Zia ul Haq my grandfather

[Multani]

My abusive language is not targeted towards any forum members....it is only towards Zia and co.

Zia and Bhutto were the two juggernauts whilst these Nawaz and Benazir(L) are just mere extensions.

I will curse anyone who has brought and imposed a particular strain of Islam. I will curse anyone who has unleashed the demon of terrorism and jihadist tendencies in the country. I will curse anyone who fools the masses with so called notion of Ummah and whatnot.

Zia played a vital role in all of the above. You can open up a thread on Bhutto and I will talk about Bhutto as well....no problem.

PS. Just because the useless BB wasn't able to stop or reverse Zia's blunders doesn't mean Zia gets a free pass. A billion or more people have committed murder after Kane....does it mean Kane wasn't wrong?

Brother, TTP is not a strain of Islam. Their ideology has nothing to do with Islam. That is why many PDF members and those in opposition usually label them as khawarij [ those who left religion ]

However, Physical struggle of Jihad and Ummah [ brotherhood of followers of Islam ] are both concepts proven by the Sunnat of the Prophet salamuAllah elaih. They are spoken by God in His eternal speech Quran Majeed. The Ummah concept applies between Pakistanis as a priority. All Pakistani Muslims, irrespective of their ethnicity, community, language, race or background are bound in physical Jihad against TTP as one Ummah, or Muslim nation state. Non-Muslim Pakistanis are included too. This is not a spin or a twist of the concept. It is a direct application.

Its usually spelt as Cain, not the Kane of WWE

 

[Zarvan]

I call it fasad too. Because it wasn't a jihad . Didn't fulfill any conditions for Jihad even from a local Afghan perspective, and left them with bad memories rather than good ones. It was a political fasad.

It was a Jihad never a fasad

 

[Metanoia]

Brother, TTP is not a strain of Islam. Their ideology has nothing to do with Islam. That is why many PDF members and those in opposition usually label them as khawarij [ those who left religion ]

However, Physical struggle of Jihad and Ummah [ brotherhood of followers of Islam ] are both concepts proven by the Sunnat of the Prophet salamuAllah elaih. They are spoken by God in His eternal speech Quran Majeed. The Ummah concept applies between Pakistanis as a priority. All Pakistani Muslims, irrespective of their ethnicity, community, language, race or background are bound in physical Jihad against TTP as one Ummah, or Muslim nation state. Non-Muslim Pakistanis are included too. This is not a spin or a twist of the concept. It is a direct application.

Its usually spelt as Cain, not the Kane of WWE

My bad for the Cain being spelled Kane...lol

Mate I am not just merely hinting at TTP, as they are but a drop of water in an ocean of cultural quagmire.

As far as the Ummah is concerned, reality on the ground is completely different...it just simply doesn't exist apart from being a thought for manipulation of the "slave" class. When you talk about Ummah it consists of all the Muslim majority nation states and not only Pakistan...you can not be selective in your definition bro.

For me a Christian/Hindu/Shia/Sunni/Ahmadi/Ismaili/Sikh Pakistani is more dear and brother to me than an Arab/Turkish/Persian/Malaysian Muslim.

This something which the Right-Wingers have severely opposed since Day-1.

 

[patriotpakistan]

The writer is a London-based student who has contributed to The Express Tribune Blogs and Pakistan Today.
I can only come up with the forewarning that this is not a reactionary outburst, nor in support or defence of the merits of military governments in place of genuine democracy, if we can ever come to that. Yes, former president Ziaul Haq is my grandfather, and if this article appears to you as one-sided, and no doubt it certainly will, perhaps, we should first question our overzealous political anchors and their self-crowned analyst guests, who repeatedly present the same side of the coin.
26 years after the C-130 crash, I decided to pick up Benazir Bhutto’s much-lauded 1988 memoir, Daughter of the East. Initially apprehensive given that Benazir begins with her father’s execution, I had prepared myself for the barrage of criticism that would be directed towards General Zia. Three chapters in, however, I found myself laughing at the baseless accusations that Bhutto levels against Zia and his family.
Regarding the former president’s funeral, Benazir claims that in order to increase participation, the government paid for the accommodation of citizens in Islamabad. In reference to Shahnawaz Bhutto’s funeral, Benazir describes the feeling of tremendous sadness that swept over Sindh, and how millions turned up to mourn ‘martyr Bhutto’s’ son. The videos of the 1988 state funeral are online, and while Shahnawaz’s untimely and mysterious death (which his niece Fatima claims was Benazir’s doing) may have attracted many supporters, there is no comparison to the two to three million individuals who descended upon Faisal Masjid from all across Pakistan. The Mohtarma’s memoir is replete with the downplaying of the facts which reveal the support Zia had from Pakistanis.
Then there is the absolutely absurd claim that General Zia planned to flee to Saudi Arabia after Benazir’s return in 1986. She writes, “Zia allegedly left with his family, three airline containers of furniture, and a gold-plated Rolls Royce gifted to the president from an Arab head of state.” I’d certainly like to know where the car is, because we, Zia’s family, definitely don’t have it; perhaps it, along with the ‘furniture’, has made its way to Surrey, or better yet, the underground garage of a certain someone’s Park Lane apartment.
In order to understand the extent of the damage that Bhutto, both father and daughter, caused to Pakistan, one has to dig deeper. Yet, our media is inclined toward the superficial, remaining on the surface during attempts to dissect the characters of General Zia and Bhutto — a moustached general who came to power through martial law doesn’t look as good to them as an idealistic prime minister with a feudal background swaying the masses with his romantic notions of roti, kapra and makaan.
If power doesn’t change hands, and only changes faces, which Fatima Bhutto once said in a Karan Thapar interview, then Benazir, behind her dupatta and coiffed hair, was about as much a dictator as General Zia. A January 1995 Amnesty International report titled Pakistan: The Pattern Persists outlines the human rights promises made by the PPP, and how the government instead facilitated the spread of torture and rape by the “widespread practice of incommunicado detention, sometimes in places not officially designated as prisons.” There was also Operation Clean-up or Blue Fox, which under Bhutto’s initiation turned Karachi into a hotbed for sectarian violence that continues to this day.
On the much-decried issue of General Zia’s censorship, let’s not forget Junoon’s song Ehtesaab, parodying fat cat bureaucrats and politicians as well as the infamous poly pony stables at PM House, which was banned from being aired on PTV under Benazir’s premiership. Najam Sethi said it best in the 1996 exposé, Princess and the Playboy, when he told viewers that Bhutto forgot to be an elected leader and instead became a queen. The irony lies in her repeated reference to herself as Cory Aquino, and General Zia in the same category as Ferdinand, the Shah and other tyrants. In hindsight, it seems that she was less Aquino and more Imelda.
More recently, however, under the government of former president Zia’s biggest mistake, the media has launched a campaign of defaming his character under the guise of political satire. The July 31 episode of Express News’s Media Azaad Hai parodied Ziaul Haq in extremely bad taste: if the media is truly as ‘azaad’ as it says it is, then perhaps it should also poke fun at the former prime minister’s late father in primetime.
It’s almost funny how political programmes across networks repeatedly mention former president Ziaul Haq in every single episode. Why? Because General Zia sells books, because General Zia gets ratings up, because General Zia is forever etched into our selective national memory.
We never fled the country, never got whisked away by a sympathetic Middle Eastern despot. President Zia did not run any political party like a family business either. He did not pass on the mantle of power to his son, or spouse, or sibling in a system akin to monarchy. It is today’s politicians who think they can loot and plunder Pakistan’s exchequer, manipulate the mandate from the people, and then cry foul in remembrance of the dictators that sent them into the wilderness of exile (Kensington, Jeddah, Dubai). This is ‘democracy’ in Pakistan, and General Zia is its most convenient target.
Published in The Express Tribune, August 16th, 2014.
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Ziaul Haq, my grandfather – The Express Tribune
@Aeronaut @Chak Bamu @AUz @RazPaK @Slav Defence @Secur @Oscar @Fulcrum15 @Bratva @nair @WebMaster
@Stealth @Windjammer @Areesh @Alpha1 @balixd @Rafi @cadet zain @GURU DUTT @OrionHunter @Kaan @Emmie @Aether @Spring Onion @akhlieos @RazPaK @Kaan @Jf Thunder @faisal6309 @tarrar @JonAsad @Multani @salman108

This cartoon is trying to salvage Zia's reputation because Zia was his grandfather. I say bring him to Pakistan and try him for his grandfather's crimes. The post-zia Islamists are the biggest reason for Pakistan and Islam's dowfall. These beardy wierdos were nurtured by Zia and unleashed upon the country where they continue to suppress intelligent muslim minds to this day. That is why the country is just a big mob today, not a rational intelligentsia.

 

[EagleEyes]

I say bring him to Pakistan and try him for his grandfather's crimes. The post-zia Islamists are the biggest reason for Pakistan and Islam's dowfall.

How are you any different?

 

[patriotpakistan]

How are you any different?

Giving a trial is not the same as lynching. If someone tries to cover up and justify crimes, it means they would commit those crimes and feel no remorse. Perhaps some punishment would induce remorse.

 

[rockstar08]

well i have a question for @Secur @forcetrip
if we dont Collaborate with USA in Afghan war , dont you think that all the stuff we get from US , we wont get ?
plus as far as i know that our N program was reach to final stages during that ... your comments ..?

 

[forcetrip]

well i have a question for @Secur @forcetrip
if we dont Collaborate with USA in Afghan war , dont you think that all the stuff we get from US , we wont get ?
plus as far as i know that our N program was reach to final stages during that ... your comments ..?

Please note how we were treated by the Americans during Ayub Khans time or even before and how we were treated after Zias time. You can see what kind of equipment we we getting before we became a punching bag. Plus if you for a second think the Americans gave us any help building the nuclear bomb you could follow the links to previous posts of how even Zia lied to keep the weapon a secret.

 

[qamar1990]

It is the duty of every true Pakistani to piss on the grave of Zia up Haq.

piss on your face you mean

 

[Dubious]

You cant travel back with a time machiene and correct those mistakes ...those are not writings on the board ...in a deep jungle you wont be having liberty to change direction ..you should be careful to choose one

and exactly what was I saying??

 

[Pakistani E]

You can gauge the moral state of our religious right wing by the fact that they hold in high regard a man who broke a promise witnessed by millions of people around the world.

It was narrated that ‘Abd-Allah ibn Amr (may Allah be pleased with him) said: "The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “There are four characteristics, whoever has them all is a pure hypocrite: when he speaks he lies, when he makes a promise he breaks it, when he makes a covenant he betrays it, and when he disputes he resorts to obscene speech. Whoever has one of them has one of the characteristics of hypocrisy, until he gives it up.”

HAHAHA, the mard e momin of our religious right is a pakka munafiq. Dub maro maulviyon.

 

[Zarvan]

How are you any different?

I have noticed one thing which ever thread I start every body goes crazy

 

[Multani]

My bad for the Cain being spelled Kane...lol

Mate I am not just merely hinting at TTP, as they are but a drop of water in an ocean of cultural quagmire.

As far as the Ummah is concerned, reality on the ground is completely different...it just simply doesn't exist apart from being a thought for manipulation of the "slave" class. When you talk about Ummah it consists of all the Muslim majority nation states and not only Pakistan...you can not be selective in your definition bro.

For me a Christian/Hindu/Shia/Sunni/Ahmadi/Ismaili/Sikh Pakistani is more dear and brother to me than an Arab/Turkish/Persian/Malaysian Muslim.

This something which the Right-Wingers have severely opposed since Day-1.

I am not being selective in definition. Ummat concept starts at home, and then goes out. Home is priority. First one must set their home in order and then go out. This i mentioned in the "time to abandon ummah thread" .

Because abandoning the concept of Ummat is abandoning Islam. It is rejecting Allah's Speech. I cannot believe Pakistani Muslims are talking like this on PDF. @Zarvan because it is the same as if one was allowing alcohol in Islam. Ummah concept rejectors in Turkey have no shame in drinking and promoting alcohol and other vice either.

The christian/hindu/shia/sunni/qadyani/ismaili/sikh pakistanis are more dear to you because they are a part of your family in close proximity. They live in your land and you feel a sense of responsibility. They are home. And home is the first responsibility in Ummat. This is a false comparison you are making between home and other Muslim majority countries.

Ummat includes your immediate and extended family first. One cannot say the families 10 villages away are more dear to you than your own family or own village family. People will think of this to be crazy. If you are a Punjabi from Lahore, then it makes less sense to say that unknown families in Peshawar are more dear to you than related families in Lahore.

Ummat is a religious concept proven from Qur'an and Sunnat. God Himself has spoken about it, and Rasool e Paak salamullah alaih has mentioned in numerous Sahih Ahadith. He made the concept himself in Madina Munawarah and during the conquest of Makkah Mukararmah

 

[Zarvan]

You can gauge the moral state of our religious right wing by the fact that they hold in high regard a man who broke a promise witnessed by millions of people around the world.

It was narrated that ‘Abd-Allah ibn Amr (may Allah be pleased with him) said: "The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “There are four characteristics, whoever has them all is a pure hypocrite: when he speaks he lies, when he makes a promise he breaks it, when he makes a covenant he betrays it, and when he disputes he resorts to obscene speech. Whoever has one of them has one of the characteristics of hypocrisy, until he gives it up.”

HAHAHA, the mard e momin of our religious right is a pakka munafiq. Dub maro maulviyon.

And still you follow a liar Mirza

 

[Multani]

You can gauge the moral state of our religious right wing by the fact that they hold in high regard a man who broke a promise witnessed by millions of people around the world.

It was narrated that ‘Abd-Allah ibn Amr (may Allah be pleased with him) said: "The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “There are four characteristics, whoever has them all is a pure hypocrite: when he speaks he lies, when he makes a promise he breaks it, when he makes a covenant he betrays it, and when he disputes he resorts to obscene speech. Whoever has one of them has one of the characteristics of hypocrisy, until he gives it up.”

HAHAHA, the mard e momin of our religious right is a pakka munafiq. Dub maro maulviyon.

What you are saying is not true, and shows your ignorance of Pakistani Muslims.

Mr TUQ is not held in high regard by any major religious organization in Pakistan except of his own. He is rejected by most Sunnis in Pakistan as a liar, and most Shia Muslims, Ahle Hadith, and Deobandi scholars.

Look what a Pakistani Shia Scholar says about TUQ