1500 years old Bible in which 'Jesus predicts coming of Prophet Muhammad' unearthed in Turkey

[Thirdfront]

If the Quran was in Chinese thirdfront would say, "Why is it in Chinese"? LOL it could have been sent down in Martian and these guys still would find a problem with it.

When did I object it being written in arabic (not saudi)? But yes, even if it was in chinese AND was written down in the place it was written, LOT of people would have had less question. Is it a coincident that all religious texts (which claim to be for all of the humanity) were originally written in languages that are either dead now of understood by tiny minority of the people even in current day? Is it coincident that it was always "revealed" in the local language??

 

[M. Sarmad]

And where was this taken from? If a hadith that just goes into another circle where by @KingMamba already refuted that the hadith are not word of God no Muslim will tell you that...So you are using a source that is not word of God to disprove one that is?

There are authentic Shia narrations from their Imams clearly instructing their followers(i.e Shia) that what is between the covers (i.e Uthmanic Quran) is the perfect Quran , which they should follow . All reports which tell otherwise have been graded weak (/fabricated) by Shia Ullema themselves

 

[KingMamba]

So, then this did not happen "Muhammad (pbuh) was very vigilant in preserving the entire Quran in written form as well. The Prophet (pbuh) could not read or write, so as soon as a portion of the Quran was revealed, he called upon his scribes to record the revealed text.The Prophet (pbuh) specified the part of the Quran the revelation belonged to and had the companions read back what was written to ensure that it corresponded exactly with what was revealed.Thus, the complete Quran was not only memorized by the Prophet (pbuh) and many of his companions, but also existed in written form during his lifetime.Within a year after the Prophets (pbuh) death, a manuscript of the entire Quran was assembled by a committee led by the chief scribe of the Prophet (pbuh), who followed stringent criteria to safeguard against any errors" (general claim). They were so short of time that had to use shorthand before verse was forgotten? hmm... makes so much sense now...

Yes and that is what we have been telling you sir that the Quran was already made but it was only compiled into a book form in a certain order by Hazrat Usman RA, you do realize the Chinese were the first to have paper right or do you dispute that as well? The Quran was compiled into one order because companions began to bicker about the order of verses and the pronunciation so Usman RA sought to settle that and codified one standard.

The conclusion you come to is that oh he must have added or removed something. We say fine then just provide proof to that effect but you have nothing.

 

[Thirdfront]

Had he gone to a Muslim website he wouldnt have wasted 2.5 hrs of our time reading off anti Islamic websites !

Great. From guilt by association to honor by association fallacy...

 

[Dubious]

Great. From guilt by association to honor by association fallacy...

whatever sails your boat! It is a fact you rather go to a butcher than a surgeon to get you appendix removed?

When did I object it being written in arabic (not saudi)? But yes, even if it was in chinese AND was written down in the place it was written, LOT of people would have had less question. Is it a coincident that all religious texts (which claim to be for all of the humanity) were originally written in languages that are either dead now of understood by tiny minority of the people even in current day? Is it coincident that it was always "revealed" in the local language??

When did Arabic as a language die? So what do all of Middle East speak? Gaelic ?

 

[Thirdfront]

began to bicker about the order of verses and the pronunciation so Usman RA sought to settle that and codified one standard.

Not so. Bickering about the "content" of the verses. Example hadith- Bukhari: vol. 6, hadith 468, p. 441-442; book 60

 

[KingMamba]

When did I object it being written in arabic (not saudi)? But yes, even if it was in chinese AND was written down in the place it was written, LOT of people would have had less question. Is it a coincident that all religious texts (which claim to be for all of the humanity) were originally written in languages that are either dead now of understood by tiny minority of the people even in current day? Is it coincident that it was always "revealed" in the local language??

There is no doubt that the Quran was already written down when Hazrat Muhammad PBUH died the problem began with the bickering over verses and order of verses.

What you want a prophet of the Chinese to talk to the Chinese in a language they do not understand? It is common sense that God would send each nation a messenger to talk to them in their own language and he says as much in the Quran that each nation got a messenger and Muhammad PBUH is the last of these messengers.

Yes we know many of the languages are now dead which is why we say many holy books have been altered but guess what Arabic is not dead and is in fact one of the most spoken languages today and it is because of the Quran who God himself swore to protect from being lost in time. 1400 years later it is still here in tact in the same language it was revealed.

 

[Thirdfront]

whatever sails your boat! It is a fact you rather go to a butcher than a surgeon to get you appendix removed?


When did Arabic as a language die? So what do all of Middle East speak? Gaelic ?

No, it is second category, followed by only minority of people

 

[Dubious]

Not so. Bickering about the "content" of the verses. Example hadith- Bukhari: vol. 6, hadith 468, p. 441-442; book 60

And again...Let me ask you a simple question...can you prove the authenticity of that hadith? Can you prove it was narrated as it is stated and not adulterated as you claim of the Quran?

No, it is second category, followed by only minority of people

How much in minority are Arabs and Arabic speaking Africans? Oh and lets not forget the non native Arab speaking population who learnt Arabic to either criticize the Quran (non-Muslims who speak Arabic) or learn it better (Quranic scholars)? Minority indeed!

 

[Thirdfront]

Quran is not an operation manual, it is a book of signs and guidance... which are clearly and repeatedly defined in Quran.

It is more than that. Are you saying it is ok to do something against what it says (I know majority of the people do that exact thing but for you is it ok)?

 

[KingMamba]

Not so. Bickering about the "content" of the verses. Example hadith- Bukhari: vol. 6, hadith 468, p. 441-442; book 60

Narrated Ibrahim:

The companions of 'Abdullah (bin Mas'ud) came to Abi Darda', (and before they arrived at his home), he looked for them and found them. Then he asked them,: "Who among you can recite (Qur'an) as 'Abdullah recites it?" They replied, "All of us." He asked, "Who among you knows it by heart?" They pointed at 'Alqama. Then he asked Alqama. "How did you hear 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud reciting Surat Al-Lail (The Night)?" Alqama recited:

'By the male and the female.' Abu Ad-Darda said,

"I testify that I heard me Prophet reciting it likewise, but these people want me to recite it:--

'And by Him Who created male and female.' But by Allah, I will not follow them."

The red bold is talking about recitation, he said how did you hear it being said. You see that is why Usman RA standardized the text into one dialect so they would not bicker about little things like this, besides look at what they are talking about the change in pronunciation had no change on the meaning of the verse itself because the verse was the same but they were fighting over how to say it.

And again...Let me ask you a simple question...can you prove the authenticity of that hadith? Can you prove it was narrated as it is stated and not adulterated as you claim of the Quran?


How much in minority are Arabs and Arabic speaking Africans? Oh and lets not forget the non native Arab speaking population who learnt Arabic to either criticize the Quran (non-Muslims who speak Arabic) or learn it better (Quranic scholars)? Minority indeed!

He does not need to prove authenticity for this hadith because it does not prove what he claims at all.

 

[Thirdfront]

And again...Let me ask you a simple question...can you prove the authenticity of that hadith? Can you prove it was narrated as it is stated and not adulterated as you claim of the Quran?


How much in minority are Arabs and Arabic speaking Africans? Oh and lets not forget the non native Arab speaking population who learnt Arabic to either criticize the Quran (non-Muslims who speak Arabic) or learn it better (Quranic scholars)? Minority indeed!

They are not more than 5% of the total population, combined. It is minority isn't it??

 

[KingMamba]

No, it is second category, followed by only minority of people

Nearly 300 million speakers and rising is a minority to you? Fifth most spoken language on the planet out of hundreds if not thousand and you say minority just stop it sir.

They are not more than 5% of the total population, combined. It is minority isn't it??

You have to look at total number of languages before you compare and there is no latest info on how many people speak what today, only thing that is certain is Mandarin is number one.

 

[Thirdfront]

Narrated Ibrahim:

The companions of 'Abdullah (bin Mas'ud) came to Abi Darda', (and before they arrived at his home), he looked for them and found them. Then he asked them,: "Who among you can recite (Qur'an) as 'Abdullah recites it?" They replied, "All of us." He asked, "Who among you knows it by heart?" They pointed at 'Alqama. Then he asked Alqama. "How did you hear 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud reciting Surat Al-Lail (The Night)?" Alqama recited:

'By the male and the female.' Abu Ad-Darda said,

"I testify that I heard me Prophet reciting it likewise, but these people want me to recite it:--

'And by Him Who created male and female.' But by Allah, I will not follow them."

The red bold is talking about recitation, he said how did you hear it being said. You see that is why Usman RA standardized the text into one dialect so they would not bicker about little things like this, besides look at what they are talking about the change in pronunciation had no change on the meaning of the verse itself because the verse was the same but they were fighting over how to say it.



He does not need to prove authenticity for this hadith because it does not prove what he claims at all.

I gave the verifiable islamic source to prove the bickering was about content and not the order. Now suddenly it is not authentic?? what is authentic per you??

 

[BATMAN]

It is more than that. Are you saying it is ok to do something against what it says (I know majority of the people do that exact thing but for you is it ok)?

please, do not go out of context and make it more complicate.
If you havn't understood my post than go back and read your comments to which my reply is intended.