1300 hp engine unveiled

[Hack-Hook]

After all don't forget Desa company stand for Iran Heavy Diesel Manufacturing Company

And formed mainly to produce diesel engine for locomotives And powerplanets .

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

Do you have any proof to back up your statement? This can fit in a tank

I have no real proof exept that compared to the audiance members in attendance at the ceremony this engine looks much taller than a tank engine especially for a Karrar tank that is based on the T-72. Do you have any proof that this engine actually fits? Those Photos you posted of the T-72 and T-90 engines dont really give a good indication of their size compared to this 1300hp engine. I do hope you are right but to me it doesent look like it would fit.

 

[Sine Nomine]

Great Going Iran.I would like to see industrial cooperation between Pakistan and Iran.

 

[VEVAK]

A good achievement was unveiled by defence ministry of Iranian armed forces. A diesel engine which could possibly be used in Karrar tank, and also for FACs of IRGC naval forces.

To watch the video of this engine, refer to this website
http://www.irinn.ir/fa/news/602845/خط-تولید-موتوردیزلی-ملی-1300-اسب-بار

Nice but currently the production is way too low at 50 units per year for it to be worth the effort and Iran needs to work towards increasing production from 1 per week to 1 per day at one facility for it to be both worth the effort and hopefully they'll get enough orders to do that within the next few years so they can meet all the demands for that size engine

~100 per year should go towards Armored Units Tanks & IFV
~50 per year should go towards Naval both civil and military
~50 for other civil and military use in Iran Trains, trucks, generators,....
~50-100 for export products bot civil and military

 

[PeeD]

It's a heavy duty engine, it is designed to work continuously at ~1 MW power.
A lighter tank variant of it would work with transient power levels, reaching max power only for limited time periods.

Lets see how long it takes until a tank variant is ready. In the photos we can already see two different heavy duty variants. If they have mastered the design and serial production, the step to a light weight tank variant is not that big and they stated that it is one of the goals.

 

[mohsen]

The problem with Ahmadinejad era. Achievement were many of them were unveiled before they really become ready and were still in development . incidentally it was the case with Rafsanjani unveiling .
So it can be another such cases or it can be what you said.

By the way by looking at the ceremony and the production capacity of the company you wonder if the target is civilian sector like trains instead of military sector for example use in tanks.

Notice that even the projects which Ahmadinejad didn't unveil, a few months later were unveiled in early stages by Rouhani and then either were suspended or advanced very slowly.
Problem isn't when to unveil, other countries unveil when their projects is nothing but a painting, problem is that Rouhani stopped funding all national projects in the hope of getting a better one after his shitty deal.


And about D87 engine, currently it's just used as power generator for producing electricity, that's why the production line is so small. at this point, it's specifications doesn't suit any vehicle, so I don't think we would see it in any truck or tank in near future, specially with current president!

 

[Hack-Hook]

Nice but currently the production is way too low at 50 units per year for it to be worth the effort and Iran needs to work towards increasing production from 1 per week to 1 per day at one facility for it to be both worth the effort and hopefully they'll get enough orders to do that within the next few years so they can meet all the demands for that size engine

~100 per year should go towards Armored Units Tanks & IFV
~50 per year should go towards Naval both civil and military
~50 for other civil and military use in Iran Trains, trucks, generators,....
~50-100 for export products bot civil and military

I doubt if we can make it competitive with for example what Siemens offer at least at this stage so I guess at this stage foreign export is out of question . and for naval use well it can be used that but honestly we already have Bonyan for that what we need in that field is a Gas turbine generator compact enough so it can be used in naval ships and let be frank we can't achieve that unless we master production of newer generation of alloys and for military use in tanks well we need a smaller version of it . we don't have tanks big enough so this engine be an easy fit for it . we must produce a smaller and a little weaker engine for it that is more suitable for our tanks or manage to tweak it can be smaller but produce the same amount of power and my guess is the first solution is more realistic for us at this times. Don't forget or tanks have roughly the same weight and size as T-72 and that tank come with two engine one 780hp and another one 1130hp that is used in the latest generation . so even if we manage to compact the engine at the price of 20% loss in power that won't be catastrophic.

Notice that even the projects which Ahmadinejad didn't unveil, a few months later were unveiled in early stages by Rouhani and then either were suspended or advanced very slowly.
Problem isn't when to unveil, other countries unveil when their projects is nothing but a painting, problem is that Rouhani stopped funding all national projects in the hope of getting a better one after his shitty deal.


And about D87 engine, currently it's just used as power generator for producing electricity, that's why the production line is so small. at this point, it's specifications doesn't suit any vehicle, so I don't think we would see it in any truck or tank in near future, specially with current president!

That's the problem that we have our defence industry instead of being a private industry monitored by government is a governmental industry . and sadly there is not much competition in it .just looking good so you don't loose your management sit.

By the way I won't say what Rouhani did was all peachy and fantastic , but be realistic can you compare for example was unveiling of Hamaseh at the time of Ahmadinejad the same as it at the time of Roohani ?
Was it wise to abandon Shafaq in favour of Wager which is a lot harder to master ?

 

[AmirPatriot]

Artesh is said to be the first customer, they need a better engine for old tanks such as challengers and American ones. Could be a part of modernization by Artesh

If IRGC decides to use Karrar tanks, it's possible that this engine will be one of the main choices for it.

@AmirPatriot brother, what do you think? I expected a gas turbine engine for Karrar, however, our sources are just talking about possibilities. Given that Artesh is buying this engine, with the least doubt, it's going to power up the old tanks that had troubled engines.

A gas turbine engine is a logistical nightmare which maybe the Americans can afford, but no-one else. Even the Soviets stopped producing the T-80 because its gas turbine powerplant was causing issues.

As for this specific engine, @OldTwilight's figures indicate it is too big.

DESA engine

Length: 2400 mm
Height: 1370 mm
Weight: 1558 kg

T-90A engine (V-92S2)

Length (mm): 1480
Height (mm): 896
Width (mm): 902
Weight (kg): 1020

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product893.html

Just larger and heavier by quite a large margin. I don't think this could fit into a T-72/T-90/Karrar chassis.

 

[Muhammed45]

A gas turbine engine is a logistical nightmare which maybe the Americans can afford, but no-one else. Even the Soviets stopped producing the T-80 because its gas turbine powerplant was causing issues.

As for this specific engine, @OldTwilight's figures indicate it is too big.

DESA engine

Length: 2400 mm
Height: 1370 mm
Weight: 1558 kg

T-90A engine (V-92S2)

Length (mm): 1480
Height (mm): 896
Width (mm): 902
Weight (kg): 1020

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product893.html

Just larger and heavier by quite a large margin. I don't think this could fit into a T-72/T-90/Karrar chassis.

See also

http://khabarone.ir/news/17053092/بهره-برداری-از-خط-تولید-موتور-دیزل-ملی

In this video clip, there is two engines, one in blue the other in red color. There must be plenty of its variants for multiple purposes, in defence and civil use of it.
The dimensions suggested by OldTwilight has no actual source on the Web. Any credible source is appreciated

A gas turbine engine is a logistical nightmare which maybe the Americans can afford, but no-one else. Even the Soviets stopped producing the T-80 because its gas turbine powerplant was causing issues.

 

[VEVAK]

A gas turbine engine is a logistical nightmare which maybe the Americans can afford, but no-one else. Even the Soviets stopped producing the T-80 because its gas turbine powerplant was causing issues.

As for this specific engine, @OldTwilight's figures indicate it is too big.

DESA engine

Length: 2400 mm
Height: 1370 mm
Weight: 1558 kg

T-90A engine (V-92S2)

Length (mm): 1480
Height (mm): 896
Width (mm): 902
Weight (kg): 1020

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product893.html

Just larger and heavier by quite a large margin. I don't think this could fit into a T-72/T-90/Karrar chassis.

I doubt if we can make it competitive with for example what Siemens offer at least at this stage so I guess at this stage foreign export is out of question . and for naval use well it can be used that but honestly we already have Bonyan for that what we need in that field is a Gas turbine generator compact enough so it can be used in naval ships and let be frank we can't achieve that unless we master production of newer generation of alloys and for military use in tanks well we need a smaller version of it . we don't have tanks big enough so this engine be an easy fit for it . we must produce a smaller and a little weaker engine for it that is more suitable for our tanks or manage to tweak it can be smaller but produce the same amount of power and my guess is the first solution is more realistic for us at this times. Don't forget or tanks have roughly the same weight and size as T-72 and that tank come with two engine one 780hp and another one 1130hp that is used in the latest generation . so even if we manage to compact the engine at the price of 20% loss in power that won't be catastrophic.


That's the problem that we have our defence industry instead of being a private industry monitored by government is a governmental industry . and sadly there is not much competition in it .just looking good so you don't loose your management sit.

By the way I won't say what Rouhani did was all peachy and fantastic , but be realistic can you compare for example was unveiling of Hamaseh at the time of Ahmadinejad the same as it at the time of Roohani ?
Was it wise to abandon Shafaq in favour of Wager which is a lot harder to master ?

Right but you still have the option of building a chasse around your engine since building a chasse is by far easier than an engine but I personally think a few adjustments should do the trick and yes the engines may be bigger but compared to a Tank it's not comparison and yes I would say it's doubtful that Iran would go though that trouble unless forced to do so due to sanctions especially since current production rates are at only 1 per week and your going to need them for Rails, Generators, Industrial equipment, Naval,.....

I think 1300 HP is more than sufficient in terms of power

 

[Hack-Hook]

Right but you still have the option of building a chasse around your engine since building a chasse is by far easier than an engine but I personally think a few adjustments should do the trick and yes the engines may be bigger but compared to a Tank it's not comparison and yes I would say it's doubtful that Iran would go though that trouble unless forced to do so due to sanctions especially since current production rates are at only 1 per week and your going to need them for Rails, Generators, Industrial equipment, Naval,.....

I think 1300 HP is more than sufficient in terms of power

1300hp is far more than that you need for a tank in class of late at even around 2/3th of that is enough. The problem is if we don't made it smaller we had to make the chassis bigger and that offer more opportunities but it also mean instead of a 45ton tank you have a 80t tank and then you'll need a more powerful engine .you see a 65tom Abram m1 or merkava uses a 1500hp engine.

 

[VEVAK]

1300hp is far more than that you need for a tank in class of late at even around 2/3th of that is enough. The problem is if we don't made it smaller we had to make the chassis bigger and that offer more opportunities but it also mean instead of a 45ton tank you have a 80t tank and then you'll need a more powerful engine .you see a 65tom Abram m1 or merkava uses a 1500hp engine.

You arguing over nothing brother! 1st off a production rate of 50 unites per year is just not sufficient to meet the needs of the countries Armored Unites so as I said unless Iran is forced to they will not use that engine for Tanks!

I would say it's more likely that they'll buy until they can produce a more suitable engine.

 

[PeeD]

The good news is that th engine has a TBO of 30k hours. It is a heavy duty, high durability engine made to work for many hours and close to the whole lifetime at max power of 1300HP.

A tank engine would be less durable --> lighter --> smaller --> work in total at a much lower power level, reaching max power only in 20% of the lifetime.

Hence I'm looking forward for a tank variant in 2-3 years.
They now got the production line running and the part suppliers manufacturing with all the management behind the scene.
The difficult part is doe done, the rest, expansion and variations will go quite fast hopefully.

 

[Muhammed45]

The good news is that th engine has a TBO of 30k hours. It is a heavy duty, high durability engine made to work for many hours and close to the whole lifetime at max power of 1300HP.

A tank engine would be less durable --> lighter --> smaller --> work in total at a much lower power level, reaching max power only in 20% of the lifetime.

Hence I'm looking forward for a tank variant in 2-3 years.
They now got the production line running and the part suppliers manufacturing with all the management behind the scene.
The difficult part is doe done, the rest, expansion and variations will go quite fast hopefully.

Just one question, why is Artesh buying this engine? Is it suitable to be equipped inside old challengers? I remember that challengers had troubled engines.

1300hp is far more than that you need for a tank in class of late at even around 2/3th of that is enough. The problem is if we don't made it smaller we had to make the chassis bigger and that offer more opportunities but it also mean instead of a 45ton tank you have a 80t tank and then you'll need a more powerful engine .you see a 65tom Abram m1 or merkava uses a 1500hp engine.

Also the Chinese type 99, Japanese type 90

 

[Bahram Esfandiari]

Just one question, why is Artesh buying this engine? Is it suitable to be equipped inside old challengers? I remember that challengers had troubled engines.

I don't think the artesh is buying this specific Engine. I think that they want to work with the company to develop a High output diesel Tank engine. Iran never purchased Challenger tanks, only Chieftain although the Shah had placed an order with UK to develop a tank for Iran (Shir-2) which the British further developed into the Challenger tank.