Anti Hindi storm brewing in Tamilnadu

[Narashima]

@Ravi Nair should hindi be official?

Hindi is an official language with 21 other languages.

 

[qamar1990]

Hindi is an official language with 21 other languages.

how many official languages??
what is the fuss about??

 

[INDIC]

how many official languages??
what is the fuss about??

22 Official languages.

1.Assamese, 2.Bengali, 3.Bodo, 4.Dogri, 5.Gujarati, 6.Hindi, 7.Kannada, 8.Kashmiri, 9.Konkani, 10.Maithili, 11.Malayalam, 12.Manipuri, 13.Marathi, 14.Nepali, 15.Oriya, 16.Punjabi, 17.Sanskrit, 18.Santhali, 19.Sindhi, 20.Tamil, 21.Telugu and 22. Urdu.

 

[abjktu]

The Bollywood mainly use it because the film industry is mix of Hindi and Urdu and they need Urdu for certain genre of songs, now even Punjabi is used. The Hindi media don't use such language, the popular Hindi newspapers hardly use Persian-English words in their news reports. As for North Indians, we are acquainted with such words but still don't use it either in speech or literature. As I told you many of such Persian words has also been replaced by English equivalents.

just saying..If thats the case,Sanskrit was also an alien language in South India..Old Malayalam has minimal Sanskrit influence and was considered as a dialect of Ancient Tamil....Same for halegannada(old Kannada) also.....Notable Sanskritization happened only around 14-15 century afterwards...
whats the big deal with some Persian loanwords??
Persian words are there in all south Indian languages...Afterall language is just for communication...

 

[Indrani]

The Bollywood mainly use it because the film industry is mix of Hindi and Urdu and they need Urdu for certain genre of songs, now even Punjabi is used. The Hindi media don't use such language, the popular Hindi newspapers hardly use Persian-English words in their news reports. As for North Indians, we are acquainted with such words but still don't use it either in speech or literature. As I told you many of such Persian words has also been replaced by English equivalents.

Bollywood started out all Hindi. Urdu crept in later and finally took over. They do not need Urdu for Hindi films, there is plenty of music which is without any Urdu words. They gave in to Urdu because Hindi was associated with Hinduism and Hinduism was infra dig according to them.

All North Indians (especially Delhiwallas) I know are fond of shero shayari. They have one shayari for ever emotion, every occasion. That also seems to be expression of high culture according to them.

A Historical Sense | OPEN Magazine

Here is one excerpt from the article, though it is about Sanskrit, it may well be applicable to Hindi too.

"The place I grew up in was not just culturally denuded, but—and this is to be expected, for we can only value what we have the means to assess—it held its past in contempt. Urdu was given some token respect—though no one really bothered to learn it—but Sanskrit was actively mocked and despised. It was as if the very sound of the language had become debased. People recoiled from names that were too Sanskritic, dismissing them as lower class: ‘Narindar,’ someone might say, ‘what a driver’s name!’ They preferred Armaan and Zhyra and Alaaya. The Sanskrit teacher in most elite schools was a figure of fun. And people took great joy at having come out of a school, such as The Doon School, say, without having learnt any more Sanskrit than a derisive little rhyme about flatulence.

What was even more dismaying was that very few people in this world regarded Sanskrit as a language of literature. In fact, Sanskrit, having fought so hard historically to escape its liturgical function and become a language of literature and statecraft, had in the India I grew up been confined once again to liturgy. And an upper-class lady, on hearing that you were learning Sanskrit, would think nothing of saying: ‘Oh, I hate all that chanting-shanting.’

Sanskrit was déclassé; it was a source of embarrassment; its position in our English-speaking world reminded me of the VS Naipaul story of the boy among the mighty Mayan ruins of Belize. ‘In the shadow of one such ruin,’ Naipaul writes in The Enigma of Arrival, ‘a Mayan boy (whatever his private emotions) giggled when I tried to talk to him about the monument. He giggled and covered his mouth; he seemed to be embarrassed. He was like a person asking to be forgiven for the absurdities of long ago…’"

just saying..If thats the case,Sanskrit was also an alien language in South India..Old Malayalam has minimal Sanskrit influence and was considered as a dialect of Ancient Tamil....Same for halegannada(old Kannada) also.....Notable Sanskritization happened only around 14-15 century afterwards...
whats the big deal with some Persian loanwords??
Persian words are there in all south Indian languages...Afterall language is just for communication...

As much as you want India to lose its Hindu identity and make it Abrahamic or Islamic, it is not going to work. Sanskrit is the base for all languages in India, including SI.

 

[INDIC]

just saying..If thats the case,Sanskrit was also an alien language in South India..Old Malayalam has minimal Sanskrit influence and was considered as a dialect of Ancient Tamil....Same for halegannada(old Kannada) also.....Notable Sanskritization happened only around 14-15 century afterwards...
whats the big deal with some Persian loanwords??
Persian words are there in all south Indian languages...Afterall language is just for communication...

We have no issue with small amount of Persianized Hindi as long as we have Sanskritized Hindi too, as Sanskrit is the ancestral language of North Indian languages as well as liturgical language, and thus also relates to our identity and we will always look towards Sanskrit for inspiration to develop Hindi language, not some foreign origin Persian or Arabic.

 

[abjktu]

Khariboli developed out of Shauraseni Apabhramsha and so on. We can trace all Indian languages back to Sanskrit.

LOL...
haven't you read old Kannada poems??
Sanskrit influence is there in all Indian languages..Even in High literature Malayalam(once a dialect of Tamil) has now around 80% Sanskrit loan words..but that doesn't means that Malayalam is derived from Tamil..Same for your mother tongue Kannada...

 

[Indrani]

how many official languages??
what is the fuss about??

There is no fuss except some confusion in some Hindi speakers head about Hindi being the national language of India when India has no national language.

 

[abjktu]

sorry,typo..derived from Sanskrit..

 

[Indrani]

LOL...
haven't you read old Kannada poems??
Sanskrit influence is there in all Indian languages..Even in High literature Malayalam(once a dialect of Tamil) has now around 80% Sanskrit loan words..but that doesn't means that Malayalam is derived from Tamil..Same for your mother tongue Kannada...

According to me all Indian languages have derived from Sanskrit. Tamil may be a sister language of Sanskrit or derived from Sanskrit. All Indian languages have the same form of grammatical structuring which is not possible if they had different roots.

 

[abjktu]

We have no issue with small amount of Persianized Hindi as long as we have Sanskritized Hindi too, as Sanskrit is the ancestral language of North Indian languages as well as liturgical language, and thus also relates to our identity and we will always look towards Sanskrit for inspiration to develop Hindi language, not some foreign origin Persian or Arabic.

agreed...Same in malayalam also..we have both Sanskritized and non Sanskritized version(Thani Malayalam)..
We have loan words from Tamil,Sanskrit,prakrit...Persian/Arabic(Muslim dialects),Hebrew/Aramaic(Syrian Christian dialect) and also traces of Portuguese/dutch/English etc etc...

Tamil may be a sister language of Sanskrit or derived from Sanskrit.

Sister language may be,possibility is there...But not derived from Sanskritam...

 

[INDIC]

agreed...Same in malayalam also..we have both Sanskritized and non Sanskritized version(Thani Malayalam)..
We have loan words from Tamil,Sanskrit,prakrit...Persian/Arabic(Muslim dialects),Hebrew/Aramaic(Syrian Christian dialect) and also traces of Portuguese/dutch/English etc etc...

British created a planned controversy by favoring Persianized form of Hindustani in Perso-Arabic script and tried to impose it on Hindus who were in overwhelming majority(85-90%) in entire Hindi belt, it was done to appease the remnant of Mughal/Nawab aristocracy leading to resentment from Hindus giving the feeling of second class treatment to the majority, infact the majority who were 85% of the population had to fight decades of court cases to get Hindi recognized as a provincial language in UP and Bihar, although both Hindi and Urdu were kept as provincial languages. This controversy lead to more Sanskritization of Hindi. Although Hindi literature is traced to Bhakti era poetry of 14th century, the modern literature is traced to tradition started with Bharatendu Harishchandra.

 

[INDIC]

All Indian languages have the same form of grammatical structuring

This look mysterious too how Indo-Aryan(including Sanskrit) and Dravidians have same grammar structure(subject object verb) but different vocabulary while in English, verbs are used in mid of subject and object in a sentence making English very tough to learn for Indians. English is categorized as a fellow Indo-European language of Hindi.

LOL...
haven't you read old Kannada poems??
Sanskrit influence is there in all Indian languages..Even in High literature Malayalam(once a dialect of Tamil) has now around 80% Sanskrit loan words..but that doesn't means that Malayalam is derived from Tamil..Same for your mother tongue Kannada...

Hindi is a direct descedent of Sanskrit through Shauraseni apabhramsha/Prakrit since Prakrit came out of Sanskrit but Prakrit continued to be influenced by Sanskrit throughout history of India continuing the tradition to modern North Indian languages. Sanskrit was the 'refined speech' while Prakrit which means 'natural speech' was the slang form of Sanskrit.

 

[INDIC]

A Historical Sense | OPEN Magazine
Here is one excerpt from the article, though it is about Sanskrit, it may well be applicable to Hindi too.
"The place I grew up in was not just culturally denuded, but—and this is to be expected, for we can only value what we have the means to assess—it held its past in contempt. Urdu was given some token respect—though no one really bothered to learn it—but Sanskrit was actively mocked and despised. It was as if the very sound of the language had become debased. People recoiled from names that were too Sanskritic, dismissing them as lower class: ‘Narindar,’ someone might say, ‘what a driver’s name!’ They preferred Armaan and Zhyra and Alaaya. The Sanskrit teacher in most elite schools was a figure of fun. And people took great joy at having come out of a school, such as The Doon School, say, without having learnt any more Sanskrit than a derisive little rhyme about flatulence.
What was even more dismaying was that very few people in this world regarded Sanskrit as a language of literature. In fact, Sanskrit, having fought so hard historically to escape its liturgical function and become a language of literature and statecraft, had in the India I grew up been confined once again to liturgy. And an upper-class lady, on hearing that you were learning Sanskrit, would think nothing of saying: ‘Oh, I hate all that chanting-shanting.’
Sanskrit was déclassé; it was a source of embarrassment; its position in our English-speaking world reminded me of the VS Naipaul story of the boy among the mighty Mayan ruins of Belize. ‘In the shadow of one such ruin,’ Naipaul writes in The Enigma of Arrival, ‘a Mayan boy (whatever his private emotions) giggled when I tried to talk to him about the monument. He giggled and covered his mouth; he seemed to be embarrassed. He was like a person asking to be forgiven for the absurdities of long ago…’"

Do you know that all Hindi states implement three languages formula as Hindi, English, Sanskrit and Sanskrit is taught in the same way other languages are taught and contain same amount of difficulty level as learning other languages. There is no escaping from studying Sanskrit as there is no other option of third language for us. So, I don't think Sanskrit is degraded when 40% of your population compulsorily studying it in school even if some people try to insult Sanskrit. Anyway, I believe reaching consensus on Sanskrit will far more difficult than reaching a consensus on Hindi for various reasons you know.

 

[Indrani]

Anyway, I believe reaching consensus on Sanskrit will far more difficult than reaching a consensus on Hindi for various reasons you know.

Let us see.