Air Force Question Thread
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fatman17
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DCAT is part and parcel of CSS - Sargodha.
Imran Khan
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pakistan can enter in 5th genration in 2020.before that there is no chance.resorces of pakistan not allow for 5th genration planes enter in PAF
sohailbutt
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Imran bhai i doubt that coz of 2 major reasons:
1. Lockheed is going to produce an estimated 3500 F-35's for the potential customers, which include Turkey, US, Britain and other countries as well, so once there orders r fulfilled then we may recieve our jets if US allows us to have them (If we order F-35's which I doubt due to the price tag)!!!
2. Till now the are only aircraft in the 5th generation category are, Raptor and F-35, one thing is for sure US will never sell us Raptor, the other thing even if it sells us F-35 it may be we have to wait 15 years to get our hands on the first one!!!
In my view, despite our purchase of F-16's (Block 52's and modifications to the older F-16's), J-10's, and JF-17's we should have fighters which can really be a force to reckon with, my point here is we have an option for 18 more F-16's it would be best for PAF to get 18 F-16 block 60's, I would love to see more of these block 60 aircraft with PAF.
1. Lockheed is going to produce an estimated 3500 F-35's for the potential customers, which include Turkey, US, Britain and other countries as well, so once there orders r fulfilled then we may recieve our jets if US allows us to have them (If we order F-35's which I doubt due to the price tag)!!!
2. Till now the are only aircraft in the 5th generation category are, Raptor and F-35, one thing is for sure US will never sell us Raptor, the other thing even if it sells us F-35 it may be we have to wait 15 years to get our hands on the first one!!!
In my view, despite our purchase of F-16's (Block 52's and modifications to the older F-16's), J-10's, and JF-17's we should have fighters which can really be a force to reckon with, my point here is we have an option for 18 more F-16's it would be best for PAF to get 18 F-16 block 60's, I would love to see more of these block 60 aircraft with PAF.
Imran Khan
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i thing they not sell pakistan F22 or F35 more then 25 years. whats new plane we get from USA after F16.nothing they scared to sell new waipens to pakistan .there is so many resans first of all if happen same like IRAN in pakistan extremists take power.pakistan is close friend and aly of chaina they scared to TOT of new waipens to chaina . and also our nekes .these F16 now we get when F16 not like 80s and 90s.persnaly i not trust on USA .better we go with chaina france or sweden for modren planes.what you think mr sahilbutt?
IceCold
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If US places sactions on pakistan, you can say goodbye to sweden. Why because many compotents in the Gripen are of US origin and hence too many strings attached to it.
France, the option is there provided india does not go for the rafale, because if they do, french would never want to upset their costumer, besides the cost factor with the french equipment is also there. They are too high of a price for PAF to have in significant numbers.
China well we can always rely on to them interms of military hardware, but they are still lacking behing years as compared to the western tech and would require few more years and maybe a decade to reach the same level of success as that of the west.
sohailbutt
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Imran Bhai thank you for asking me to give my views, here is what I think, after reading ur and IceCold's post:
I'm damn sure US will not place sanctions on Pakistan in the coming 10 years, because of the current situtation they are in, they r a lost cow at the moment, they r simply stuck in Afganistan and Iraq they would never sanction us especially now when they can start a war with Iran at any time, they need us more than ever, it can be justified by their increasing so called "MILITARY AND FINANCIAL AID", and one more thing PAF will not go for gripen fighters cause they have already selected F-16's over them, so eliminate gripen from the equation.
You mentioned rafale, if India selects it as the MRCA winner, I know one thing for sure that PAF will not be purchasing the same jet to counter the rafale threat, PAF will be looking for a real kick *** fighter which I think would be either Eurofighter or US F-18 SuperHornet (Eurofighter most likely to be the choice), I know that the price tag is above $100 million per piece for all three jets, but PAF does not need them in very high numbers 50 of either of these 2 jets eurofighter or f-18 can kick some serious rafale ***, cause we know one thing "if our brave pilots can kick *** in gulf war without any loss aginst Israeli pilots, then i think they can do anything, just think wut they can do with new block 52's or possibly in the future eurofighter or superhornet".
Regarding Chinese fighters,
, I completely agree with u, we know Chinese avaiation industry lacks in technology when compared to Western Countries that's why I would suggest that we do buy Chinese jets like the J-10 and the co-produced JF-17's but we should keep some new Western tech with us as well, cause if in the future we buy either eurofighter or superhornet as a response to MRCA, we can use one of those jets, study it and then use it to improve J-10's or any fighters with us at that time, this will reduce the technology gap between the Chinese and Westerns Jets but again, I would recommend that PAF should not keep all of its eggs in one basket (NO offence here to anyone by this statement), they should have Western jets with Chinses jets at the same in PAF.
I'm damn sure US will not place sanctions on Pakistan in the coming 10 years, because of the current situtation they are in, they r a lost cow at the moment, they r simply stuck in Afganistan and Iraq they would never sanction us especially now when they can start a war with Iran at any time, they need us more than ever, it can be justified by their increasing so called "MILITARY AND FINANCIAL AID", and one more thing PAF will not go for gripen fighters cause they have already selected F-16's over them, so eliminate gripen from the equation.
You mentioned rafale, if India selects it as the MRCA winner, I know one thing for sure that PAF will not be purchasing the same jet to counter the rafale threat, PAF will be looking for a real kick *** fighter which I think would be either Eurofighter or US F-18 SuperHornet (Eurofighter most likely to be the choice), I know that the price tag is above $100 million per piece for all three jets, but PAF does not need them in very high numbers 50 of either of these 2 jets eurofighter or f-18 can kick some serious rafale ***, cause we know one thing "if our brave pilots can kick *** in gulf war without any loss aginst Israeli pilots, then i think they can do anything, just think wut they can do with new block 52's or possibly in the future eurofighter or superhornet".
Regarding Chinese fighters,
, I completely agree with u, we know Chinese avaiation industry lacks in technology when compared to Western Countries that's why I would suggest that we do buy Chinese jets like the J-10 and the co-produced JF-17's but we should keep some new Western tech with us as well, cause if in the future we buy either eurofighter or superhornet as a response to MRCA, we can use one of those jets, study it and then use it to improve J-10's or any fighters with us at that time, this will reduce the technology gap between the Chinese and Westerns Jets but again, I would recommend that PAF should not keep all of its eggs in one basket (NO offence here to anyone by this statement), they should have Western jets with Chinses jets at the same in PAF.
Imran Khan
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so we have to wait and see until india select any jet .then we show our cards. but i also say same like my last post pakistann can't trust USA .we trust them so many time but they always same use us and forget.and my brother if they sanctions us after 10 years then we buy speare parts from black market same like before ? 
for jets also we have to see multy nation jets not from one country even chaina.but we must enter chaines new 5th genration jet program.
for jets also we have to see multy nation jets not from one country even chaina.but we must enter chaines new 5th genration jet program.asifhabib7
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Assalamualaikum to all of u
regarding airforce my question is that would jf17 with the help of awac be able to take on mki effectively?
2.what is the difference between the rc400, mica and chinese avionics in terms of performance.....and hv v signed the mica and rc400 deal with france for our jf17?
i would love to see some expert comments on the above questions particularly from fatman sir,icecold sir,blain sir.mastan sir and from webmaster sir... thx
regarding airforce my question is that would jf17 with the help of awac be able to take on mki effectively?
2.what is the difference between the rc400, mica and chinese avionics in terms of performance.....and hv v signed the mica and rc400 deal with france for our jf17?
i would love to see some expert comments on the above questions particularly from fatman sir,icecold sir,blain sir.mastan sir and from webmaster sir... thx
MastanKhan
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Asifhabib,
It is unfair to compete JF 17 w / awacs support to the SU 30. There is no comparison at this time. SU 30 is on a totally different pleateu----there has to be some fairness given in comparison of two machines. You are not talking about DACT are you instead of real combat
You cannot compare a Chevrolet Corvette to a Honda civic and specially a plane that has not even entered service yet---that is a big no no.
Now between the next 3 to 5 years from now, when all the euipment has matured and a much more powerful engine is available for the JF 17, we can say that we do have a platform that can compete with all the other planes in the IAF arsenal except for the SU 30.
Su 30 MKI is a monster of a plane---PAF will have the blk 52 with the amraams to match upto it. Remember in combat, a pilot makes the big difference, but if one pilot is not even within the firing range of his weapons and the opponent has a first and second shot at their discretion---how can you compete.
You have to provide the pilots with a comparable equipment and then expect them to perform. Otherwise, you are sending them on suicide missions.
As for the equipment Mark will be able to answer that question better.
It is unfair to compete JF 17 w / awacs support to the SU 30. There is no comparison at this time. SU 30 is on a totally different pleateu----there has to be some fairness given in comparison of two machines. You are not talking about DACT are you instead of real combat
You cannot compare a Chevrolet Corvette to a Honda civic and specially a plane that has not even entered service yet---that is a big no no.
Now between the next 3 to 5 years from now, when all the euipment has matured and a much more powerful engine is available for the JF 17, we can say that we do have a platform that can compete with all the other planes in the IAF arsenal except for the SU 30.
Su 30 MKI is a monster of a plane---PAF will have the blk 52 with the amraams to match upto it. Remember in combat, a pilot makes the big difference, but if one pilot is not even within the firing range of his weapons and the opponent has a first and second shot at their discretion---how can you compete.
You have to provide the pilots with a comparable equipment and then expect them to perform. Otherwise, you are sending them on suicide missions.
As for the equipment Mark will be able to answer that question better.
asifhabib7
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thx mastan sir for making it clear
Imran Khan
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when we get tanker of air refuleing wich plane refule by it ?
f-16
JF17
F7PG
A5
MIRAGE
f-16
JF17
F7PG
A5
MIRAGE
True, however in my humble opinion DACT is not the responsibility of the CCS alone. They do much more than training aircraft on DACT profiles.
The PAF sqns go through yearly training camps where aircraft of various types from different sqns are pitched against each other for DACT. CCS participation in many of these exercises is on the basis of organizers, umpires etc.
Speaking of CCS, the latest batch of the combat commanders from CCS just graduated.
http://www.app.com.pk/photo/photo_lib/19-04-2008/2b68f20401733353b9cd94d271dc9437.jpg
For those unaware, the CCS is Pakistan Air Force's Weapons School similar to USAF's Warfare Center (Nellis).
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