source ?
@Topic MBT arjun is better than T90 is on official records and I don't give a shit about what IA sources think about and it proved that it Outran with heaps and bound and fairly comparable in outgunning too.Read the report it says it cleary got edge on mobility while firepower is more or less comparable and again missile firing capability of Arjun MK2. diminished that edge

 

[Omega007]

Well I asked someone in IAF and he said that Su 30 mki is junk and very low availability.He swear that many of IAF pilots like MK2 more than the Mki and they also heard Tejas is on similar lines.You believe this source ?
@Topic MBT arjun is better than T90 is on official records and I don't give a shit about what IA sources think about and it proved that it Outran with heaps and bound and fairly comparable in outgunning too.Read the report it says it cleary got edge on mobility while firepower is more or less comparable and again missile firing capability of Arjun MK2. diminished that edge

Show the recent CAG report to that fucking rabbit.

Yes @sancho when I read about Arjun being better than T-90. I asked someone in IA who knows this in and out and his answer was that Arjun is better than T-72 and a good Tank but is not better than T-90. He also said that the there are fake news circulated and IA cannot respond to those news. He had no hesitation when he said so. I believe him and I cannot disclose but he was in very important position at that time and knew this in and out.

Yeah yeah,shove it up your arse you idiot.

 

[MilSpec]

Hi,

Please edit offensive language

 

[Krate M]

@sancho @indianrabbit If arjun tank is better than t72 then why are the production lines lying idle? Why still there is not a major order for arjun? Why we still have old version of t72 (non upgraded ) still in use while the arjun line has been stopped, not even talking about mk2 which is better than t90.

 

[Sine Nomine]

As specs say Arjun is better then T-90, then we go on and just say there may be something else we don't know and IA knows and that's why they would say T-90 is better but i think and you are also sure that T-72 is nothing Against Arjun it will be better to upgrade T-72 using Arjun tech what you guys say about it. @sancho @eowyn

 

[Black Widow]

As specs say Arjun is better then T-90, then we go on and just say there may be something else we don't know and IA knows and that's why they would say T-90 is better but i think and you are also sure that T-72 is nothing Against Arjun it will be better to upgrade T-72 using Arjun tech what you guys say about it. @sancho @eowyn

T72 is old platform. Even updated they are old machine (most batches are build 10 year ago).. So its better to phase them out and replacing them with Arjuna MK I and II .

More over our dearest brother sancho is against domestic production.. He likes Import..

@sancho @indianrabbit If arjun tank is better than t72 then why are the production lines lying idle? Why still there is not a major order for arjun? Why we still have old version of t72 (non upgraded ) still in use while the arjun line has been stopped, not even talking about mk2 which is better than t90.

Arjuna is not only better than T72 rather it is better than T90. If you go by specs, It is world class Tank..

But our corrupt procurement department need Gandhi Jee.. Without Gandhiji nothing work..

 

[Sine Nomine]

T72 is old platform. Even updated they are old machine (most batches are build 10 year ago).. So its better to phase them out and replacing them with Arjuna MK I and II .

More over our dearest brother sancho is against domestic production.. He likes Import..

This is old desi thinking found on both sides of border that imported is better even the same product made by desis is selling like hot cake in foreign countries

 

[sancho]

Yes @sancho when I read about Arjun being better than T-90. I asked someone in IA who knows this in and out and his answer was that Arjun is better than T-72 and a good Tank but is not better than T-90. He also said that the there are fake news circulated and IA cannot respond to those news. He had no hesitation when he said so. I believe him and I cannot disclose but he was in very important position at that time and knew this in and out.

Yeah, kept that in mind. Any chance that you can get his (inofficial) point of view about the MK2 upgrade?

@sancho @indianrabbit If arjun tank is better than t72 then why are the production lines lying idle? Why still there is not a major order for arjun? Why we still have old version of t72 (non upgraded ) still in use while the arjun line has been stopped, not even talking about mk2 which is better than t90.

Only because Arjun is better than the T72s, doesn't mean that the life of the T72s is over now. They even get upgrades and will remain in use for quiet some time. And there are orders for Arjun, just not in the high numbers we would like to see, but that's a matter of the customer and what requirements he has, but with even DRDO now hoping on FMBT, why should IA go for large orders of Arjun MK2 and not insist on the newer development. I only hope that the government will put IA on top of the new development and make them responsible too, only then they will commit themselfs for to the project and only then DRDO will develop something good from the start and not only after several upgrades, that are poorly attached to the initial design.

As specs say Arjun is better then T-90, then we go on and just say there may be something else we don't know and IA knows and that's why they would say T-90 is better but i think and you are also sure that T-72 is nothing Against Arjun it will be better to upgrade T-72 using Arjun tech what you guys say about it.

I was always liked the Tank Ex idea and would love to see how the T72 chassis would look with the Arjun MK2 turret, but IA rejected that, the question is why? Costs can play a role, since it can be a waste to pay so much for a new turret, when the base of the tank doesn't have too much life left, but I'm just guessing here, don't know what the reasons of IA were.

 

[Hulk]

Yeah, kept that in mind. Any chance that you can get his (inofficial) point of view about the MK2 upgrade?



Only because Arjun is better than the T72s, doesn't mean that the life of the T72s is over now. They even get upgrades and will remain in use for quiet some time. And there are orders for Arjun, just not in the high numbers we would like to see, but that's a matter of the customer and what requirements he has, but with even DRDO now hoping on FMBT, why should IA go for large orders of Arjun MK2 and not insist on the newer development. I only hope that the government will put IA on top of the new development and make them responsible too, only then they will commit themselfs for to the project and only then DRDO will develop something good from the start and not only after several upgrades, that are poorly attached to the initial design.



I was always liked the Tank Ex idea and would love to see how the T72 chassis would look with the Arjun MK2 turret, but IA rejected that, the question is why? Costs can play a role, since it can be a waste to pay so much for a new turret, when the base of the tank doesn't have too much life left, but I'm just guessing here, don't know what the reasons of IA were.

@sancho I do not have a chance to get an update, since he only talks in person and I am not going to travel to India before 2016. Additionally, he is very reserved about disclosing anything, hard to get anything out. He gave me some hint about Dhanush at that time, but I only understood it when I saw the news. He told me this "We have a clear roadmap for Arty guns and I am sure in 2 years we will sort out everything". He told me that they were happy with Dhanush but also said Dhanush is actually slightly inferior to Bofors.

 

[MilSpec]

Not trying to malign any professional sources, but In my experience personal prejudices comes up with Military operators as well. I have come across, 21 drivers who claimed they can hunt down anything in the sky, and m29 drivers claiming the machine was the "sliced bread" for the sky. Being engineers we learn to look at actual capabilities from testing not from testimonials, although they help.
I have seen crpf complain about Insas without knowing(or forgotten) how to shoulder the thing.

So dikhavo pe mat jao, apni akal lagao....

@sancho @indianrabbit

 

[Badbadman]

Show the recent CAG report to that fucking rabbit.



Yeah yeah,shove it up your arse you idiot.

Someone didn't had a nice day.

 

[Krate M]

@sancho because arjun is ready today and can be made now. Also on one hand you don't trust DRDO timeline targets and on the other you are saying that fmbt will come in soon enough to take care of obsolescence of t72? Many t72 cannot be upgraded due to age and wear. Also arjun line is idle and can be used to bring up the force level.

 

[sancho]

Also on one hand you don't trust DRDO timeline targets and on the other you are saying that fmbt will come in soon enough to take care of obsolescence of t72?

No, I said that IA might prefer the FMBT in larger numbers, rather than going for Arjun that doesn't work for them and their tactics. They already stated that they consider it mainly for the desert regions, while the T72s, T90s and obviously FMBT fit their requirements for other regions too.

 

[MilSpec]

No, I said that IA might prefer the FMBT in larger numbers, rather than going for Arjun that doesn't work for them and their tactics. They already stated that they consider it mainly for the desert regions, while the T72s, T90s and obviously FMBT fit their requirements for other regions too.

And why doesn't Arjun Mk2 (58T) work for IA, just curious, Weight I highly doubt is an issue, as heavyweights like Leopard 2 (62.3 T), Challenger 2 (62 T) and M1A2 Abrams (62T) works for everyone else.

may be an OT question, how are those recovery vehicles working out for IA?

 

[Krate M]

@sancho it is funny how arjun designed according to GSQR given by army and modified numerous times based on their demand now does not work for them.
Is this your thinking or army source for this?
Arjun is useful in other terrain too. And logistics can be organized.