What's new

Indian Navy gets firepower in its armoury

Well I don't think Americans would sell India any ship, there is still the issue of technology that the US is not likely to share. Which is why India usually buys from Russia and France who willingly share their technology case and point the Arihant Nuke sub which had assistance from the Russian or at least it incorporates some Russian design.

US won't share the Aegis AD system. But India have no need for tech transfer of this system as India won't be able to absorb them anyway. And why go for inferior European or Russian systems if India can obtain the best system in the world, even without tech transfer. Trust me, none of the European or Russian systems are any where close to an Aegis system and I believe Indians deserve the best air defense system out there for its navy. Also, if India cannot absorb ACS, why waste money in tech transfer.

Well, the South Koreans and Japanese built their own Arleigh Burke derivatives with US coorperation, who knows what India might be able to do at some point in the future. Next is Australia with their Spanish F100 (another eurofrigate) derived AWD that uses Aegis. Scaling down one more step is Norways Spanish built Nansen class. The first three countries are key US allies in Asia essentially since WW2 and Spain and Norway are NATO partners, so ... don´t hold your breath!

US had offered it to India about 5 years ago. look it up.
 
US won't share the Aegis AD system. But India have no need for tech transfer of this system as India won't be able to absorb them anyway. And why go for inferior European or Russian systems if India can obtain the best system in the world, even without tech transfer. Trust me, none of the European or Russian systems are any where close to an Aegis system and I believe Indians deserve the best air defense system out there for its navy. Also, if India cannot absorb ACS, why waste money in tech transfer.

It is true that US ships are best in the world, but it doesn't mean that all countries go for them. India buys from Russian and the European because India can learn a heck of a lot from the tech transfer. Indian Navy is not going to fighting the US navy so there is no point in having the US ships, the European and Russian technology are also world class and are more than able fulfill the needs of the navy. Rather just buying, the Navy is trying to make ships at home using the knowledge it gains from the ToT. The Europeans have access to the American technology which they incorporate in their own designs so in the end India gets the technology. As for the defense system for ships, the Israelis are going to supply the defense system and the Israelis have good experience in building such system so it is fine with the IN. India has no current need for US systems in its ships.
 
US won't share the Aegis AD system. But India have no need for tech transfer of this system as India won't be able to absorb them anyway. And why go for inferior European or Russian systems if India can obtain the best system in the world, even without tech transfer. Trust me, none of the European or Russian systems are any where close to an Aegis system and I believe Indians deserve the best air defense system out there for its navy. Also, if India cannot absorb ACS, why waste money in tech transfer.



US had offered it to India about 5 years ago. look it up.

In one breath you say:
US won't share the Aegis AD system and US offered AEGIS to India
India needs US Aegis ships and India have no need for tech transfer of this system

That´s somewhat inconsistent.

You are aware that The Netherlands Navy intends to use the De Zeven Provinciën class (LCF) in a limited Ballistic Missile Defence (BMD) role, having recently awarded a contract for modification of the ships’ Thales SMART-L and APAR radars? There is nothing particularly inferior about it, certainly not when compared to IN ship fielded or shortly to be fielded.
In Brief: The Netherlands’ De Zeven Provinciën class frigates | Security Scholar
De Zeven Provinciën class frigate
 
It is true that US ships are best in the world, but it doesn't mean that all countries go for them. India buys from Russian and the European because India can learn a heck of a lot from the tech transfer. Indian Navy is not going to fighting the US navy so there is no point in having the US ships, the European and Russian technology are also world class and are more than able fulfill the needs of the navy. Rather just buying, the Navy is trying to make ships at home using the knowledge it gains from the ToT. The Europeans have access to the American technology which they incorporate in their own designs so in the end India gets the technology. As for the defense system for ships, the Israelis are going to supply the defense system and the Israelis have good experience in building such system so it is fine with the IN. India has no current need for US systems in its ships.

My point is that India should not go for an inferior system that cannot protect its AC but provide tech transfer that India won't be able to absorb any way. Rather, it should go for a system that can provide area air defense but without tech transfer. Tech transfer have not done anything for India as India have proven that it is not capable of absorbing foreign technology. Why not spending the money for the best equipment.
 
My point is that India should not go for an inferior system that cannot protect its AC but provide tech transfer that India won't be able to absorb any way. Rather, it should go for a system that can provide area air defense but without tech transfer. Tech transfer have not done anything for India as India have proven that it is not capable of absorbing foreign technology. Why not spending the money for the best equipment.

We don't need the best equipment in the world, because our potential enemies are not exactly world class either. Neither pak nor CHina. We don't need aegis to defend against china's ding dong missiles, or Pakistani copies of the same. After all, Chinese navy has NEVER fired a shot in anger, and probably never will. Our present equipment is more than enough to deal with your harbor queens, megaton f@rts notwithstanding.

Now since you have clowned on yet another thread and made TWO self contradivtory statements in one troll post, as pointed above, don't you think you should quietly slip away from this thread and start trolling on another, like you always do after you get owned?

In one breath you say:
US won't share the Aegis AD system and US offered AEGIS to India
India needs US Aegis ships and India have no need for tech transfer of this system

That´s somewhat inconsistent.

You are aware that The Netherlands Navy intends to use the De Zeven Provinciën class (LCF) in a limited Ballistic Missile Defence (BMD) role, having recently awarded a contract for modification of the ships’ Thales SMART-L and APAR radars? There is nothing particularly inferior about it, certainly not when compared to IN ship fielded or shortly to be fielded.
In Brief: The Netherlands’ De Zeven Provinciën class frigates | Security Scholar
De Zeven Provinciën class frigate

Maybe you haven't visited any India related threads recently. If you did, you would know that the person you are responding to is only here to troll and flame. A junior think tank's energies shouldn't be wasted on him. Just saying.
 
In one breath you say:
US won't share the Aegis AD system and US offered AEGIS to India
India needs US Aegis ships and India have no need for tech transfer of this system

That´s somewhat inconsistent.

You are aware that The Netherlands Navy intends to use the De Zeven Provinciën class (LCF) in a limited Ballistic Missile Defence (BMD) role, having recently awarded a contract for modification of the ships’ Thales SMART-L and APAR radars? There is nothing particularly inferior about it, certainly not when compared to IN ship fielded or shortly to be fielded.
In Brief: The Netherlands’ De Zeven Provinciën class frigates | Security Scholar
De Zeven Provinciën class frigate

If I have to demonstrate the obvious to you, I will.

US is willing to sell the system but not willing to share the technology.
India should buy the system but forget about the technology. Its the best technology and US won't want to share it with any one.

If you want a reliable air combat system out there, Aegis is the only choice.
 
If I have to demonstrate the obvious to you, I will.

US is willing to sell the system but not willing to share the technology.
India should buy the system but forget about the technology. Its the best technology and US won't want to share it with any one.

If you want a reliable air combat system out there, Aegis is the only choice.

If it was obvious, I wouldn´t have to make you spell it out. Clearly, none of the 4 export customers of AEGIS asked or got the technology: it is a non-issue to discuss. Meanwhile, what supports your claim that e.g. Thales Sewaco FD and Tacticos are less reliable than AEGIS?

http://www.es.northropgrumman.com/s...ent/assets/integrated-combat-management-s.pdf
http://articles.janes.com/articles/...n-control-And-COmmand-system-Netherlands.html
 
If it was obvious, I wouldn´t have to make you spell it out. Clearly, none of the 4 export customers of AEGIS asked or got the technology: it is a non-issue to discuss. Meanwhile, what supports your claim that e.g. Thales Sewaco FD and Tacticos are less reliable than AEGIS?

http://www.es.northropgrumman.com/s...ent/assets/integrated-combat-management-s.pdf

Is that even a debate? You would be the first to raise the question, why don't you look it up as no serious person in here would spend too much time on that. A quick hint, European generally need American help when producing advance weapons.
 
Is that even a debate? You would be the first to raise the question, why don't you look it up as no serious person in here would spend too much time on that. A quick hint, European generally need American help when producing advance weapons.
A quick hint: look up ´Hazemeyer mount´ and ´Hazemeyer's Radar Type 282 ´. That´s how far back Thales Netherlands goes. Hazemeyers Signaalapparaten dates back to 1922 and became Hollandse Signaal Apparaten (HSA) or Signaal after acquisition by Phillips in 1956. It became Thales Netherlands after it was taken over by Thomson-CSF in 1990. Even back then, US and UK bought from the Netherlands. And e.g. the Mk 92 Fire Control System is a US-built medium-range anti-aircraft missile and gun fire control system. It was developed for the Oliver Hazard Perry class guided missile frigates. The system is a licensed USN version of the Thales Nederland WM-25 fire control system. Both CAS and STIR are Dutch products. Just an example. Did I mention Goalkeeper CIWS?

______________

The Bofors had a curious introduction to naval service as it was originally adopted by the Army (a fortunate change of mind; the 2pdr was initially selected instead). Its obvious qualities led to its adoption by the Navy in 1941, the first ships equipped being the Prince of Wales, Nelson, Manchester and Erebus. These guns, and many others fitted to warships, were of the air-cooled Army pattern only slightly modified for Naval use and the single mountings weighed between 1,200 and 1,400kg; about the same as the 2pdr.

The air cooling obviously limited the continuous rate of fire (the 2pdr, and even the 5in Vickers, were almost invariably water--cooled although the Oerlikon was not). The Navy therefore adopted the twin-barrelled water-cooled Hazemeyer mounting of Dutch origin, the first RN vessel so equipped being the Whimbrel in November 1942. This was a complex mounting, triaxially stabilised so that the guns would (at least in theory) be held on target regardless of ship movement, but it weighed over 7,000kg and was not noted for reliability. Towards the end of the war the simpler and lighter (6.500kg) Mk V twin mounting was developed instead and this became the standard postwar twin mounting.

Water-cooled Bofors guns were also supplied from the USA in both twin and quadruple mountings, weighing about 6,000 and 11,000kg respectively. Finally, mention must be made of two British mountings which did not see service until after the War; the six-barrel Mk VI, fitted in Vanguard, which weighed nearly 22,000kg, and the awesome 15,000kg twin STAAG, a sort of "Super Hazemeyer" with its own on-mount radar. The theoretical performance of this mounting did not compensate for its weight and complexity and it did not long survive.
http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/RNCIWS.html

http://navalhistory.flixco.info/H/56149/8330/a0.htm
 
@faithfulguy

There is very little an Aegis-equipped DDG can do that the P-15A DDG (with ELM-2248 AESA radar, RAN-40L radar, Barak-8 SAM system) can't.

Aegis is the name of a combat management system, which includes several components, if you put in a radar, a SAM system as a package and give it a combined name, they will be considered equivalents of Aegis.

British DDGs with SAMPSON AESA radars & Aster-15/30 SAMs are no worse than a Aegis DDG. Neither is P-15A DDG with MFSTAR AESA radars & Barak-8 SAMs.

So my advice to you is, go back to praying for your almighty American support pillars.
You live and breathe America it seems, you crazed America-worshipper.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
@faithfulguy

There is very little an Aegis-equipped DDG can do that the P-15A DDG (with ELM-2248 AESA radar, RAN-40L radar, Barak-8 SAM system) can't.

Aegis is the name of a combat management system, which includes several components, if you put in a radar, a SAM system as a package and give it a combined name, they will be considered equivalents of Aegis.

British DDGs with SAMPSON AESA radars & Aster-15/30 SAMs are no worse than a Aegis DDG. Neither is P-15A DDG with MFSTAR AESA radars & Barak-8 SAMs.

So my advice to you is, go back to praying for your almighty American support pillars.
You live and breathe America it seems, you crazed America-worshipper.

The latest Aster missile and yet to be field Barak-8 missile can be as good as SM-3 missile? You must be kidding. Aegis ACS is now part of the naval THAAD. Does Israel or the British has ability to produced THAAD like system? Well Israel is developing David's Sling and had developed Iron dome with help from LM. So do not question the preeminence of the US military technology supremacy. I do not worship US, I do have a God that I worship and his name is definitely not Barack Hussein Obama. But its beyond any doubt that US is head and shoulders beyond everyone else combined in military technology.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
If I have to demonstrate the obvious to you, I will.

US is willing to sell the system but not willing to share the technology.
India should buy the system but forget about the technology. Its the best technology and US won't want to share it with any one.

If you want a reliable air combat system out there, Aegis is the only choice.

why dont yu sell it to us with TOT...both of us will profit...:) what say....
 
The latest Aster missile and yet to be field Barak-8 missile can be as good as SM-3 missile? You must be kidding. Aegis ACS is now part of the naval THAAD. Does Israel or the British has ability to produced THAAD like system? Well Israel is developing David's Sling and had developed Iron dome with help from LM. So do not question the preeminence of the US military technology supremacy. I do not worship US, I do have a God that I worship and his name is definitely not Barack Hussein Obama. But its beyond any doubt that US is head and shoulders beyond everyone else combined in military technology.

In that case, if none of the countries that have an avenue on this forum can match the Yankee technological pace, you'll find better appreciation for your not so subtle trolling on an american defence forum. What India does with her money, her dealings is none of your concern, nor should it be.
 
Well the Aegis with SM-3 vs the MF-STAR with Barak 8/NG is going to be a hot debate of this thread. I can see that....The Barak 8 is no way comparable to the SM3 but both the radars are comparable. The BARAK 8 is good against cruise missiles and AShM when taking the Barak 1 as the yard stick. But the Aegis with SM 3 is a proven system. Lets see which one comes on top. Only a war can actually show which one is a better system.
 

Back
Top Bottom