Air Commodore (R) Kaiser Tufail explains the Su-35S offer.

[bdslph]

SU35 can be edited by Pakistan when on order
and also no need to buy alot start small 8 planes and then add slowly

 

[black-hawk_101]

No fault in Sukhoi , our engineers have already approved it

Rafale is no match for Sukhoi-35, they had political aspirations to build some connections with french it was political decision

We had bad taste after the mirage saga with french , so we need better more lethal plane

• We did not get replacement from French for engines
• No spare parts
  
• And they sold us a plane that had no spare parts it was a pain for Pakistan Airforce to maintain it
  
• All their deliveries were late

French also have bad history with backing out on deal just look at the Mistral deal !!!! They are flip floppers you pay them money they eat their Wine and cheeze and then they do not deliver

After Pakistan went nuclear in response to India , french stopped all cooperation to maintain the Mirages was a backstab of epic proportions

Sukhoi serves us well - RUSSIA has 100% good history for military order deliveries


Russian:

On time delivery of engines
On time delivery of helicopters for Pakistan , transport
On time construction of steeles mills in Pakistan
2 Billion dollar gas line project with Pakistan (Economic deal)

These deals will enable that PAC might assemble the RD-93B engines locally with Russian help.

I think Pak Steel mill will going back in Russian hands?

 

[Econofpak]

Rather than being poetic and subjective about Su-35's greatness, we should take a deep breath and do its
Capabilities-to-Cost analysis with JF-17 (Block 3 in +2018) and F-16s (Single engine). It's better, but how much in % terms? In War, how many planes we are expected to lose per day? Can we afford to have only few planes against 7 times bigger enemy? Real pain for India is our ability to raise JF-17 sqdns quickly, and wouldn't mind how many fancy and expensive foreign planes we have for showing off. Why China is important? Because it can replicate or match any foreign technology at 10th or 100th of a cost. Moral of the story: Any country other than China is a distraction. We should analyze ideas rationally irrespective of our emotions & tastes. Finally choices are mutually exclusive: we do one thing at the cost of other.

 

[Econofpak]

- In an event of war we can maintain effective supply-chain only with China.

- In man-over-machine principle we should consider flying hours on each plane, which is still a key. As Pierre Sprey mentions better pilots with inferior planes beat opponents (with inverse relation) all the time.

 

[war&peace]

as much as i want to see SU-35 with PAF i can't see it happening for 2 basic reasons.
1. money (where in the hell is the finances going to come from?)
2. India (100% they will lobby hard against it).
I think the best PAF can hope for is Russia improving the JF-17 with better avionics and a better engine. I doubt we get anything more then that.

Both of these are not big issues if PAF decides to get Su-35, it will get it but the main problem has been it hasn't made up its mind yet or at least publicly.

 

[araz]

These is pretty unprofessional for a pro. If all Pakistan was to end up buying Su35, then what is the point of having robust antiship capabilities in JF17s and the depolyment of airial refuelers in karachi?

An alternative narrative is always good to see if you can improve a good situation. What has happened is good but the deficiencies have not been adequately met. Can the SU35 fulfill those deficiencies___YES. Can we afford it _____Probably not, If there is a choice between J31 and SU35 would you delay J31 just due to lack of resources_____ definitely not. So where does our choice lies. KT has very nicely highlighted the need for a twin engined plane but left out the other bit of the conundrum. For if he were to let the cat out of the bag now, what would he have to write about later!!!!!
Araz

 

[Alpha BeeTee]

because russian jets are maintenance nightmare. the availability rate is 60%-70%. while that of western jets is 85%. and IAF need an excellent ground attack aircraft with A-A capability. that is why IAF choose rafael.

But Rafael is still not choosing IAF so far..

 

[Alpha BeeTee]

Su-35 is a proper beast. With that being said...weren't we interested in J-10s to to fill the gap between JFT and a 5th Gen (prolly J-31s)?

Su-35 is really expensive, do we seriously have the cash to buy them with all the other assorted costs such as the training, maintenance, etc.?

That is the real problem.

 

[syed_yusuf]

PAF can get J-16 or J-11D why go for Su-35

 

[Viper 94]

Rather than being poetic and subjective about Su-35's greatness, we should take a deep breath and do its
Capabilities-to-Cost analysis with JF-17 (Block 3 in +2018) and F-16s (Single engine). It's better, but how much in % terms? In War, how many planes we are expected to lose per day? Can we afford to have only few planes against 7 times bigger enemy? Real pain for India is our ability to raise JF-17 sqdns quickly, and wouldn't mind how many fancy and expensive foreign planes we have for showing off. Why China is important? Because it can replicate or match any foreign technology at 10th or 100th of a cost. Moral of the story: Any country other than China is a distraction. We should analyze ideas rationally irrespective of our emotions & tastes. Finally choices are mutually exclusive: we do one thing at the cost of other.

PAF will lose fewer planes if it takes the fight into the enemy territory taking a defensive posture will not be beneficial
raad and babur cruise missiles will play a vital role in damaging enemy bases and aircraft parked there

 

[deckingraj]

Didn't stop them from offering Indonesia a line of credit for their Su-35 purchase.

you are right...but don't you think you are taking a very simplistic view of this....i mean you can also quote an example of Syria where they are supplying weapons like anything...Russia is a major supplier to Indonesia whereas Pakistan/Russia relations are very much non-existent(with signs of change)....and on top of that risking hard cash from a way bigger market like India and replace it with soft loans for Pakistan....

 

[special]

But Rafael is still not choosing IAF so far..

it is not rafael, it is MoD and FM which is not signing the deal.

 

[Super Falcon]

SU 35 induction in PAF definately answers all indian airforce procurement until we get our stealth jey

Along with F 16 JF 17 SU 35 makes a potsnt air force and make IAF think twice before inveding in our airspace

Even USAF agrees SU 35 can destroy any USAF fighter jet apart from F 22 raptor.

Yes we need long range air defence equipment thick and fast

I was one put the mental block if paf to hnckl

 

[CHI RULES]

PAF can get J-16 or J-11D why go for Su-35

both mentioned jets are new, especially J11D is still in development phase, instead of securing future we should first check current scenario. It will take much longer time to get even limited numbers of mentioned jets as compared to SU35.

We may get immediately limited batches of J11b at maximum as first priority for China shall be to arm their own PLAAF and Naval Air force with these Jets first.

Please do check current status of our naval support,can our Mirage Vs defend themselves in A to A encounters answer is No. Further can they perform deep strike missions answer is certainly Know.

In Musharaf's era China was ready to provide Two three squadrons of J11 fighter jet along with FC20. So we may assume that even now they can immediately provide Pak the J11b jets say up to 36 with AESA radars, on the argument that it may not have mature Radar, one may assume that AESA radar even with lesser range may prove to be more effective than PESA or synthetic apperture radars.

So summing up one may say thatSU35 is good enough but we have equivalent options from China though assuming little bit lesser capabilities and lesser service life. Whatever we want to get should get it quickly. As India has already modernized it's Migs and Mirrages especially for naval role, meanwhile we are sticking with Mirrages. Our JFT squadrons can also prove to be effective if used in combination with any heavy Jet.

 

[RazorMC]

if j-11 is not advanced enough f-15 strike eagle is an excellent option if the u.s is willing to sell them
f-15 shares many parts with the f-16 especially engines and all the missiles and bombs we purchased for the f-16 can be loaded on the f-15

We'll be putting too much into American hands again. The Eagle is a wonderful aircraft, but comes from an unreliable supplier and is superceded by more current platforms.

And bombs on an Eagle?