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American attack aftermath: Pakistan declares attack a 'plot'

Nope...... Everybody is trying to shovel it our throat that it was indeed a Pakistani mistake and Pakistan is responsible for the attack.

I dont agree with that.. Its just that Pakistani media is coming out with Pakistani side of the story and NATO media with its own. None of it is the official version yet (atleast on the NATO side). So the shoveling down the throat is the fact that there are arguements and counter arguments that exist which can not be accepted/refuted till the official versions of both sides of the story are out.
 
But The Sunday Times has learned that the two checkpoints hit by the air strikes were in fact constructed on Afghan soil, in Kunar province’s Khas Kunar district between the villages of Shaley and Shrunkey.
:eek:


This reporting of SUNDAY TIMES has proved that it is pure propaganda.. The checkpost was in Mohamand Agency which is inside Pakistan.
SO SHUT UP SUNDAY TIMES! :close_tema:
 
Did you not want a few pages back, news from 'any' source ? Suddenly if a source comes and you deem it uncredible ?

If you haven't read its Sunday Time learned.... Not NATO or Pakistani official..... Or perhaps they are following that theory of Afghanistan border starts at Attock
 
Why are we even bothering to justify?

Even if the Pakistani soldiers were drunk out of their minds and shooting randomly in the air, it is still the NATO aircraft's fault for being2.5km inside Pakistani airspace.

Yup don't know why are we even trying to answer the justifications by Indian members.

Worst part is it is still only Pakistanis who are taught hatred against India and the situation isn't the same vice versa according to Indian members here. :hitwall:

---------- Post added at 12:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:09 PM ----------

Who's justifying.. Everyone is just pushing the idea of waiting for the official version of the events to be published instead of dreaming up theories and unfeasible retaliatory options..

Apparently it is Indians who are willing to accept any official version coming from NATO(not Pakistan). No matter what it is. Even if they say that all 28 soldiers got killed by their own guns somehow.
 
Three different theories. One says the attack was in hot pursuit of terrorists, the second says it was retaliatory (& in defense) after the Afghan troops were fired upon, & the third says the air strikes did not take place in Pakistan at all, they took place in Afghanistan. :woot:
 
May they rest in peace...

nato_2067946b.jpg
 
Other sources, who refused to be named because of the sensitivity of the subject, blamed the killings on the close relationship between elements of Pakistan’s security forces, such as the country’s Frontier Corps, and the insurgents based on Pakistani soil.

“The US could be hiding the fact that sometimes it can be quite difficult to discern Talibs from Frontier Corps given they often work closely together on operations and that one may be wearing the uniform of the other,” said one source.


Complete BS. Talibs don't use uniforms. FC guys have a very clearly identified Khaki color or black color uniform. Plus, both of these posts were being manned by FC as well as soldiers from a regular AJK regiment.

All the border posts are on top of mountain peaks, Pakistani flags are hosted on them, locations on maps are provided to opposite side, GPS coordinates are provided, the structure of these posts are very clear and from far away they can be very easily identified as military check posts.

Complete at utter BS, they are coming up with baseless theories and sources to justify their killings, which was deliberate.

They knew the exact location of these posts, they attacked it deliberately and knowingly.
 
Other sources, who refused to be named because of the sensitivity of the subject, blamed the killings on the close relationship between elements of Pakistan’s security forces, such as the country’s Frontier Corps, and the insurgents based on Pakistani soil.

“The US could be hiding the fact that sometimes it can be quite difficult to discern Talibs from Frontier Corps given they often work closely together on operations and that one may be wearing the uniform of the other,” said one source.


Complete BS. Talibs don't use uniforms. FC guys have a very clearly identified Khaki color or black color uniform. Plus, both of these posts were being manned by FC as well as soldiers from a regular AJK regiment.

All the border posts are on top of mountain peaks, Pakistani flags are hosted on them, locations on maps are provided to opposite side, GPS coordinates are provided, the structure of these posts are very clear and from far away they can be very easily identified as military check posts.

Complete at utter BS, they are coming up with baseless theories and sources to justify their killings, which was deliberate.

They knew the exact location of these posts, they attacked it deliberately and knowingly.

May Be............. US/NATO troops are COLOUR BLIND.. :woot:
 
Well Indians aren't logical from any direction. Haha for the logical and less emotional part. Check last few pages and the stories Indian members have come up with to "justify" this incident. Right now they are looking to catch anything coming from NATO. No matter how difficult the catch is.:)

Why are you describing which is very obvious ??


Just leave this topic, let them say whatever they want, its useless to argue with them.


Concentrate on the topic / discussion being done.
 
Well Indians aren't logical from any direction. Haha for the logical and less emotional part. Check last few pages and the stories Indian members have come up with to "justify" this incident. Right now they are looking to catch anything coming from NATO. No matter how difficult the catch is.:)

Same can be said about Pakistanis who are latching on to everything coming out of Pindi without questioning the basics and even making lame excuses for gaps in the story like
1. How come hekis and jets ingressed without being tracked by the Pakistani radar.. I dont buy the BS about terrain and how it is difficult to track a low flying heli.. Army is not sitting there to do easy jobs only
2. How come PAF didnt get scrambled
3. How come 2 hours long assault continued without any air support provided to the 2 posts
4. How come after the attack on the 1st post, the second post was also caught unaware
5. How come low flying helicopters continued the assault for over 2 hours without taking any damage

Hence, as I said, every thing is just speculation (except the unfortunate deaths of 28 soldiers).. We will get to know the answers to some/all these questions only when both the official versions are out
 
Any takers for this story?

S Attack on Pakistani Outpost - What Really Happened

11/27/2011

Bismillah ar-rahman ar-raheem.

Midnight, on the 26th of November, a Pakistan Army post, manned by soldiers from the Azad Kashmir Regiment, detected movement in a valley below and adjacent to their check-post. The checkpoint is 2 km inside Pakistani territory and located on high ground. After identifying the movement as armed individuals via night vision devices, spot light and flares, the soldiers opened fire. Shortly, they came under attack of an AH-64 Apache helicopter, resulting in the loss of 19 lives.

Gleaning from the ISAF press release, it seems that these unidentified individuals were US soldiers infiltrating well into Pakistani territory, without any prior notice to Pakistani counterparts. Furthermore, there is no official operation indicated by the occupation forces, so this was likely a classified operation. The Pakistanis have given coordinates of all Pakistani posts / bases in the region and, given the GPS and other navigation devices available to NATO, it is impossible that the occupation forces did not know that they were: 1) inside Pakistani territory and 2) where this base was located.

This leads to the conclusion that at some point in the past, the US military has received permission to expand the war into Pakistan and to "increase the heat temperature" so to speak.

Continuing with our narrative, the attacked troops called regional command for help, and a quick reaction force was send to aid them. These were then attacked by A-10s of the occupation forces. The battle lasted for at least an hour and resulted in the death of not only the Pakistani forces engaged but also those asleep in the compound. Total death toll stands at 24-28.


Given that the battle lasted that long and that US forces have both coordinates and high tech equipment to note their position, and being aware of the location of the Pakistani base 2km inside Pakistani territory, the attack is obviously deliberate. Given both that the A-10s, which are USAF assets and AH-64s (Army / Marine) assets were involved, this was a predetermined operation aimed, coldly calculated to have specific objects.

An educated guess of those objectives are as follows. The United States want to destabilize Pakistan or to directly confront her. Their supply is well stocked for the winter and they have developed alternative routes to Afghanistan. They now wish to create political space to go into Pakistan. A destabilized Pakistan would allow them this opportunity.

At present, the mood within the Pakistan Army, particularly junior / mid-tier officer ranks would lend credence to the possibility that the US may have achieved its objective. What the rank and file want is a punitive punishment of the US. Kayani cannot accomplish this without losing military procurements and showing that the political establishment has no effective power. On the other hand, if he does not react appropriately, he loses face with his men who are on the verge of a mutiny. This is thus a lose-lose situation for Pakistan and a win-win scenario for the US.

Any Pakistanis reading this would be sincerely advised to calm down, there will be enough time to return the favor to the Americans, insh'Allah. Do not act in haste, do not lose your discipline. Actions should not be taken in haste, calm down, relax. We shall deal with them insh'Allah in a time and location of our choosing and not theirs.

Grande Strategy

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakistans-war/143321-us-attack-pakistani-outpost-what-really-happened.html
 
Same can be said about Pakistanis who are latching on to everything coming out of Pindi without questioning the basics and even making lame excuses for gaps in the story like
1. How come hekis and jets ingressed without being tracked by the Pakistani radar.. I dont buy the BS about terrain and how it is difficult to track a low flying heli.. Army is not sitting there to do easy jobs only
2. How come PAF didnt get scrambled
3. How come 2 hours long assault continued without any air support provided to the 2 posts
4. How come after the attack on the 1st post, the second post was also caught unaware
5. How come low flying helicopters continued the assault for over 2 hours without taking any damage

Hence, as I said, every thing is just speculation (except the unfortunate deaths of 28 soldiers).. We will get to know the answers to some/all these questions only when both the official versions are out

Would have answered the "gaps" in the Pakistani story even if they have been answered very comprehensively in this thread. But first looking at your flags and then as the Taimi said the intentions of you guys is obvious so let's leave it for now. Thanks for being "logical". My foot.
 

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