Ababeel Missile Tested

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

What/who does Pakistan need an ICBM for?

One only under sells it's own deterrence by not employing it's full capacity. It need not be pointed at against someone, or something. It's value resides only in it's ability to project.

The flipside of not applying it is more damning than just limited deployment only hindered by internal objections.

Remember, no one sees or seeks use of these weapons except the value they endow it's bearer.

 

[sparten]

All warheads currently in use by Pakistan on Shaheen series and Nasr, are pretty advanced and already boosted by fusion .

They may well be using multi stage fusion boosted fission.Those are top up at a few hundred KT yield but are compact and highly efficient.
Consider

Now, once one considers using substantial amounts of HEU in the secondary, the question of why the fusion fuel is needed at all arises. The answer: it probably is not essential. The idea of imploding fissile material is what set Stanislaw Ulam on the path to that led eventually to thermonuclear weapons. But with the availability of large amounts of HEU, and the trend toward smaller weapon yields (compared to the multimegaton behemoths of the fifties), the Ulam's idea of using radiation implosion to create a light weight high-efficiency pure fission weapon returns as a viable possibility. It is an interesting question whether all modern strategic nuclear weapons *are* in fact thermonuclear devices!

 

[TheSolution]

Just showmanship

1- Iraq war , No participation by Pakistan army just patrol work in Saudi Arabia
2- Afghanistan war , No Participation , just proxy weapon supply
3- WOT , forced to defend own turf , lost considerable loses
4- Syria War , No participation
5- Yamen War, No Participation
6- Rohongia crisis near Bangladesh , No participation


No capacity to engage all weapons are for exhibition and trade shows

Only Active when?

• When PTI performing Jasla , come out in trucks command the Police and Gulu Butt to beatup people, own country citizen
• Send out Vigo vans to kidnap politicians in night

Compare this to Turkey

• Disturbances from Syria , they built a massive wall
• Air Space violation , took out the intruder
• Went actively into Syria , and secured the zone
• Stopped Toppling of Government of Erdogan by hand full of core Commander
• Spoke openly about People of GAZA and protecting people

Not Pakistan's job to do any of those things.

It's job is the defence of Pakistan.

If you want to be a slave of the Arab world and fight their wars, do it on your own accord. Be cannon fodder for them and if you're lucky they might remember to spit on your grave.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Not Pakistan's job to do any of those things.

It's job is the defence of Pakistan.

If you want to be a slave of the Arab world and fight their wars, do it on your own accord. Be cannon fodder for them and if you're lucky they might remember to spit on your grave.

Toppling own government is not defense of Pakistan

 

[TheSolution]

Toppling own government is not defense of Pakistan

I agree here, but what does that have to do with you wanting to be a slave and fight Arab wars for them?

Start thinking for your own interests instead of doing ghulaami

 

[khansaheeb]

Not Pakistan's job to do any of those things.

It's job is the defence of Pakistan.

If you want to be a slave of the Arab world and fight their wars, do it on your own accord. Be cannon fodder for them and if you're lucky they might remember to spit on your grave.

That's not how Muslims think, it's all for one.

 

[TheSolution]

That's not how Muslims think, it's all for one.

If you thought like a Muslim you wouldn't be advocating for wars in Muslim nations to protect the interests of elite rich Arabs

Fighting in Yemen for Saudi interests or in Syria is not what a Muslim does

 

[khansaheeb]

If you thought like a Muslim you wouldn't be advocating for wars in Muslim nations to protect the interests of elite rich Arabs

Fighting in Yemen for Saudi interests or in Syria is not what a Muslim does

Divide and rule ain't going to work now mister.

 

[sparten]

I think the thing holding our ballistic missile program is the solid-rocket motor technology. I think a lot of the other things are pretty advanced. It's not always about expertise but also about money and the risks that they are willing to take. It takes decades for us to fully develop and mature a system and we are not like the US that we can develop new systems in quick succession. We just don't have the economic and risk appetite for the kind of progress that we want to see.

Sir we would like to hear some technical analysis of Ababeel Missile.
In the sense that where our Ballistic Missile Program is heading regarding technological maturity?
This missile still looks like 2010 era design.Since SPD organizations have done significant work on Conventional Air vehicles like Cruise Missiles & Drones,I expect them to have a solid base of Aero-Design experts.
Do you expect a clean design for may be Ababeel 2 once this MIRV technology is established?
All we see is that SPD is playing with 2000 era Shaheen designs.

or may be the focus will shift towards other technologies like Glide Vehicles and then we might see some efficient designs.

No. The Solid rocket motor technology is very advanced. For strategic systems, the issue is warhead designs.
There was a great leap forward for us in 1998. We tested 6 different designs and got reams of data. This permitted us to design and deploy highly advanced warheads come the 2000's. Light, highly efficient and compact, yet still with significant yield.

The problem is that most of these were designed for systems which were on the drawing board in 1998. The designs were optimised if not locked in for these. It is possible to adapt these for newer system, but that is sub-optimal. You can also design a new warhead and have it be reliable, without full up testing, but that requires allowance of generous engineering and performance margins, which affects size and efficiency, neither of which are things which are conducive for missile warheads. Especially for MIRV'd ones.

From open sources, what I can tell is that originally they intended to simply use existing Shaheen type warheads on the Ababeel, but that likely proved unfeasible. Its very unlikely that either KRL or PAEC would certify totally new warhead designs without testing.

I believe the delay of 6.5 years was caused by needed to develop a new warhead which was based on an already tested or at least certified one, to avoid the issues of size and weight, but was also conforming to the Ababeel warhead bus. In other words, the worst of both worlds had to be done.

 

[White and Green with M/S]

Divide and rule ain't going to work now mister.

Stick to the topic dude

 

[khansaheeb]

Stick to the topic dude

This aint the time for petty squabbling.

 

[White and Green with M/S]

This aint the time for petty squabbling.

This is Ababeel thread you bring Muslim Ummah Chumma and politics to this thread, is this relates to the topic??

 

[Bratva]

No. The Solid rocket motor technology is very advanced. For strategic systems, the issue is warhead designs.
There was a great leap forward for us in 1998. We tested 6 different designs and got reams of data. This permitted us to design and deploy highly advanced warheads come the 2000's. Light, highly efficient and compact, yet still with significant yield.

The problem is that most of these were designed for systems which were on the drawing board in 1998. The designs were optimised if not locked in for these. It is possible to adapt these for newer system, but that is sub-optimal. You can also design a new warhead and have it be reliable, without full up testing, but that requires allowance of generous engineering and performance margins, which affects size and efficiency, neither of which are things which are conducive for missile warheads. Especially for MIRV'd ones.

From open sources, what I can tell is that originally they intended to simply use existing Shaheen type warheads on the Ababeel, but that likely proved unfeasible. Its very unlikely that either KRL or PAEC would certify totally new warhead designs without testing.

I believe the delay of 6.5 years was caused by needed to develop a new warhead which was based on an already tested or at least certified one, to avoid the issues of size and weight, but was also conforming to the Ababeel warhead bus. In other words, the worst of both worlds had to be done.

1. I guess the Espionage case also added the delay in ababeel development. The warhead info got leaked. So they had to redesign the leaked warhead designs once again

2. RECENT test of Ghauri missile is surprising. But if one has to take an educated guess, The third stage of Ababeel is liquid fuel? Meaning KRL would've been involved in Ababeel? Meaning latest warhead was also tested on ghauri by KRL separately to validate some extra parameters?

 

[Vapnope]

1. I guess the Espionage case also added the delay in ababeel development. The warhead info got leaked. So they had to redesign the leaked warhead designs once again

2. RECENT test of Ghauri missile is surprising. But if one has to take an educated guess, The third stage of Ababeel is liquid fuel? Meaning KRL would've been involved in Ababeel? Meaning latest warhead was also tested on ghauri by KRL separately to validate some extra parameters?

Offtopic: The Lt. general who was ousted as someone who leaked this information has been pardoned by the current chief. So was he involved or not?

 

[Muhammad Saftain Anjum]

The warhead info got leaked. So they had to redesign the leaked warhead designs once again

Why is it so big problem?
This leaks can't be prevented completely.