Are you Hindu first or Indian first?

[magudi]

Sanatani first akhand bharati second

 

[ranjeet]

Sanatani first akhand bharati second

Mallu with a dream.

 

[Styx]

kidar post kia ha? I think you quoted me in someone else post..check properly

k, I'll play along

 

[bongbang]

Correct, but I think the point of the question is only between religious and nationalistic identity.

Ok, but extreme nationalism and extreme religious feelings are both dangerous for humanity. The world was always affected extreme nationalist and religious people. Majority of the comment here represented extreme nationalism. So we have to remind people time to time they are human also. So that their blind beliefs dont hurt humanity.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

wut? dunno what you're trying to do but, bhai, who created this thread ?

inti bhi nahi pi

Oh bhi woo Dr jamil ne kaha tha Raja asim ne sirf uss ko quote kia ha

 

[ayesha.a]

@ayesha.a this concerned citizen of Hindustan has made a certain claim about "MANY" Indian Muslims giving their religion a priority.....implying that they Love and Support Pakistan.

This is a serious allegation about your community....surely any patriotic Bharati would not support the enemy of Hindustan.

Well, depends on what he means by "many". Is that ten? Hundred? Thousand? What exactly is "many"?

If he is suggesting that the majority of Indian muslims support Pakistan, then he is wrong, no two ways about that. If that were true, Pakistan could destroy India in any war - because having 200 million sympathetic collaborators is a dream come true for any military planner. India would crumble in the face of a Pakistani invasion, if 15% of its population were sympathetic to "the enemy".

I find the question fallacious - muslim or hindu or sikh refers to religious identity/affiliation, and Indian or Pakistani refers to nationalistic affiliation. Why would there be a question of which one you pick first? If that question is posed to hindus, how would they respond? My guess is that they (most of them, anyway) would find the question ridiculous.

You are right, no patriotic Indian would support an enemy of the state. Patriotism and nationalism are two very different things. At least it is so in India, which by make-up is religiously neutral.

BTW, even if somebody holds her religious identity more important than her nationalistic one - why would she love and support Pakistan? It's not like Pakistan is the torch bearer or guardian of Islam, is it? Pakistan too is a nation, not an official representative of the religion. If there is a war between Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, whom would a patriotic, muslim Pakistani support? Answer that, and you will know the answer to your question.

 

[Styx]

Oh bhi woo Dr jamil ne kaha tha Raja asim ne sirf uss ko quote kia ha

haan obviously, main kaunsa unke lavz aapke muh daal ke aapko gaali de raha tha ?

but I'll clarify anyway.. imo, dr jamil is the chutia, not you.

 

[ayesha.a]

1947 partitions just killed secularism. Allowing muslims to live in India even after giving away Pakistan and BD is the reason I hate Gandhi, Nehru and whoever else supported that move at that time.

What is your suggested alternative? What would you do with the muslims who chose to remain in India than migrate to Pakistan? Exterminate them in concentration camps?

By the way, your choice of wording is casuistic - "allow"? Really? You are not "allowing" muslims to live in India, any more than they are "allowing" you. Muslims and hindus and everybody else are equal partners in the affairs of the nation. So drop your patronizing posture.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

That's an inconvenient question. Yes, it is true that to become a naturalized citizen of another country, they have to take an oath of allegiance to that country, and that country alone. But most people who obtain ciizenships in the west do so not due to any cultural affinity, but for economic reasons. Job prospect, salary etc. There is a saying that you can take an Indian out of India, but you cannot take India out of an Indian.

BTW you are sporting two different flags, so shouldn't you have an answer to that question yourself? What's your take?



I love that song!!!!!!!

Ayesha i already explained this in previous replies. Most of our nationalists are actually jingoists thats why their behaviour will be different than those white British or american or Canadian who adopted multiculturalism and real secularism thats why they will not object if British born Indian wave Indian flag during India vs England match in Lords. They also dont expect you to become totally westernised and adopt western culture and then you will be loyal to Britain or Canada. Thats beauty of their secularism. You will see that even British Muslim openly oppose foreign policies of Britain in Public because its constitution who give them this right and people respect this right but most Indian will say that British Muslim are not loyal to UK. What loyalty to land mean is also different for Indian or white british? Loyalty to Britain mean following their rule of laws, pay taxes, behave nicely without any racism or bigotry towards any group because of his colour/race or religion. Loyalty to Britain dont mean hating any country or its people and pleasing majority white British

Btw i am loyal to Islam and God only which always take the side of justice/equality and speak against injustice and wrong irrespective of who does it. I love my country but my love is not blind

 

[ayesha.a]

I think you did not get it. You dont mind when a British or candian born Indian consider himself Indian first and feel loyalty towards India before Cnada but you feel pain when Indian Muslim or Kashmiri Indian cheers for Pakistan. Why ignore emotional attachment there? Canadian Indian would not be traitor for Canada if he support India over Canada but same is not true for Indian kashmiri lol

That analogy is flawed. The analogue to a British or Canadian born person considering himself to be Indian first, would be an Indian born considering himself to be British or Canadian first, due to her roots. An Indian muslim cheering for Pakistan would be akin to a British muslim cheering for Pakistan/Saudi/Indonesia/Yemen etc.

Either talk about nationhood, or about religion - they are not mutually exclusive, and they are not the same thing.

I think Hindu is not religion , Hindu can be Muslim or Christian, who ever lives in that region.

By that definition all Pakistanis living east of Indus are also hindu, right?

 

[Sam.]

I think Hindu is not religion , Hindu can be Muslim or Christian, who ever lives in that region.

yes , Hinduism is way of life.Evert thing east to Indus river are Hindus.(or used to be)

That analogy is flawed. The analogue to a British or Canadian born person considering himself to be Indian first, would be an Indian born considering himself to be British or Canadian first, due to her roots. An Indian muslim cheering for Pakistan would be akin to a British muslim cheering for Pakistan/Saudi/Indonesia/Yemen etc.

Either talk about nationhood, or about religion - they are not mutually exclusive, and they are not the same thing.



By that definition all Pakistanis living east of Indus are also hindu, right?

They are but history got re written in 1947.

 

[HAIDER]

yes , Hinduism is way of life.Evert thing east to Indus river are Hindus.(or used to be)


They are but history got re written in 1947.

Map please...Boundaries are confusing....some map covers half of Afghanistan...

 

[Sam.]

Map please...Boundaries are confusing....some map covers half of Afghanistan...

Leave it bhai , kahi or troll kare.

 

[Samudra Manthan]

Why Muslim of India/Pakistan should be responsible for what Afghan or Arab invaders did to India or Hindus? Did they got our certificate of approval before doing any such anti-islamic things? Or we approved any forced conversions or destruction of temples for no reasons or looting their wealth..

When Muslims of India take pride in the Islamic history of India what are they taking pride in? The Arabs and Afghan rulers and their kingdoms? Since they claim pride and ownership of that part of history, they also must take the blame for the evil those regimes were. Yes, Indian Muslims once converted approved of forced conversions and participated in destruction of temples and looting Hindu's wealth. Malik Kufar is a fine example of that.

 

[Not So Good]

Its there

ohey yea muje kiss k post meain quote kar dia

Yes there are some flaws in our society no doubt about that
but more than half of the points mentioned by writer in whine list is
you know whin
Btw Muslim mirror is just sooooooo secular, check it out, you certainly would fall in love with it