American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

[Mav3rick]

Truth is always there to be seen- Lies needs time- fabrication- planning- saving all lose ends-
Till 23 Dec the "Lie" will be ready-

And I wonder why the report is being prepared at a date which is the last working day for almost 2 weeks after that!

 

[JonAsad]

^^ UAE demands an apology from NATO- in exchange of what?- "Hold of Shamsi"?-
This sh1t is getting old and too obvious-

 

[Developereo]

Such a scenario would represent a significant escalation in the hostile positions taken by both sides, and it would be best to avoid it.

Well, NATO would have to obtain authorization from the UN to violate Pakistani airspace. I am not sure on what basis they would make that case, unless they orchestrate a major false flag operation.

If justified neutrally NATO/ISAF planes should be shoot down..... in such case,
w/o any warning, info.....

Pakistan can not take on NATO militarily. The Pak generals are not weak or stupid; they understand full well the consequences of getting into a shooting match with NATO.

 

[clmeta]

In the recent past it has been observed that whenever Paksitan has been angered by Americans they have persued a more peaceful policy with India. A case in point is MFN which reportedly has Pak army backing.
Lets improve our relations. All other world issues like America, AFghanistan, Iran China and yada yada apart, India and Pakistan should remove mutual suspicions. No one can take advantage of us if we can build some trust.
All the best.

 

[Developereo]

let me propose pure fiction.

say tomorrow US declares war on pakistan. Indian establishment supports pakistan and signs a 100 year defence treaty with Pak,any attack on pakistan will be considered an attack on India and forms a joint military body. Would pakistanis denounce its moral support to terror outfits in India????

There are so many fictional attributes in this scenario. Leaving aside the fact that Pak+India combined is still a cakewalk for America, the fact is that Pak apprehensions about India come in two forms: support for subversive activities within Pakistan, and the Kashmir issue. Your premise implies that India would halt the former so that only leaves Kashmir. And, as long as Kashmiris ask for Pakistani help in their cause, we are obligated to respond. You can classify them as "terrorists" to justify your actions, but we still consider their cause as a legitimate freedom struggle. It goes without saying that all sides should avoid targetting civilians regardless of any pacts.

 

[Jango]

[/COLOR]

I already saw the video.

Why would the Apaches hover over Infantry positions. What he heard was something different or he is conflating two things.

Apaches engage from long distances. Like when Israel takes out Palestinian Militants, the militants don't even hear the Apache before the missile explodes.

I don't belive the DGMO statements because they have lied in the past so there is no reason to believe that they want to improve their image among the Pakistani public so they are using this issue to do so.

Did I say that the Helis hovered above the post?

They were in the Pakistani airspace for a long time.

And do you even know who the DGMO is?

 

[Omar1984]

 

[opps]

Pakistan budges on Bonn meet

Pakistan on Wednesday hinted at the possibility of participating in the coming Bonn Conference on Afghanistan but ruled out any high-level representation on the ground that Afghan soil had been used by North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO) to attack the country in what the Army calls a “deliberate” act of aggression.

Agreeing to consider German Chancellor Angela Merkel's repeated requests for Islamabad's participation, Prime Minister Syed Yusuf Raza Gilani said he would refer the suggestion of having Pakistan's Ambassador in Germany attend the deliberations to the Parliamentary Committee on National Security.

Ms. Merkel called Mr. Gilani to impress upon him the importance of Pakistan's participation at the meeting to make it meaningful. As Mr. Gilani was unwilling to budge on high-level participation, she suggested the Ambassador be permitted to represent Pakistan so that its seat at the table was not left vacant.

In view of bilateral relations and the fact that the German Foreign Minister was among the first to personally call his Pakistani counterpart to express solidarity with Pakistan and condole the death of 24 Pakistan Army soldiers in the NATO firing at Pakistani outposts on Saturday morning, Mr. Gilani agreed to refer the request to the Parliamentary Committee.

Meanwhile, the formal communication to the U.S. asking it to vacate the Shamsi airbase has been sent with December 11 set as the deadline.

Pakistan has released footage of two posts which came under fire from helicopters of the coalition forces in Afghanistan and wanted to know where the NATO casualties were in case there was firing from the Pakistani side.

The Hindu : News / International : Pakistan budges on Bonn meet


Climb down has started soo it will be full circle like raymond davis case.

 

[untitled]

self delete....

 

[Awesome]

Brother, note this:

He went into comprehensive detail about the sequence of events known so far, explaining that a check post code-named Volcano first came under attack at around 15 to 30 minutes after midnight. A nearby check post, code-named Boulder, responded with 12.7 mm anti-aircraft weapons and mortars after the Volcano check post came under attack from gunship helicopters.

The NATO choppers involved in this incident may have been heavily armored.

And NATO forces made sure that communications with the higher command shall not happen. They likely destroyed both checkposts for this reason.

AA guns are not good enough when you have a variety of SAMs at your disposal.

 

[Omar1984]

 

[Jango]

Ok, back to the discussion without going around in circles:

We have the PA facts about what happened - NATO will not accept that it acted 'deliberately', but it will try and provide a 'face saving' explanation for both sides.

An apology, at this point, is likely, and it appears the GoP is willing to return to 'normal' if given an apology.

Comments?

From the statements being given by the civilian government and the military, 'an apology is not enough' statements, it seems the issue may drag down for smoetime.

-NATO supplies blocked permanently, says the FM and Rehman Malik
-Shamsi to be vacated by Dec 11
-Bonn conference bycott
-A official document sent to the UN to see in the matter that US has violated UN mandate, but it just gets regarded as a piece of trash ( Oh, the irony)
-All relations with ISAF/NATO to be reviewed on intelligence, military, political level.

---------- Post added at 12:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:54 PM ----------

Thats because the Osama raid was planned in great detail.

This was a hot pursuit into Pakistan gone wrong.

US and NATO will need to come with a detailed report stating what went wrong.

They will interview the ground commanders, the soliders who took part in the raid, re-interview them for any discrepancies, check facts on the ground.

Its a long and tedious process.

Are you sure this was a hot-pursuit gone wrong?

Explains it all perfectly. The white flag raised by the soldiers at the post, but still gunned down.

The facts from the Pakistani side are established, good enough for me and most of us.

Again, the image says it all.

---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:56 PM ----------

AA guns are not good enough when you have a variety of SAMs at your disposal.

At night, it is difficult to shoot down Apaches with 12.7mm guns, hovering at a distance.

Time has come to issue MANPADS to selected posts, and give a strong message.

The amount of troops has increased in some agencies , according to GOC Peshawar.

 

[Awesome]

In Waziristan where this war is going on, they describe it this way. The bigger chaudhary (Taliban) slaps the smaller chaudhary (Nato). Nato looks around who can it slap, it can't figure anything out, and it slaps a goat (Pakistan)

 

[untitled]

In Waziristan where this war is going on, they describe it this way. The bigger chaudhary (Taliban) slaps the smaller chaudhary (Nato). Nato looks around who can it slap, it can't figure anything out, and it slaps a goat (Pakistan)

I think it as this way. The gnat (Taliban) stings Wolf (NATO). The wolf takes its revenge on the Sheep (Pakistan)

 

[Omar1984]

Pakistan budges on Bonn meet




The Hindu : News / International : Pakistan budges on Bonn meet


Climb down has started soo it will be full circle like raymond davis case.

"The Hindu" doesn't know squat.



Pakistan says decision on Afghanistan conference is final | Pakistan | DAWN.COM