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Afghan peace talks should not cross 'red lines': India

@muse,
Pakistan, Taliban and the US vs Russia, Iran, Karzai and India.
Are we back in the 80's? that's a big dose of nostalgia - right there :lol:
I don't know if we had ever left that - many of the equations seem the same, though some change while others find it difficult to.

what you think about CIA & house of sauds preparing a suni super state to dictate iran & sirya?
all these negociations are just broad bassed drama, which is just there to hve a ceremoney?
 
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I don't know if we had ever left that - many of the equations seem the same, though some change while others find it difficult to.

It seems history will repeat itself.
 
History never repeats itself ---

By history I meant the alignments - there have been a number of variables and changes down the years. But history is surely repeating itself as far as the Afghan populace is concerned - they will not see peace yet.
 
Afghanistan urges Pakistan to free Taliban prisoners for peace
By Reuters
Published: June 22, 2013


KABUL: Pakistan could secure peace in Afghanistan by releasing dozens of senior Taliban prisoners to help kick-start the process, the Afghan foreign ministry said on Saturday, in remarks that underscore the issues plaguing peace talks in Qatar.

The ministry’s statement was a response to comments by the Pakistani foreign ministry on Tuesday, which welcomed the opening of a Taliban office in the Qatari capital of Doha, saying the country stood “ready to continue to facilitate the (peace) process to achieve lasting peace”.

Afghanistan has long accused Pakistan of playing a double game regarding the 12-year-old war against the Taliban, claiming that its neighbour makes public pronouncements about peace but allows elements of its military complex to play a spoiling role.

“(If) Pakistan has the sincere determination to support the Afghan peace process … then the most useful and urgent step would be to release those Afghan Taliban leaders who have been arrested by Pakistani authorities,” the Afghan foreign ministry said.

“The release of these prominent Taliban leaders would provide the High Peace Council of Afghanistan with the opportunity to start peace talks with them,” it added, referring to a body set up by President Hamid Karzai in 2010 to seek a negotiated end to the 12-year war with a Taliban-led insurgency.

The Taliban opened its Doha office this week amid hopeful signs of movement in a long-stalled peace process.

But the opening ceremony caused a stir, with Taliban envoys raising the Taliban flag and signs proclaiming the “Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan”, the name used during their brief rule from 1996 to 2001.

This prompted Karzai to cancel plans for an Afghan peace delegation to travel to Qatar and suspend talks with the United States over a vital security pact in the belief it had failed to ensure the Taliban did not misuse the office.

Afghanistan’s main opposition party and alliance of the country’s northern leaders, the National Front, also condemned the fanfare over the opening of the Taliban office.

“This is an illegal act, in conflict with international conventions and causes serious damage to the legitimacy of the Afghan political state,” they said in a statement on Saturday.

Pakistan is seen as crucial to stability in Afghanistan as most foreign combat troops look to leave the country in 2014, given close political and economic ties and because militant sanctuaries straddle the mountainous border.

Afghanistan has long sought the release of, or at least access to, dozens of senior Taliban officials captured in Pakistan, including Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar, Taliban leader Mullah Omar’s former second in command and a hugely influential figure in the insurgency.

Baradar was the day-to-day commander responsible for leading the Taliban campaign against US and NATO troops, until his capture in 2010 in Karachi by a joint team of CIA and Pakistani intelligence officers.

Afghan officials believe Baradar could play a key role in talks with the insurgents, acting as a go-between with Taliban leaders, including Omar.

Pakistan though has released as many as 26 high level Afghan Taliban leaders since November 2012 to help spur the Afghan peace process and has even considered to release Baradar.

Pakistan’s response

Foreign Office spokesperson Aizaz Chaudhry, while declining to comment specifically on the Taliban prisoners issue, said Saturday that Pakistan remains committed to the peace process planned to take place in Qatar.

“We will remain positive and will consider each step necessary that helps to advance the reconciliation process taking place in Doha, which we supported for the regional peace and stability.

“Reasons for not taking part in the reconciliation process are best known to Mr Karzai, we cannot comment over it.”

The spokesperson added that “Kabul should not issue such statements at this point of time when a stalemate in peace talks between US officials and Taliban representatives in Doha is over after a hell of efforts to resume it.”
 
what you think about CIA & house of sauds preparing a suni super state to dictate iran & sirya?
all these negociations are just broad bassed drama, which is just there to hve a ceremoney?

:D This is something interesting, can you expand on that?

I believe the alignment is more towards the North of Afghanistan.
 
The conversation will race along - it always does and both leaders will want to get to the subject of Afghanistan, the latest conflict in which Qatari leader Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani has emerged as sponsor or chaperone for the Islamist movement in the equation - in this case, the Taliban.

His tiny but hugely wealthy government is carving a role for itself as a regional heavyweight, nurturing the Muslim Brotherhood and its associated movements from Tunnis to Cairo to Damascus, and on to Kabul.

In doing the rounds of the region, the pair will be struck by all the common ground between them - things got a bit tetchy over arms for the Syrian rebels, but in the end Washington came good with weapons for them. Obama will know where the Emir is going in this talk, because the Taliban is not the only insurgent movement hosted in a swanky government villa in Doha. The Emir's other honoured guests are the leaders of the Palestinian Hamas movement.

The implicit deal, which senior figures in Hamas have confirmed to me, is that for abandoning Damascus, which was Hamas's HQ for more than a decade, the Qatari Emir undertook to speak for Hamas in the capitals of the world - especially Washington.

The US is now ready to talk to the Taliban, after months of diplomatic spadework by Qatar. And the Emir would be entitled to ask Obama: what would it take for Washington to talk to Hamas? Did someone say bring in the diplomatic jack-hammers?

Unlike the Taliban, which stole government in Afghanistan, Hamas was fairly elected as the governing party of the Palestinian occupied territories in 2006.

The Taliban is responsible for the deaths of more than 3300 US and allied troops, about 10,000 Afghan security personnel and thousands of Afghan civilians. By contrast, the US Congressional Research Service attributes the death of ''more than 400'' Israelis and ''more than 25 US citizens'' to attacks by Hamas in Israel.

Given that the impact of Taliban violence dwarfs that of Hamas, how does Obama go to peace talks on Afghanistan without preconditions? In the past, US officials have insisted the Taliban must reject Al-Qaeda, renounce violence and recognise the new Afghan constitution.

By this week all that had been watered down to maybe the Taliban could disown Al-Qaeda in the future; and it would be nice if the insurgents would embrace the rights of women and minorities in the constitution.

Hamas spurned Al-Qaeda years ago, and while the Taliban is cosying up with Tehran, Hamas's relationship with Iran has cooled because the Palestinian movement refuses to back Iran's key regional ally, Syria's President Bashar Al-Assad.

Insisting on preconditions the other side cannot accept is a great ruse by which to be seen to be posturing about peace, while doing little or nothing to achieve it. Unless, that is, the Qatari Emir knows something Obama is not letting on about yet.
Hamas officials were quoted claiming US representatives had been present at a meeting between Hamas and European officials two weeks ago.

The State Department issued a denial of sorts, saying the claims ''are not true''. Indeed.


Read more: Peace talks call for a truly even hand
 
une 22, 2013, 5:44 am
The New New Thing in U.S.-Indian Relations?
By DANIEL KURTZ-PHELAN
B. Mathur/Reuters

Sometime early in the last decade, official Washington discovered India’s “strategic” value. The emblem of this revelation was the Bush administration’s civil-nuclear agreement, unveiled with great fanfare in 2005. The agreement was technically designed to allow peaceful nuclear cooperation with India despite its status then as a nonproliferation pariah, but the real purpose, as one architect of the accord put it, was to “forge the strategic partnership based on common values that had eluded both countries for many decades” and demonstrate how valuable Washington “deemed the U.S.-Indian partnership to be in meeting U.S. grand strategic objectives.”

It was an act of faith: two big, diverse, sometimes exasperating democracies, the United States and India would surely find a way to do wonderful things together. India would be an ally in global causes, a counterweight to China, a shining example of democratic development.

Since then, the official pronouncements have gotten grander and more sweeping — the United States-India relationship, President Obama proclaimed to the Indian Parliament in 2010, “will be one of the defining partnerships of the 21st century” — while a chorus of skepticism, in both capitals, has gotten louder and more pointed. In Washington, the relationship is derided as oversold, wilting, adrift; India can’t deliver on an agreement, refuses to open its markets to our companies, undercuts us in international negotiations, remains unshaken in its fealty to old ideologies and “strategic autonomy.” In New Delhi, the Americans are bemoaned as impatient, myopic, fickle, the United States as too set in its domineering ways to treat India as an equal partner. Both sides lament the absence of the next big thing, a new undertaking on the order of the civil-nuclear agreement, to give the partnership some splash.

Those complaints greatly overstate the difficulties and downplay the progress in what was long a very tense relationship. Yet they add up to a bloc of opinion that John Kerry will have to confront when he arrives in New Delhi on Sunday for his first visit to India as secretary of state.

Mr. Kerry and India’s minister for external affairs, Salman Khurshid, will devote most of a day to the India-U.S. Strategic Dialogue, an endeavor started by Mr. Kerry’s predecessor, Hillary Clinton, in 2009. As American and Indian officials rightly and insistently point out, the range of issues that dozens of representatives of the two governments will discuss would have been almost unthinkable 15 years ago: energy and the environment, terrorism and cybersecurity, development cooperation and higher education, trade that has roughly quintupled in a decade, and security cooperation that now includes both frequent military exercises and booming military sales. Easily belittled, often deadly boring to sit through, these proceedings serve a prosaic but essential function: they force top officials to take the time to communicate and bureaucracies to make the effort to cooperate. They are, the insiders say, “action-forcing events.”

But no matter how long the list of joint projects, technical dialogues and substantive agreements, there is a nagging sense that until a major new initiative is found, charges of drift and divergence – the “widespread” impression that “relations are on a plateau, if not in the doldrums,” as a former Indian ambassador to the United States observed on Thursday – will dog the relationship. The Brookings Institution’s Tanvi Madan has warned of “India fatigue” among those in Washington who expect a headline project and short-term returns. So diplomats and policy makers are pressed to find that next big thing to quiet the doubters.

That search hasn’t shown much promise. Even as the civil-nuclear agreement gets tangled up in the details of liability rules, candidates for the next big thing promise at best modest progress and at worst mutual recrimination. Heightened energy cooperation, especially a United States decision to allow natural-gas exports to India, would be useful but hardly transformative in the short term. The key economic issues, supposedly at the top of Mr. Kerry’s agenda, are largely divisive.

In advance of his trip, the top Democrat and the top Republican on the Senate Finance Committee wrote to Mr. Kerry, “We cannot afford to sit back and watch as India adopts policies that adversely impact U.S. innovative and creative industries, and threaten the greater stability of the international trading system.” A coalition of American businesses went to the White House with complaints that “India is discriminating against a wide range of U.S. exports, jeopardizing domestic jobs and putting at risk a growing bilateral trading relationship.”

An investment treaty and expanded foreign direct investment, longstanding items on Washington’s wish list, are as fanciful as ever as India’s elections approach next year. “We just have to get beyond,” one Indian official said, “depending on big ideas.”

The more traditional “strategic” topics don’t allow for easy feel-good interaction, either. In the most crucial foreign policy areas, Afghanistan and China, there may be long-term convergence between American and Indian interests, but at the moment, tactical differences lend the discussions an air of apprehension. Indians have long worried about what the United States might do as it heads for the exits in Afghanistan, particularly that it will cut a desperate deal with the Taliban or Pakistani security services like the Inter-Services Intelligence spy agency, or ISI. “That’s what gives us the creeps,” one senior Indian diplomat said. And for many, this week’s aborted unveiling of talks with the Taliban (or the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, as they proclaimed from their Qatari outpost) looked like exactly that: “The ISI and the Taliban are getting everything they want from the Americans.”

Indian officials have talked of East Asia as the “strategic glue” that will hold the relationship together, but that raises another set of anxieties. For some Indians, United States policy toward China risks becoming too hard; for others, too soft. It takes a lot of reassurance and explanation to persuade them that Washington wants a policy that is just right. That means, on the one hand, that the United States has no interest in pressing the Indians into some kind of neo-containment regime directed at China and, on the other, that it will not retreat and abandon them to Chinese hegemony.

Even many sophisticated Indian observers wonder whether the United States will eventually have little choice but to accede to a “G-2,” with Beijing and Washington divvying up Asia and leaving India out in the cold. “That fear is always lurking in the back of our minds,” one recently retired top diplomat said. After President Obama’s meeting with China’s president, Xi Jinping, in California (and the recent Chinese-Indian standoff in Ladakh), it seemed to creep to the front, with a former Indian intelligence chief snidely referring to the meeting “as the Big Boys’ Club … dividing the world into spheres of influence and power” and speculating about a secret declaration that would constitute “Asia’s Yalta.”

Yet if the quest for the next big thing is futile, the disagreements and difficulties inherent in these “strategic” discussions should not be causes for discouragement or reasons to skirt hard issues for the sake of proclaiming Mr. Kerry’s visit a great success and the relationship as sunny as ever. In fact, a focus on these issues would be less a sign of drift than a sign of progress. They represent the basic purpose behind the grand claims for the “strategic partnership”: a testament to its maturity as well as a test of its seriousness.

The validity of those claims will hinge not on an endless search for the next big thing, the next headline-grabbing breakthrough, but on whether the two sides can address these sorts of differences, manage them and find complementary (which will not always mean cooperative) policies that serve common longer-term interests. In the process, Americans should remember that some of the United States’ most important partners in the past have demonstrated plenty of “strategic autonomy” – think France during the cold war – and were still crucial in supporting shared goals.

When two difficult democracies, each with its own chaotic and often dysfunctional politics, try to do all of this together, the process becomes even more complicated. For diplomats, democracy can seem as vexing in practice as it is uplifting in theory, as much a curse as a blessing – whether in thwarting big deals (as was nearly the case with the civil-nuclear agreement in 2008) or in blocking bilateral discussions (a persistent complaint of American economic officials). Yet it also means Americans can take considerable comfort in the fact that, according to recent polling, Indians view the United States more positively than they do any other country (while 83 percent view China as a threat). Whatever the disagreements, whatever the foiled aspirations and diplomatic spats, that bodes well: ultimately, the United States supports India more for what it is than for what it does.

Daniel Kurtz-Phelan, a member of Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s policy planning staff from 2009 to 2012, is a senior visiting fellow at the Centre for Policy Research in New Delhi.
 
:D This is something interesting, can you expand on that?

I believe the alignment is more towards the North of Afghanistan.

if muallha omar is the hired guns for next 10 years, thn CIA & house of sauds will be delighted from whereever it may starts?
cant go further was in a chat some one calls himself whistle blower?;)
 
une 22, 2013, 5:44 am
The New New Thing in U.S.-Indian Relations?
By DANIEL KURTZ-PHELAN
B. Mathur/Reuters

Sometime early in the last decade, official Washington discovered India’s “strategic” value. The emblem of this revelation was the Bush administration’s civil-nuclear agreement, unveiled with great fanfare in 2005. The agreement was technically designed to allow peaceful nuclear cooperation with India despite its status then as a nonproliferation pariah, but the real purpose, as one architect of the accord put it, was to “forge the strategic partnership based on common values that had eluded both countries for many decades” and demonstrate how valuable Washington “deemed the U.S.-Indian partnership to be in meeting U.S. grand strategic objectives.”

It was an act of faith: two big, diverse, sometimes exasperating democracies, the United States and India would surely find a way to do wonderful things together. India would be an ally in global causes, a counterweight to China, a shining example of democratic development.

Since then, the official pronouncements have gotten grander and more sweeping — the United States-India relationship, President Obama proclaimed to the Indian Parliament in 2010, “will be one of the defining partnerships of the 21st century” — while a chorus of skepticism, in both capitals, has gotten louder and more pointed. In Washington, the relationship is derided as oversold, wilting, adrift; India can’t deliver on an agreement, refuses to open its markets to our companies, undercuts us in international negotiations, remains unshaken in its fealty to old ideologies and “strategic autonomy.” In New Delhi, the Americans are bemoaned as impatient, myopic, fickle, the United States as too set in its domineering ways to treat India as an equal partner. Both sides lament the absence of the next big thing, a new undertaking on the order of the civil-nuclear agreement, to give the partnership some splash.

Those complaints greatly overstate the difficulties and downplay the progress in what was long a very tense relationship. Yet they add up to a bloc of opinion that John Kerry will have to confront when he arrives in New Delhi on Sunday for his first visit to India as secretary of state.

Mr. Kerry and India’s minister for external affairs, Salman Khurshid, will devote most of a day to the India-U.S. Strategic Dialogue, an endeavor started by Mr. Kerry’s predecessor, Hillary Clinton, in 2009. As American and Indian officials rightly and insistently point out, the range of issues that dozens of representatives of the two governments will discuss would have been almost unthinkable 15 years ago: energy and the environment, terrorism and cybersecurity, development cooperation and higher education, trade that has roughly quintupled in a decade, and security cooperation that now includes both frequent military exercises and booming military sales. Easily belittled, often deadly boring to sit through, these proceedings serve a prosaic but essential function: they force top officials to take the time to communicate and bureaucracies to make the effort to cooperate. They are, the insiders say, “action-forcing events.”

But no matter how long the list of joint projects, technical dialogues and substantive agreements, there is a nagging sense that until a major new initiative is found, charges of drift and divergence – the “widespread” impression that “relations are on a plateau, if not in the doldrums,” as a former Indian ambassador to the United States observed on Thursday – will dog the relationship. The Brookings Institution’s Tanvi Madan has warned of “India fatigue” among those in Washington who expect a headline project and short-term returns. So diplomats and policy makers are pressed to find that next big thing to quiet the doubters.

That search hasn’t shown much promise. Even as the civil-nuclear agreement gets tangled up in the details of liability rules, candidates for the next big thing promise at best modest progress and at worst mutual recrimination. Heightened energy cooperation, especially a United States decision to allow natural-gas exports to India, would be useful but hardly transformative in the short term. The key economic issues, supposedly at the top of Mr. Kerry’s agenda, are largely divisive.

In advance of his trip, the top Democrat and the top Republican on the Senate Finance Committee wrote to Mr. Kerry, “We cannot afford to sit back and watch as India adopts policies that adversely impact U.S. innovative and creative industries, and threaten the greater stability of the international trading system.” A coalition of American businesses went to the White House with complaints that “India is discriminating against a wide range of U.S. exports, jeopardizing domestic jobs and putting at risk a growing bilateral trading relationship.”

An investment treaty and expanded foreign direct investment, longstanding items on Washington’s wish list, are as fanciful as ever as India’s elections approach next year. “We just have to get beyond,” one Indian official said, “depending on big ideas.”

The more traditional “strategic” topics don’t allow for easy feel-good interaction, either. In the most crucial foreign policy areas, Afghanistan and China, there may be long-term convergence between American and Indian interests, but at the moment, tactical differences lend the discussions an air of apprehension. Indians have long worried about what the United States might do as it heads for the exits in Afghanistan, particularly that it will cut a desperate deal with the Taliban or Pakistani security services like the Inter-Services Intelligence spy agency, or ISI. “That’s what gives us the creeps,” one senior Indian diplomat said. And for many, this week’s aborted unveiling of talks with the Taliban (or the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, as they proclaimed from their Qatari outpost) looked like exactly that: “The ISI and the Taliban are getting everything they want from the Americans.”

Indian officials have talked of East Asia as the “strategic glue” that will hold the relationship together, but that raises another set of anxieties. For some Indians, United States policy toward China risks becoming too hard; for others, too soft. It takes a lot of reassurance and explanation to persuade them that Washington wants a policy that is just right. That means, on the one hand, that the United States has no interest in pressing the Indians into some kind of neo-containment regime directed at China and, on the other, that it will not retreat and abandon them to Chinese hegemony.

Even many sophisticated Indian observers wonder whether the United States will eventually have little choice but to accede to a “G-2,” with Beijing and Washington divvying up Asia and leaving India out in the cold. “That fear is always lurking in the back of our minds,” one recently retired top diplomat said. After President Obama’s meeting with China’s president, Xi Jinping, in California (and the recent Chinese-Indian standoff in Ladakh), it seemed to creep to the front, with a former Indian intelligence chief snidely referring to the meeting “as the Big Boys’ Club … dividing the world into spheres of influence and power” and speculating about a secret declaration that would constitute “Asia’s Yalta.”

Yet if the quest for the next big thing is futile, the disagreements and difficulties inherent in these “strategic” discussions should not be causes for discouragement or reasons to skirt hard issues for the sake of proclaiming Mr. Kerry’s visit a great success and the relationship as sunny as ever. In fact, a focus on these issues would be less a sign of drift than a sign of progress. They represent the basic purpose behind the grand claims for the “strategic partnership”: a testament to its maturity as well as a test of its seriousness.

The validity of those claims will hinge not on an endless search for the next big thing, the next headline-grabbing breakthrough, but on whether the two sides can address these sorts of differences, manage them and find complementary (which will not always mean cooperative) policies that serve common longer-term interests. In the process, Americans should remember that some of the United States’ most important partners in the past have demonstrated plenty of “strategic autonomy” – think France during the cold war – and were still crucial in supporting shared goals.

When two difficult democracies, each with its own chaotic and often dysfunctional politics, try to do all of this together, the process becomes even more complicated. For diplomats, democracy can seem as vexing in practice as it is uplifting in theory, as much a curse as a blessing – whether in thwarting big deals (as was nearly the case with the civil-nuclear agreement in 2008) or in blocking bilateral discussions (a persistent complaint of American economic officials). Yet it also means Americans can take considerable comfort in the fact that, according to recent polling, Indians view the United States more positively than they do any other country (while 83 percent view China as a threat). Whatever the disagreements, whatever the foiled aspirations and diplomatic spats, that bodes well: ultimately, the United States supports India more for what it is than for what it does.

Daniel Kurtz-Phelan, a member of Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s policy planning staff from 2009 to 2012, is a senior visiting fellow at the Centre for Policy Research in New Delhi.

The point of this here?

India - US relations is too complicated to make sense of..
 
The point of this here?

India - US relations is too complicated to make sense of..


That an explanation of exactly where the US wants to go with Doha is certain to be on the agenda, as is the re-hypenation that seems to have crept into equations. Also see Rumbling and Grumbling in Dehli
 
Lets call the taliban who agree to democratic set up and leaves AK's as Good Taliban :cheers:

Now two Questions in this regards......

Is Afghanistan ready for democratic process........??

What would be the strategy of India to deal with bad Taliban........???

In my view the nations who are imposing sanctions are no where near Iran or they have any historic relations with Iran, India do have some serious relations and trade relations with Iran, India should not back out on this issue of trade with Iran and continue its relations when Iran is facing tough times.

What would be more beneficial trade with Iran or Trade with World Community.....???
 
Now two Questions in this regards......

Is Afghanistan ready for democratic process........??

What would be the strategy of India to deal with bad Taliban........???

Difficult to tell, and better to predict after peace talks :cheers:, ANA will take care of their country :cheers:



What would be more beneficial trade with Iran or Trade with World Community.....???

There is always good diplomacy which we can balance the relations between USA and Iran :cheers:

Last time when sanctions were imposed on Iran. India and China are exceptions :cheers:
 
That an explanation of exactly where the US wants to go with Doha is certain to be on the agenda, as is the re-hypenation that seems to have crept into equations. Also see Rumbling and Grumbling in Dehli

India is not in the picture in the Taliban - US talks and wouldn't want to be as well, though there will be signals that will be thrown in the general directions - I guess New Delhi will wait for the US to figure out its way, and Afghanistan is not an issue that is of such importance that it will affect US India relations. There has been a slow turnout in results compared to what was hoped for in the relations but that can be attributed to the laggardness in the global economy and both big nations having some major commitments at home to take care of.
 

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