Anti-Vietnam Sentiment against Vietnamese with Chinese Citizenship living in China

[Aepsilons]

I’m expecting Viet and his buddy to post those pie chart and graphs trying to link Viet and Han together, the all too familiar ones that always get posted on the other Vietnamese forum I once mentioned. Cos thats the true desire of these guys, trying to make a link between Viets and Han.

Read about the Shang Dynasty; there are studies that the people of the Shang were actually related to the Aborigines. Anyways, please read:

http://iis-db.stanford.edu/docs/117/ShangDynasty.pdf

 

[Viet]

Look at the number of posts I've made. I've never read your post until page 4 of this thread.
I'm new here.

Your open hostility to Viet is the only posts of yours I've read. Like I said, it seems remarkably like a Chinese nationalist.


I'm a bit leery of any Asian netizen who adopts the "identity", if you will, of another Asian ethnicity.

P.S. My user name is not really about Nicolas Tesla, the brilliant scientist, but the cool cars and car company that was named after him. I'm a fan of Elon Musk to boot.

ha ha ha ...this poster yoro obviously scans and reads all of my 10,000 + posts, looking for errors. he hates and admires me deeply. I have no clue what he has in mind. either way, in contrast to many posters, I can remember of every single post I made on this forum. even when I tried to insult and trolled someone, testing the Mods´ reactions, their limits.

yeah he can be a chinese nationalist. or terrorist, who knows.

 

[Tesla85]

This theory later was debunk, recent research supports the IQ of Vietnamese is slighly higher than Chinese and the Vietnamese genetic is older than those NEA.

Well, I put Vietnam's IQ to be at about 99-101, but Vietnam is still developing. Look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

I put overseas Vietnamese IQ at about 103-105, i.e. they live in first world conditions, but it seems to be converging towards 105.

I put East Asian IQ at about 105.

China's IQ at 101-103 only because China's still developing. Again, look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

Overseas East Asian IQ is about 107-108, but this is because they are elite immigrants.

But most important, I don't believe IQ is genetic, or rather that the disparities in IQ between groups (races, ethnicities, states, regions) is environmental.

 

[Aepsilons]

ha ha ha ...this poster yoro obviously scans and reads all of my 10,000 + posts, looking for errors. he hates and admires me me deeply. in contrast to many posters, I can remember of every single post I made on this forum. even when I tried to insult and trolled someone, testing the Mods´ reactions, their limits.

Bro, just let it go. You two are both hard headed and proud members, and yet two very important Vietnamese members that make this section very addictive (for me, that is, i don't know about others' view). You both are eloquent and very educated. I have engaged in debate with you as well as @Yorozuya in the past, in various threads, and in various capacities of dialectics. How about you both just agree to disagree. Drop it, move it on.

Both of you are alpha males. Clashing is usually common in alpha-dynamics.

Now...take this as a word of advice from me:

I put East Asian IQ at about 105.

China's IQ at 101-103 only because China's still developing. Again, look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

Overseas East Asian IQ is about 107-108, but this is because they are elite immigrants.

Not to mention the number of patents , on a global scale, are either mostly from East Asian societies or at least from East Asians living in the West. Says a lot. Data don't lie.

 

[Edison Chen]

Reason for the thread is gone because it makes Chinese look bad regardless there is truth in it. It is very common in this forum which known for Pro Chinese.

It is known that Chinese netizens try so hard to connect themselves with Korean and Japanese create a theory called East Asian superior race, and the rest below China is SEA inferior.

This delusional theory which Chinese and Korean kpopper spreading all over internet. This creates an after effect where many SEA netizens try to be part of East Asian superior race And the so called NEA alpha males.

This theory later was debunk, recent research supports the IQ of Vietnamese is slighly higher than Chinese and the Vietnamese genetic is older than those NEA.

Also funny is the Japanese does not want to relate to both Korean and Chinese. Instead they claim relate to SEA.

You are insane. You also have a very deep inferior complex.

 

[Aepsilons]

Also funny is the Japanese does not want to relate to both Korean and Chinese. Instead they claim relate to SEA.

Well Japanese do have a strong D2 haplotype that is common in Japanese males. The D2 is found in South Asians (Sri Lankans, Dravidians, Tamilians, et al). The theorists say that during the primordial epoch, the Aborigines of South Asia traversed through the Tibetal plateau, through Mongolia and into modern day Japan. They then contributed to the Jomon identity of pre-Yayoi Japan. The Yayois (Mongloid looking folks) came to Japan some 3000 years ago from the Chinese mainland (Zhejiang / Jiangsu region) and then had amalgamated and intermixed with the Jomon Japanese. Hence the reason why a Japanese male who may "look" East Asian, but actually has D2 haplotype that is common not in Northeast Asians, but is commonly found in South Asians.

It supports the human migration theory.

So , technically speaking, Japanese are closer to South Asians than say Southeast Asians or Austronesians.

Some Japanese men (pure blooded Japanese) have physical phenotype that are actually very caucasoid, and can easily be mistaken for a South Asian:

Some more Northern Japanese men who don't look very "East Asian" at all. We can pass for Eurasian, or even straight out White.

 

[DaiViet]

Well, I put Vietnam's IQ to be at about 99-101, but Vietnam is still developing. Look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

I put overseas Vietnamese IQ at about 103-105, i.e. they live in first world conditions, but it seems to be converging towards 105.

I put East Asian IQ at about 105.

China's IQ at 101-103 only because China's still developing. Again, look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

Overseas East Asian IQ is about 107-108, but this is because they are elite immigrants.

But most important, I don't believe IQ is genetic, or rather that the disparities in IQ between groups (races, ethnicities, states, regions) is environmental.

Where did you get any source or any support that viet iq is 99 to 101. The pisa test does not say anything about IQ neither China included.

 

[Tesla85]

Sorry to say this, but you sound like another insecure Vietnamese wanting to be Chinese/East Asian. The type that Yorozuya talked about. And Your attempt to look academic also fell terribly short.

Projection.

LOL

No reputable scientists deconstruct DNA into nationality or regional geography. What exactly is 67% SEA "South East Asian" DNA? SEA covers hundred of different ethnic groups with different DNA makeup. A Thai person is genetically different from a Javanese Indonesian. DNA are breakdown by haplogroup, denoted by a specific marker. A South East Asian person can have high 02a or very little 02a, but high 03.

You mean NatGeo Genographic Project? Or the Chinese Genographic Project? LOL

Your Regional Ancestry: Reference Populations

Kinh = 57% NEA + 43% SEA
Chinese = 72% NEA + 28% SEA
Japan = 75% NEA + 25% SEA
Mongolian = 65% NEA + 12% Southwest Asian + 4% Native American + 9% SEA + 6% Northern European

Source: google "national geographic Your Regional Ancestry: Reference Populations"

Ever heard of google? Use it.

(I googled Razib Kahn. He is a student blogger who hasn't even got his degree. Cavalli-Sforza study cluster ethnic group based on linguistics similarity and geographic distance. Not a breakdown of DNA )

Razib Khan is a racist jerk. He used to be a paid blogger for the NY Times, but was fired after he was outed. Having said that he knows genetics.

If that's not bad enough, have a look at this garbage you wrote.

"This could mean proto-Vietnamese are the parents of modern Chinese and Japanese, quite the opposite of what you are trying to project onto Vietnamese generally (genetically), and the motives of Vietnames netizens in particular. Indeed, many geneticists have for decades believed the peopling of both NE Asia and SE Asia came thru Northern Vietnam, vis-a-vis studies on certain key mtDNA and Y-DNA markers."

Almost all academic texts put Vietnamese as Astro-Asiatic group. Actual DNA breakdown will varies depend on sample Some may indeed have Chinese gene markup given the history with China. But no academic ever claimed Vietnamese are parents of modern Chinese and Japanese.

Really?

Southeast Asian Mitochondrial DNA Analysis Reveals Genetic Continuity of Ancient Mongoloid Migrations

Ballinger et al, 1992

The greatest mtDNA diversity and the highest frequency of mtDNAs with HfiaI/HincII morph 1 were observed in the Vietnamese suggesting a Southern Mongoloid origin of Asians.

Source: google "Ballinger 1992 Southeast Asian Mitochondrial DNA Analysis Reveals Genetic Continuity of Ancient Mongoloid Migrations"

Some unsolicited advice: Stop renting white guys. You'll understand then I have no interests in such disturbing behavior. LOL.

 

[DaiViet]

Sorry to say this, but you sound like another insecure Vietnamese wanting to be Chinese/East Asian. The type that Yorozuya talked about. And Your attempt to look academic also fell terribly short.

No reputable scientists deconstruct DNA into nationality or regional geography. What exactly is 67% SEA "South East Asian" DNA? SEA covers hundred of different ethnic groups with different DNA makeup. A Thai person is genetically different from a Javanese Indonesian. DNA are breakdown by haplogroup, denoted by a specific marker. A South East Asian person can have high 02a or very little 02a, but high 03.

(I googled Razib Kahn. He is a student blogger who hasn't even got his degree. Cavalli-Sforza study cluster ethnic group based on linguistics similarity and geographic distance. Not a breakdown of DNA )

If that's not bad enough, have a look at this garbage you wrote.

"This could mean proto-Vietnamese are the parents of modern Chinese and Japanese, quite the opposite of what you are trying to project onto Vietnamese generally (genetically), and the motives of Vietnames netizens in particular. Indeed, many geneticists have for decades believed the peopling of both NE Asia and SE Asia came thru Northern Vietnam, vis-a-vis studies on certain key mtDNA and Y-DNA markers."

Almost all academic texts put Vietnamese as Astro-Asiatic group. Actual DNA breakdown will varies depend on sample Some may indeed have Chinese gene markup given the history with China. But no academic ever claimed Vietnamese are parents of modern Chinese and Japanese.

Austroasiatic is language speaking group, using language to determine relation of an ethnic is out dated method. Google english speaking countries, you will find countries in Africa speaking english and french, do they relate to anglo saxon? Nope.

Language is evolved over time by either conquest of influence or interaction. 200 hundred years from now, you will find Vietnamese language heavy influency by the west, so far the writing system is roman alphabet, and large library of words borrow from western french, cafe, sofa, taxi...etc use as native vietnamese.

 

[Place Of Space]

Well, I put Vietnam's IQ to be at about 99-101, but Vietnam is still developing. Look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

I put overseas Vietnamese IQ at about 103-105, i.e. they live in first world conditions, but it seems to be converging towards 105.

I put East Asian IQ at about 105.

China's IQ at 101-103 only because China's still developing. Again, look at actual IQ tests and PISA scores.

Overseas East Asian IQ is about 107-108, but this is because they are elite immigrants.

But most important, I don't believe IQ is genetic, or rather that the disparities in IQ between groups (races, ethnicities, states, regions) is environmental.

You know, you guys' times was over. I remember some 10 years ago, a lots of American Chinese came back to China / forums to post their American opinions or show their advantage, we had a comprehensive tough argument, then they are quite quiet. You may know how the American ambassador Gary Locke ducked out China. It's strange American Chinese nowadays become more and more pro-China, some of them start to send their children back China entering summer camp.

 

[William Hung]

Look at the number of posts I've made. I've never read your post until page 4 of this thread.
I'm new here.

Your open hostility to Viet is the only posts of yours I've read. Like I said, it seems remarkably like a Chinese nationalist.

Coming up with conclusions based on just a few posts in this thread means that you are making projection, something that you had accused me of doing.

I'm a bit leery of any Asian netizen who adopts the "identity", if you will, of another Asian ethnicity.

P.S. My user name is not really about Nicolas Tesla, the brilliant scientist, but the cool cars and car company that was named after him. I'm a fan of Elon Musk to boot.

Well there’s no point for me to carry on this convo if this is how you rationalise things.

Other Vietnamese, Chinese and other Asian members use account name with foreign words too, do they all make you feel leery too? My screen name is foreign instead of Vietnamese, do you know the reason why I used it or it doesnt matter because as long as its foreign it should make you feel leery? Your screen name “Tesla”, for whatever reason you are using it, is still foreign so does that make you feel leery about yourself too?

From my view, the bottom line is this, you got caught for making a projection, making a wrong assumption about me (that I am Chinese). And instead of just admitting that you were wrong and move on, you are now trying to drag this on and justify yourself by talking how leery my name sound, etc. just so that you don’t need admit that you were wrong. This is actually a common trait in this forum.

I have no interest in such petty squabble and you can have the last words on it.

 

[Viet]

Bro, just let it go. You two are both hard headed and proud members, and yet two very important Vietnamese members that make this section very addictive (for me, that is, i don't know about others' view). You both are eloquent and very educated. I have engaged in debate with you as well as @Yorozuya in the past, in various threads, and in various capacities of dialectics. How about you both just agree to disagree. Drop it, move it on.

Both of you are alpha males. Clashing is usually common in alpha-dynamics.

Now...take this as a word of advice from me:

Not to mention the number of patents , on a global scale, are either mostly from East Asian societies or at least from East Asians living in the West. Says a lot. Data don't lie.

I just post the study of Havard Medical School, and the clown has chosen to personally attack me. I don´t even made a conclusion, just citing the result of the researchers that Taiwanese seafarers came to Vietnam 5,000 years ago. and as per population statistic, mainland Chinese make up 98 per cent of Taiwan population, it is safe to conclude, the settlers were mainland Chinese. If anyone does not agree, he/she may go and protest against the School. here is the url:

Home | HMS

once again, the result in german language, published on a website.
Austronesien: Südseebewohner: Aus Taiwan über Vietnam nach Polynesien? - Spektrum der Wissenschaft

in english:
Reconstructing Austronesian population history in Island Southeast Asia : Nature Communications : Nature Publishing Group

 

[VALKRYIE]

I’m expecting Viet and his buddy to post those pie chart and graphs trying to link Viet and Han together, the all too familiar ones that always get posted on the other Vietnamese forum I once mentioned. Cos thats the true desire of these guys, trying to make a link between Viets and Han.

Posting picture of a language? What do you mean? Or you mean pictures of the people groups that speak Austronesian languages?

It's genetically proofen that Kinh are an admixture between Tai Kadai, Han and Austroasiatic. I can flood this thread with genetic info if that's what you really want.

i am always wondered, physically Vietnamese have a lot similarities with Dayak people in Borneo

apparently Vietnam comes from Indonesia according to this picture

臺灣 - 维基百科，自由的百科全书

Only Cham are related to Austronesian.

Cham

Kinh

Can some friendly Indonesians member here please explain to this guy that the article were specifically talking about the Austronesian people who migrated down south to the SEA islands and that it was not talking about the Han?

BTW @Viet, the Mon-Khmer is a sub-branch of Austroasiatic, and Vietnamese (Vietic) is a sub-branch of Mon-khmer. I hope one day you could eventually accept this, and stop lingering onto your wish that Viet is Han (Sino-tibetan).

Contrary to popular belief, it was first classified as Sino Tibetan, than to Tai Kadai, afterwards to Austroasiatic shifted back to Tai Kadai and after conclusive studies was put back as a sub branch under the Austroasiatic family.

VN vocabulary uses about 70% Classical Chinese (Middle) words from Tang and Song dynasty. 30% words come from Pro Viet Muong which is a mix of Tai Kadai and Austroasiatic. The grammer structure is somewhat similar to Austroasiatic like noun + noun modifying factors but differs greatly because it is a monosyllabic tonal language like Cantonese and has lost many Proto-Austroasiatic phonological and morphological features.

It is nearly 100% isolating, no morphology, no prefixes or suffixes; words never change in sentences as oppose to austroasiatic languages like Khmer.

 

[Aepsilons]

I just post the study of Havard Medical School, and the clown has chosen to personally attack me. I don´t even made a conclusion, just citing the result of the researchers that Taiwanese seafarers came to Vietnam 5,000 years ago. and as per population statistic, mainland Chinese make up 98 per cent of Taiwan population, it is safe to conclude, the settlers were mainland Chinese. If anyone does not agree, he/she may go and protest against the School. here is the url:

Home | HMS

once again, the result in german language, published on a website.
Austronesien: Südseebewohner: Aus Taiwan über Vietnam nach Polynesien? - Spektrum der Wissenschaft

I think the data is referring to the Aboriginal Taiwanese, bro, not the Han settlers who came in later. Remember, bro, that even up until the late 19th century Taiwan was not completely "civilized" by the Chinese. The Hakka Chinese who colonized Taiwan mainly stayed in the coastal areas. The interior of the island was home to the Aborigines -- and they came to Taiwan from the Mainland from 10,000 to 15,000 years ago. This was before the rise of the Han (Sino-Tibetan). Original inhabitants of Mainland China were not the Han, but were the Aboriginal people (Proto-Austronesians).

In fact, the Aborigines of Taiwan was only "pacified" when the Japanese Empire conquered Taiwan. The whole of the island was made to integrate and the interior of the island was completely conquered as well. The aboriginals did wage a war of resistance, but they were systematically put down.

The whole of Taiwan was colonized and civilized only when Japan administered the island. Then the Japanese administration in Taiwan had encouraged the Chinese to colonize the interior of the island, and also encouraged the Aboriginals to intermarry with the Chinese or Japanese.

@Viet --- you want to watch a great movie about Taiwanese Aboriginals? And their struggle to preserve their culture against Japanese colonization ? Check this out.

 

[Shotgunner51]

OMG gorgeous, especially the one in the 3rd pic!
Are they movie talents or some celeb, names please?