Russians Use Iranian Anti-Armor Guided Missiles

[TheImmortal]

not last days about the half way through the war and it won't change the fact israel used 30000 soldier against less than 2000 fighter

They did not use 30,000. They called up 30,000 reservists. There is a difference. And you know it.

or probably due to the fact they were not that portable
now tell me what anti tank weapon hezbollah used the most and there is no photo of them falling in hand of Israel?

At the time AT-4 was the most widely used by HZ less range and capability, but easier set up and greater quantities.

You are comparing 2006 to the era of social media 2023 and wondering why there aren’t more pictures? Is this a joke? That’s like answering why there arent more pictures of captured military equipment in WW2….

Add to the fact Israel is one of the most famous military censorship countries in the world and the war was a giant blunder.

professor , they meant rocket like Kalibre-1 , Fajr-5, Grad and so not ATGM

Pire mard, I know. I am saying that even their rocket stores (main deterrence) weren’t even 50% used! That should give you an indication how much longer HZ could have fought (likely another 4 months easily).

 

[Neby Rakachun]

not last days about the half way through the war and it won't change the fact israel used 30000 soldier against less than 2000 fighter

Having 30,000 soldiers does not mean 30,000 soldiers engaged in combat, most were just covering flanks. Israel only had 121 soldiers dying, this shows how this ground invasion wasn't serious. In comparison the Russians have tens of thousands of casualties for a small city

If i didn't know you, i would have said that you are trying to objurgate our defense achievements. I say night is dark, you still insist that its light as snow. Here you are :

View attachment 928699

The launcher and missile together have a weight of 27 Kg in total. The war is not like you load missiles and launchers on the shoulders of 1 poor soldier and ask him to walk into the frontline. Every soldier of anti tank units carries an specified part of ATGM.

The 8 Km version is an air launched one. The man portable version has a range of 3,500 m at night and 5,500 m in light of day.

Israel cannot fight in multiple fronts, they avoided attacking Syria when they were engaged with Lebanon. Iran did not transfer heavy weapons but sent them aid through Syria.

Can't fight on multiple fronts? Lol we can fight on all fronts and win within days

let rephrase it for you .
Hezbollah during the war only used what they had in storage . no weapon from foreign sources and as they were not aware how long the war will last , it was illogical for them to abandon their best ATGM on battlefield if it was logical for them to also transport them
and what air , israel used more than 30000 soldier against 2000 hezbollah fighter , the war included some heated clash that last for days no where israel soldier went that they didn't face resistance , then can you explain how it only was an air campaign ?

still storages, not in a positions they were using to engage israel forces. those were system reserved for immediate use against israel attack

against several thousand fighter , not firing several thousands against 14-16 fighter in just 3 day

Those are a few photos I found of captured ATGMs, I'm not sure of their type.

You just proved that watching "Hollywood" films - which is something you actually engage in as opposed to me, will not improve one's English comprehension skills all too much.

Hence why the quoted gibberish is way off and perfectly missing the point of the twin objections I rightly raised to the foregoing produce of your logorrhea.

Thus, to repeat:

1) There's no evidence those boxes aren't empty. Tellingly no launcher is visible.

2) They could originate from a hidden weapons cache detected by the zionists. There's nothing on those photographs to conclusively establish that HezbOllah fighters abandoned them in the midst of combat operations. Sniper rifles are visible too, doesn't mean they were left there because they weigh too much now, does it?

In other words, nothing proves HezbOllah fighters had been actively utilizing those arms at the front in the first place. The items may indeed have been part of an unmanned cache discovered by the enemy. You understand what a cache is? By your logic, HezbOllah thought Dragunov rifles are too heavy to be carried by personnel, because three such rifles form part of the displayed equipment and you're assuming that what we're seeing is weaponry abandoned as a result of urgent troop relocation.

In short, I never remotely insinuated "HezbOllah fighters lift objects weighing >60kg across the battlefield" - this is a pure figment of your bizarre imagination (while your misplaced implicit sarcasm against the Resistance tends to expose where you stand). Nor do we care about off-topic anecdotes from conscription days. In essence you're gratuitously deriving various baseless conclusions from the documents you shared and your line of argumentation has consistently been flawed.

My suggestion, lay off whatever blurred your elementary senses when you cobbled together that piece of balderdash.

Now try reading again.

Sorry dude if you think Kornet is somehow man portable you might want to re-evaluate some life choices

Hezbollah's only advantage is that they're light weight, those are the mountains of Lebanon we're talking about, try climbing the stairs in some building with 50kg on you and you'll pass out before you reach the 10th floor.

Kornets are Squad portable. Not man portable.

Elite units here carry around 55 percent body weight for 55 kilometres in their training but it slows them down, for Hezbollah to be slowed down means death. Carrying more than 50 percent body weight for anywhere more than a few hundred meters basically gurantees injuries.

To carry a alone Kornet you need a 130kg, REALLY fit guy that could climb mountains with it as well. And that's without taking water, food and any other stuff he might need with him.

Anyway, Kornets are not going to be useful in the future

 

[SalarHaqq]

Sorry dude if you think Kornet is somehow man portable you might want to re-evaluate some life choices

Hezbollah's only advantage is that they're light weight, those are the mountains of Lebanon we're talking about, try climbing the stairs in some building with 50kg on you and you'll pass out before you reach the 10th floor.

Kornets are Squad portable. Not man portable.

Elite units here carry around 55 percent body weight for 55 kilometres in their training but it slows them down, for Hezbollah to be slowed down means death. Carrying more than 50 percent body weight for anywhere more than a few hundred meters basically gurantees injuries.

To carry a alone Kornet you need a 130kg, REALLY fit guy that could climb mountains with it as well. And that's without taking water, food and any other stuff he might need with him.

Anyway, Kornets are not going to be useful in the future

Another person with reading comprehension issues, unbelievable. I wasn't discussing whether or not Kornet is manportable, but demonstrating how the reasoning put forth to reach the conclusion was flawed. Moreover I rightly underscored the unsubstantiated nature of the claim that the Kornet misses targets "more often than normal".

 

[Neby Rakachun]

Another person with reading comprehension issues. Unbelievable. I was not discussing whether or not Kornet is manportable, but demonstrating how the reasoning put forth by that user to reach the conclusion, is flawed. Moreover I rightly underscored the unsubstantiated nature of the claim according to which it misses targets "more often than normal".

It did miss twice on the same target, a Spike missile operator would never miss such a shot.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/o39cxh

 

[SalarHaqq]

It did miss twice on the same target, a Spike missile operator would never miss such a shot.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/o39cxh

Proves nothing about the system.

1) Single example, that's never enough to draw a sweeping conclusion. Dozens if not hundreds of test would have to be conducted, and comparable systems with identical guidance system tested under the exact same conditions for comparison.

2) Possibility of human error for whatever reason, and many such reasons are conceivable.

In short, this is not scientific deduction it's bar room talk.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Those are a few photos I found of captured ATGMs, I'm not sure of their type.

wondering if they are AT-4 or AT-5 I believe I see an AT-3 at the last row of the third picture

Proves nothing about the system.

1) Single example, that's never enough to draw a sweeping conclusion. Dozens if not hundreds of test would have to be conducted, and comparable systems with identical guidance system tested under the exact same conditions for comparison.

2) Possibility of human error for whatever reason, and many such reasons are conceivable.

In short, this is not scientific deduction it's bar room talk.

Salar , you are discussing a mute point , Kornet flight pattern is unpredictable , its like a drunken Bee, it help protect it against direct kill system , but o other hand it reduce the precision , its simple physics , if the target is small the chance of miss is higher . that is why i told you in tests i saw it usually hit at periphery of target , your chance of miss if you target a jeep is alot higher than when you target a tank because of difference in size not because of the operator

 

[SalarHaqq]

Salar , you are discussing a mute point , Kornet flight pattern is unpredictable , its like a drunken Bee, it help protect it against direct kill system , but o other hand it reduce the precision , its simple physics , if the target is small the chance of miss is higher . that is why i told you in tests i saw it usually hit at periphery of target , your chance of miss if you target a jeep is alot higher than when you target a tank because of difference in size not because of the operator

Don't talk as if you supervized testing of the Kornet ATGM. Token anecdotal examples do not allow to pass judgement in this regard.

But even assuming the above is accurate, the phrasing "higher than normal miss" (sic) would've still been inappropriate and must therefore be taken issue with.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Don't talk as if you supervized testing of the Kornet ATGM. Token anecdotal examples do not allow to pass judgement in this regard.

But even assuming the above is accurate, the phrasing "higher than normal miss" (sic) would've still been inappropriate and must therefore be taken issue with.

a tow have lesser chance of missing , what i can say then.
can you show me some test that prove your point ?

 

[SalarHaqq]

a tow have lesser chance of missing , what i can say then.

Substantiate that assertion with evidence. You're making the tall claims, burden of proof's therefore on you.

Unlike what you've been insinuating due to the weapon's non-western origin, Dehlavie / Kornet is not sub-par system at all which is why Iran has adopted and is mass-producing it.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Substantiate that assertion with evidence. You're making the tall claims, burden of proof's therefore on you.

Unlike what you've been insinuating due to the weapon's non-western origin, Dehlavie / Kornet is not sub-par system at all which is why Iran has adopted and is mass-producing it.

who said its subpar , it has higher penetration , the problem is its miss chance increase by distance and size of the target .
that distance part is applicable to all atgm , but the size is more prominent with Kornet because of how it fly also like the rest of Russians system it vary dramatically on domestic and export system for example tracker on Russians Kornet is 5 time more accurate than the one on export ones so it allow them to use it upto 10km while the export ones only work upto 5500m .
and well yes tow a lot depend on the gunner , a poor gunner on tow can have a hit probability of upto 10% but a trained a proficient one has the hit probability of north of 90% which is higher than kornet .
by the way the discussion here is if systems like toophan and dehlavyeh are man portable or platoon portable we don't discuss the precision. and how much you argue don't change the fact that Almas missile with just 40% of the weight is actually man portable but Dehlavieh and Toofan are not

 

[SalarHaqq]

who said its subpar ,

In that case the formulation "higher than normal miss" was uncalled for.

and well yes tow a lot depend on the gunner , a poor gunner on tow can have a hit probability of upto 10% but a trained a proficient one has the hit probability of north of 90% which is higher than kornet .

You don't know this, since to make such an assertion one would need to run elaborate comparative tests and you aren't privy to the results of such tests supposing they were actually carried out.

 

[Muhammed45]

27kg is the weight of the kornet missile
the 29kg is the weight of the missile and tube .
63.5 kg is the weight of the missile plus tube plus tripod plus firing unit . instead of that wrong article why not look at other sources or you here claim that Iranian version of kornet has 40% of the weight of the russian version ?
its a simple google search

kornet missile weight - Recherche Google

and no the 3km increase in range belong to Dehlavieh-2 your nomber is related to dehlavieh-1 which is based on export version of kornet , they improved the missile last year.
View attachment 928819

Then Iran has improved its subsystems in Dehlavieh version

 

[Hack-Hook]

You don't know this, since to make such an assertion one would need to run elaborate comparative tests and you aren't privy to the results of such tests supposing they were actually carried out.

I don't knew , that is what Us Army say

 

[SalarHaqq]

I don't knew , that is what Us Army say

Such figures aren't available for the Kornet.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Then Iran has improved its subsystems in Dehlavieh version

View attachment 929420

by that photo it mean iran reduced the weight of the missile to half from 27kg to 15kg
the photo is complete bulshit or the dehlavieh no longer is kornet made in Iran this is more likely

22.7 + 26 = 48.8kg
still twice the weight of Almas + launcher