71% voting recorded in 2nd phase of Jammu & Kashmir poll

[SQ8]

Even accepting your argument, it has to be acknowledged that it has made life much harder for the Pakistani Foreign service and has hugely dimished the "separatists" to a point where they might really struggle to be heard as a voice of Kashmir. Not with 70+% voting. Will be difficult to now argue that those elected do not represnt the people.

While the emotions of the people will not change overnight, this does constitute proof that people yearn for more and as you alluded to, there is a tiring of the old ways. whether this goes into economic integration or an intellectual evolution of the armed struggle - only time will tell but the odds favour India. As of now. Unless there is a major goof-up ( and there is no guarnatee that there won't be), people are likely to stick with this path, especially if Delhi wisely opens up the purse strings and makes for visible development. Many Kashmiris want to work outside of J&K and they must be encouraged to and there must a noticable attempt at their integration (meaning less police harrasment, suspicion etc). Can be done; not easy but doable.

This might also open up the best chance to resolve Kashmir. That will depend on what the Pakistani establishment makes of this. We will know soon enough.

The separatists have their own baggage with Pakistan. Much like Hafiz Saeed cannot be abandoned overnight(both for his clout with nutjobs and his information on dirty laundry) the separatists themselves have a resonating voice in Pakistan. A lesson has already been learnt with the cutoff from the Taliban and the resulting chaos that engulfs the country, so a gradual drawdown combined with "de-extremism" is the call of the hour.
Im actually waiting to see what revelations does Kasuri bring with his book on the near deal between India and Pakistan that is supposedly sitting there in the corner always ready to go.

 

[Bang Galore]

Im actually waiting to see what revelations does Kasuri bring with his book on the near deal between India and Pakistan that is supposedly sitting there in the corner always ready to go.

It's a pity that didn't fructify but the essential parameters of any solution lie firmly within that band. Both Kayani & the PPP government played for more, now they might find that what is on the table is even less than what they refused as not enough.

 

[SQ8]

It's a pity that didn't fructify but the essential parameters of any solution lie firmly within that band. Both Kayani & the PPP government played for more, now they might find that what is on the table is even less than what they refused as not enough.

Kasuri was around the Musharraf time. That was pre-26/11.. and perhaps the only chance post Agra declaration to get a settlement that seemed to please everyone(although rumour has it that the Separatist leadership was not happy as the deal short changed them).

 

[Bang Galore]

Kasuri was around the Musharraf time. That was pre-26/11.. and perhaps the only chance post Agra declaration to get a settlement that seemed to please everyone(although rumour has it that the Separatist leadership was not happy as the deal short changed them).

Yeah I know when Kasuri was FM, the agreement couldn't be done because Musharraf got into trouble on the CJI issue & the lawyers agitation that followed and Kayani withdrew his backing for the deal soon after Musharraf's exit. There were some demonstrations in Kashmir & the PPP government thought that they could get more & also backtracked. Then 26/11 happened & the rest is history.

 

[Stephen Cohen]

Kasuri was around the Musharraf time. That was pre-26/11.. and perhaps the only chance post Agra declaration to get a settlement that seemed to please everyone(although rumour has it that the Separatist leadership was not happy as the deal short changed them).

We have heard this rumour many times that India - Pakistan were close to a deal
in Musharraf's time

India was just being nice to Pakistan on the insistence of Washington DC

We had just been rewarded with the nuclear deal in 2005 by the US so we had to accept US
requests of " going along " with talks and the peace process

The whole deal was unmanageable ie soft borders ; demilitarisation ;
it would have only led to easier infiltration of armed intruders

Secondly once Gen Musharraf became busy with his domestic problems after
the LAWYERS ' movement and emergency and all that ;
India just quietly buried the whole thing

We knew that the infiltrators would cause problems in Kashmir ie terror strikes
and the whole peace process would come to an end but instead we got the shock of 26/11

And after that there has been no desire on India's part to talk on ANY issue

 

[Kaniska]

What is the red part?

Pakistan already realizes the idea that J&K is no longer a matter for sstrengthor direct conflict. Where do you think the whole proxy conflict and LeT came up from? they were not born yesterday.


My flag should give you an idea of relative safety.



Not really. I have a few friends there and their idea is quite correct. They DO like Pakistan but they want NOTHING more to do with militancy and having to live without basic facilities and education. They do NOT see the end to their struggle but only an evolution of it from an armed struggle to that of an intellectual one.

if this is the way they see their struggle, even they will find many supporters in India too...I think this is very much an accepted way to show your protest with any form of injustice as long as you are not following the path of violence.

 

[Alfa-Fighter]

what is average height of Mountain ranges in AJK.

tell me , It must be less then tibet ... or same as on Indian side.

18700+ / 17500 ft is what Indians drive on road in J&K ( world Highest Drivable roads open for civilian). check if you if road at that much height also

Once can from see the fact ... see your international airport and see ours world class Del / Mumbai / Bang and compare the development... you will know the difference.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

Nobody would want to. I dont want to live in a place where me and my family's safety is not guaranteed. If I cannot leave it with my entire family, then I need to ensure that safety. Even if it means making a deal with the devil.

Better a devil than any unknown angels........ or worse still; the Deep Sea!

 

[Sine Nomine]

tell me , It must be less then tibet ... or same as on Indian side.

18700+ / 17500 ft is what Indians drive on road in J&K ( world Highest Drivable roads open for civilian). check if you if road at that much height also

Once can from see the fact ... see your international airport and see ours world class Del / Mumbai / Bang and compare the development... you will know the difference.

In AJK peoples are not using donkeys there are too drivable roads and it's height greater then tibet and indian side and there is also project for bullet train with china.
Your world class Airport, what percentage of Indians are living in poverty,without homes and under rifle muzzle.

Because this enough to realize reality to some day dreamers.

Now Pakistan go and cry about Kashmir in UN as much as they can

Then why superpower India is afraid of referendum under UN.

 

[A1Kaid]

India pushing it's bs figures again trying to convince others that this is a message that Kashmiris actually like them.

 

[Sam Manekshaw]

India pushing it's bs figures again trying to convince others that this is a message that Kashmiris actually like them.

And how you come to know that it's BS figures?

 

[Storm Force]

A1,kaid India needs to prove nothing re Kashmir.

That's why there is no talks.

Nothing to talk about

Close the door now please when you leave.

 

[Wolfhound]

Great work. The process of "properly" integrating J&K into Rest of India has begun..

Great work. The process of "properly" integrating J&K into Rest of India has begun..

wow thats great! but didnt india partition in 1947?

 

[Sam Manekshaw]

wow thats great! but didnt india partition in 1947?

so do Pakistan in 1971

Note:- According to some PDF Pakistani members here India was never in existence before 15 Aug. 1947... If i take their logic seriously then Partition is unknown to India but for Pakistan it is well known.

 

[Wolfhound]

so do Pakistan in 1971

Note:- According to some PDF Pakistani members here India was never in existence before 15 Aug. 1947... If i take their logic seriously then Partition is unknown to India but for Pakistan it is well known.

did*

yes it did.your point being?
i never said that india never existed before 1947(stupid shit) you shouldnt make assumptions you arent too good at them
you have bad communicating skills i couldnt understand what you said after *if i take their logic seriously then*