Accept Vande Mataram or go to Pakistan

[FireFighter]

Although CNN-IBN screened out religious practicing muslims and gave a lot more airtime to secular/liberal muslims that suit their agenda.

This is rather interesting still.

Hope you guys will enjoy this

 

[deepakthirdreich]

just out of curiosity.what does islam say about one muslim soldier killing enemy muslim soldier.

 

[brahmastra]

if these maulvis are saying that it is un-islamic to say 'vande mataram' and issues fatwas against it then why they don't issue fatwa against muslims taking government help for 'HAJ' as its also un-islamic to goto 'haj' with the help of money which are not earned with your own efforts.

 

[MilesTogo]

I think we should expand the discussion to include all UN-Islamic practices or may be someone could open a new thread.

 

[pagans]

just out of curiosity.what does islam say about one muslim soldier killing enemy muslim soldier.

Muslims are not allowed to kill another Muslim under any occasion.

 

[FireFighter]

Muslims are not allowed to kill another Muslim under any occasion.

Since when did the pagans become authorities on Islam and Muslims?

Welcome to the forum lad

 

[Kaali]

Muslims are not allowed to kill another Muslim under any occasion.

What about Taliban which the army of Pakistan. At the end of the day they are Muslims.... What about war between Iraq and Iran...

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Muslims are not allowed to kill another Muslim under any occasion.

In principle yes. But immediately after the death of the Prophet [PBUH] the practice changed. Currently the trend has changed so much that it is more likely for a Muslim to kill another Muslim than a kaffir. Islam like Christianity no longer has one voice and is now controlled more or less by cultural dictates. Hence the entire issue of Vande Mataram will become a confusion and eventually the fatwa will fall away on its own

 

[pagans]

Since when did the pagans become authorities on Islam and Muslims?

Welcome to the forum lad

Do not underestimate pagans !. We survived the onslaughts of Abrahamic religions for over 4000 years.

We were in control of even the Kabba before Muhammed took over.

Thanks for the welcome.

 

[deepakthirdreich]

anything between india and pakistan comes down to hindus,muslims,christans,sikh etc.As an atheist i would like to know about every religion so should we start a new thread for discussions..

 

[rubyjackass]

Jana....this is where your thinking is completely flawed.....You're apologizing for something that you havent completely even understood

This has nothing to do with Religion....this is our "national song"....a song that is used to inspire the youth, our army men......it reminds us of the pride that we feel about being Indians.....its the song that brings out the nationalism in us.....
Why do you insist on painting everything with the religion brush......We are not offended because we cant "impose" our religion on other minorities in India as you're suggesting...thats childish and outright insane......we are hurt because this hurts us as Indians ......nothing else....

Even after explaining the meaning and reference of Durga and Laxmi....yet you keep up with your argument about,
"In this case i feel its clearly the case that its is related to hindu belief about hindu godess thats why you took it that way"
You really have a hard time accepting that India is secular and that a majority of educated Indians are liberal minded and think of themselves as Indians first.....Hindu, muslim, sikh etc....later.....

Now you know the answer....why dont you just quit while you're ahead!!!

Thanks dude!! Saved me a clarification.

 

[EjazR]

if these maulvis are saying that it is un-islamic to say 'vande mataram' and issues fatwas against it then why they don't issue fatwa against muslims taking government help for 'HAJ' as its also un-islamic to goto 'haj' with the help of money which are not earned with your own efforts.

The Haj subsidy is basically an Air India subsidy. Many religious scholars as wella s muslims leaders have been calling for revoking this haj subsidy and use thsi money for developmental and education support instead.

For example even the Shahi Imam, Ahmed Bukhari, as prominently reported by Inquilab , Qaumi Awaaz and Akhbar-e-Mashriq (August 27) has argued that the concession given in the name of the haj subsidy is actually being given to the monopoly carrier, Air India, which “covers its annual deficit with the help of such a subsidy.” According to Bukhari, “Air India’s regular Delhi-Jeddah airfare of Rs. 22,000 is raised to Rs. 37,000 during haj. So the subsidy is limited to the airline and does not flow to the traveller.”

So as long as Air India Babus have thier way they will continue to have their "Haj subisdy" to cover their mismanagemnet and losses.

 

[EjazR]

Muslims are not allowed to kill another Muslim under any occasion.

According to the Quran, killing any innocent human being (not only muslim, but any non muslims as well) is as if you have killed the entire mankind and there is capital punishment for that unless the relatives of the deceased are willing to forgive the accused.

...if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people." [Noble Quran 5:32]

"Whoever has killed a person (muslim or non-muslim) having a treaty with the Muslims shall not smell the fragrance of Paradise, though its fragrance is found for a span of forty years."Hadith.

Even at times of war, you can't attack women, children, old people, people of have given up the worldly life and are basically monks in temples or churches, those who don't fight you (i.e. civilians). You also are not allowed to burn fields and cut trees or kill livestock.

 

[EjazR]

The point is wethere vande mataram will result in shirk. The two stanzas that are part of the national song were written prior tot he novel or the rest of the song which definitely has elements of idol worship and is not acceptable to just muslims but any religion that does not practice idol worship including hindus like Arya Samajis, vendatists e.t.c who believe in one God and follow the vedas. This was the reason why only the two specific stanzas were chosen.

However, sining the national song can't be imposed forcibly just as the national language Hindi can't be imposed forcibly and it is ridiculous to equate that with patriotitsm. And since fatwa means a religious opinion based on facts in front of the the person giving the fatwa, if the urdu translation for exaxmple if provided and the mufti is explained that vande in this context means saluting the motherland, and there is no worship of the country involved. This is the reason why some other ulemas have given fatwas (keep in mind these are religious opinions not edicts or laws) that based on "these" translations it is permissible.

This is a good article discussing this Islamic monotheism is not under threat

 

[Novice09]

The Haj subsidy is basically an Air India subsidy. Many religious scholars as wella s muslims leaders have been calling for revoking this haj subsidy and use thsi money for developmental and education support instead.

For example even the Shahi Imam, Ahmed Bukhari, as prominently reported by Inquilab , Qaumi Awaaz and Akhbar-e-Mashriq (August 27) has argued that the concession given in the name of the haj subsidy is actually being given to the monopoly carrier, Air India, which “covers its annual deficit with the help of such a subsidy.” According to Bukhari, “Air India’s regular Delhi-Jeddah airfare of Rs. 22,000 is raised to Rs. 37,000 during haj. So the subsidy is limited to the airline and does not flow to the traveller.”

So as long as Air India Babus have thier way they will continue to have their "Haj subisdy" to cover their mismanagemnet and losses.

Don't you think that they have option to take different flight but they go for Air India.