Agnostic/Atheist on this Forum

[Chinese-Dragon]

Sir, Kindly read influencing factors that changed Hitler. He considered religion responsible, so how is religion responsible for Holocaust. Isn't Hitler's misconception about Judaism and his version of Christianity the reason.

Again, note that it was Hitler's decision and thought process that made him to commit those crimes. We can't blame Judaism just because a person hated that religion.

Of course. The only ones truly responsible were the Nazis themselves.

It is not religion itself, it is how people use religion.

 

[KRAIT]

See my very first few points, where i said religion is very basic concept to led people to live a standard pious way of life, in which it failed miserably.
So i worship my consciousness, believing that it'll give me power to differentiate Good from Bad.

Failed for all ?

Sorry sir. It was man who failed. Tell me one religion that teaches violence and hatred. Again, I say that religion was made by good morals of good people, to influence their generation to do good, but few evil and greedy people changed according to their needs and benefits and hence used religion to justify their evil actions.

Religion is like a knife. You can use it for cutting vegetables to prepare food for your family or use it to kill a person to loot him.

 

[Yeti]

I believe in "principle of Karma" if you do good to people it will be returned to you 10 times. So my Karma will take care of me.

For People like you it is better to believe some one superior will take care of you and say such power exists and guides us. AS per my understanding The Concept of GOD is there to make Humans secure and cross the bridge in difficulties thinking some is there to help you and he is universal.

In a way the same can be said of 'Karma' that it is a also a form of reassurance as it provides a spiritual form of justice for example you said if you do good you will be rewarded with good in return that is also a sense of security which we humans need, it is our nature or perhaps us weak humans need like me lol the sense of justice and security is a comfort to humanity.

 

[gubbi]

A highly religious person can be tyrant or a saint.

Precisely. It is this very religious ideology that adds fuel to a character trait in man. It can make him a saint or a monster. Character and actions of men, driven and fueled by religious ideologies is the root cause of many problems.

 

[Skull and Bones]

Failed for all ?

Sorry sir. It was man who failed. Tell me one religion that teaches violence and hatred. Again, I say that religion was made by good morals of good people, to influence their generation to do good, but few evil and greedy people changed according to their needs and benefits and hence used religion to justify their evil actions.

Religion is like a knife. You can use it for cutting vegetables to prepare food for your family or use it to kill a person to loot him.

Sir! Not denying what you said. But isn't it evident from our views that evolved minds don't need religion to survive? And isn't religion incomplete without proper education? If you don't know how to use a knife, then it's more likely to be used as weapon, as making food requires creative mind, while every insecure mind can use it as a weapon on the pretext of self defense?

 

[KRAIT]

Agreed , But to you think we need religion now . I mean yes people in older days were savages so needed code of conduct . Now We dont Need that . Any person will help a old women et all regardless of religion .

Well here come a small difference between religion and what we are taught by our parents. See, when you were a kid, your parent taught you to do no harm, help the needy, be honest, don't steal etc. But as you grow up, sometimes you ask for more difficult questions which can't be answered by your parents or any person you know. So who will you reach to ? A person who has done his research, spend his life on same question that you are asking for. So here comes religion.

Religion is vast experience of our forefathers so that we don't have to reinvent the wheel. But the person who explains you the religion may be good or bad. So, if he is bad and has evil in his mind, he can use same religion to misguide you.

Another question, if you look at today's world, don't you think we need code of conduct more than ever. Go to any village, people take care of themselves. Whereas in cities, your neighbor may not even know anything or care about you. Modernity has made people less emotional and more selfish.

Again, an atheist and a religious person can be good or evil, it all depends on choice.

 

[Yeti]

Max-Neef classifies the fundamental human needs as:
subsistence,
protection,
affection,
understanding,
participation,
leisure,
creation,
identity and
freedom.

 

[Hellraiser007]

In a way the same can be said of 'Karma' that it is a also a form of reassurance as it provides a spiritual form of justice for example you said if you do good you will be rewarded with good in return that is also a sense of security which we humans need, it is our nature or perhaps us weak humans need like me lol the sense of justice and security is a comfort to humanity.

Exactly mate

 

[ajtr]

use of violence is recommended for right cause of dharma and in selfdefence both in hinduism and islam.
Ram faught with ravna for right cause
Ram killed Bali for right caue
Ram killed Tadaka for right cause
Krishna faught kans for right cause
Krishna persuaded arjun to fight against his own relative in kurukshetra.

Who can forget the sacricices made at karbala for right cause.

 

[Cherokee]

Well here come a small difference between religion and what we are taught by our parents. See, when you were a kid, your parent taught you to do no harm, help the needy, be honest, don't steal etc. But as you grow up, sometimes you ask for more difficult questions which can't be answered by your parents or any person you know. So who will you reach to ? A person who has done his research, spend his life on same question that you are asking for. So here comes religion.

Religion is vast experience of our forefathers so that we don't have to reinvent the wheel. Bu the person who explains you the religion may be good or bad. So, if he is bad and has evil in his mind, he can use same religion to misguide you.

Another question, if you look at today's world, don't you think we need code of conduct more than ever. Go to any village, people take care of themselves. Whereas in cities, your neighbor may not even know anything or care about you. Modernity has made people less emotional and more selfish.

Again, an atheist and a religious person can be good or evil, it all depends on choice.

That is why you are A Think Tank and i a Troll Tank ( I wanted that handle but Webmaster striked that motion down like a f-15 striking a Starfighter )

use of violence is recommended for right cause of dharma and in selfdefence both in hinduism and islam.
Ram faught with ravna for right cause
Ram killed Bali for right caue
Ram killed Tadaka for right cause
Krishna faught kans for right cause
Krishna persuaded arjun to fight against his own relative in kurukshetra.

Who can forget the sacricices made at karbala for right cause.

Khalajaan

baba Bulleh Shah said

mandir Dhaa de Masjid Dhaa de , Dhaa de sab kuch jo disdaa
Per kisi ka dil na Dhaween rab dilaa wich wasda

Karbala ... was painful to say the least but i wont comment on it as it would be offtopic

 

[zip]

I am not religious but i firmly believe in some higher power .. When i saw there are seperate Gods ,seperate preaching from God for different religion i was 100% sure that religion and all bs is a big lie but a necessary one in some stage of human history ..

 

[KRAIT]

Sir! Not denying what you said. But isn't it evident from our views that evolved minds don't need religion to survive? And isn't religion incomplete without proper education? If you don't know how to use a knife, then it's more likely to be used as weapon, as making food requires creative mind, while every insecure mind can use it as a weapon on the pretext of self defense?

Again, a religious, uneducated person can be good while an atheist educated person can be evil. Vice versa is also true.

I had a chance to meet a very learned person. He was a Hindu but he told me if you want to seek spiritual satisfaction, become disciplined like Muslims. No matter what, they take time to offer Namaz, 5 times a day. He didn't say I should do puja 5 times, but he said be disciplined like they are. Puja on time and with full mind and soul. There are so many things about Islam that he told me about. He said if a person wants spiritual satisfaction and peace, no matter which religion he/she follows, he/she can get it. Its all about how much you are disciplined about following it.

People like him gave me insight about that when it comes to God, follow any religion, if you follow what's said in Gita, Quran or Bible etc, you will find peace. I have seen people with great aura (I mean a shine that is mesmerizing) in few Hindus, Muslims, Christians and Sikhs. And when you meet such people, they will never say that their religion is better than others. For them, its all about God.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/members-club/209904-naswar-corner-635.html#ixzz2ETrKRWz9


Look at the beauty of the argument of that learned person. Even being a Hindu, he used Islam and Muslims to teach me discipline. This is where people generally fail. They start comparing religion but the Real educated ones are those, who put rationality over blind belief, rationality doesn't mean atheism, rationality means ability to judge what's right and wrong with proper thinking.

 

[Hellraiser007]

use of violence is recommended for right cause of dharma and in selfdefence both in hinduism and islam.
Ram faught with ravna for right cause
Ram killed Bali for right caue
Ram killed Tadaka for right cause
Krishna faught kans for right cause
Krishna persuaded arjun to fight against his own relative in kurukshetra.

Who can forget the sacricices made at karbala for right cause.

Seems you have good knowledge about Ramayana and Mahabharata.

That is not dal "tadaka" it is "thataki".

Dharma is a concept which is relative and keeps changing with the times and to decide what is right and what is wrong, one must have complete knowledge and to attain that enlightenment first Human should conquer emotions like anger,fear....

 

[KRAIT]

Precisely. It is this very religious ideology that adds fuel to a character trait in man. It can make him a saint or a monster. Character and actions of men, driven and fueled by religious ideologies is the root cause of many problems.

A correction - driven and fueled by distorted and misinterpreted religious ideologies

 

[Skull and Bones]

Again, a religious, eneducated person can be good while an atheist educated person can be evil. Vive versa is also true.

I had a chance to meet a very learned person. He was a Hindu but he told me if you want to seek spiritual satisfaction, become disciplined like Muslims. No matter what, they take time to offer Namaz, 5 times a day. He didn't say I should do puja 5 times, but he said be disciplined like they are. Puja on time and with full mind and soul. There are so many things about Islam that he told me about. He said if a person wants spiritual satisfaction and peace, no matter which religion he/she follows, he/she can get it. Its all about how much you are disciplined about following it.

People like him gave me insight about that when it comes to God, follow any religion, if you follow what's said in Gita, Quran or Bible etc, you will find peace. I have seen people with great aura (I mean a shine that is mesmerizing) in few Hindus, Muslims, Christians and Sikhs. And when you meet such people, they will never say that their religion is better than others. For them, its all about God.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/members-club/209904-naswar-corner-635.html#ixzz2ETrKRWz9


Look at the beauty of the argument of that learned person. Even being a Hindu, he used Islam and Muslims to teach me discipline. This is where people generally fail. They start comparing religion but the Real educated ones are those, who put rationality over blind belief, rationality doesn't mean atheism, rationality means ability to judge what's right and wrong with proper thinking.

So it is the consciousness of the person, whether he'll be good or bad. Isn't?