American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

[tvsram1992]

NATO knows how to use pakistani airspace

 

[Areesh]

For those with so much 'faith' in NATO capabilities:

Should we allow Nato free rein to attack and kill people?

The airstrike that killed 24 Pakistani soldiers is just the latest in a series of mistakes that raise doubts about Nato's credibility


Pratap Chatterjee
guardian.co.uk, Tuesday 29 November 2011 08.30 EST


An unmanned Predator drone of the type operating along the Afhanistan-Pakistan border. Photograph: Sipa Press/Rex
Why did Nato forces kill two dozen Pakistani soldiers at a border post in the Mohmand region, some 300 yards across the frontier from Afghanistan early on Saturday morning? The US military claims the attack was in response to hostile fire, and the Pakistanis are demanding proof of that.

There is a very simple explanation of what happened: the US military makes deadly mistakes all the time, and for all its technological wizardry and tremendous firepower, it has very little intelligence on the ground.

"There are many questions that need to be answered," an editorial in the New York Times pronounced:

"Who first fired on the American-Afghan force? Pakistan's army is far too cozy with the Taliban. Were fighters sheltering near the Pakistani outposts? What about Pakistan's claim that the Nato strikes continued for two hours even after Pakistan alerted allied officials? What needs to be done differently going forward?"

In New York and Washington, this is standard fare. We can't trust the Pakistanis, they are with the terrorists. But can we trust Nato or the US military? There are numerous examples of firing on civilians, killing children and even deliberately targeting and assassinating individuals who turn out not to have been the people they were claimed to be. And that is in Afghanistan, a country where the US has easy access.

A US air force investigation into the killing of 23 civilians in Uruzgan province in February 2010 concluded that it was a tragic mistake. "Information that the convoy was anything other than an attacking force was ignored or downplayed" by the Predator crew, whose reporting was "inaccurate and unprofessional", the investigation by a two-star army general reported.

In September 2010 Nato claimed to have killed Muhammad Amin – the alleged Taliban deputy governor of Takhar province in Afghanistan – in a drone strike. Kate Clark, a former BBC correspondent in Kabul who now works for the Afghanistan Analysts Network, and Michael Semple, a Taliban expert at Harvard University, have confirmed that Amin is alive and well and that the dead man was Zabet Amanullah.

Those are just two of the better documented examples: In February 2010 Nato admitted killing 12 civilians in Helmand. The following day it admitted to killing five civilians in Zhari district of Kandahar. Just last week, it admitted killing seven civilians, most of them children, in the same district of Kandahar.

In Pakistan, the US record is even murkier. I work at the Bureau of Investigative Journalism where we have documented the killing of more than 175 children and as many as 600 other civilians inside Pakistan by the CIA.

So before we jump to conclusions that the Mohmand strike was a result of the Pakistani military's relationship the Taliban, we need to ask ourselves a much more basic question: should we be allowing Nato, let alone the CIA, free rein to attack people and kill them – especially when their attacks are based on what is clearly very poor intelligence in the field?

Should we allow Nato free rein to attack and kill people? | Pratap Chatterjee | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

Good article by Pratap Chatterjee. Apparently it looks like living in USA has helped him to see beyond hatred which isn't the case for many here. Good one.

 

[blain2]

Here is some back-peddling on the issue.

"U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid"
U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid - CBS News

Not that things cannot be confused, but it seems there was significant communication between the higher headquarters on both sides while the action was ongoing. Yet despite that, the strikes by Apaches and the AC-130 were carried out.

 

[chava]

this is bound to happen if US comes in, US treats friends worse than enemies

 

[blain2]

this is bound to happen if US comes in, US treats friends worse than enemies

You should beware!

 

[fd24]

Here is some back-peddling on the issue.

"U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid"
U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid - CBS News

Not that things cannot be confused, but it seems there was significant communication between the higher headquarters on both sides while the action was ongoing. Yet despite that, the strikes by Apaches and the AC-130 were carried out.

Goodness me - just read it. Is that why they continued to bomb the sh1t out of the posts - even after they heard it was blue on blue?

I like this comment on the same post at the bottom.

his is completely possible, in that the highest education level of the Taliban is somewhere around the 2nd or 3rd grade level. So, they should be able to out fox our military, the USA leaders without even having to think about it!

 

[VelocuR]

Here is some back-peddling on the issue.

"U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid"
U.S. suspects forces lured into Pakistan raid - CBS News

Not that things cannot be confused, but it seems there was significant communication between the higher headquarters on both sides while the action was ongoing. Yet despite that, the strikes by Apaches and the AC-130 were carried out.

Good to see you back.

Sir, I request you to participate everyday, your few sentences are not enough to know your perspectives and opinions. Being neutral or silence is not helpful.

 

[chava]

You should beware!

no sir.. we are always non aligned

 

[vikrams]

muthafking zionists.......

Blame Israel on Everything

 

[Areesh]

Love the way Pakistanis have attacked NATO facebook page. Good work Pakistanis.

 

[regular]

It is not a matter of IF they figure out something, just watch as they surely WILL fool the public yet again.

Yes! Ure right cuz our public is already so much fool...so they don't need to fool them anymore.Thats why they getting backstabbed from the same ruling elite all the time....

 

[VelocuR]

Love the way Pakistanis have attacked NATO facebook page. Good work Pakistanis.

If anyone is missing this thread, please visit- http://www.defence.pk/forums/general-images-multimedia/143534-nato-terrorist-awareness.html

 

[regular]

Another pack of lies by Nato

http://nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-n...f-lies-by-Nato

Today’s papers carry the news that the Nato Chief has said that the attack on Pakistani soldiers was un-intentional. Very generous of him! Yesterday, I talked to Lt Col Shahid Jan from Peshawar. He had just visited CMH Peshawar to meet the wounded in Salah Post by the US/Nato raid on night of 26 November. This is what he told me.
There were 14 wounded lying in the surgical ward suffering a variety of wounds. He talked to everyone of them and asked them what had happened. The crux of the account of the soldiers and officers was that at about 11pm on 26th Nov a light aircraft came from across the border, flew over the post and fired flares and returned. About half an hour later armed helicopters and light aircraft came. They again fired flares and began firing at the men. They remained in the area for about 5 to 6 hours. During this time, the helicopter kept firing at individual personnel at will. The post had only one 12.7 anti-aircraft gun which opened fire. The gunner was shot. The major on the post took up the gun and began firing at the helicopters. He was fired at again. While changing position he was hit by a rocket or missile. His body was blasted to pieces. Only his name-plate was found. Every one of the men on the post was killed or wounded. They seemed to be in no hurry and going after each individual separately. Having finished the entire post, they went back without any casualty on their part.
And the Nato Chief has the effrontery to say that it was un-intentional.
Now my question is, if for 5 to 6 hours this enemy action was taking place and our ground troops were under such deliberate enemy fire, where was the Army’s reaction and where was the PAF during all this time? I cannot believe that the Corps HQ or the PAF Northern Command in Peshawar did not know what was going on, on the front. If so, both should be disbanded for deliberate incompetence.

AYAZ AHMAD,
Rawalpindi, November 28.

By God , Our Army Chief , our PAF chief and the Civil ruling elites they are all traitors and the innocent blood of our poor soldiers are on their sholders...They realli need to be arrested for treason and must be hung to the wall.....if this happened what U've said above.....

 

[BATMAN]

US military chief declines to apologise for airstrike deaths

Video: US military chief declines to apologise for airstrike deaths - Telegraph

Decline who?

 

[Jango]

ISAF,NATO attacks on Pakistani posts on Afghan border not unintended: DG MO


RAWALPINDI, Nov 29 (APP): Terming the strikes on Pakistani posts by Coalition and International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) force unprovoked act of blatant aggression, Director General, Military Operations, Maj Gen Ishfaq Nadeem said on Tuesday that attacks were not unintended in which all coordination procedures were violated. “The positions of the posts were already conveyed to the ISAF through map references and it was impossible that they did not know these to be our posts,” he said while briefing columnists, defence analysts and television anchorpersons here at GHQ. Chief of General Staff, Lt General Waheed Arshad was also present during the briefing.

The DG MO said that there were four border communication centres to coordinate operations against militants but,unfortunately, all Standard Operating Procedures (SOPs) were violated by ISAF and North Atlantic Tearty Organization (NATO) on the night of attack.
The area where the attacks were carried out was already cleared of the militants by Pakistani forces and there was not any cross border movement of terrorists from Pakistan to Afghan territory, he added.

The DG MO apprised that prior to this incident, there had been three attacks which were carried out from across the border in 2008, 2010 and 2011 killing 14 Pakistani soldiers and injuring another 13 troops.

“No information regarding inquiry of these attacks was shared or provided to us despite our repeated requests and when provided, it was inaccurate and incomplete,” he added. Giving details of the incident, he said after the midnight on November 26, 2 to 3 helicopters appeared and started engaging Volcano post breaking down all communication systems.
In response, the Boulder post engaged helicopters with anti aircraft guns and all available weapons. The helicopter also attacked this post.
He said all channels of coordination methods were immediately activated. “We informed them about the attack. But, the helicopters reappeared and also engaged the Boulder post.”

In both attacks, 24 soldiers including two officers embraced Shahadat while 15 others sustained injuries, he added.
Responding to a question, regarding response, he said that army deployment on the Western border was not against ISAF and NATO forces rather it was against militants.

When asked why did the ISAF and NATO attack on Pakistani posts and what type of advantage they wanted to get, he said that people could better analyze in the backdrop of environment emerged after the May 2 incident. To a query, he said the response of the Government was adequate and mentioned the Defence Cabinet Committee (DCC) meeting and vacation of Shamsi airbase.

About Pakistan Air Force response, he said the situation was not clear till morning so considering on ground situation which was not clear, the PAF was not asked to respond. He said that the President, Prime Minister and Defence Minister were informed about the incident on the next morning after situation became clear.

To another question, he said that Army also takes deaths of civilians in Drone attacks very seriously and said the attacks should be stopped as these were proving counter-productive and increasing militancy.

Regarding Afghan media reports about shelling on Afghans from Pakistani side, he said that Afghan media reports were totally incorrect and there was no truth in them. The Afghan government officials have agreed that the information shared by locals with them was totally wrong.

Associated Press Of Pakistan ( Pakistan's Premier NEWS Agency ) - ISAF,NATO attacks on Pakistani posts on Afghan border not unintended: DG MO

When your DGMO says that, you know something is really going on.